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ஊர் அறிந்த பிராமணனுக்குப் பூணூல் எதற்கு?

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Raghy said:
Sri. Mahakavi, Greetings.



From what I heard, in the initial days mangalya dharanam was not part of the ceremony. It was added in the later days. Yes, initially, husband's name was written and it hung around her neck. The girl did not have any right to deny that. Well, if she denied one ownership, someone else would be dragging her anyway. So, what is the use? Even now the thali is an indication of ownership; it indicates to what community that woman belong to. We have specific thali for specific community.. then she says who her husband is. But husbands don't wear thali, nothing taken away when he becomes a widower.

Cheers!
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Dear Raghy,

I agree with what you have written.
Once I read a book written by a famous Swamiji where he was proudly acclaiming that Hindu women of the upper caste DO NOT remarry when their husband is dead unlike women of the west.

I was pleasantly surprised to read that cos I was wondering as a Swamiji why he was still seeing the difference between Upper Caste woman of India and woman of the west.
And since he didn't include lower caste women in his statement that means he leaves it open to interpretation.

I was wondering "how to feel proud when a woman could be suffering silently as a widow? are people so sadistic that for the sake of pride women should not remarry?"

Sometimes I also wonder what some swamiji's actually try to convey.
That was the only thing about that swamiji I was surprised about..otherwise he was a shining example of a true brave Hindu.
 
Luckily the same thaali is worn by the successive wives
so the inscription showing their order is not necessary. :)

I have heard this case when the maappillai was busy talking to his friend on the dais during the maangalya dhaaranam and tied the thaali around the neck of the girl's father - who was keeping the girl on his lap! :becky:

The forerunner of the same sex marriage??? :rolleyes:

I have personally witnessed these two funny incidents.

When the priest said "mookaip pidiyungo" for doing his part of the ritual,
the bridegroom promptly caught hold of the priest's nose! :shocked:

(Apparently he had never performed sandhya vandana even once in his life!)

In the other incident the kachcham of the soman fell off from the back side. The bride demurely took hold of it and walked behind him - remanding the large trains of the queens carried by sweet little girls!

If we keep our eyes open, we can see a lot of funny sideshows in addition to the main show.


Iyyarooraan said:
Good effort Madam lest people should forget. Particularly men, many of them might not know what their wife is wearing. Any number is inscribed thereon to show - First wife, Second wife.
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The same thaali can be worn if the man marries after the demise of his current wife.
But those who run parallel households may need to inscibe the order of seniority
to avoid future controversies and confusions! :)
 
Though it is good to bring our funny examples & exceptions in life, we miss the main crux. Poonal & thaali have their own significance. Over time different communities modified certain peice of it for their convenience. Over all we should be looking for the purpose.If a women is independent financially, it doesnot mean she can remove her thaali.if she does it for better looks, still more worse to me personally (sorry if it hurts!).Leave the Poonal & Thali associaed with rituals & ceremony.How do one see a tantrik in wrist or in the neck ?.That's worn by muslims, chrsitians & hindus...not a question of B or NB. (may be a topic for new thread!)Over a period, we have lost the knowledge & we laugh at our own ancestorial way of life or customs.Better learn,understand & then talk.I joined this forum basically to know more information.But it appears we ditch each other at some or other time rather than promoting good stuff's for betterment of the culture & society.
 
You are yet to see the world and KNOW a FORUM!
Good luck in your mission! :thumb:


r_lakshminarasimhan said:
Though it is good to bring our funny examples & exceptions in life, we miss the main crux. Poonal & thaali have their own significance. Over time different communities modified certain peice of it for their convenience. Over all we should be looking for the purpose.If a women is independent financially, it doesnot mean she can remove her thaali.if she does it for better looks, still more worse to me personally (sorry if it hurts!).Leave the Poonal & Thali associaed with rituals & ceremony.How do one see a tantrik in wrist or in the neck ?.That's worn by muslims, chrsitians & hindus...not a question of B or NB. (may be a topic for new thread!)Over a period, we have lost the knowledge & we laugh at our own ancestorial way of life or customs.Better learn,understand & then talk.I joined this forum basically to know more information.But it appears we ditch each other at some or other time rather than promoting good stuff's for betterment of the culture & society.
Click to expand...
 
