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Hinduism - Is not a religion, Way of Life. Whats it?

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pvraman

Active member
Pranam to Everyone.

The purpose of this topic is to learn the real difference of our Sanathana Dharma from the other religions. Our Hinduism as for as I understand, has more scientific tools to achieve our goal, and it has given a broad guidelines to achieve it. Hinduism remains as it is. But the Prism through which it is looked, changes everyday and changed nowadays.

Hinduism - What is the Ultimate destination it advises us to visualize and achieve? I mean - Swarga & Naraga?. What is the path it laids out to achieve that. Peace? or material gains?. I understand our Swarga is a place where there is no emotions and only eternal peace. Achieving peace itself is a great thing. And it advocates to do our duty, No pursuit to achieve material goals. In Brief it advises us to have a simple life. Isn't it?

What the tools and guidelines it provides - Have we understood it properly? Like Manusmriti. Though Brahmins are given the most important place, is that easy to be a brahmin as compared to other varnas as per the guidelines. I think Brahmins are to follow strictest rules than others and hence, it is not only easy to be a brahmin it requires lot of self discipline to be a brahmin.

We analyse the things through the prism of material gains and we blame our poor state to others. Yes the world is changing. Certain things will never change like eating through mouth. But if you leave the values to accommodate the mindless changes, where is our wisdom? Brahmins are given the top most respect and ALSO RESPONSIBILITY. That's why brahmins are kept near the god. Other Varnas can achieve but they have to do good deeds and move up to be a brahmin in their next birth. The rules given to other varnas are not as strict as brahmins. What I understand, Manusmriti is a beautiful guidelines to society so that all live harmoniously. More importantly, according to it, all 4 varnas depend upon each other and failure of one is the failure of all. It is our responsibility as a top of the varnas, who not only should follow the strictest of the life who should be responsible to keep the social thread in harmony to each other.

When the difference will arise?, when one varna tries to enter into others business. Why? I think it is the violation of the teachings of the sanathana Dharma. Moving towards achieving material gains. A brahmin can be a true brahmin only when he is supported by other varnas. Similar thing to kshaktriya. Based on Manusmriti script (From a little what I understand), one varna can be moved to other varna after rebirths and deeds as described. If we apply this logic, the brahmins could once be sudras, vysyas, kshatrias. The point, I want to make it, being a brahmin, we have greater responsibility in the society than anyother varna. The fall of our values, is the fall of basic concept of Hinduism.

Irrespective of sub-sects we should know sanskrit to know the vedas. How many of us Know? I am guilty ridden, because i dont know. I am 41. I want to start learning now.

Secondly, a true brahmin should learn veda and teach veda, then who will support his family. Now the question is we should seek job to accommodate our basic requirement or rich life style?.

Now the world is rolled over to rich and materialistic life style. The highly knowledgeable race, we too fallen victims. Our Education system make us respect the Money. It is totally against Hindu Philosophy. But if we dont work for money, how to take care our family? Our system Killed Bharathiyar who tried to live as a true brahmin, many days he starved. The question is we should change to the changed times and live with the flow, or We should come back to the original and great tradition?. When we fight for a place in job it makes brahmin as a group not varna.

I think, logically, if we are to follow true Hinduism, we should stop running behind materialistic gains, and stop looking up people who are rich and stop comparing. We should realize that one who follows this simplistic value is superior to all. We should help others to realize this goal. When they see Brahmin is something to boast, or superior, naturally others will get jealousy. But when they see a true brahmin they will help voluntarily and many of them will also respect their respective varnas in this birth. According to me, brahmin should follow the most difficult way of life.

It is in my mind for a long time. I think, our ancestors left us with great wealth. We have to realize.

I still feel, instead of blaming the govt and other community, in this Kaliyug, we should be the start of all changes.

We should create a directory and take the pledge of members who would like to live like a true brahmin.

The present education system is a sin, and targets the ways to make money even unethically.

1. Revive badashala.
2. In the first half of the day, Teach & Learn Sanskrit, Veda and sacred scripts and understand.
3. In the second half of the day, follow the Normal education system barring history and geography (which is already in the vedas)
4. Teach, preach the value of simplicity and actual aim of our life. When the fight for materialistic goal lowers, then all the so called social economic imbalance will go surely.
5. We should create a trust and we should seek for funds not only from Brahmins and from other Varnas. There are always good people in all varnas who can help fund revival of badashalas.

Since we are too deep in this materialistic world so much so that we are fighting for reservations, now the time is we should have the new outlook of our existence, Our true responsibilities towards the world, if we are true follower of Hinduism.

