Upanayanam

[sarang]

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carpenters with sacred thread



Carpenter family wearing poonul in madras presidency in the 19th century. Their knowledge of scriptures, ithihasa and puranas was total as exemplified in their work.

"Dr. Krishna Rao says, "The most highly organized & efficient of the industrial classes was Virpanchal comprising Goldsmiths, coiner blacksmiths, carpenters and masons. In the finest period of Indian art, particularly between eighth and ninth century, they claimed and enjoyed a social status in the community, equal to Brahmans. The art of engraving & sculpture had attained a high stage of development. It was exclusively cultivated by Panchals who wore sacred thread & considered themselves as Vishwakarma Brahmans. The craftsman being deeply versed in national epic literature always figured in the history of India as missionaries of civilization, culture & religion. The intellectual influence being creative & not merely assimilative was at least as great as that of the priest and the author".

 

[sarang]

Goldsmiths with sacred thread

This is a picture from the old madras presidency of 18 the century. The goldsmiths too, belong to the vishwakarma clan, were highly respected, were closely associated with temple activities. They too wore sacred threads, and were scriptures relevant to their profession.

 

[Raji Ram]

WOW... Sacred thread for the Lord! (Balaji??)

Courtesy: Google images.

 

[mahakavi]

Well this golden sacred thread is wow alright but the diamond diadem provided by KAnchi maTam to Lord venkateshwara is wow to the power wow! I wonder whether the Lord appreciates all this and return the favor to those who provide Him such ornaments.

 

[Raji Ram]

I could get only this picture and news by Google search. Where is Wow to the power Wow??

Karnataka tourism minister and Bellary mine baron Gali Janardhan Reddy will probably be better known for

something else: with an offering of a diamond-studded crown worth Rs 45 crore, he became the biggest donor

to Lord Venkateswara at Tirupati since the Vijayanagara kings 400 years ago.


The 20-kg stunner was a 'thanksgiving' gesture, the minister said. Sources added that 32kg of 'aparanji'

(pure) gold went into its making, besides 70,000 diamonds weighing 4,000 carats. The 2.5-ft crown has a

huge 890-carat emerald from Africa engraved in the centre which alone costs around Rs 10 crore.


The crown will be placed the Lord's idol during Abhishekam seva on Friday morning. It was earlier kept in the

Vaibhavotsava Mandapam in Tirumala and special pujas were performed. After a ritual called Sahasra

Deepalankara seva, it was taken around on a procession along with the deity, Lord Malayappa Swamy. Around

7pm, the crown was taken inside the sanctum sanctorum.Keertilal Jewellers of Coimbatore in Tamil Nadu took

nine months to fashion the crown.


There are no records of more expensive donations to the temple and Gali's donation is considered as the

costliest gift offered to the Lord after the Vijayanagara kings in the 16th century. The Vijayanagara kings

ruled from Hampi not far from modern day Bellary ....


With this offering, the total number of crowns placed with the Lord has gone up to seven. This precious crown

has been added to the jewel treasury of Lord which holds over 11 tonnes of gold ornaments and vessels. :high5:

 

[mahakavi]

Is this Reddy the same mine baron who was indicted by the Karnataka High Court? If so, is he bribing the Lord to get him out of the hands of the law? Taking the lord as a partner in crime is a nice ruse to fight humans.

 

[mahakavi]

I guess he is not a minister anymore but a former Karnataka minister. Here is some latest news on him
ED grills Janardhan Reddy in illegal mining case

If this Reddy is convicted the Lord should return the kreeTam since he did not absolve Reddy of his crime.
Has anyone made a count of tons of jewelry dumped into the hundis in Tiruppati (all products of black money obviously)?
Venkatesa samO dEvO na bhUto na bhavishyati---according to varAha purANam
But in kali kalam man dictates what God should do.

 

[Govinda]

Is this Reddy the same mine baron who was indicted by the Karnataka High Court? If so, is he bribing the Lord to get him out of the hands of the law? Taking the lord as a partner in crime is a nice ruse to fight humans.

