The Power of Brahmins - Recap !!

[Ramaa]

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Dear Vijisesh,

i am certain about the fact that the Brahmins are indeed superior and this is a well known fact between you, me and the others.

I would agree with you but conditionally!

Brahmins are superior in terms of their intellectual prowess which they only possess. This sets apart the Brahmins from others.

The Kshathriyas are superior on pursuit of worldly ideals which they only possess. The Vaisyas are adept in making money which they only possess. For making money ideals are obstacles and have to be sacrificed! And the Vaisyas do so spontaneously! I.e. the Vaisya has no ideal that would cause wasteage of money!!

A Kshathriya would be guilt ridden if he sacrifices his ideal. However if he does degenerate enough to lose this guilt he could very well turn into a Vaisya!

And no one can excel in the endurance in the exhausting labour of the Sudharas. The other three varnas could easily become a Sudhra by circumstance and necessity!

Also it is believed that the Brahmins can change themselves to become a Kshathriya, a Vaisya or a Sudhra because of this intellectual prowess. Looking at it some people begin to think that the Brahmins have ceased to be Brahmins! The point is that they forget that Brahmins as a whole do not change but a number of them have exercised their options! This happens circumstantially. And the circumstances change!! When the cirucmstance changes the number dwindles.

Can a non-Brahmin become a Brahmin? The answer to this lies in the my underlined sentence above.

 

[vijisesh]

Dear Mr Ranganathan ji ,

Good Wrap up of " Human Life "

Respected Mr.Vijisesh,

It is 'desire' which ultimately brings misery and unhappiness. Since the
unfulfilled desire brings kroda ( anger ), Lord Krishna says Kama and krodha
pushes us into the sea of births and deaths.

Although just 2 things to get away from - Kama and krodha ! but is it simple?? - krodha may be to some extent , one can use the proven age old method of counting from one to ten , to get into his calmness , but to get away from the other one counting one to hundred forward and backwards , may not help !

We will have to liberate ourselves from this cycle of births and deaths. Moksha does not mean that we have to go to some other world to enjoy it; we can have it here itself and whilst still in this body, which is the status of a Jivanmukta.

Something sounds odd here ! Cycle of births and deaths , why doesn't a human get tired of going through similar experiences ! Just like the successful story writers of Indian cinema , mixing the right combination of emotions, action , love and sorrow to bring new movies over and over again !

By viveka ( discrimination ) and vairagya, we can identify those things that
are impermanent and stay away from them and set on the royal path of
self-enquiry and attain self-realization.

But to begin this self enquiry process either Man should get himself out of the materialistic world or should be born as a lonesome ranger !


Narada Bakthi Sutra says : 'saa thvasmin parama premaroopa'. and
' amrithaswarupa cha'. The unparallelled pure love of God is Bakthi and
it is like a nectar and is eternal.

Bhakthi , is definitely there amongst all , the intensity varies ! Some people prefer sacrificial bhakthi while others are happy looking at other people's sacrifices !. Test of Bhakthi to confirm the purity of one's soul is not resorted by GOD , now-a-days as he would have decided to make a lumpsum harvest by his avatar as kalki !

I really want to know what is true Bhakthi and how it is to be practiced ?

பற்றுக பற்றற்றான் பற்றினை அப்பற்றைப்
பற்றுக பற்று விடற்கு.

அதாவது பற்றில்லாதவனாகிய கடவுளை மட்டும் பற்றிக்கொள்ள
வேண்டும். மற்ற பற்றுகளை விடுவதற்கு இந்தப் பற்றைப் பற்றிக்-
கொள்ளவேண்டும். இபபடி செய்து வந்தால், அந்நிலை பிறவித்
துன்பத்தை ஒழிக்கும் என்கிறார் வள்ளுவர் :

பற்றற்ற கண்ணே பிறப்பறுக்கும் மற்று
நிலையாமை காணப்படும்.

 

[hariharan1972]

Dear Sri Vijisesh,
Lord Krishna talks of ' Kama and Krodha ' as one. If our desire is not fulfilled
or if some hurdle comes in the way, we get angry ( krodha ). So, if desire
can be avoided, there is no question of krodha.

Dear Sri NRR (hope you dont mind this)

These are really great words well spoken.

