namaste shrI mahakavi.
This has reference to your post #83:
I have given only a part of the verse, but as indicated by the term
பெருங்கண் கருமை--peru~gkaN karumai,
tAli here refers to only a woman's
mangalasUtram. For details of the explanation, you might check here:
:: TVU ::
I scanned the TVU verses. I am not sure whether the tAli (nagutAli) mentioned is tied by the dame's husband. It says the women like to wear the gem-strung nakutAli, and the collyrium (mai) in their eyes. Maybe it is mentioned elsewhere but not in this particular verse. nakutAli could just be another ornament.
• Here is an interesting explanation of why ANDAL did not sing anything about
mAngalya dhAraNam:
vAraNam Ayiram – Wedding, the way it should be – Three Minutes Series - Anudinam.org
Yes, it is just an interpretation. ANDAL's tiruppAvai and nAcciyAr tirumozhi have been discussed for so many PhD theses even. We have to take it as another interpretation. But the decad of VAraNamAyiram never mentions mAngalyadhAraNam. It is cultural addition in later times, as many others think.
• It seems that in the
ANDAL kalyanam festivities, she is undergoes
mAngalya dhAraNam:
Koodaravalli | Govindarajapuram
Yes, people who celebrate ANDAL kalyANam do all these paraphernalia including nalangu. That is just ti go with the current custom.
• Yes,
ஐம்படைத்தாலி--aimpaDaithtAli is worn by male children (which is also mention in the dictionary explanation I have given).
We are in agreement here to recognize that tAli is just an ornament.
• Although there is no direct mention of
ma~gkala aNi--mAngalyam in the description of Kovalan-KaNNaki wedding in Chapter 1 of
sillapadhikAram, when Kovalan deserted her for Madhavi and KaNNaki was suffering from his separation, poet ILangkO mentions that KaNNaki wouldn't wear any other jewel than her
mAngalyam:
மங்கல அணியின் பிறிதுஅணி மகிழாள்
ma~gkala aNiyin piRiduaNi makizhAL--4.50
Let me cite you another line in chapter 2 of silappadikAram. 2. 61-64
நறுமலர்க் கோதை! நின் நலம் பாராட்டுனர்
மறு இல் மங்கல அணியே அன்றியும்
பிறிது அணி அணியப் பெற்றதை எவன் கொல்?
Here "mangala aNi" is taken to mean "natural beauty (iyaRkai azhagu). If you understand the meaning here it means "Oh, dame who wears the fragrant flower garland, those who praise your beauty are adorning you with so many ornaments instead of letting you wear your natural beauty, how come?". If you analyze it further, Kovalan tells Kannagi during the wedding night "mangala aNiyE anRiyum". If the tAli is meant by mangala aNi, why does he say "mangala aNiyE anRiyum piRidu aNI"?
The meaning "natural beauty" is implied in mangala aNi which was taken to mean tAli in later times, according to Dr.sa.vE. Subramanian in his book "SilappadikAram" published by Gangai puttaka nilaiyam. Accordingly the lines 4.50 could also be taken to mean that except for her natural beauty she did not wear any other ornament during her separation with KOvalan because she did not want to wear ANY ornamanent except what is her innate ornament (beauty). I am convinced that there was no tAli tying in Kannagi period.
• It seems that the term
izhai was the equivalent of
tAli/mAngalyam in the weddings of Sangham times, as per this research paper:
Thali in Sangam Liteuature by K.V.RAMAKRISHNARAO
A Brief Study on the Significance of Thaali among the Tamils
From the above specific references of Sangam literature, it is very evident that ‘Izhai’ and its other forms refer to an auspicious and important ornament that is nothing but Tali or Mangala Ani (Mangala sutra), though not such words were used in the ancient Tamil literature. It should be noted that the women who have been depicted above were all married with sons and described as auspicious women. No doubt, during marriage, as depicted in Agananuru, the tying of ‘Izhai’ is not mentioned, but its removal at the time oif death of husbands has been mentioned not only in Agananuru itself, but also in other Sangam literature, as has been pointed out above. Definitely, without tying ‘Izhai around the neck of a woman, it could not have been possible for her or there was no necessity to remove after the death of her husband, unless it was considered as so dear to her as auspicious and unifying symbol of husband and wife relationship in ancient Tamil society. The woman, who followed Kaimmai nonbu to avoid sati, also would not have been asked to remove it, if ‘Izhai’ had not represented Tali or Mangala Ani (Manga sutra).[/QUOTE/]
The last reference you gave is just a discussion without examples. I am not convinced there was this ceremonial tAli tying using maRaiyOr (priests) during sangam times. Post-sangam, yes, maRaiyOr came as evidenced by SilappadikAram. In sangam period there was more of elopement of talaivan/talaivi and as a symbol of their union there may have been a garland exchange and/or some other thread on the neck of the talaivi as a symbol of their commitment to each other in front of the rural god/goddess shrine.
More discussion welcome!