That person incriminated himself with such a loud donation

 

[renuka]

Try to think on the positive side..may be Mr Reddy could have been one of the 16th century Vijayanagar Kings born again and hence making donations as he did in his previous life.

 

[mahakavi]

He obviously will cite the Lord as a co-conspirator because he gave the Lord 10% of his wealth (which is estimated to be about 400 crore rupees).
This 10% is nothing compared with ThamizhnADu politics. Here is a standard joke.

MK when he was chief minister invited J for a congenial dinner, at his Gopalapuram residence. J took a tour of the house and everywhere there was gold on the faucets in the bathrooms and handles on the toilet and all the kitchen appliances had gold facade. The house had marble flooring throughout. J asked him how could he accumulate wealth to show off like that. He called her to the window and told her with a smug smile "see there the flyover---10%".

After he lost power and J became chief minister she reciprocated his invitation in kind. The location was a bungalow situated amid coconut and mango groves on the banks of KAvEri in Srirangam. More opulence than MK could stand. He could not contain his curiosity and asked her "How?". She called him over to the window and said "see the bridge over the river KAvEri". MK said "what bridge?". J replied "100%":amen:

 

[mahakavi]

Try to think on the positive side..may be Mr Reddy could have been one of the 16th century Vijayanagar Kings born again and hence making donations as he did in his previous life.

Yes, of course, he was Krishnadevaraya in his pUrva janmam. He should get Lord Venkateshwara to vouch for that and hence all the property in the Tungabadra region was his and as such no crime was committed by him. If that is done that would be a modern day miracle similar to BhadrAcalam Ramadas who was released from prison by the Sultan when Rama and Lakshmana were supposed to have delivered gold coins to the Sultan on Ramadas's behalf.

 

[mahakavi]

I am quoting from a blog somebody wrote>
"Bhakti should be in the mind. NO GOD HAS EVER ASKED FOR DIAMOND DIADEMS TO PROTECT THE POOR. The lord has only said ” PATRAM, PUSHPAM, PHALAM, THOYAM, YO MEY BHAKTYA PRAYACCHATI, TAD AHAM BHAKTHYUPAHRUTAM ASNAMI PRAYATATMANAH.”—-He never said, “YO RATNA-KIREETAM VA SWARNAKIREETAM VA VINA BHAKTYA PRAYACCHATI !!!”

 

[mahakavi]

Here is another link about Reddy's crown (sorry the Lord's diadem now). The Lord has decided to keep it and has no intention of returning it (the decision was made by TTD on behalf of the Lord).

Should Tirupati return only Reddy’s gold crown? « churumuri

 

[renuka]

I am quoting from a blog somebody wrote>
"Bhakti should be in the mind. NO GOD HAS EVER ASKED FOR DIAMOND DIADEMS TO PROTECT THE POOR. The lord has only said ” PATRAM, PUSHPAM, PHALAM, THOYAM, YO MEY BHAKTYA PRAYACCHATI, TAD AHAM BHAKTHYUPAHRUTAM ASNAMI PRAYATATMANAH.”—-He never said, “YO RATNA-KIREETAM VA SWARNAKIREETAM VA VINA BHAKTYA PRAYACCHATI !!!”

To we humans we still see the difference between a lump of mud and gold.

To God a lump of mud and gold or diamonds are nothing but the 5 elements.

So no matter what a devotee offers even if its water,fruit,leaf,flower,diamonds,gold or even our eye balls (like Kannapa) God will accept it if it is coming from a pure heart.