Not without reason does Valluvar also say

'Irandhar Irandhar inaiyar sinathai
Thurandhar Thurandhar thunai'

Anger Management is possibly the first step towards Anger avoidance. Also the role of desire in driving anger is very succinctly explained.

'aasai arumin aasai arumin eesanodaayinum aasai arumin'

Having said that, i wonder whether it is only 'desire' that fuels Anger ?

What is the role of Ego ?

 

[KRS]

Vow!

Dear Sri Hari,

You seem to have the grasp of the FUNdamentels, atleast as how I see it.

Ego is the root of everything that is not desirable, if you wish for the Ultimate.

But Ego is what you want if you want to shine in the Sun today.

This is the conundrum called Maya.

Regards,
KRS

 

[hariharan1972]

நன்றி திரு கே.ஆர்.எஸ் அவர்களே...

ஃபன்டமென்டல் என்று எழுதியதில் உங்கள் வார்த்தை விளையாட்டு அருமை.

திரு ரங்கனாதன் அவர்களே,

உங்கள் தமிழ் பதிவுகளை படிக்க படிக்க மகிழ்ச்சியாகயிருக்கிறது.
தொடரட்டும் உங்கள் நற்பணி.

நன்றியுடன்,
ஹரி.

 

[malgova.mango]

We superior in brain power is all wrong concepts.
The roots of good characters like humilty and passion to know the truth about anything, love for others - here not only material things but also for people in general all are diminishing day by day. so the power also vanish.
By adhering to discplines set by the elders and thirst for truth is the only way to get out of this present day situation.
Without Ishvara Bhakti and a relentless spirit of enquiry in us, how we can expect to gain the society's respect.
So we must do a lot of introspection and with the help of learned pandits , bring some discipline like doing sandhyavandanam and do spiritual enquires on world, life GOD etc..

In short, the trinity of Knowledge , Bhakti and discipline all the three should be practised as far as possible in the daily life.

Failing to do so will result in Asuric forces coming to play.


Namaskarms
Ram

 

[malgova.mango]

We superior in brain power is all wrong concepts.
The roots of good characters like humilty and passion to know the truth about anything, love for others - here not only material things but also for people in general all are diminishing day by day. so the power also vanish.
By adhering to discplines set by the elders and thirst for truth is the only way to get out of this present day situation.
Without Ishvara Bhakti and a relentless spirit of enquiry in us, how we can expect to gain the society's respect.
So we must do a lot of introspection and with the help of learned pandits , bring some discipline like doing sandhyavandanam and do spiritual enquires on world, life GOD etc..

In short, the trinity of Knowledge , Bhakti and discipline all the three should be practised as far as possible in the daily life.

Failing to do so will result in Asuric forces coming to play.


Namaskarms
Ram

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Malgova.Mango,

I like your name!

I agree with you!

I suppose you didn't equate brain power to the intellectual prowess. Because they are different!

We need brain power without which one cannot be a human being who is either a Brahmana, or Kshathriya or Vaisya or a Sudhra!

One needs intellectual prowess only to be a Brahmin!!

Who can tell that intellectual prowess is physical?

I say that the intellectual prowess is God given. God does not give because He is discriminatory. You have earned it as a poorva karma phala!

Some people do not consider this as the God given wealth but try to share with others! Can this be shared?!

Regards,

 

[lotus]

Namaskaram ,

Dear Malgova.Mango,

I like your name!

I agree with you!

I suppose you didn't equate brain power to the intellectual prowess. Because they are different!

We need brain power without which one cannot be a human being who is either a Brahmana, or Kshathriya or Vaisya or a Sudhra!

One needs intellectual prowess only to be a Brahmin!!

Who can tell that intellectual prowess is physical?

I say that the intellectual prowess is God given. God does not give because He is discriminatory. You have earned it as a poorva karma phala!

Some people do not consider this as the God given wealth but try to share with others! Can this be shared?!

Regards,

Intelligence is god given can be accepted if you consider your parents as god which now a days is called genetic. It is not true brahmins have superior power because of god. Several decades back we had an advantage in education & so appeared to be smart. I said only appeared to be.

If any body still imagine that they are smarter than others please drop it.Instead try to be hardworking , disciplined and more important now a days is social networking which is a v tough for south indian brahmins.Give atleast 4hrs a week for socialising with other tha your family members.

Thanks

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Lotus,

'Intellect' and 'intelligence' are two different things. Intellect refers to what we call Buddhi.

