Tambrahms

[Vaagmi]

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Dear Vaagm ji,
I am beyond praise and blame!LOL
Really..its not that I am God but its just that I do not have to proof myself or try to add value to my "image".
As it is with hardly any effort I have a Fan club and "Jalras"..I am even Guru/Mentor to some....so I am already quite a high profile member here.
Sometimes too much attention is not too easy to handle.
Even Avatars descend only from Yuga to Yuga and not on daily basis..cos God knows too much attention is not good.
So frankly speaking I do not mind having any sort of image..Good<Bad>Ugly..all images are mine.
I try not to identify with any even though I might project myself in many ways.
It might confuse you ..so I can understand.
Anyway lets wait for Kunjs to come online and till then everyone is welcome to leave their comments. .
Let the party begin!LOL

That is okay. Your position is understood. And no comments on that.
I had enough and I do not intend to continue this argument any more.
The party may begin and go on. LOL.

 

[Vaagmi]

Dear Vaagmi ji,
Ok I will be brutally honest with regards to what I thought about your statement to go ask a Muslim or Christian to be a judge.
I thought this "Is Vaagmi Ji nuts!LOL Why the heck should I ask a Christian or Muslim to be a judge about 2 systems of Hinduism? A Xtian and Muslim are no more part of the Hindu system to be a judge..a judge needs to have a sound knowledge of Hinduism and also to be neutral preferably someone who is not related anyway to either school of thought.
Its just logical to choose a judge who is a Hindu and not a biased one.
So I felt I was apt for the role of the judge here cos I am not a TB and whatever I can infer from my personal experience and my knowledge in Hinduism will offer a non biased verdict.
But sadly you still felt I must ask a Xtian or a Muslim who knows neither head nor tail of Hinduism and might consider us Hindus a bunch of infidels.
A Xtian or a Muslim does not qualify to be a judge on Hindu matters..just imagine if a engineer is allowed to be a High Court Judge..would he know anything about law?It would be disastrous!
Further more as a Hindu I feel we need to solve all Hindu "issues" ourselves as I earlier said I do not discuss Hindu matters with Non Hindus..becos one should not disclose the strength or weakness of Hinduism to Non Hindus"
Now coming to Kunjs bringing in the caste part that my judgment wont be of any value becos I am a Non Brahmin..to be frank I did not feel that this was a caste issue..all I thought is "Vaagmi ji is nuts"..in fact at one stage I thought that this is starting to be like the famous supreme court and elephant case!LOL
Anyway Kunjs is entitled to his opinion and I respect that....just like how Kala Bhairava Ji is also entitled to his opinion and I respect that too and replied him...who is right? who is wrong? I am not going to be a judge on this. I hope my answer satisfies your deepest desires!

I did not have the benefit of reading this before my previous post. One last time I would participate in this conversation:
Renukaji, I want you to recall the post #52:

Renuka said: Dear TBS Garu,

From my limited exposure to Vaishnavas I think I have to agree with you to a certain extent.
I have noted Vaishnavas are either totally Orthodox or totally Heterodox.
This is not only with TBs...even among the NBs who adhere to Vaishnavaism I have seen this..they are always on the either end of the spectrum and almost never thread the middle path.

Vaagmi said................................. fanciful thoughts have no limit. They will become acceptable to others only when there are endorsements. Please get endorsements for the views on vaishnavas by asking christians and muslims because their views will be unbiased in this matter. And never go to a smartha to ask about a vaishnava. LOL.

Now let me be brutally frank. The discussion here is not about the tricky pratama pratyaksham or the ever mysterious sritatva. It is not about the involved discussion of khyati or the pregnant-with-meaning mahavakhya tattvamasi. There is no meaning to ask a muslim or a Christian to sit in judgment of a discussion on any of these unless he has spent time understanding these. The issue in hand is whether a group of people who are tagged by a certain faith system for convenience of ID are extremists, moderates or pacifists. This can be determined by an unbiased observer who knows what is meant by extremism, pacifism or moderation. All that is required for the determination to be correct is that the individual concerned does not belong to the hindu faith of which the people under scrutiny are a part. For instance some one who gets an orgasm thinking about a certain god who is muscular, red hot etc., can not sit in judgment of a philosophical discussion between the worshipers of that god and some other god.

