Growing Old Gracefully!

[sangom]

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Ten Golden Rules for Old Age:

The following tips appeared years ago in a Malayalam weekly. I have tried to translate them into English to the best of my ability. There was one more advice:

Simplify your life rather than trying to lead a simple life.

1. Avoid excessive talk, especially the tendency that we can and should talk and express our opinion on anything and everything at all times.

2. Let us not be under the false impression that we can find a solution for every problem of every one, because we are more experienced.

3. Let us cultivate the thinking habit but not become sullen.

4. Let us try to be helpful to others but let not that create a possessiveness in our minds.

5. Let us try to cultivate a circle of friends with whom we can share our thoughts and views.

6. Let us not equivocate or get into the habit of being garrulous. Let us be factual as far as possible.

7. Let us not talk about our physical and mental agonies and let us maintain silence on these; if we start talking about these, which will go on increasing as age advances,
our keenness to make others aware of our suffering will also increase and that will only cause pain to them.

8. Let us have the awareness that we may be fallible more often than we think ourselves to be.

9. Let us not ponder over past life too much, accumulate a sense of regret and become moody.

10. Let us cultivate the capacity to enjoy the good aspects of life without creating troubles for others.

 

[sankara_sharmah]

The period starting from the when you retire or quit your job is one of the most important periods of a man's life. Most of us work to earn money. Not many enjoy their work. We are bound by the rules of the organization we work for.

Once you quit your job, you are free to do whatever you want. Fix your own schedule. You get your independence.

But many of us are not prepared for this independence. We are scared of this. Because of this there is a tendency to take up a job after retirement. May be some of us are still financially in need of a job. I can understand their taking a job. But why do people who are not in need of the salary take up a job.

உத்யோகம் புருஷ லக்ஷணம். Often quoted saying. But is it applicable to people who have worked for 30 to 35 years? Definitely not.

You feel totally at a loss for quite some time after leaving your job. The initial period is tough.

Surprisingly being Brahmins who swear by the Ashrama dharma, how come we never think of Vanaprastha Asrama?

The householder (grihastha), discharging his debts to his ancestors by begetting sons and to the gods by sacrificing; then retire (as a vanaprastha), with or without his wife, to the forest to devote himself to spiritual contemplation; and finally, but not mandatorily, become a homeless wandering ascetic.

How many of us are even thinking of working towards Vanaprastha? You need not go to a jungle. But atleast work towards detachment and spiritual contemplation.

 

[Dr.T.N.Jambunathan]

I strongly feel the problems of old will be compounded if one looses his spouse . Probably this was the reason for the women often telling சுமங்கலியா போயிடணும் ! But what happen to men?
தனிமையில் இனிமை காணமுடுயுமா ?:nono:

 

[sankara_sharmah]

Dear Shri Sankara_Sharmah,

There are now many parents staying in the same city but separate from their sons/children. I know one or two cases where the widowed mother is staying on the first floor and cooking separately, while her son and family live downstairs. For outside this may not matter but such instances reveal the situation today. In fact I know one couple, wife very sickly, staying in an old age home (very decent) some kilometers away from the metro-city in which their only son lives. These have come to be accepted and no one reacts the way here (I am talking of TVM) as you found in TN.

Is it happening only now?

When my father's generation left Palghat/Mayavaram to go to Chennai/Mumbai/Kolkata did they bother about what happens to the parents? The parents stayed back in the villages.

How many old parents were alone in Tharakad/Tattamangalam/Mayavaram because their children had gone to Bombay/ Madras/Kolkata. I know of many Pattis staying alone in my village. Our Brahmin community prospered because they migrated to bigger cities abandoning their parents. In addition many of them dumped their children on the parents. Old parents had to bring up young children.

What is the difference between going from Palaghat to Bomabay and going from Chennai to New Jersey. In the 1930s when the Brahmins from Palakkad went to Bombay, the telephone facilities were almost non-existent. Trains would take two days to reach from Bombay to Palakkad.

Why are we pointing our fingers at the present generation? When You point one finger four fingers are pointing at us. Why this Hypocrisy?