Ravan knew the fact that there is no difference between a lump of mud and gems:

दृषद्विचित्रतल्पयोर्भुजङ्गमौक्तिकस्रजोर्-
-गरिष्ठरत्नलोष्ठयोः सुहृद्विपक्षपक्षयोः ।
तृष्णारविन्दचक्षुषोः प्रजामहीमहेन्द्रयोः
समं प्रवर्तयन्मनः कदा सदाशिवं भजे ॥ 12 ॥


When will I worship Lord Sadasiva (eternally auspicious) God, with equal vision towards the people and an emperor, and a blade of grass and lotus-like eye, towards both friends and enemies, towards gems and some lump of dirt, towards a snake and a garland and towards varied ways of the world

 

[sarang]

26/11 attackers made to wear sacred threats

"Recently captured LeT terrorist abu jundal has confirmed that he and other 26/11 masterminds had plotted to make the attack appear a handiwork of hindu radicals . . .

"As part of the deception, gunman ajmal kasab and the other terrorists were made to wear suffron wristbands (maulis). And IDs with hindu names were also arranged.

From times of india, 28jun2012.

 

[Raji Ram]

Here is another link about Reddy's crown (sorry the Lord's diadem now). The Lord has decided to keep it and has no intention of returning it (the decision was made by TTD on behalf of the Lord) ........

நாய் விற்ற காசு குரைக்குமா?
அதே போலத்தான், ஊழல் தந்த காசு கசக்குமா? opcorn:

 

[mahakavi]

Perhaps the Lord did not want Reddy to keep all the ill-gotten wealth for himself and hence convinced him in his dreams to give 10% to Him, fooling him thereby that he would escape from the clutches of the law if he did so. Now that Reddy may not escape the law, I expect the Lord to make the law get the other 90% of Reddy's wealth appropriated illegally. The Lord has work to do and I expect him to prevail. parithrANAya sAdhUnAm vinAsAyaca dhuskritAm............

 

[Govinda]

Now that Reddy may not escape the law, I expect the Lord to make the law get the other 90% of Reddy's wealth appropriated illegally. The Lord has work to do and I expect him to prevail. parithrANAya sAdhUnAm vinAsAyaca dhuskritAm............

AnAdhi kala karmas cannot be solved right away. Thus, Lord wont/cannot fix all the karmas at one point, then complete dharma would be established, and the Universe/Drama wouldn't exist. They are done in a step by step manner, with the individual's realization, willingness and effort.

Then, you might question the purpose and the validity of 'PavithrAya SAdhunam..'. But, that is an exception, the Lord will take action when those completely Pure/SAdhus are troubled by the un-conquerable wicked. But, we in this kali yuga, we are all a-dharmic some-way or the other, so He acts as a passive witness.

 

[mahakavi]

AnAdhi kala karmas cannot be solved right away. Thus, Lord wont/cannot fix all the karmas at one point, then complete dharma would be established, and the Universe/Drama wouldn't exist. They are done in a step by step manner, with the individual's realization, willingness and effort.

Then, you might question the purpose and the validity of 'PavithrAya SAdhunam..'. But, that is an exception, the Lord will take action when those completely Pure/SAdhus are troubled by the un-conquerable wicked. But, we in this kali yuga, we are all a-dharmic some-way or the other, so He acts as a passive witness.

So we don't need him, you say? "sAdhUs" do not mean those remote souls who dwell in the forest sitting on a mat and chanting the lord's name. There are so many innocent souls among the 6+ billion people on planet earth. The west does not believe in karma or fate. They say it is all man's free will to do as he pleases. If a person starts shooting randomly in a crowd of people and lots of them die would you characterize it as the fate of the people to die? God would not choose to inflict punishment on that individual who takes out so many lives? A quote from Epicurus comes to mind.

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able,but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?-Epicurus, philosopher (c. 341-270 BCE)

 

[mahakavi]

>>Thus, Lord wont/cannot fix all the karmas at one point, then complete dharma would be established, and the Universe/Drama wouldn't exist<<

Then let him fix one at a time. I don't want any thrilling drama. I want action. Dramas are OK to read in books or watch in theaters/movies but in real life most of them are cruel and evil. If God insists on conducting drama for his own enjoyment that is cruel too. Let us not characterize it as drama and create an escape clause.

