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dowry deals

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kunjuppu

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Long route to justice for bride, family | bride | family | Indian Express

here is an example of a dowry deal gone wrong.

the demand was 100 sovereigns initially, which was doubled on the eve of the reception.

wedding expense total was 25 lakhs.

i dont know who is crazy here. the bride's father or the grooms'.

the bride has an MBA, and apparently all this education had no value when it comes to weddings? why was she quiet and accepting all this?
 
Long route to justice for bride, family | bride | family | Indian Express

here is an example of a dowry deal gone wrong.

the demand was 100 sovereigns initially, which was doubled on the eve of the reception.

wedding expense total was 25 lakhs.

i dont know who is crazy here. the bride's father or the grooms'.

the bride has an MBA, and apparently all this education had no value when it comes to weddings? why was she quiet and accepting all this?

The surprise in this whole episode is the large amount of money and jewelry which an accounts officer in Metro water could offer to the bridegroom. Definitely he could not have amassed this wealth from his salary
 
good point vsubbu.

let us discount that this may be ancestral wealth or wealth that arumugham got for HIS resource.

what type of opportunity can a metro water accounts officer can have for being bribed?
 
I stay in Nanganallur which is nearer to Adambakkam.Both the locations come under Alandur Municipality,Chennai.It is a known fact to everyone
that Chennai and other suburban areas
suffer from acute water shortage for a minimum of 5 months( anytime from may/june to october/November).Persons connected with Metro water
supply,all elected representatives get opportunity to make illegal money by selling Metro water.
This problem started in my area only from middle of2003.During 2003 and 2004,I had to purchase water at the rate of Rs.2 sometimes Rs.3 per kudam of 12 liters and expenses came to around Rs.2700 to Rs.3000 per month.I constructed a Sump at a cost of Rs.40,000 which will contain a full lorry load of water(12,000 liters costing Rs.800/ per lorryload).Mypresent expenses on water during 'acute shortege period) is Rs.1600 to Rs.2000 per month.
So, the bride's father had every opportunity to mint money.
One has to learn a moral lesson from this story.All illgotten wealth will not remain permanently and will have to be spent either for treatment of
prolonged illness of self or other members of the family or go waste as in this case.It is not only a question of loss of money but also prestige and honor.I pity the poor Girl.This incident would definitely have impact on her future life.
 
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The parents of a bride want a business partner by way of marriage. On those days kings married daughters of neighbor kingdoms to maintain peace. But to day onle one wedding is allowed but some politicians have two or three wives and think that it is permitted for them alone. If a bride's parents prefers a boy with IIM IIT and IAS they must pay the price. This is only a trade and not a marriage! If the bride's father prefers a man or groom with good habits he will be only from middle class (not Upper middle class or high class in wealth).

The present day society needs lessons.
 
ramacc,

was it not the same 50 years ago too? the ias commanded more than the ca, who did better than the engineer?

we always had this stratification. if at all, dowry was 'respected' till very recently.

my confusion here, is why the girl, so well endowed, put up with all this nonsense.
 
50 years ago, the family of the groom was very crowd. They had 6 to 7 sons 4 to 5 daughters and a bride step in a house as a cook or care taker of the entire family. She worked as a nurse for her in laws.

But to day we have only couple of children or only one on whom we depend.

To my knowledge even if a girl works in an IT company she may not work for ever. She has to give up her job after she gets her first child.

Secondly if the family that depend on a care taker for the baby will fall in ruins. In one of my posts some where I mentioned that a known family engaged with a care taker, where the husband made an illegal with the care taker connection caught red handed and that lead to divorce.
We read in news papers about the loot that the care makes and slips with the child. One such incident a care taker rented the infant for begging and she was caught in Anna nagar Roundabout!

Only if the society feels and accepts that the Sambandham is uniting a couple and not trade our society will come up. If the society feels that money is every thing and we can buy anything it will be in ditch! Money can buy comfort but not peace. Money can buy medicine but not health and affection.