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Marriage is a vedic ritual; poonul is necessary to do a vedic ritual. Perhaps that is why one is made to wear it.
I would request those who wear for the occasion to continue to wear it and do more vedic rituals.

Vedanta is abstract; only rituals reinforce the faith and sustain the philosophy. We need both theory and practicals.

Why there are so many mini, micro and midi sannadis in addition to the presiding deity in a temple? Our mind is so fickle we cannot concentrate for a long time, but we are able to pray with 100% devotion for a couple of seconds in every sannadi. - kanchi periyavar in 'deivathin kural'.

If poonul is a prop to remind the man that he must not do anything wrong, the thali is a prop for the woman to remind her status and position in life. It is not uncommon to see ladies to apply manjal/kumkum to the thali seeking welfare for the husband and the family. Rituals are important for several reasons. props can be memory aids, conduct aids and character aids.

In a seminar (nothing to do with religion) it was pointed out that the league of nations established after the second world war did not survive whereas the united nations has survived - because it has lot of other other activities (rituals) apart from just politics.

Raghy said:
Sowbagyavathy Raji Ram, Greetings.

To my knowledge, even non-brahmins are asked to wear poonool during the wedding ceremony. They don't have poonool before; wouldn't have poonool after the ceremony.

Cheers!
Click to expand...
 
I am highlighting the same ignorance you want to be removed.
What kind of brahmin will NOT know whose nose is to caught??
What kind of brahmin will not be able to tuck in the loosened kachcham
before going round the agni with his bride following him???
I just said these in my own way which make people smile and think about it.
If we are preaching all the time no one will even enter the dry thread!
 
sarang said:
Fees for the medical course are now fixed at 2.8 lakhs. I do not know whether per semeste or year or the for the whole course.

We had a reddy boy in our engineering class. He said - dowry will go up by several lakhs for every year he completes (not passes).

How to recover the fees on medical courses?

Why are the fees so high?
Click to expand...



Your concern on high capitation fees is quite understandable. Let us remember that in India education is divided into two categories. 1. Social and 2. Power-based. While the first category caters to SC/ST/BC/MBC/OBC, the latter is for people with power – be it the financial power or influence. Unfortunately, neither system serves 100% the interests of truly deserving candidates.
As you may be aware, in a State like Tamil Nadu, 68% of the seats are reserved for candidates based on their castes. Yes. Caste by birth is the only criteria. The balance 32% goes to political bigwigs, people with right connections, etc. with a few seats hardly ever going to candidates with merit. The private colleges have Govt. quota and Management quota of seats. While the former is filled based on caste again, the management quota is for people with vitamin M. It is these seats that give “return on investment” (ROI) for the people who have “invested” in building the colleges. One cannot blame the management alone for the high capitation fees for they pay huge bribes to obtain permission to start the institution. So, the whole system is responsible for the present state.

If you are wondering why anyone would recover the fees paid for education by way of a dowry, traditionally there are some castes/regions in India who are deep into dowry. Reddy community is one of them. Even in 90s they were talking of Lakhs of Rupees as dowry. I would not be surprised if the figures are in Crores now. Please remember that the entire business in A.P. and most businesses (notably Real Estate) in Karnataka are in the hands of Reddy community.
 
Last week a high court judge in mumbai chided a couple married for 15 years, but wanting a divorce now - the girl was muslim, the man was a christian and they married according to hindu customs and registered their marriage as hindu couple.

renuka said:
Ok now for some real life Thali stories..I have lots of them.