However, neighbours, relatives and others will always desire that old people stay with their children so that, in case an emergency arises and these people do something they are not found fault with, by the children, later on for their omissions and commissions. We must understand their compulsions also. The very same people go on harping about the parents migrating to the foreign country and staying with their son/s (if none of them is in India) or one of the children leaving the foreign country and coming to India to take care of the aged parents as it is the filial duty.

This is the society that I was talking about. How many people resigned their jobs in Chennai and Mumbai to go and stay with their parents in villages/towns?

My generation and the older generation treated the parents badly. Suddenly when they have become old they are talking about filial duty and all that crap because they are affected.

Let the older generation stop whining, stop this hypocrisy. That is the first step toward having a peaceful old age.

 

[sangom]

Is it happening only now?

When my father's generation left Palghat/Mayavaram to go to Chennai/Mumbai/Kolkata did they bother about what happens to the parents? The parents stayed back in the villages.

How many old parents were alone in Tharakad/Tattamangalam/Mayavaram because their children had gone to Bombay/ Madras/Kolkata. I know of many Pattis staying alone in my village. Our Brahmin community prospered because they migrated to bigger cities abandoning their parents. In addition many of them dumped their children on the parents. Old parents had to bring up young children.

What is the difference between going from Palaghat to Bomabay and going from Chennai to New Jersey. In the 1930s when the Brahmins from Palakkad went to Bombay, the telephone facilities were almost non-existent. Trains would take two days to reach from Bombay to Palakkad.

Why are we pointing our fingers at the present generation? When You point one finger four fingers are pointing at us. Why this Hypocrisy?

This is the society that I was talking about. How many people resigned their jobs in Chennai and Mumbai to go and stay with their parents in villages/towns?

My generation and the older generation treated the parents badly. Suddenly when they have become old they are talking about filial duty and all that crap because they are affected.

Let the older generation stop whining, stop this hypocrisy. That is the first step toward having a peaceful old age.

Dear Sankara_Sharmah,

I replied after reading your first post in which (I understood) you were decrying the society's tendency to look askance at old people staying independently, away from their children. My post was in support of your ideas, I thought but on reading your post, I find either I have not expressed myself clearly or, may be, there is some misunderstanding on your part. I will try once again to state my observations in a nutshell.

Nowadays parents opt to stay independently even if their children (son/daughter) are nearby and the concerned parties, i.e., the parents themselves and their children, have no complaints about it. But people outside often feel that if some emergency situation arises in the case of the old parents (like a sudden heart attack) and the neighbours / other relatives living close by come and do some things like calling an ambulance, taking the patient to a hospital etc., and if something goes wrong unfortunately, the children will start blaming those neighbours / relatives for doing something or for not doing something. Because of this possibility, they desire that the onus of taking immediate care of these old people does not fall on their shoulders and talk to see that the parents live with their children.

It is not that the present generation, after forsaking their parents in old age want their children to live with them; it is the society, comprising the middle aged and youth of today, who would like these old people not to become a headache for them.

I hope I have made myself as clear as I can.

 

[kunjuppu]

Is it happening only now?

When my father's generation left Palghat/Mayavaram to go to Chennai/Mumbai/Kolkata did they bother about what happens to the parents? The parents stayed back in the villages.

How many old parents were alone in Tharakad/Tattamangalam/Mayavaram because their children had gone to Bombay/ Madras/Kolkata. I know of many Pattis staying alone in my village. Our Brahmin community prospered because they migrated to bigger cities abandoning their parents. In addition many of them dumped their children on the parents. Old parents had to bring up young children.

What is the difference between going from Palaghat to Bomabay and going from Chennai to New Jersey. In the 1930s when the Brahmins from Palakkad went to Bombay, the telephone facilities were almost non-existent. Trains would take two days to reach from Bombay to Palakkad.

Why are we pointing our fingers at the present generation? When You point one finger four fingers are pointing at us. Why this Hypocrisy?

This is the society that I was talking about. How many people resigned their jobs in Chennai and Mumbai to go and stay with their parents in villages/towns?

My generation and the older generation treated the parents badly. Suddenly when they have become old they are talking about filial duty and all that crap because they are affected.