Don't you remember that we pray "BhagavaanE nalla Buddhi kudu"? If we get it from the parents then there is no sense praying for it from Bhagavan!

Intelligence is everything about being smart but that does not include Buddhi.

Buddhi is that faculty which knows the real from the unreal where 'real' is that which is 'saaswatham' and unreal is the fickle.

At the time of the Upanayanam when a boy passes from the childhood, he is given the secret manthra of Gayathri which in effect is a prayer to the deity Savithri that says: "Please incite my intellect so I can know the real from the unreal".

Intelligence on the contrary is 'gathered' from parents and from everyone out there.

If I have to give some analogy I would put it this way. You can win a battle with intelligence but you need buddhi to win a war!

 

[malgova.mango]

Namskarams


Thanks for your compliments regarding the name and agreeing with other things.


Your term Intellectual Prowess – i really don't understand. I mean prowess is ability , so intellectual ability. This is what i conclude. Then Brain power, is it not equal to intellectual ability ?


In another blog with Lotus you said buddhi is something given by god and not genetics,,, sorry i could not follow you.
Buddhi and intelligent is it not the same term expressed in different languages.


The body given by parents, can be improved by proper diet, yoga and exercise. Is this not applied to buddhi also inherited but still can be improved by enquiry,concentration etc... We also pray Bhagvan please give shakti – ie health and not only buddhi.


Concluding the term buddhi , intellectual ability and brain powers are all synonoms. Am i correct to say that.


To know the real from unreal is the function of the above term.


Am I communicating?


I also don't understand your question about sharing?


Another thing it is stated clearly in the following sloka, no body by birth becomes brahmana only by knowing the brahmam that is the equation between oneself and “Ishvara “ one become brahmana.


“ JANMANA JAYATE SHUDRA” - By Birth one is Shudra
“ KARMANA DVIJA UCHYATE” - By the action of the ritual upanayanam he becomes the twice born


half baked state.


“VEDA PATENA VIPRASYAT:- By learning Vedas he is ready to receive the knowledge.
“BRAHMANO BRAHMA VEDANA” - By knowing the brahmam he become a brahmana.


Fully baked.


So without any commitment to pursuit of knowledge (here spritual knowledge), to call oneself as brahmin is like living in a bubble.


So sorry if I've hurt any body''s sentiments or feelings in experssing what I felt.


Namskarams
Ram

 

[vijisesh]

Friends,

A quick browse at the exchanges in Pages 9,10 reveals that " We are back to square one disputing on - Why *** *** the Brahmin is superior ?? "
Sorry for a harsh choice of word used !
We just need to focus on the job ahead ! after discussing so long , it doesn't matter any more if one consider's himself to be superior over the other or not !
Assume that you are superior if you have any objections for that reason , BUT move ahead !
Once in the elated level of your supremacy , concentrate , think of How best a Brainy brahmin could've utilised his Life effectively or can plan the pathway ahead ?
what does he lack , in general !!
The bottom line is Unless you have the sufficient Intellectual prowess or the intellect - call it whatever , let's say some specially given gift by GOD , many Brahmins would have been brainwashed and would've resorted to animal behaviour !
On the contrary , we think and then Act , rather than Act first and repent later !
So using this Advantage , given by GOD, how effectively can we use our thought process , our concentration capacity and our intellect to lay down simple rules and procedures that can be easy to follow and at the same time logical for the forthcoming generations !
So please move ahead !

Thanks !

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Malgova.mango,

I suppose your name is also Ram. Raama naamame Malgova maambazhame!

Ok, now coming to your last post ostensibly addressed to me, please do read my postings in this thread once more posted on the following dates and times.

11-12-2007, 10:26 AM
Yesterday, 05:19 PM
Today, 01:42 AM

Before I attempt to answer please let me do my prayers:

"Bhagavan Dhakshinamurthy! Please show your karuna kataaksham to all those who are trapped inside the invisible walls of avidya! Aum"

Let me split your doubts and try to answer one by one.

First and foremost we have to understand is:

1. All physical things are observeable, understandable, measureable.

2. Tools of observation, understanding and measurements are also physical. They cannot be otherwise.

3. The body and its parts such as brain are physical and have the same characteristics in terms of knowing it as given in (1) above.