Muslims still follows their age old Quran, Christians still follows 2000 years old Bible, why we should not follow our ancient scriptures which is more logical, scientifically superior and older importantly which preaches peace.

In Brief, instead of feeling lower down the order, we are made to realize our true responsibilities, and why we are BRAHMINS.

I saw a thread here about NB boys marrying a brahmin girl. If a parent teaches their child when she is young, the true characteristic of hinduism and varnas, (according to it, the offspring from brahmin girl and NB boys will be an outcast, Kandalas, who will dare to do that), when she becomes old, with the help of education she can know what is right and wrong. When people stops thinking for self, the social disturbance will be eliminated. Again in this example, when the girl think selfishly then she tries to oppose the parents. Which is flaw in the teachings and knowledge she gained from the parents and teachers. So, instead of blaming the society, have we taught our kids from the young age about the life, hinduism.

Look what we want our kids to do? Study in a elite school ( we try hard to put them), go with the fashion, give best of the dress (creating in his young mind to have best things in life), best of the facilities, phone, two wheeler car......This is totally against the basic of Hinduism what it tries to teach.

Now, we are criticized for our hypocrisy. We want to be a brahmin as a group not as a greatest followers of Hinduism. Its hard not to go into materialistic path. But it starts from ourselves and our kids. We should teach them the true value of Peace which can not be achieved by any amount of success in this materialistic world.

Lets be proactive, the fall in Brahmin value is the fall of Hinduism.

I am in search of this, i am confused. For a long time, i am very uncomfortable when i started to read Bhagvat Geeta. I feel ashamed. I need your help to make me clear, come out of my ignorance. When I questioned my view towards this life, i am really bewildered.

Lot of questions are bombarding me. I enrolled myself to get a enlightenment from our community member first.

I all along studied in Tamil Medium only. So i don't command expertize in english. So if you find my words aggressive or wrong, please forgive me. It is not my intention.
 

kunjuppu

Active member
pv,

your query in the title, is way above my comprehension.

but when i read your note, i could relate to it. somewhat. hope you forgive me if my post here is way out of bounds to your query.

i only speak for myself. from a more மண்டு knowledge of hinduism, but very well versed in that famous school known as the 'school of hard knocks' for the past 59 years.

having brought up in a nominally TB household, only son. starting from 14 years involved in pithru service, which has given me a long term view of not only death, but death service.

which is why, perhaps, i focussed more on living. i have tried to find contentment within a framework without tension.

oh, i forgot to say, that it is my firm conviction, that the ultimate causes of sickness/death for both my parents was tension. i can private message you the details if you wish, only it is mundane stuff.

but i have come to believe that tension kills. absolute tension kills absolutely.

so my conscious search in life, has to be avoid tension, while at the same time, provide means for a decent livelihood for my family, do good, do no harm and above all be grateful for every day.

i do pray several times for peaceful life, healthy life and quickeasy death. nothing more. nothing less.

i look forward to tomorrow, as i believe tomorrow is a better day than today which is better than yesterday.

the bottom line, what i wish to say, is that i do not think too much of what a brahmin should, would and must do.

i believe, to find peace, one should be in sync with the hums and tunes of today. for today is reality for us. it is today that we deal with everyday.

how can one peace, if one is not in harmony with the values and rules of his environment - defining it in the broadest sense re religion, residence and the residual self?

when i read of the brahmins of yore, i am just a namesake. just not me, but all the ancestors that i can trace back, and everyone in the community that i know that i claim to belong.

the best ones, are ones, who have accepted the times that is now, moved along, and believe in the humanity of our community lies in service and charity.

definitely not claiming any sense of ownership or guardianship to a way of life known as hinduism. that, to me, would reek of taking on something, which in the current world, we are ill prepared.

there is this big spasm of history, which divides us the current, from ancient brahmins. when we say abhivadhey, we invoke rishis to whom we claim lineage, but what we can trace is barely 3 generations gone.

we live in a ever fastly changing world of values,knowledge, competition and above all one in which the underprivileged and the downtrodden are finally getting hopes of correcting wrongs.

would i want to be one of those wrongs? would i want to be an instrument of change to right?

these matter more to me, than a call to translate my current life to conform to a translation of scriptures. in values, i wish to do so - generosity, kindness and above all humanity.

does it make a difference in outward forms. i would only do so much, and such, that i am comfortable with, knowing myself. not beyond what i can handle, without tension, within myself and my surroundings.

even more, i would not impose on my children, my half baked practices in the name of tradition. for children see through duplicity, and what we end up passing on as heritage, is practices handed down incomplete and insincere.

you ask what about muslims or christians.

i would not worry about them. personally, to me, hinduism, especially tamil hinduism, is a wholesome inclusive phenomenon - of kapali koil and mundankanni amman koil, both of mylapore.