I said the above in a very polite language "Please get endorsements for the views on vaishnavas by asking christians and muslims because their views will be unbiased in this matter. And never go to a smartha to ask about a vaishnava".

As I said earlier I am not interested in continuing this conversation. I stop with this. Thanks.

 

[auh]

it takes someone out of india or a very enlightened indian to understand how they are literally, thanks to the worldly global values of absolute dignity and equality, how cruel the caste system with its hierarchical structure is. add to it, the disenfranchisement of the dalits, which i see no sympathy here in this forum. at all...

I think the caste system has now, been reduced to merely a system with whatever hierarchy that was supposed to exist being relegated to the confines of one's hearts only. Houses, in certain cases. This is in the case of brahmins only. I cannot comment on others.

Having embroiled in too many arguments against a particular sect tends, sometimes, and in some individuals, to colour the bent of mind. It may be hard for those, who live in the world where the multitude is in an everpresent revolt against the advertised cruelty of brahmins, to perhaps come down to reality to have a look around. For such is the mind cloaked in the righteousness of the indignance of the dalits that the eyes refuse to open even when the dalit shakes hands with the brahmin on equal footing. For then the mind would ever search for that tiny opening, that exception to the rule, that folly of the other which would enable one to sustain on the tirade against the brahmin.

Oh well...

 

[a-TB]

Guys...when Kunjs wrote that post initially the part about caste was not there..I think it was edited a bit later and only in the later part of the day I read the "new" addition.

By that time the discussion had taken a different turn so I was thinking to respond or not cos I know caste based discussions eventually go out of hand..by then Kala Bhairavan Ji had jumped in and called me a casteists!LOL


Anyway I am wondering why you both Vaagmi Ji and a-TB ji are disappointed with my silence?

What does silence mean?

Its hard for you both to prove what is in my mind isnt it? So dont be disappointed..at times even I do not know what is in my mind..so no use trying to figure me out.

As I said earlier I chose to remain neutral on this..so I did not chose to respond..but what is in my mind only I know.

BTW guys...it still makes me wonder why you both expected a response from me to disagree with Kunjs..but it makes me laugh that I was NOT disappointed with anyone for not disagreeing with Kala Bhairava Ji but neither did I indirectly "accuse" anyone of remaining silent on this...I was not looking for support of any kind cos I know myself well...can defend myself and also gun down anything!LOL


Just to add after certain stage in life elation or disappointment ceases to exists in our vocabulary..everything that we witness is merely an experience.


But it somehow seems that at times people need my "help" to make them feel better out here in Forum..so guys lets make a deal..some day I will make you guys feel better till then enjoy this song.


[video]https://youtu.be/y6Sxv-sUYtM[/video]

Madam Renuka:

Did not say - 'I am disappointed'! dont know you to say that!
I stated what I observed and how it led to uncivil exchanges which has now led to even more

'nuff said on this

 

[renuka]

Madam Renuka:

Did not say - 'I am disappointed'! dont know you to say that!
I stated what I observed and how it led to uncivil exchanges which has now led to even more

'nuff said on this

My Dear a-Tb,

I had replied to you and Vaagmi ji in one post..since Vaagmi ji said he is disppointed the reply was directed more towards him..so dont worry I did not mean you..but since the reply was in one post it seemed as if it was directed to both of you...I guess its an illusion.

Anway no big deal...the thread was not civil to start with anyway..members were doubting each others intelligence in some posts too even before I gave my comment.

Agreed..enough said on this..time to move on and have fun in other threads.

 

[kunjuppu]

apologies (unconditional) to vaagmi, as he has stated, that his post was not meant, in the way i understood it.

the communication gap, and its consequences are mine. atleast i should have had the courtesy to ask him to explain himself. in the heat of things, i did not, and hence this 'sorry'. please accept it sir.