4. The tools of observation such as eye and other sense organs and their extensions such as telescopes and so on and the coordinator of them in a human body viz. the mind are physical. The eye, ear, even brain etc. are observable whereas the mind is only inferred. For example, You may be looking like seeing me but if you are thinking of something else you are not actually seeing me!


5. We then infer that which prevented you from seeing me even though your eyes were fixed on me, as the mind which by its thought process acts and reacts. That is it makes your body move, perform karma.

6. The function of the brain which is a part of the physical body is in the making of effective use of the other parts of the body for the well being of the whole body. It is the CPU the store house of intelligence.

7. The above applies to all living organisms not necessarily confined to the humans.

Do you have any questions on these?

 

[vijisesh]

Dear Vijisesh,


Can a non-Brahmin become a Brahmin? The answer to this lies in the my underlined sentence above.

Dear Sri Ramaa,

Very Good question !

I really do not know whether I am right or wrong but may be the following could well have happened .............

Long Long ago , when the varna system would have been formed , people from the other caste's had been busy with the activities scheduled and prescribed for them , the shatriya flexing his muscles , developing his skills of armory, the vaishya developing their skills on mesmerizing people by their business skills and the shudra's - poor one's doing the lower end jobs !

Although some Brahmin's would have spent major part of their lifetime , brainwashing and controlling other people's brains and getting their job done / making merry in their lives with their intellectual advantage and knowledge superiority over the rest !

Majority of the brahmins however would have kept themselves away from the mundane affairs , seeking the Unknown and developing their IQ's , practicising a disciplined life style and establishing their feats on some thing they would be good at , may be music , may be science or any part of astrology , etc etc.

Now it could have happened that the parents of the children from the people of the other castes would have pointed to the brahmin child around as guide's for their children , appreciating their disciplined life style , strict prayer routine , following rituals systematically and having better overall knowledge over other's .

So over the passage of generations , some the children from the other caste's have been more effective and proved to be better humanitarians as they have the IDEAL to pursue !

But the Brahmin boys are lost !!! More so the relaxed hindu religion , makes life so easy , Nothing compulsory ! Anything can be questioned in the religion and the poor parents do not have sufficient knowledge to give a logical reasoning for their children's queries !! A pitiable state !
-- Also , majority of the prayers are done to satisfy the ego's of parents and relatives !! out of compulsion and may be to make their parents happy -- No real DRIVE for getting the best of what GOD has given !!!

So if this stage continues , the a non-Brahmin becomes a Brahmin !! - if ever they desire !!
and the Brahmins by birth should be at a comparatively lower level , in the eyes of GOD !

 

[Chintana]

Vijisesh,

I edited out the bad word you used in your posting. Please use other words in the vocabulary that are effective in conveying your thoughts.

Chintana

Friends,

A quick browse at the exchanges in Pages 9,10 reveals that " We are back to square one disputing on - Why *** *** the Brahmin is superior ?? "
Sorry for a harsh choice of word used !
We just need to focus on the job ahead ! after discussing so long , it doesn't matter any more if one consider's himself to be superior over the other or not !
Assume that you are superior if you have any objections for that reason , BUT move ahead !
Once in the elated level of your supremacy , concentrate , think of How best a Brainy brahmin could've utilised his Life effectively or can plan the pathway ahead ?
what does he lack , in general !!
The bottom line is Unless you have the sufficient Intellectual prowess or the intellect - call it whatever , let's say some specially given gift by GOD , many Brahmins would have been brainwashed and would've resorted to animal behaviour !
On the contrary , we think and then Act , rather than Act first and repent later !
So using this Advantage , given by GOD, how effectively can we use our thought process , our concentration capacity and our intellect to lay down simple rules and procedures that can be easy to follow and at the same time logical for the forthcoming generations !
So please move ahead !

Thanks !

 

[vijisesh]

Vijisesh,

I edited out the bad word you used in your posting. Please use other words in the vocabulary that are effective in conveying your thoughts.

Chintana

Thanks Chinthana, the Stars (asterisks) look better and appropriate rather than the words used !Anyway i am trying to look for better words that can ADD VALUE to what I wish to convey !

 

[kannan]

Welcome Mr.Kannan,

Good thoughts ! but a few of them in my opinion are pro-active than
Re-active !
Let me explain - i am certain about the fact that the Brahmins are
indeed superior and this is a well known fact between u and me and the
others.
They feel superior within themselves , coming from such a community !