I pray that the time should come soon where people understand the secretes of life.
 
IMHO I see big social changes coming. I am hearing that clandestine pre-marital sex is quite common in large cities, whether we approve of it or not. In 10 or 20 years, arranged marriage will go the way of joint-family system. Dowry will be gone. This change will take a while to filter down to lower economic class. Personally I feel dowry system is despicable. Our girls have led the way in progress and are a model to the world. To be treated like slaves in the meat market is inhuman and shows India in poor light. I will fault both the dowry-demander and dowry-giver. We need sweeping social changes! We need a re-appearance of Bharathiyaar!
 
This day I heard a news that a section of girls well educated don't want to go for employment and they prefer sit at home. They don't want to give any dowries too. But they assure good assistance to the family.
 
This day I heard a news that a section of girls well educated don't want to go for employment and they prefer sit at home. They don't want to give any dowries too. But they assure good assistance to the family.


ramacc,

in a country of 1.2 billion, will there no be enough sampling of all kinds of folks? personally, i will not read this as a new trend. just a fringe group.

i think the new reality, is career, self fulfilment and above all balancing life/family quality - for the current female. the same as it was for the male all these milleniums. let us welcome the change and be of a supportive nature to anyone whom we know, who faces the challenges of this rapid social change in our society.

btw how did you hear of this news? was it in the radio? do these people form a group?

the reason i am asking, is that there have been numerous ads here in the forum, from folks, who are searching for just this type of girls. i gather that these are hard to find.
 
IMHO I see big social changes coming. I am hearing that clandestine pre-marital sex is quite common in large cities, whether we approve of it or not. In 10 or 20 years, arranged marriage will go the way of joint-family system. Dowry will be gone. This change will take a while to filter down to lower economic class. Personally I feel dowry system is despicable. Our girls have led the way in progress and are a model to the world. To be treated like slaves in the meat market is inhuman and shows India in poor light. I will fault both the dowry-demander and dowry-giver. We need sweeping social changes! We need a re-appearance of Bharathiyaar!

ar,

whether bharathiar reappears or not, his 'pudhumai peNN' is now a reality.

many of us have sisters or daughters who are such, and a source of immense pride to us.

not so happy are certain groups, and only they have to blame themselves for it - let me list them as i understand it

- parents of sons and only sons: aged 29+ these guys are looking at the 'marriage market' with glasses which appear to be fogged by yester years' values.

they appear to believe, that 'no expectations, no dowry, just a simple marriage enough' is a sufficient enticement to attract hordes of girls' parents.

also many of these sons' parents want - a cook, a wage earner, a nurse, a private secretary, a hostess, a housekeeper and more - all bound together in this entity called 'daughter in law'.

one only has to read and interact with many such ads even in this forum to understand the mindset of these folks. i would not want my sister or daughter anywhere near these households.

also i do not wish these guys 'luck' for i do not want any girl, from our community or otherwise, to fall into the traps of these spiders. :)

you can hear the bleatings, outbursts and wails of these at any gatherings. there are solutions, but these would not hear them. they would rather bang their heads against the walls in the hope that the walls break, not realizing it is their head that gets damaged. sometimes beyond repair. sad

- parents of high achieving girls: who simply cannot find guys who are earning more than their daughters (i dont know whether this hangup is with the father or daughter).

it is high time that these realise that there need not be a competition between the spouses as to which gender earns more. as long as they are willing to agree to build a home together, and all earnings go towards it, why should they care which one of them earns more?

is it just ego? or a holdover from old values that the male has to be the primary earner?