i see no contradiction in being materialistic and being a brahmin. i encourage my children, where they can, to have the killing instinct to succeed. but, i remind them consistenly, in an even more demanding tone, to GIVE. give.

give, loudly, like bill gates, so that you can set an example.

give quietly, like oliver goldsmith's 'man in black', shy and anonymous.

but do not give with arrogance, anger, a need to leave a legacy, and above all shout boastfully from the roofs of the world as if your 100s of crores are what made the difference to poor TBs.

let not your boastful crores be a tin of senseless cacophony which gives cause to further the cancer of want, but rather a paise of a little tinkle of a bell to harmonize with that little water drop from your roof on a rainy night. the sweetest sounds are those that beg to be heard due to their understated melody.

for in the ultimate, i believe, that a one penny given where it hurts most is worth more than the supposed crores of idle and arrogant boasts. educate a poor youth, brahmin if you wish to be particular. nothing wrong with that. pay for those huge medical bills to the needy. but give. keepo on giving. give till it hurts. that will count.

truths, they are heard when whispered the softest. your own voice, the voice of your loved ones are the truths that matter most to you. charity and peace begin where every thing of value for you originates ie your home.

somewhere there humility comes in. its presence is felt. the knowledge of it, acknowledged by the rest of the world, but unaware to yourself.

one word formula to peaceful life? avoid tension. whatever that word means or makes sense to you. tension kills.


God Bless ...
 
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Revival of certain good customs and practices is alright. But, trying to make an exact replica of the distant past is not workable, nor beneficial, in the modern world.

Mere learning of one field or subject may not suit all and pay dividends for all. That's why the learning theories of the day suggest 'eclectic approach' and 'inter-disciplinary approach' in studies.

I appreciate a person who studied Sanskrit and scriptures in his young age becoming
an army man, in his later part of life.

Similarly, I have seen a physicist taking interest in his middle age to learn our ancient texts and literature. That also deserves praise.

But, expecting the entire brahmin community to change their line to their original occupation that was practised by their ancestors some hundreds of years ago is hypothetical, simply impractical and even suicidal in the present context.

Let's be very clear in our vision and thoughts.
 
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pvraman

Active member
Thank you very much for the reply.

I am trying to figure out still. I also wonder, if we can not follow the one described, what could be the new set of descriptions that could define a Brahmin apart from Parents insistence & Poonool kalyanam.

Thanks
P.Venkataraman
 

kunjuppu

Active member
Thank you very much for the reply.

I am trying to figure out still. I also wonder, if we can not follow the one described, what could be the new set of descriptions that could define a Brahmin apart from Parents insistence & Poonool kalyanam.

Thanks
P.Venkataraman

pv,

pardon me for another note.

i have always found for me, it works to listen to myself.

poonul is only aspect of defining a brahmin. there are aspects, which give you great joy and internal satisfaction. follow and make sure these are part of your life.

then there are others, which are a drudgery. you do it from a sense that it is a must for reasons like, it is a tradtion, or what the community expects or for our dignity sake or inane other reasons.

i have learned that by shunning these, that i remove a great source of tension within myself, body and mind.

whatever it takes to remove tensions, is the first step.

things, i find, sort themselves out, at their own pace. listen to yourself and you get to know what is best for you. everything else, is only guidelines.

our religion is broad and tolerant enought to accommodate all of us.

take care.
 

anandb

Active member
I think living like a brahmin who lived in those ages is not tough provided one has the conviction to live like that. Performing all the 40 samskaras including begging for alms may not be possible but definitely performing the Sandhya, chanting Gayathri, performing homams, studying Vedas and Sanskrit or performing the Shrardham is definitely not an impossible task for a office going brahmin. The main thing here is the want and the conviction to do it. But these rituals are again not science where something is proved and then you start using it. A lot of times one has to jump into it and wait before seeing the results. In my case the act came initially while the conviction slowly built up. Like yoga or pranayama which has to be performed at least for sometime before we start seeing the results. I personally do not subscribe to the fact that being a no brahmin is better than being a half brahmin meaning why take the trouble of doing only karma or that anushtanam if the rest of the prescribed stuff cannot be performed. So someone can argue that since you don't beg for food and go to office you are already not doing what a brahmin is supposed to do, so why perform the Sandhya. Chuck that as well. One has to remember that every karma you do is supposed to accumulate merit. Something like a bank account. We start saving in small portions now to perform a marriage or fund the child's education. Similar is the performance of rituals. Everything has a significance. It is better to study it and then perform it. The Gurus say a brahmin has to do as much as possible of what is prescribed within the constraints present.