And To accomplish something against odds facing the Brahmins , one
needs to have the ' Killer Instinct '. When you can bear atrocities over
generations, when you are given the right kind of respect , show the
world what you are capable of - at the right time !

Take all the time in the world to plan your assault ! that's what we're
doing here!

points from kannan :

There is no doubt about the fact that a strong defence is to be built for the brahmins though the killer instinct should be confined to the quick reaction energy for making the world around the world, through peaceful means to realise the truth and then through a wide public opinion. Any effort towards this goal may not be sucessful if we isolate ourselves from the rest of the human population.
It was possible for the God incarnate Parasurama to suppress the Kshatriyas with his power of Arms since that was the order of the that period. But in today's world, the power of public opinion reigns over others. This is a proven fact that the whole world condemns the USA for its attack on Iraq and the final after effects are yet to be seen.
I fully agree with your point that we have to plan for our assault on those who attack us. We have, in my opinion, the following options, to begin with.

1. To work towards making ourself strong with strong educational base, for which we should seek the status of minority in tamil nadu on the grounds of our Aryan race, as the others call us. We being only around 10 % of the TN population where the rest 90 % call themselves Dravidians and rule the state with utter disregards to the brahmin community. In this context, a true definition of religion ( for distinct religious dharma assigned for brahmins by the Vedas) may help us for attaining minority status on religious grounds as well as that of the Aryan race.

2. We should start our own university where our children can get the best education iwith ample opportunity to persue the vedic studies right from the young age.

3. The order of the day is to recognise efficiency and our children will undoubtedly be in the fore front.

4. We should shape ourselves as a strong body caring for the public and our selective professions should include journalism, medias including Tv, cenema etc.

5. We can discuss more and more from now on>

Regards

 

[hariharan1972]

நண்பர்களே,

இந்த திரியின் மைய்ய கருத்து யாதென்று எனக்கு விளங்கவில்லை.
அதாவது திரியின் தலைப்பு 'பிராமணர்களின் சக்தி - ஒரு பின்னோக்கிய பார்வை' என்று தலைப்பிடப்பட்டு கருத்து பரிமாற்றங்கள் வேறு திசையில் போவது போல எனக்கு ஒரு உணர்வு.

அறிஞர்கள் சபையில் கேட்பதை விட்டு பேசுவது அறிவீனம் என்று அறிந்த போதும் என் சிறுமதிக்கெட்டிய சில வார்த்தைகள்

1. பிறப்பாலேயே யதார்த்த வாழ்வுக்கு தேவையான அறிவாற்றல், அதாவது புற அறிவு, பிராமணர்களுக்கு உண்டு என்பது ஏற்க முடியாத ஒரு நிலைப்பாடு

2. அக அறிவு, பிராமணர்கள் வளர்த்துக்கொண்டார்கள். அதாவது இறைப்பற்றை சார்ந்த வாழ்வியல் முறையை பின் பற்றியதாலும், 'தான் யார், தான் தோன்றியதன் காரணமென்ன' என்ற தேடலும் பிராமணர்களுக்கு இருந்தமையால் அவர்களால் 'இறையை' எளிதில் அறிய முடிந்தது.

3. இறையை அறிந்ததனாலேயே மறையையும் அவர்களால் உருவாக்க முடிந்தது.

4. இது இதுவரை கடந்து வந்த பாதை.

5. இனி என்ன ? என்று பார்க்கையில் நாம், நமது முன்னோர்களால் வகுக்கப்பட்ட வாழ்க்கை முறைக்கு மீண்டும் செல்லுதல் என்பது முடியாத ஒன்று.

6. ஆக இனி, பிராமணர்கள், யதார்த்த வாழ்க்கையும், வாழ்வியல் முறையும் இணைந்த ஒரு வாழ்க்கை நெறியை வகுக்க வேண்டும் என்பதே என் கருத்து.

 

[KRS]

Dear Sri Hari,

Can hardly read Tamil nowadays, but I understood the essence.

'Thathasthu'

Pranams,
KRS[



quote=hariharan1972;10335]நண்பர்களே,

இந்த திரியின் மைய்ய கருத்து யாதென்று எனக்கு விளங்கவில்லை.
அதாவது திரியின் தலைப்பு 'பிராமணர்களின் சக்தி - ஒரு பின்னோக்கிய பார்வை' என்று தலைப்பிடப்பட்டு கருத்து பரிமாற்றங்கள் வேறு திசையில் போவது போல எனக்கு ஒரு உணர்வு.