- also i have come across a few cases in my own family. intelligent parents of boys, who take the initiative of going after the girls' families while the boys are still in their early twenties.

they develop a relationship with the family, and tacitly promote 'love' or 'arranged love' as it is called now, between the youngsters, so that there is an unsaid committment between the two families for an eventual weddings.

has worked 100%, with a few of them, the boys' side footing 50% of the wedding expenses. all in singaara chennai too :)

- families of girls who marry whom they want. the parents i know, have been behind this 100% of them, in the past 5 years since. i have parents proudly in my family, who claim that their family is an 'integrated' india - integration here means, that their daughter or son has married a north indian or sikh.

.. and so the changes are happening rapidly in our community - for some it appears too fast. i dont know what can be done for such folks.
 
It is person who negotiated with a brides' family. If I reveal the names I feel it won't look nice. The Groom's parents visited the house of the bride and negotiations started, From the beginning the groom's mother insisted that the would be bride should take up an employment, she said she will place her in a place that suits her and she also take classes at home. But the bride's family rejected that. Shall I send you full address of the bride by PM?
 
ramac,

i am not really into knowing the identity of folks. i am more interested in the trends. the instance that you mention, is very seldom heard these days.

if there are takers so be it. i have found that the 'marriage market' is an ode to Darwin's theory of the survival of the fittest or each couple eventually finds their own 'level' of compatibility.

except nowadays, there may be no takers for some. which is sad.
 
Isn't dowry a non-issue for Brahmin families? Let me hear the members' response before relating the opinion regarding dowry that I heard from two marriage-age Brahmin girls.
 
Dowry is collected by all castes and all religion not only Brahmin
 
Dowry is collected by all castes and all religion not only Brahmin

it does not make this a good habit, because everyone does it. right?

our community, has moved on beyond dowry, thanks to female entitlement. someone who earns regularly, gives dowry for life in monthly instalments. so why bother with just a lumpsome?
 
it does not make this a good habit, because everyone does it. right?

our community, has moved on beyond dowry, thanks to female entitlement. someone who earns regularly, gives dowry for life in monthly instalments. so why bother with just a lumpsome?

Sri.Kunjuppu Sir,

I think, the old system 'parisam' should come back. Money and gifts should be given to brides parents in compensation by the groom for rearing her up to that age. Only that makes sense.

Cheers!
 
raghy,

atleast in our community, i am hearing, in my relatives, where girls are insisting on taking care of their parents.

this is a big improvement in attitude. in that, the parents of both boys and girls, are now held on par. re respect and future expectations.

no longer is it acceptable, for the guy to say, that his parents take precedence. i think all this is good improvement in mindset and attitudes.

ofcourse there are some leftover of all kinds. some girls & their parents who want the traditional relationship, and should have, normally no problem finding varans.

on the other hand, we have boys and their parents, with traditional attitudes, and it is these that are having issues re finding girls.

Darwin's rule re survival of the fittest appear to be operating here. or simply we call call it, 'cut throat competition' for our girls - from our boys and beyond?
 
Dear Kunjuppu
parents of high achieving girls: who simply cannot find guys who are earning more than their daughters (i dont know whether this hangup is with [COLOR=#da7911 !important][FONT=inherit !important][COLOR=#da7911 !important][FONT=inherit !important]the [/FONT][COLOR=#da7911 !important][FONT=inherit !important]father[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] or daughter).

it is high time that these realise that there need not be a competition between the spouses as to which gender earns more. as long as they are willing to agree to build a home together, and all earnings go towards it, why should they care which one of them earns more?

is it just ego? or a holdover from old values that the male has to be the primary earner?

Things are not that simple. The girl in my house got quite a few proposals like this. I had no issues. I asked her. Her reply made sense too. She said -
the guys whether they earn less or more are egoistic. If they earn less they are likely to harass you in more ways. In other cases if they want to marry you, its more for your earning than for what is in you. I cannot accept boys earning less or less qualified than I am.
 
raghy,

atleast in our community, i am hearing, in my relatives, where girls are insisting on taking care of their parents.

..........some girls & their parents who want the traditional relationship, and should have, normally no problem finding varans.

on the other hand, we have boys and their parents, with traditional attitudes, and it is these that are having issues re finding girls.