Let the older generation stop whining, stop this hypocrisy. That is the first step toward having a peaceful old age.

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear Sankara_Sharmah,


Nowadays parents opt to stay independently even if their children (son/daughter) are nearby and the concerned parties, i.e., the parents themselves and their children, have no complaints about it. But people outside often feel that if some emergency situation arises in the case of the old parents (like a sudden heart attack) and the neighbours / other relatives living close by come and do some things like calling an ambulance, taking the patient to a hospital etc., and if something goes wrong unfortunately, the children will start blaming those neighbours / relatives for doing something or for not doing something. Because of this possibility, they desire that the onus of taking immediate care of these old people does not fall on their shoulders and talk to see that the parents live with their children.

It is not that the present generation, after forsaking their parents in old age want their children to live with them; it is the society, comprising the middle aged and youth of today, who would like these old people not to become a headache for them.

I hope I have made myself as clear as I can.

sangom,

i very much doubt whether the children will ever complain for any succour given to the parents by relatives. even if it be of a limited kind. something is better than nothing.

i myself relied on my uncle/aunt to help mom out taking care of dad. for which help, i am eternally grateful. as a son, i am programmed by my society, that i should take care of my parents and am their old age insurance.

mercifully, i have broken away from this paradigm. my children have not, and are not even aware that it is their DUTY to take care of moi/spouse when we become infirm. we have provided enough money for good care that could be purchased, free and clear.

ofcourse, as khushwant said, money is #2 in the requirements for graceful aging, after good health.

re 'society' wanting something, i consider these as tongue wags with nothing better to do.

 

[kunjuppu]

I strongly feel the problems of old will be compounded if one looses his spouse . Probably this was the reason for the women often telling சுமங்கலியா போயிடணும் ! But what happen to men?
தனிமையில் இனிமை காணமுடுயுமா ?:nono:

jambu,

it is said that the loss of one's spouse is the biggest loss suffered by any human - man or woman. it is not the loss of the child or parents, which causes more grief.

between the man & the woman, our men are the most helpless. they cannot even know how to boil water. which is why i say, for all our men, 'learn to cook and manage a household'.

 

[tbs]

hi folks,
migration to towns/cities are integral part of community....from lord parasurama period....after making keralam from gokarnam to trivandrum..
he brought brahmins to settled down..... in keralam many palakkad pattars migrated from tanjore/tirunelveli....so migration
is our blood culture....according to many centuries it is going on ...still goes on....initially after SSLC with typerwriting/shorthand
knowledge ...they moved to bombay in jayathi janta express to mattunga/chembur.....some moved to madirasi by mangalore mail
to work mainly in hotel busineess/purohits....then slowly their children moved to new delhi/calcutta....now many bombay mama/mamis
children moved to dubai/muscat/saudi etc.....many new delhi mama/mamis children moved from new delhi to new jersey....every generation's
older ppl lived in their own way....many pattis/tathas waited for post man for letter/money order every day in palakkad gramam in olden days...
now with modern technology things are changing in modern way....i talk to my mom in chennai every day in phone/internet from USA free of
cost....now tech helps a lot

regards
tbs.
now

 

[Dr.T.N.Jambunathan]

I strongly feel the problems of old will be compounded if one looses his spouse . Probably this was the reason for the women often telling சுமங்கலியா போயிடணும் ! But what happen to men?
தனிமையில் இனிமை காணமுடுயுமா ?:nono:

Dear Kunjappu

This is true for professional சமயல்காரர் also. It is because of "emotional emptiness or vacuum" created in this situation than the physical loss. That is is important. :sad: & :scared: Jambu

 

[kunjuppu]

Dear Kunjappu

This is true for professional சமயல்காரர் also. It is because of "emotional emptiness or vacuum" created in this situation than the physical loss. That is is important. :sad: & :scared: Jambu

very correct. i did not think through the emotional impacts. probably more devastating.

 

[nachi naga]

i am still young at heart and my spouse thinks,she is even more younger at heart.wonder what my kids think of this competetion from parents,i bet they think they are illusions or optical aberrations of mommy & daddy.emotional attachment is the best gift for any human,ts priceless,just as god is.