அறிஞர்கள் சபையில் கேட்பதை விட்டு பேசுவது அறிவீனம் என்று அறிந்த போதும் என் சிறுமதிக்கெட்டிய சில வார்த்தைகள்

1. பிறப்பாலேயே யதார்த்த வாழ்வுக்கு தேவையான அறிவாற்றல், அதாவது புற அறிவு, பிராமணர்களுக்கு உண்டு என்பது ஏற்க முடியாத ஒரு நிலைப்பாடு

2. அக அறிவு, பிராமணர்கள் வளர்த்துக்கொண்டார்கள். அதாவது இறைப்பற்றை சார்ந்த வாழ்வியல் முறையை பின் பற்றியதாலும், 'தான் யார், தான் தோன்றியதன் காரணமென்ன' என்ற தேடலும் பிராமணர்களுக்கு இருந்தமையால் அவர்களால் 'இறையை' எளிதில் அறிய முடிந்தது.

3. இறையை அறிந்ததனாலேயே மறையையும் அவர்களால் உருவாக்க முடிந்தது.

4. இது இதுவரை கடந்து வந்த பாதை.

5. இனி என்ன ? என்று பார்க்கையில் நாம், நமது முன்னோர்களால் வகுக்கப்பட்ட வாழ்க்கை முறைக்கு மீண்டும் செல்லுதல் என்பது முடியாத ஒன்று.

6. ஆக இனி, பிராமணர்கள், யதார்த்த வாழ்க்கையும், வாழ்வியல் முறையும் இணைந்த ஒரு வாழ்க்கை நெறியை வகுக்க வேண்டும் என்பதே என் கருத்து.[/quote]

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Sri Vijisesh,

You have spun a good logic. However there is flaw in it!

I observe that your thought process is only in one direction either uphill or downhill.

It is like going from weakness to strength, from nothing to something, for example, from a sapling to a fruit laden tree;

OR

on the lines of thinking that things go from good to bad, from something to nothing, such as a young and energetic boy would grow into a haggard old man and dies.

Though both have ingredients of nature, one excludes the other!

You have to integrate both! Be cautious not to make it spiraling because it would still go only up! We should not lose sight of the fact that there is both jeeva and Easwara are involved in this world. We can only do things that we have been made capable of doing!

Think cyclically, something of a horizontal nature. The driving aspect is still the four different prowess of the mankind, each excuding the other. Yet it has a 'nidhanam' aspect to go down. A Brahmin can easily become a Kshathriya, Vaisya or a Sudhra. A Kshathriya can become a Vaisya or a Sudhra and the Vaisya can become a Sudhra. As they say 'one swallow does not make a summer' one or few or many Brahmins becoming a Kshathriya or a Vaisya at some time or some length of time isn't the destruction of the Varna system per se. But the motion in the opposite direction would definitely vitiate the four-fold varna. Bhagavan takes care of this aspect. Those who do not like it may challenge Bhagavan!

This is the view that is contested by modern so called 'humansists'. Varna system is integral to Sanathana Dharma. These 'humanists' would want to redefine Hinduism to suit their convenience.

They can have a religion of their own with their own definition. I have no problem. After all hundreds of religions have sprung up on earth in its long history and starting another one would make no difference.

The problem with them is that they want to bury the old view in order to advance their new one. They join the EVR-MK gang in some subtle way. They do not want to understand and appreciate the rationale behind the Sanathana Dharma as a whole but want to sit in judgement over those who follow and condemn then as inhuman. They remain trigger happy in their judgements! They have a firm view that their interpretation of Dharma is the right one!

We have seen the dastardly attacks of the EVR and Mu.Ka. variety. We are also seeing the subtle 'intellectual' attacks of the neo-humanist variety.

Can't do much about it. After all Sanathana Dharma is ancient and eternal. It will never die so it is ever fresh!

 

[malgova.mango]

Dear Ramaa.


Your hicuu poem “rama namame malgova mambahame “ is sweet.


And thanks for your prayers and your efforts to split my doubt. I venture to suggest that you should include yourself inside the prayers.


Before you proceed , Let me explain what I understand


Shastric definition


Manas – mind – That which feels, pleasure and pain, desire and anger is manas


Buddhi – Intellect – That which analyze and decides is buddhi.


