Upanayanam

[Haridasa Siva]

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Smt.RR's posts at 44 and 46 are like an eye-opener for me. Good thinking and good organising.

I did not advocate being miserly not to celebrate occasions. I do stress the need to share our wealth but for a purpose and to people to whom it matters. I celebrated my daughter's punyahavachanam like anybody else but also undertook the expenditure for a full day meal for all the inmates of 'Udavum Karangal'. Charity is a pleasure.

For my father's first year anniversary, I sponsored 4 day meal for all the inmates of an old age home, where my father celebrated his last birthday. It is important that the haves share their wealth with the have-nots.

"Oruththarukkaa koduththaar illai oorukkaaga koduththaar".....

 

[Raji Ram]

Smt.RR's posts at 44 and 46 are like an eye-opener for me. Good thinking and good organising. ..........

I guess you mean the posts # 42 and # 44! :decision:

 

[vikrama]

I agree with Sri Brahmanyan that money is meant for changing hands. But fun and frolic should not obscure the religiosity of the occasion. The difference between others and us is that our forefathers considered marriage as a religious obligation to acquit ourselves of our debts to our forefathers. Others consider marriage as a social contract and when one party does not fulfill his/her part the other is free to get it dissolved. Let us maintain the sanctity of institutions like marriage, upanayanam etc. and then we are free to engage ourselves in all sorts of luxuries.

The balancing is a delicate act and if we succeed in it, the community will be glorified and be a role model for others to follow.

Two months ago, I attended the marriage of a friend. In the evening, inside the marriage hall there was a veritable bazaar of free eateries. One could choose, 1 traditional South Indian meals or 2 iddly, dosai, puri, pongal 3 Gujarati Thali, or 4 pani puri etc or 5 tender coconuts or 6 ice cream, sugar cane and other juices etc. each in a different corner of the hall. Of course the organizers were well off and could afford to spend more. But what a waste of resources and labour! Who am I to preach frugality to those people? But the brazen manner in which the pomp was displayed did annoy me and I could not taste any item of the dinner since my conscience wept for the have-nots just outside the mandapam. I gave my packet of sweets with a little money to one of them and came home with a heavy mind.

luxury is something above the normal. It should not be abnormal.

 

[mahakavi]

To pursue your "kadan vAngik kalyANam" further should the next line be "kalyANam paNNiyum brahmachAri"? ---because after borrowing so much the parents cannot recover from the debt and want their daughter to stay with them and earn to pay off the debt?

 

[Iyyarooraan]

Lakshmi has chanchal buddhi. I agree it should change hands. How can it change from empty hand to itching hand. This difference is conveniently forgotten in the cloak of reasonableness, demands, requirements and other ego-centric options. And here we are cursing each other in this forum.

 

[tbs]

hi
kalyanam panni paaar....veettai katti paar...in both places minimum can be possible...maximum can be possible in the hands of thaai kulam....many times we do for others satisfaction........http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gfOuldRWzU..

 

[mahakavi]

Very true! Everybody should only view their own circumstances. You never know what are the inner doings in other households. What appears may be deceptive. Unfortunately thAykkulam goes by perceptions, mostly(as seen in the edir neechal song). Ambition and aspiration are needed to get ahead in life but they may also get you astray if reason does not prevail. ​AsaikkOr aLavillai akhilamellam kaTTi ALinum....

 

[Raghy]

Dear Sri. Vikrama, Greetings.

The balancing is a delicate act and if we succeed in it, the community will be glorified and be a role model for others to follow.

Two months ago, I attended the marriage of a friend. In the evening, inside the marriage hall there was a veritable bazaar of free eateries. One could choose, 1 traditional South Indian meals or 2 iddly, dosai, puri, pongal 3 Gujarati Thali, or 4 pani puri etc or 5 tender coconuts or 6 ice cream, sugar cane and other juices etc. each in a different corner of the hall. Of course the organizers were well off and could afford to spend more. But what a waste of resources and labour! Who am I to preach frugality to those people? But the brazen manner in which the pomp was displayed did annoy me and I could not taste any item of the dinner since my conscience wept for the have-nots just outside the mandapam. I gave my packet of sweets with a little money to one of them and came home with a heavy mind.