 

[Vaagmi]

apologies (unconditional) to vaagmi, as he has stated, that his post was not meant, in the way i understood it.

the communication gap, and its consequences are mine. atleast i should have had the courtesy to ask him to explain himself. in the heat of things, i did not, and hence this 'sorry'. please accept it sir.

Dear kunjuppuji,

I appreciate that gesture. You are great. You have gone several notches up in my respect. God bless you.

 

[renuka]

Dear kunjuppuji,

I appreciate that gesture. You are great. You have gone several notches up in my respect. God bless you.

So nice to see this..everyone kissing and making up...you guys make me very happy..nice to see males being loving to each other..its feels more tender!LOL

 

[krishnamehra]

nice post.

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear kunjuppuji,

I appreciate that gesture. You are great. You have gone several notches up in my respect. God bless you.

me happy tooooo

 

[vgane]

All is well that ends well! It means curtain down for this topic!!

 

[sarang]

High hopes! Ingrained hatred will ooze out under some pretext. Happened several times.

All is well that ends well! It means curtain down for this topic!!

 

[Vaagmi]

All is well that ends well! It means curtain down for this topic!!

Until some one stupid enough shoots his mouth again about an elephant, cat, mongoose,mouse or cockroach with a Naamam that went to supreme court and how the other elephant, cat, mongoose, mouse or cockroach with a pattai and kottai never did such a thing. LOL.

 

[renuka]

All is well that ends well! It means curtain down for this topic!!

Yes..Curtains down..Vaagmi ji and Kunjs need privacy to make out..sorry I mean make up!

 

[renuka]

Whoa...the Iyengars are out in full force today!LOL

I thought the curtains were down and the party was over!

 

[renuka]

High hopes! Ingrained hatred will ooze out under some pretext. Happened several times.

Yup..you are right..you just officiated the 2nd round!LOL

 

[CHANDRU1849]

It is proved that Diettry restrictions have no role to play when religious fanaticism takes over, which can be very explicitly seen in the elephant case.

India is in badly need of a saint like Bhagwan Mahavir.

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

Until some one stupid enough shoots his mouth again about an elephant, cat, mongoose,mouse or cockroach with a Naamam that went to supreme court and how the other elephant, cat, mongoose, mouse or cockroach with a pattai and kottai never did such a thing. LOL.[/QUOTE

Knowledgeble Vaishnava should introspect insted of being arrogant! Agama experts should know that temple gates can be closed only as agma ordained and not at their whims and fancies

This act in the premises of Hayagriva, Lord of Wisdom?
When shall we grow?

Story:


https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2014/10/20/cuddalore-vaishnavaite-clash-painful-anachara/

 

[Raji Ram]

All is well that ends well! It means curtain down for this topic!!

:nono: but for two options:

1. Request to the moderator for closure, by J J ma'am. :lock1:

2. Fierce :fencing: in which no member asks for apology and someone presses the panic button!!

 

[sarang]

It is idiotic to demand introspection when none is necessary. As in any family there are disagreements and disputes related to say philosophical issues (higher level) or mundane issues related to property, practices, ownership etc. Many a time as like secular media, issue is blown out of proportion in parts, deliberately avoiding a balanced median view. Such issues are local, origin most likely of no cosequence and more like once a year utsavam. It is advisable to let the issue sorted out by the local disputing groups. Outsiders just ignore and carry on. In the old days such issues when not sorted out at local panchayat level were taken to the king. Now to the courts. Nothing wrong.
There is no instance of fist or sword fight or bombing as in other cultures.
Same way, issues between dalits and non dalits must be resolved by themselves at local level. Muddying by opportunist politicians and communists only widens the conflict and deepens the differences.