Brain – The important organ responsible for the above two to operate.


Any dispute?


Of course manas or buddhi – mind operates in sychronisation with sense , if out of synch we can't feel. No need to explain further.


Now your goal


To explain between intellectual prowess (or ability) and intellect. Because you want me to understand the difference.

Have a go.

Regards

Ram

 

[malgova.mango]

Dear all


the discussion start –


how brahmins with supposedly superior intelligence can be a model in current society?


before proceeding further,we need to analyse whether the above statement is water tight or not? if we don't and assume the above as per se and continued it is like building a house without foundation.


So we analyse the word Brahmin now


in my previous chat i've quoted a sloka which states clearly the definition of a brahmin.


to repeat , it is like butterfly life cycle where it cross 3 stages and finally evolve into the 4th stage. then only it is called butterfly. before that it has the potential to become butterfly but not a butterfly.
(could any one justify why it got the name butterfly, someone please suggest another name ???? of course i'll name it “ARTISTFLY” , “SKYARTIST” )


supposedly superior intelligence.


Big words.




May be this assumption is from our abiltiy to pass on the vedas intact from generation to generation in a oral tradition. Which means we need to have a high memory power to do so.


Reflecting on “eels” a kind of fish which breeds in fresh water and travels to ocean for feeding and return back to the same birth place travelling thousands of kilometers. I'm sure they can easily beat us in terms of memory. Not to mention migratory birds with navigation and memory skills.
Nowadays we have another competitor – computer. Just can't beat it.


May be this assumption is from our ability to build temples,towns, rituals etc.. but please remember all this are in Vedas and we act as a tool in bringing out what is said. Nowadays we can't exercise this also as the present administrators have no inclination in following Vedas in fact they are very much eager to do just the opposite of what is said.


Reflecting on the buildability, Bees or doing great isn't it? The bee hives and the nest of “thukkanang kuruvi” “karaiyan puttru” all shows high degree of intelligence isn't it?




Wait


I can hear grinding of teeth by somebody.... before he starts to swear. I suggest why not the topic be like this –


“Seeking fresh ideas for how to serve the society in current context keeping in line with the principles of our tradition”


Forgive my impertinence.


Just for thoughts yar......... no offence please . “Naan oru sadhuana aal”


good day


premaiyudan


Ram

 

[malgova.mango]

Iyya - neer solluvathu murrilum unmai

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Sri Hariji,

3. இறையை அறிந்ததனாலேயே மறையையும் அவர்களால் உருவாக்க முடிந்தது.

நீங்கள் சொல்வது சரியே அல்ல. மறை யாராலும் உருவாக்கப்பட்டது என்ற வாதம் ஒப்புக்கொள்ள இயலாது. நிரூபிக்க முடியாத கூற்று.

இறையைத் தெறிந்து கொள்ளவே மறை.

Let me switch over to English as it is easy to type though Tamil is a good medium to convey ideas.

After reading your contention, the question that would rise is:

1. How did a person know 'Brahman'? On what basis? On what support?

If I tell you how to know 'Brahman', I would then say that my basis is the Veda. Because for imparting knowledge of Brahman any other source is invalid. This is not a mere assertion for those who have known 'Brahman' have testified it. All I could say therefore would be: "Find out for yourself if it is true or not."

2. If a person has known 'Brahman' then he does not have the necessity to create the Veda. Knowing 'Brahman' is knowing that nothing else is real except Himself. For whom would he then 'create' the Veda?

3. Veda is therefore beginningless which means there is no cause or beginning to it. Those who find it difficult to accept it is consumed by 'avidya'. Only God's Grace can change it for them. In Soundarya Lahari, Aadhi Sankara says:

"Avidyaanaam andhasthimira mihiradhveepanagari..."

"For those who have drowned in the darkness of avidya that resembles like thick forest with dense canopies that would not let in the sun's rays, that he does not know east from the west and thus have no sense of direction, AmbaaL's Grace would be like putting him on top of a hill in the midst of an island where his vision is unobstructed and that he is endowed with the complete light of knowledge...(!)"

 

[Ramaa]

Dear Sri Malgova Mango,

It is a myth to say that people pray for others. Everyone prays only for himself!

After reading your reply, I realize that you are endowed with superior knowledge so I withdraw myself from discussing with you.