On the eve of our son's wedding such a 'bazaar' was set up including a 'beeda stall' by the catering contractor. He offered various menus as a package and charged per head. Once my son chose the package, I actually sat down and worked out the cost of such a buffet meal by charging each item. I found out that contractor chaged me less per head since he considered ordering in bulk. He also supplied persons to serve those dishes almost thrown in. My only doubt was, can people actually eat so many varities in one evening.... To my pleasant surprise, most persons tried almost all the varieties. There was no wastage either. They just prepared as they were serving. Everyone said it was a very tasty buffet ( I did not know. I had other things to do. By the time I got there, all the serving team were having their dinner. I joined them and ate curd rice and bisibela bath; that's it. Of course, their supervisor offered to make more varieties just for me but I declined). My point is, such 'bazaar' setups are made by the contractor just for the show;it doesn't cost any extra. ( if my memory serves me right, it costed about Rs.400 per head). (I don't know if spending about Rs.400 is considered as abnormal luxury though. Some of our relatives thought it was very economical and took that contractor's contact details with them).

Cheers!

 

[Raghy]

Sowbagyavathy RR, Greetings.

I refer to to your message in post #44. I thought most marriages take place as you have mentioned. Our son's wedding took place almost like that. Most of the points were covered. The number of guests were not 400.. not even 200. Less than that. There was no formal reception ( I didn't agree to reception before wedding). There was a great Saxophone concert to go with ( he played all carnatic songs and he was good. I just loved it. But could not sit down to enjoy it though. Others did). Vadhyar made a big fuss about groom's desire to wear sherwani.... I had to convince him though.

Cheers!

 

[Raji Ram]

......... Vadhyar made a big fuss about groom's desire to wear sherwani.... I had to convince him though. .....

Sri. Raghy Sir, Greetings!

I do not like the 'semi-bare' outfit of the brahmin grooms!! Poor guys! They are forced to wear the traditional dress in all the

weddings in India, as far as I know. For the reception, sherwani is allowed and most of the guys prefer that to a regular suit.

The muhurtham of the wedding I wrote about was in the morning and the reception, in the same evening at Woodlands. The

grooms father is a lover of carnatic music, entertains all the vidhwAns who visit the US and very close to many of them

including the famous 'Cleveland' Sundaram. I forgot to mention one important wish of that gentleman. He wanted us to buy 16

garlands for the reception and we were taken aback!! 16?? Y?? Then he explained that he will read an appreciation of each of

the invited 16 Carnatic artists for about two minutes and honor them with a garland! He had brought his OWN audio system

for the flute concert by Sri. Ramani. (He hates the shrieking sounds that a few mike systems make, in SingArach Chennai!)

PS: Ram and I were the main hosts - bill was sent to the bride's father, though!! ound:

Regards .....

 

[sarang]

What will happen if the wedding invitation is printed as in the old days - "பந்து மித்ரர்களோடு ஐந்து நாள் முன்னதாக வந்து". All the relatives landed in advance, relatives, friends and neighbours were fed decently on all the five wedding days.

 

[Raji Ram]

I must tell about the sambandhi mAmi of one of my sisters-in-law, who announced to all her relatives, NOT to land in her

house when they came to attend her son's wedding, in SingArach Chennai! They were all requested (threatened?!) to come

directly to the mandapam for 'vratham' on the first day and leave soon after lunch on the wedding day! For 'gruhapravEsam'

of the bride, ONLY the parents of the bride were taken along with them.

PS: We have not visited them in their house even once in these twenty years!! :lock1:

 

[tbs]

I am also surprised to read the 'anti mAmiyAr' concept of TBS Sir!