When I was newly married and was working in a government hospital there used to be a Tamil elderly nurse who used to wear a big Pottu and Thali and she used to keep bugging me daily "doctor why don't you wear Thali and Pottu..I am sure you will look prettier, as a married woman you should wear it blah blah blah"

I never used to tell her anything but I just wished she would stop bugging me.
Then one day when Diwali was around the corner I asked her how is her preparations for Diwali coming up and to my surprise she said "doc I celebrate Christmas cos my husband is a christian"

I was "what!! You mean to say you are not even a Hindu?"

She was "I was a Hindu but I converted to Christianity when married my husband"

I started laughing and told her "My dear...you kept asking me to wear Thali and Pottu but you gave up your religion for a man..I might not wear my Thali and Pottu but I am a Hindu"

So you see...most people just hold on to tradition but internally they might not hold on to religion and even convert.
Click to expand...
 
There are people of all hues here - who respect and practice, who respect but practice to different degrees and who do not respect. Everybody's aim is different - I prefer more in the first group.

r_lakshminarasimhan said:
Though it is good to bring our funny examples & exceptions in life, we miss the main crux. Poonal & thaali have their own significance. Over time different communities modified certain peice of it for their convenience. Over all we should be looking for the purpose.If a women is independent financially, it doesnot mean she can remove her thaali.if she does it for better looks, still more worse to me personally (sorry if it hurts!).Leave the Poonal & Thali associaed with rituals & ceremony.How do one see a tantrik in wrist or in the neck ?.That's worn by muslims, chrsitians & hindus...not a question of B or NB. (may be a topic for new thread!)Over a period, we have lost the knowledge & we laugh at our own ancestorial way of life or customs.Better learn,understand & then talk.I joined this forum basically to know more information.But it appears we ditch each other at some or other time rather than promoting good stuff's for betterment of the culture & society.
Click to expand...
 
r_lakshminarasimhan said:
Though it is good to bring our funny examples & exceptions in life, we miss the main crux. Poonal & thaali have their own significance. Over time different communities modified certain peice of it for their convenience. Over all we should be looking for the purpose.If a women is independent financially, it doesnot mean she can remove her thaali.if she does it for better looks, still more worse to me personally (sorry if it hurts!).Leave the Poonal & Thali associaed with rituals & ceremony.How do one see a tantrik in wrist or in the neck ?.That's worn by muslims, chrsitians & hindus...not a question of B or NB. (may be a topic for new thread!)Over a period, we have lost the knowledge & we laugh at our own ancestorial way of life or customs.Better learn,understand & then talk.I joined this forum basically to know more information.But it appears we ditch each other at some or other time rather than promoting good stuff's for betterment of the culture & society.
Click to expand...

Dear sir,

No one is actually belittling customs here.
Some of us are being very honest about how we run our lives and how we view each custom.
Some hold Thali with high regard and only part with it when their husband departs or its taken from their(ladies) neck before cremation of the sumangali(cos people are afraid of losing gold to thieves).

So anyway it finally leaves us.
Some of us have a different mindset.
We view marriage as a union of hearts and for practical purposes we go through a ritual to make that contract sacred.

Some of us are indeed fashionable and would like to don different types of chains to match clothes we wear but that does not mean we love our husband any less.

At the end of the day everyone dies and we have no idea who goes first..husband or wife.

Technically if a Thali can 100% confer long life no Hindu men would be dead since creation and the devas would have just wasted their time churning the sea of milk for Amrit.
They could have just tied a Thali around an Apsara's neck and saved all the trouble.

So you see sir..at the end of the day...only the Lalata Likhita(Forehead inscription) will happen.

All of us have individual karmas and thats what shapes our present life.

I think after Savitri no one has brought back their husbands to life after a Q and A with Yama Dharmaraj.

But some of us do bring back other people's husband to life by preforming CPR with a Defibrillator when they have a Cardiac Arrest.

So I feel each of us have our own way of expressing their love for their spouses and a person not wearing a Thali and Pottu is in no way lesser in her affection to her husband than anyone else who dons both.
 