 

[Vaagmi]

It is idiotic to demand introspection when none is necessary. As in any family there are disagreements and disputes related to say philosophical issues (higher level) or mundane issues related to property, practices, ownership etc. Many a time as like secular media, issue is blown out of proportion in parts, deliberately avoiding a balanced median view. Such issues are local, origin most likely of no cosequence and more like once a year utsavam. It is advisable to let the issue sorted out by the local disputing groups. Outsiders just ignore and carry on. In the old days such issues when not sorted out at local panchayat level were taken to the king. Now to the courts. Nothing wrong.
There is no instance of fist or sword fight or bombing as in other cultures.
Same way, issues between dalits and non dalits must be resolved by themselves at local level. Muddying by opportunist politicians and communists only widens the conflict and deepens the differences.

Well said.

It is not that people understand everything said by their acharyas. Yet when they get a stick-however small or frail it may be-the temptation to use it against vaishnavas becomes irresistible for these idiots. When one does not have the necessary grey matter to understand the finer points of philosophy or ontology, just keeps himself busy by picking up the story of an elephant or a cockroach with Namam.

When you can not understand or discuss about the tricky questions on aham brahmasmi's interpretation by acharyas, the next best thing that comes to you easily is to discuss the speed with which the tuft of the acharya was dancing when he was explaining a fine point in philosophy.

That is why they remain idiots. LOL.

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

The 2 eyes are there for you to see and grey matter to interpret it correctly! But being Blind by Birth like Dhirudhrashtra or blind by choice like his dharmapathini refuse to see the obvious that is in black and white! But through your 'Tele' vision - described and interpreted by others - things you can never see by yourself and call it finer points of Acharyas! You can never see an elephant phyically but talk about or lecture on the nammam on its trunck with philosophical distortions & interpretations! borrowed from some one else- You are incapable of seeing anything - but distort as finer points that sprouts from decayed grey matter! Can have only one eye vision that can see only what you want to see and brush aside what you donot want to or cannot see as foolish or silly!! You seem to have no vision or grey matter to introspect!

The graphics of Knowledgeable people with Thenga kudumi! - this may not dance while explaing the finer points or distortions! You can add Namam of your choice and lecture philosophically about the inner meaning of that !!

 

[tbs]

The 2 eyes are there for you to see and grey matter to interpret it correctly! But being Blind by Birth like Dhirudhrashtra or blind by choice like his dharmapathini refuse to see the obvious that is in black and white! But through your 'Tele' vision - described and interpreted by others - things you can never see by yourself and call it finer points of Acharyas! You can never see an elephant phyically but talk about or lecture on the nammam on its trunck with philosophical distortions & interpretations! borrowed from some one else- You are incapable of seeing anything - but distort as finer points that sprouts from decayed grey matter! Can have only one eye vision that can see only what you want to see and brush aside what you donot want to or cannot see as foolish or silly!! You seem to have no vision or grey matter to introspect!

The graphics of Knowledgeable people with Thenga kudumi! - this may not dance while explaing the finer points or distortions! You can add Namam of your choice and lecture philosophically about the inner meaning of that !!

hi

you are right.......உண்மை என்றும் கசக்கும்......சிலருக்கு உண்மையையே சொன்னாலும் கசக்கும்...என்ன செய்வது?

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Fanatics of religion or sect or we may call impertinent idiots, may not bring anything good to humanity.

We will have to pray only to God to enlighten these idiots not to harm animals.

 

[Vaagmi]

Fanatical animal enthusiasts (they are obsessed with animals), wide eyed idiots without grey matter to interpret all that the wide eyes send in, and bitter truth mahavirs This is just to remind you:

Fighting over the temple elephants is comparatively harmless while telling a qualified tamil odhuvar to stand down one level below before God Nataraja to chant the thevaram, thiruvasagam etc.,

ஈயத்தை பார்த்து இளிச்சதாம் பித்தளை. LOL.

உச்ச நீதிமன்றம் எல்லாம் போகாமலே எதிர்ப்பு தெரிவித்து பயமுறுத்திய கழகக்குஞ்சுகளுக்கு பயந்து வாலைச்சுருட்டிக்கொண்டு எல்லா துவாரங்களையும் மூடிக்கொண்ட கதை எல்லோருக்கும் தெரியும்.

Every time you open your mouth to criticise vaishnavas and their elephants, remember this episode and your mouth will shut tight. You can save energy. LOL.