If it is real, then his wife should be really afraid even to talk to him!! :fear:

hi RR madam,
in fact my wife was supported and appreciated me....she knows very well abt her mom.....if she is there....she might give ginstructions to vadhyaar/cooks etc....like a running commentary....my wife was very happy without her mom....even my mom
had problem with vadhyaar....but i cannot avoid everybody....my mom is in chennai and my mamiyaar is in delhi....so poonal went
on very welll.....even my daughter was not able to attend poonal....she had MCAT test in USA.....no regrets and no complaints...

 

[mahakavi]

TBS:
By virtue of the authority not conferred on me let me absolve you of the charges heaped on you. Just kidding!!!!
This is where one should analyze all the facts before coming to the conclusion. But all the facts were not known earlier.
Thanks for the clarification.:embarassed:

 

[Naina_Marbus]

TBS:
By virtue of the authority not conferred on me let me absolve you of the charges heaped on you. Just kidding!!!!
This is where one should analyze all the facts before coming to the conclusion. But all the facts were not known earlier.
Thanks for the clarification.:embarassed:

Not unlike the famous situation arising from the utterance "Aswathama Hathaha … (Kunjaraha)"

 

[Raji Ram]

Hi TBS Sir!

I have also seen a few mamis like your dear (!) MIL.

:gossip: . . . I would like to meet her if I go to Delhi!! ( Not in bold letters because this is a secret... :lol: )

 

[Iyyarooraan]

What will happen if the wedding invitation is printed as in the old days - "பந்து மித்ரர்களோடு ஐந்து நாள் முன்னதாக வந்து". All the relatives landed in advance, relatives, friends and neighbours were fed decently on all the five wedding days.

யாரா இருந்தாலும் தொலைஞ்சான். ஆனால் ஒன்று. தொலைவதற்கு முன்னாடி நம்ம கையிலே கொஞ்சம் காசு புரளும். கடன் கொடுப்பதற்கு எத்தனை பேர் நாயாக அலைகிறார்கள் தெரியுமா?

 

[tbs]

யாரா இருந்தாலும் தொலைஞ்சான். ஆனால் ஒன்று. தொலைவதற்கு முன்னாடி நம்ம கையிலே கொஞ்சம் காசு புரளும். கடன் கொடுப்பதற்கு எத்தனை பேர் நாயாக அலைகிறார்கள் தெரியுமா?

hi iyyarooran,
நீங்கள் சொல்வது நிஜம் தான்...அயிந்து பொன்னை பெத்தவன் மட்டும் ஆண்டி அல்ல .....இந்த மாதிரி கல்யாணம் செஞ்சவனும் ஆண்டி தான்....இந்த மாதிரி
கஷ்டம் எனக்கும் வந்திருக்கும்....என் திருமணம் டெல்ஹியில் நடந்தது....எல்லோரும் ஹரித்வார் /ரிஷிகேஷ் என்று பிளான் பண்ணினார்கள்....ஆனால்
என் தாயின் உத்தரவுபடி....நாங்கள் யாரேயும் அழக்கைவில்லை.....இல்லாவிட்டால் என் கல்யாண கடன் பத்து வருஷமானாலும் தீராது....நான் தப்பித்து
கொண்டேன்....ஆண்டவனுக்கு நன்றி சொல்ல வேண்டும்....

 

[mahakavi]

>>ஆண்டவனுக்கு நன்றி சொல்ல வேண்டும்...<<

entha ANDavanukku---rishikEsh ANDavanukkA alladhu haridwAr ANDavanukkA? avargaLil oruvar thAnE ungaLaith thappikka vaiththanar?