 

[rajuvish]

A quote, something to think about: "Beautiful young people are accidents of nature, but beautiful old people are works of art. – Eleanor Roosevelt" Preparing for old age, can be raised to the level of an artistic exercise, a very enjoyable art practised with purpose: and, leading to a sense of tremendous satisfaction and fulfillment! -- rj

 

[rajuvish]

i have one more quote to add here, an extract from a relevant article: "......The modern world puts a high premium on youth. By this standard, retirement brings the freedom to take on a second career, or find fulfillment in new hobbies, or to recapture the pleasures of youth. But the last years of life spent in such pursuits are often full of frustrations and regrets.
By contrast, from a spiritual perspective, the second half of life is the natural time to turn from physical satisfactions to inner growth. These are years of opportunity – of continued growth rather than decline. This is the time when we need to concentrate on spiritual development if we are to fulfill our highest potential and realize our immortality. All the world’s religions agree that death is not the end of life, only the end of one chapter......"

 

[sankara_sharmah]

Dear Sankara_Sharmah,

I replied after reading your first post in which (I understood) you were decrying the society's tendency to look askance at old people staying independently, away from their children. My post was in support of your ideas, I thought but on reading your post, I find either I have not expressed myself clearly or, may be, there is some misunderstanding on your part. I will try once again to state my observations in a nutshell.

Nowadays parents opt to stay independently even if their children (son/daughter) are nearby and the concerned parties, i.e., the parents themselves and their children, have no complaints about it. But people outside often feel that if some emergency situation arises in the case of the old parents (like a sudden heart attack) and the neighbours / other relatives living close by come and do some things like calling an ambulance, taking the patient to a hospital etc., and if something goes wrong unfortunately, the children will start blaming those neighbours / relatives for doing something or for not doing something. Because of this possibility, they desire that the onus of taking immediate care of these old people does not fall on their shoulders and talk to see that the parents live with their children.

It is not that the present generation, after forsaking their parents in old age want their children to live with them; it is the society, comprising the middle aged and youth of today, who would like these old people not to become a headache for them.

I hope I have made myself as clear as I can.

I misunderstood your post. Please accept my apologies.

It is not only the middle aged but also the older people who tend to think that the sons should take care of them. You see this view expressed in every seminar/conference on old age. They also recall the good old days when the parents were taken care of by the sons. And extoll the value of the Joint family system.

But they conveniently forget that it is their generation who broke away from the Joint Family system and their generation has a miserable record of taking care of their parents.

I had stopped attending such seminars and conferences because of this. It is a case of முழுப்பூசனிக்காயை சோற்றில் மறைக்கிறது.

Then all the talk about the old age homes. The Old age home of the older generation was the village. The children left the parents to their fate in the villages. More often than not they dumped the children also.

My village had become a big Old Age Home. You could see only old people and children taken care of by older people.

But the older people unlike the present old people had no complaints against their children. They were not unduly worried about becoming infirm. We did not have good hospitals nearby. Not many doctors. Still they were not worried.

Someone may say that in villages people supported each other. In a village of old people who was there to support them. Very few young people. They had a tough time even paying electricity bills. The office was far and no transport. No auto, No taxi, No bus. One young man who was staying nearby used to come collect and pay the bills.

What I am trying to emphasize is the attitude. The old people in my village as in all other villages had faith in GOD. அவன் பார்த்துப்பான். Yes. Faith and Trust in GOD. In my life whenever I needed help, it has never been my relatives who have come running. Because they were never nearby. But friends and often strangers have helped.

Have we not heard the poem எங்கிருந்தோ வந்தான். இடைச்சாதினான் என்றான் ....

CALL HIM. HE WILL COME.

Saranagata deenarta paritrana parayane
Sarvaswarthi hare Devi narayani namostute

I will not be posting any more in this thread. Because the posters here seem to be fond of following the advice of people like Kushwant Singh who is the anti thesis of what I believe in. I believe in Spirituality. He believes in the three WWWs. Nothing wrong in that. Not my way.

 

[sangom]

I misunderstood your post. Please accept my apologies.