 

[Raji Ram]

I am quoting from a blog somebody wrote>
"Bhakti should be in the mind. NO GOD HAS EVER ASKED FOR DIAMOND DIADEMS TO PROTECT THE POOR. .......

Please note the word POOR!!

The politicians who are not poor would have thought that the LORD might ask them!!

 

[mahakavi]

The politicians who are not poor would have thought that the LORD might ask them!!

Do the greedy politicians think god might need a diamond kreeTam out of their overflowing generosity? At least if they take a measure of அவல்(beaten rice) with true love like kucElar did, they might have multiplied their wealth or gotten clues from the Lord for attaining more wealth. Poor Reddy! He lost 42 crores (with a potential for losing more) for nothing . Not a good businessman, I'd say!

 

[sarang]

There are four stages for prayaschitam:
1. One must realise that he/she has done something wrong.
2. He/she must do a sankalpa to do prayaschitam approved by sastras.
3. He/she must do the prayaschitam.
4. He must never ever repeat that wrong karma.
A quarter of the papam accrued for the wrong deed is removed at each stage. So only three fourths of the papams can be cleared away, as he has to wait till the end of his/her life.

Giving ornaments to the lord is for personal satisfaction; it will not remove even an iota of the papam accrued.

Illegal mining is a violation of law laid down by the government. The laws are violated with impunity by mining mafia in all states with the blessings of politicians. If mining is delisted from licencing, rules of the game change.

Recently a lady in mumbai, who was making home made chocolates with alchohal flavour, was raided as she did not have a permit to buy alcohol or to make chocolates; 20 bottles of liquor and 20 packets of finished goods were confiscated. If she had to come out of the event, she has to pay to exercise, police departments or fight the case out in court over 10 years.

What is the definition of 'papam'?

 

[renuka]

What is the definition of 'papam'?

Frankly speaking in Hinduism Papam is just used to denote an unpleasant act that has binding consequences and Punyam is used to denote a pleasant act that has binding consequences.

Both Punyam and Papam bind us..it's just that the chains differ.

Punyam and Papam are just actions(karma) but in the opposite ends of the spectrum.

One must be in the state of mind to understand right from wrong before he can be said to commited a Papam.
An insane person who has killed someone can not be charged for murder cos he is not in a state of mind to understand the nature of his act.

Papam as in unpleasent/unlawful act is oriented to time,place and person.
Acts of Papam might differ from culture to culture and from religion to religion.

But all religions have the same core that Love All Serve All and Hurt Never.

If we have this in mind there is no need even to define Punyam and Papam and we can happily sing...

Na Punyam Na Papam Na Saukhyam Na Dukham
Na Mantro Na Teertham Na Veda Na Yajnaha
Aham Bhojanam Naiva Bhojyam Na Bhokta
Chidananda Rupah Shivoham Shivoham

 

[zebra16]

What is the definition of 'papam'?

pApam (loosely related as sin) is the result accruing out of (i) non-performance of an act prescribed Shastras or wrongly performing it or (ii) performing a prohibited act. It has nothing to do with civil and criminal laws prevailing in the country of the performer of the act.

For eg. during the rg vedic period, the inhabitants were moving from the area (presently located in Afghanistan and Pakistan) into India. This is neither Dharma viruddha nor dharma nisheda. No one would be accruing pApam by performing such an act even today.

But as per the laws prevailing in the countries as on today, it would be illegal to make such a cross over without visa or passport etc. and anyone caught in such an act will be punished as per law.

Dharma also covers atindriya (i.e. objects and matters which cannot be comprehended by sense organs) whereas law enforcement is only indriya vishaya. pApA acccrues even if no one has observed the transgression of Dharma, whereas law enforcement and punishment is always subject to observation and reporting of the violation and proof of the same by some proof/evidence/eye witness.

There is no need to mix up pApA and law violation voluntarily/involuntarily.