 

[Raji Ram]

...........என் திருமணம் டெல்ஹியில் நடந்தது....எல்லோரும் ஹரித்வார் /ரிஷிகேஷ் என்று பிளான் பண்ணினார்கள்....ஆனால் என் தாயின் உத்தரவுபடி....நாங்கள் யாரையும் அழைக்கவில்லை .....இல்லாவிட்டால், என் கல்யாணக் கடன் பத்து வருஷமானாலும் தீராது....நான் தப்பித்துக்கொண்டேன்....ஆண்டவனுக்கு நன்றி சொல்ல வேண்டும்....

Dear TBS Sir! முதல் நன்றி, யோசனை சொன்ன உங்கள் தாய்க்குத்தான்!

அருமையான தாயைத் தந்த ஆண்டவனுக்கு, அடுத்த நன்றி! :hail:

 

[sudeshwer]

It may not be opt to mention this incident; yet, I wish to share with my TBs. I was attending Aviniavittam in California, USA. Sashtrigal announced that 'thalai aviniavittam' persons should come and sit in the front. one person got up and enquired if he also has to come to the front since this is the first year of his marriage; there was loud laugh and the Sashtrigal told him that he will have only 'thalai diwali' and he should go to his mamanar's house.

 

[mahakavi]

The person was not wrong in asking because "thalai" means prime or first and foremost (apart from the meaning of head). After wedding you get to wear two bundles of three strands each which marks a new beginning. The upanayanam initiates the person into brahminhood (similar to bar mitzvah in Jews) and the boy gets only one bundle of three stands.

Another possibility for the thalai AvaNi aviTTam for a recently married person is when he got the upanayanam on the day (or the previous day) of his wedding. This thalai deepAvaLi business was a ruse for bridegroom's parent(s) to extract more material goods from the girl's parents. There is no evidence for any religiosity in that. If I were in charge I would banish the thalai deepAvaLi business. If you want to celebrate it the couple can have their own second honeymoon in an exotic place at their own expense.

 

[Raghy]

What will happen if the wedding invitation is printed as in the old days - "பந்து மித்ரர்களோடு ஐந்து நாள் முன்னதாக வந்து". All the relatives landed in advance, relatives, friends and neighbours were fed decently on all the five wedding days.

Sri. Sarang, Greetings.

Actually, I wanted to do it for our son's marriage. I was willing to pay for it; but bride's family didn't agree. In those days they went 5 days ahead...quite possible. They did all the preparations, made all the sweets etc., did all the work, cooked... the whole works. Possibly they didn't even engage a sashtri/vadhyar, may be they had one or two amoung the relatives. Come to think of it, it's only expense for the feed. Possibly they even shared it. I think it would have costed less if we did all the work ourselves... importantly, we would have known each other better, the relationship would have strengthened.... such adavantages are missing in today's contract oriented marriages.

Cheers!

 

[Raji Ram]

......... I think it would have costed less if we did all the work ourselves... importantly, we would have known each other better, the relationship would have strengthened.... such adavantages are missing in today's contract oriented marriages.

Cool idea, Raghy Sir!! But, who is ready to work / cook?

Ladies wish to have their 'mehandhi', 'hair do'-s etc done to enhance their beauty and have no inclination to trouble themselves

with any hard work. My eldest sister sat in front of the 'kodi aduppu' to fry the 'seer murukku' for her wedding, in the year

1966, when four of my mother's friend maamis had come to make the 'murukku', 'muththusaram' and three sweets for the

seer 'bakshaNam'. In those days, it was the full 'seer' which means 101 each of the five varieties of 'seer bakshaNams'.

My mother also was one of the 'murukku' makers!! Can we imagine any bride of today do such work! They start the 'bridal'

make-up sittings - about 5 or 6 - months before the wedding.

Even if about 20 people come for a small function, a caterer in arranged along with some persons to serve the food!!

In the Ayyappan pooja I attended last Sunday, the ladies in the house were grumbling because the caterer did NOT send
guys to serve the food to the 50 people who had assembled there. :grouphug:

 

[vikrama]

Degeneration sets in when people, as a community, refuse to work.