It is not only the middle aged but also the older people who tend to think that the sons should take care of them. You see this view expressed in every seminar/conference on old age. They also recall the good old days when the parents were taken care of by the sons. And extoll the value of the Joint family system.

But they conveniently forget that it is their generation who broke away from the Joint Family system and their generation has a miserable record of taking care of their parents.

I had stopped attending such seminars and conferences because of this. It is a case of முழுப்பூசனிக்காயை சோற்றில் மறைக்கிறது.

Then all the talk about the old age homes. The Old age home of the older generation was the village. The children left the parents to their fate in the villages. More often than not they dumped the children also.

My village had become a big Old Age Home. You could see only old people and children taken care of by older people.

Dear Shri Sharmah,

Another reason why old people - who dismantled the joint family system and also forsook their parents - are now demanding that they be looked after by their children, seems to be IMO that these people feel they have spent their income and wealth on their children's upbringing and insist on a return in kind, sort of, for what is projected by the media as the sacrifice of the old people. Perhaps such a selfish view was absent in the earlier generation which was dumped.

I will not be posting any more in this thread. Because the posters here seem to be fond of following the advice of people like Kushwant Singh who is the anti thesis of what I believe in. I believe in Spirituality. He believes in the three WWWs. Nothing wrong in that. Not my way.

I suppose we should be open to all kinds of opinions on any topic. Otherwise we will have no one to interact with. After all no one is compelling you to follow Khushwant Singh. Again how can we be so sure that our view/attitude/principle is the only right one? The creation in nature is so diverse that has not even our rigvedic sage exclaimed:

"Ekam sad vipraa bahudhaa vadanti"

If that is the case with "truth" what about mundane matters?

 

[Dr.T.N.Jambunathan]

Dear Shankara _ Sharma

"But they conveniently forget that it is their generation who broke away from the Joint Family system and their generation has a miserable record of taking care of their parents."

I think this statement is half correct yes Broke away from joint family system and regarding their miserable record of taking care of their parents may be a sweeping statement I was brought up in a joint family and by the time I started my life it was buried deep I am thinking of thread on joint family and my experience in that This is a forum to share our experience in Joint family I am hesitant because it might be hijacked and end up with arguments for and against rather than sharing the Good Bad & the Ugly of Joint family as we experienced Jambu . :gossip:

 

[sankara_sharmah]

Dear Shri Sharmah,

I suppose we should be open to all kinds of opinions on any topic. Otherwise we will have no one to interact with. After all no one is compelling you to follow Khushwant Singh. Again how can we be so sure that our view/attitude/principle is the only right one? The creation in nature is so diverse that has not even our rigvedic sage exclaimed:

"Ekam sad vipraa bahudhaa vadanti"

If that is the case with "truth" what about mundane matters?

Simple answer. I am a BRAHMIN and believe in Ashrama Dharma.

 

[nachi naga]

Dear Shankara _ Sharma

"But they conveniently forget that it is their generation who broke away from the Joint Family system and their generation has a miserable record of taking care of their parents."

I think this statement is half correct yes Broke away from joint family system and regarding their miserable record of taking care of their parents may be a sweeping statement I was brought up in a joint family and by the time I started my life it was buried deep I am thinking of thread on joint family and my experience in that This is a forum to share our experience in Joint family I am hesitant because it might be hijacked and end up with arguments for and against rather than sharing the Good Bad & the Ugly of Joint family as we experienced Jambu . :gossip:

jambu,

plz start.you are my fav poster as of now.makes me smile whenver i read your posts.so witty.anyways be forwarned, நான் ஒரு ஹாய் ஜக்கர் ஆகும்

 

[nachi naga]

Simple answer. I am a BRAHMIN and believe in Ashrama Dharma.

ss,

hopefully by birth as a brahmin.becoz nowadays by living life as brahmins is considered more potent to liberation than by birth.as a brahmana bandhu,i empathise both ways of brahmins.brahmano kula vritthi ayanam.