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Incidentally i saw this video today - May be of intrest to a few people & relevant to this topic.Try "Mangalsutra in Indian Marriages. Sadhguru" in YouTube.Sorry i could not post the link here.
 
Greetings.

Mangala Sutra or thali, yanjopaveetham or poonool thread .... these threads are just external indicators. Upanayanam is 'taking closer'. Do we really need a thread to take one 'closer'? What about a girl? can we take her 'closer'? If we can take her 'closer' why she is not wearing poonool? I know, people are going to point to her mensural cycle. I can't accept it though. Everyone hopefully does excrete everyday; are we considering ourselves 'unclean' for ever for that? Why should a girl be considered 'unclean' while she excretes through a different portal? It is only a natural process!?

Sri. Shiv said he only wanted to know the 'inner meaning' of the proverb! Chances are, he does know the inner meaning anyway.

I am really convinced, this society needs girls visiting the boys to 'see him', ask him to perform couple of 'manly tasks' to show off how well he was brought up by his parents. ( i am not using any smily... I am serious about this). A girl doesn't really need thali around her neck. Closeness to her husband is in her mind. Just by tying a thali around her neck, her husband should not take her love and loyalty for granted; he bloody well has to earn it. If it takes daily 'foot massage' to earn it, he should do it.

The days when Gurus were sincere, took real efforts to impart spiritual knowledge is gone. Most often than not, gurus are at the best are humbugs and gets worst from there on. There are few very sincere persons around, some of them take part in this forum too; but they teach more open mind approach than any restricted affairs. ஊரறிந்த பார்ப்பனனுக்கு பூணூல் தேவையில்லை (oorarindha paarppanukku poonool thavayillai); to 'get closer', a ceremony is not required either.

Cheers!
 
renuka said:
Dear Raghy ji,

Now I know why people say a Husband is God for a women....cos he is as close and as far from her as she thinks he is!!LOL
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Sowbagyavathy Renuka,

There is a difference though. God does not have to earn his/her position. But husband has to earn that. If the husband could earn it, he becomes greater than God; if he failed to earn it, he becomes worst than......... ( fill the gap with suitable expressions).

Cheers!
 
Raghy said:
Sowbagyavathy Renuka,

There is a difference though. God does not have to earn his/her position. But husband has to earn that. If the husband could earn it, he becomes greater than God; if he failed to earn it, he becomes worst than......... ( fill the gap with suitable expressions).

Cheers!
Click to expand...

LOL! A member of the K 9 squad I guess!
 
I personally feel a marriage should have yearly assessment like how medical professionals/paramedical support staff have to attend a Continuing Professional Development to renew their Annual Practicing Certificate.

We SHOULD NOT take marriage for granted thinking it is in auto pilot mode and walk around the plane of marriage thinking it will have a safe landing.

The pilots of a marriage should take the trouble to pay attention to their spouses and also infuse romance and passion from time to time.

If you do not ...do not blame anyone if the plane is hijacked and heavy drama in the cock pit(of the plane I mean!!)
 
renuka said:
I personally feel a marriage should have yearly assessment like how medical professionals/paramedical support staff have to attend a Continuing Professional Development to renew their Annual Practicing Certificate.

We SHOULD NOT take marriage for granted thinking it is in auto pilot mode and walk around the plane of marriage thinking it will have a safe landing.

The pilots of a marriage should take the trouble to pay attention to their spouses and also infuse romance and passion from time to time.

If you do not ...do not blame anyone if the plane is hijacked and heavy drama in the cock pit(of the plane I mean!!)
Click to expand...

When the plane gets highjacked, most trouble happens in the cockpit, of course. All the controls are placed in the cockpit. If one lost control of the cockpit, pretty much lost control of the plane!

Cheers!
 
Raghy said:
When the plane gets highjacked, most trouble happens in the cockpit, of course. All the controls are placed in the cockpit. If one lost control of the cockpit, pretty much lost control of the plane!

Cheers!
Click to expand...

I knew you will get what I meant!!LOL
That's the similarity between a woman and a plane!!LOL
 
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