Darwin's rule re survival of the fittest appear to be operating here. or simply we call call it, 'cut throat competition' for our girls - from our boys and beyond?

Sri.Kunjuppu,

Our son has not even considered about 'taking care of the parents'. but, our daughter already said, she wants to look after us when we get older. Daughters seem to pay more attention towards the elderly parents. It holds good for the anglo-saxons too. In the nursing home, I notice more 'daughters' visit the residents than the sons. I noticed that in the hospital too. Most often than not, the visiting family member would be the daughter.

Our girls don't seem to have the trick of presentation. Our guys in OZ or USA seek good looking stunners, our girls put in casual pictures in the matrimony sites. They just don't understand 'glamour'. They may be getting many alliances competing for them; but, are they able to knock down the alliance they want? that is the question.

Boys and girls are really in a stressful situation, forced to pick someone with minimum scrutiny. I don't know about the matrimony site selections; they don't have enough time together to take such huge decisions.

Our girls don't have cut-throat competition; it's just an illusion. Imagine a caste-less society....that would be a real competition.

Cheers!
 
raghy,

i agree with you on all counts.

even in canada, it is the girls who take care of their elderly parents. the sons/dils dont care or consider it a chore. you should see how some dil (including tambram ones) make fuss even to visit mil or fil in an old age home. there are cases where the mother is in an old age home in toronto, and the family has deliberately moved to the usa.

re pix of girls in matrimonial sites - yes the girls do not in many cases put efforts in proper presentation. recently a guy rejected a girl, based on just this. his logic was, if this was the best she could do to present herself to a prospective suitor, it could not say much of her.

and there is this point about getting to 'know each other'. i am still not so sure how much 'knowing' we allow before marriage. even in a perfunctory dinner by themselves does not give much familiarity as both of them are in the best of behaviour, and the most that they can take about is their careers or preferences for food, clothes and superficial stuff.

they do not have to have sex, but familiarity built over time, exposes the true person. one cannot be on guard all the time, and very soon, the short tempers and the prejudices are exposed, as are, real feelings towards prospective in laws and such.
 
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Dear Kunjuppu


Things are not that simple. The girl in my house got quite a few proposals like this. I had no issues. I asked her. Her reply made sense too. She said -

dear subbudu,

are 100% of the guys who earn less, are egoistic? would they have approached if they had such attitudes. i think, one should judge case by case. and perhaps a blanket statement, by the girl here, may be unfair? also she may be losing out on a kind, affectionate and wonderful husband ... all because of the difference of some ruppees in their paychecks!!
 
dear subbudu,

are 100% of the guys who earn less, are egoistic? would they have approached if they had such attitudes. i think, one should judge case by case. and perhaps a blanket statement, by the girl here, may be unfair? also she may be losing out on a kind, affectionate and wonderful husband ... all because of the difference of some ruppees in their paychecks!!

The expectations cited in the matrimony sites are almost unreal. Most girls/girl's parents set the bar very high, in my opinion. If the girl has a basic degree, the expectation is master's degree. There was a time, my son was actively seeking from the matrimony sites.. he passed many possible profiles... I asked him for the reason..he said he has only a bachelor's degree, so he can't approach someone asking for master's degree! Similarly, he just skims someone asking for a particular caste/sub-caste... he ended up only with profiles that said 'caste no-bar, any qualifications etc'.. now he is disgusted with the whole matrimony site..he thinks most persons are not even truthful in their expectations.

Here, amoung the anglo-saxons, I see lady doctors happily hitched up with trade persons, cops or any other professions. But in our matrimony sites, most doctors seek only doctors or surgeons.

The more I look at the matrimony sites, the more I am convinced, girls/girl's parents seek persons based on profession, education and income only. By the way, the boys/boy's parents too would be culprits too; I don't browse boy's profile, so I don't know.

Cheers!
 
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