 

[sankara_sharmah]

Dear Shri Sharmah,

Another reason why old people - who dismantled the joint family system and also forsook their parents - are now demanding that they be looked after by their children, seems to be IMO that these people feel they have spent their income and wealth on their children's upbringing and insist on a return in kind, sort of, for what is projected by the media as the sacrifice of the old people. Perhaps such a selfish view was absent in the earlier generation which was dumped.

You are right. But every generation makes sacrifices for the future generation. Whether it is the French revolution or our Independence struggle, the generation which took part in it did not benefit much. But the future geneartion and the world benefited.

Parents have always made sacrifices for their children. How many of the older generation have sold the ancestral land, pledged the mother's ornaments to educate their children. Oh. So many. Their children prospered. The children of the Mirasudar who neglected his children and spent his money on Dasis and playing cards in Kumbakonam Club suffered.

Making sacrifices for the welfare of one's children is Pithru Dharma. There is nothing great or unique about that. I expect my children also to make sacrifices for their children.

Again it is wrong to portray the present generation as selfish. The entire real estate industry in Chennai is built on the desire of the children who live abroad to repay the parents. Blocks and Blocks of apartments which are bought by children abroad for their parents. They live in comforts which they could not have dreamt of during their life time. Most of them could not have lived in this luxury even if they wanted to. There are old articles about how the Indian boy who goes to Silicon Valley first thinks of buying a home for his parents in India.

Unfortunately there are some children who neglect their parents. The magazines and newspapers only highlight such cases because that is news.

Again some of the parents do expect too much.

Let us leave it at that.

That reminds of an old joke or half humorous statement made by one of my TB friends

He said " You know our people are obsessed by Sraddham for parents. You know why? If you ill treat your parents during their life time, there is little they can do. But once they die, the power of the Ghosts are great. So it is better to please them. Dead parents are more powerful than living ones."

Makes us think.

 

[Dr.T.N.Jambunathan]

When you call somebody old ? What is the qualification or criteria to be called old? When this question was put to me I had no answer some 40 years ago in clinical exam in my final MBBS. DR. A.L. Annamali was the examiner and I had to discuss a clinical case of Pulmonary Tuberculosis with Plural effusion. I started presenting the Case Here is an old man with complaints - before I could proceed I was stopped Tell me why do you call him an old man?. I said I thought he must be above 60 by his appearance does not know his age exactly. Appearance are deceptive Suppose I tell you he is 59 years and 355 days then will he become young? There is no specific(age) line that divides the old from young! I started shivering did not have any answer for that. He then understood my plight said don't be discouraged Never present a case as here is an old man etc say her is a man 60 years or appearing to be 60 . Now proceed .

Now after 40 years I still do not when somebody is old? By Age? Obviously that is the most important factor. But again variable. TN Government Considers 58 is old enough to retire you from services Government of India feels it is 60 By Railway standards 60 makes you senior citizen But income tax Department does not think so. You should have completed 65 to be a senior citizen. Then can any body tell me when you are really old? Jambu

 

[kunjuppu]

jambu,

here in ontario province of canada, there is no retirement age. one can work as long as one wishes and can afford to retire. many reasons:

- aging population with no steady stream of youngsters to fill the vacancies.
- very poor savings habit and hence no money for retirement. the government gives an old age income security + there is a canada pension plan. this together is not enough for living.
- no habit of living with children. so a full household expense is there or retirement home or convalescence home - all need money
- human rights laws: forcing people to retire on basis of age is discrimination
- desire for many to work and keep busy; even retired people nowadays take part time jobs, either to have a more comfortable retirement or just to be active

 

[Raghy]

I have to repeat Sri.Kunjuppu's post.

That is the same condition in Australia too. But the Aussie retirement pension is more generous than the Canada pension plan (I would not have saved any decent money for the retirement, had I stayed in Ontario after 2006. But I lived there only for 2 years though). I am planning to work after retrement (65 years), provided my body don't fall apart. But, that work would be purely service, unpaid work. (Well, that is the plan, as of now. My wife seemed to have already worked out the finances of such plan...).

Cheers!

 

[nachi naga]

jambu,

when one is able to make one feel young and alive,just like how you do,then according to me,you are the youngest person here.there are some posters here,who make you feel,so ancient,that they shud be extinct like the dodo bird.