What Shri. Kunjippuji says is correct that service and charity is very important but these can very well co-exist with what I have mentioned to be the duties of a brahmin. They are not mutually exclusive. So a brahmin who is ritualistic should not develop the arrogance that service and charity is not important as all of this works towards the realization of the ultimate which is to become one with the Supreme Being. What one should avoid here is becoming a victim of religious dogma. There is nothing wrong in being materialistic but that is not the ultimate goal because the goal post keeps shifting further and further.

I personally believe in the positive effects of being a ritualistic brahmin as much as I believe in other good things like charity or service or being good to others. It is all a matter of faith. The former is faith while the latter is goodness. Faith especially if it is positive leads to goodness as well. Goodness for all though it cannot be measured. For ex, the mantras in the Sandhya offers thanks to Surya, Gayatri Devi, Bhooma Devi, the rishis and so on. A matter of simple thanks for our very survival in this planet just like saying thanks to a guy who keeps the lift open for us to enter. So what is wrong in saying thanks to entities like the Sun or Mother Earth who makes our very survival possible? Even not considering them as demi-gods but just as simple beings to whom we say thanks.

There is something called Zakat in Islam where a Muslim has to donate 5% of all his lifetime earnings to charity. A lot of Muslims do it because it is laid down in the Quran. Folks who may otherwise not do it do so because it is said. Our scriptures even contain so many such lofty ideas. A matter of taking the time to understand them.

My suggestion to Shri. PV Raman is to strive and live like a brahmana as said in the scriptures to what ever extent possible and not feel confused or inferior about it. The main thing is the conviction and along with it comes courage. If we start feeling ashamed of our own culture and traditions then even god cannot save us. Tinkering with religion especially ours which is called apauresheya is not welcome as it can only lead to fights. So you cannot define a new brahminical code of conduct as that will still be man made and subject to all kinds of arguments. If one does not believe it is better to step out. That's what a lot of Muslims do calling themselves ex-muslims. A growing number of people all over the world cite their religion as none while still believing in a Supreme Power.
 
Hinduism

Dear Mr. pvr,
Your sincerety and eagerness to be a real brahmin is a great thing.First of all I feel Tamilnadu Brahmins should shed their inferiority complex and at the same time their superiority complex.
We need not feel shy for the state in which we are now as times change, history changes and there is difficulty everywhere. With all this we are fine, respectable and we have every right to live with honour.
Hinduism was the only religion in ancient times existent and so a separate name was not needed. If there are many ramus we have to identify as kuttai ramu nettai ramu etc. If there is only one ramu no need for even that name .Andha aalu will do to denote him(Aacharyal deivaththin kural)
Our religion was and is so great that it intended only human growth and evolution and did not bother about numbers and groups. That is why there is no rule for conversion. and actually conversion is not allowed because we do not want to disturb the faith of any one. It is not only universal tolerance but universal accepatance (Swami vivekananda).
This point has turned out to be a negative one also in the present circumstance of other religions just trying to attack our religion.
Coming to practical life, learning sanskrit is excellent. But if it is posing difficulties one need not feel depressed. Dravida vedam and thamizh are equally acceptable to the Lord. Vedam thamizh seida maran sadagopan nammazhvar)
Andhamizhin inbappaavinai kulasekarar.
Archchani paatte aagum sundarar etc will clarify this point
Never give place to the idea of sin in your mind. It is not our religion . No one is a sinner. Man makes mistakes, learns, avoids and evolves.
Man travels from LOWER TRUTH to HIGHER TRUTH AND NOT FROM FALSEHOOD TO TRUTH.
Namajapam, Gayathri, giving charities to cows and needy, growing a tulasi or vilvam or arugam pul by ourselves, reading shastras or listening to sastras(pl. listen to nichur vekats bhagavatham provided by this site itself. it is beatiful consoling and guiding) will be very helpful.
Varnasrama dharmam has necessarily changed. Do not get confused with the dangers of varna sangraham.
The Lord is the most impartial and will not differentiate a person by birth. Actually every one undergoes the stages of varnam every day . In th morning we are all pious and think of holy thoughts only then u r a brahmin. then you go about earning money. HoW u sell something. either your knowledge or labour that is a vysas work When you attend to some hard household cores you are the fourth varnam when you have to fight for your rights thru associations etc it is a khathriyas work. But if one can remember his brahminhood throughout there will be a distinct way of dealing with things. I feel most of us are trying to be pious vysyas only. Brahmin hood is the ideal and a sincere attempt will only give peace and if it is not fully attained one need not feel dejected. (one in thousand hear this. one in thousand attempt this..... says bhagavat gita itself..
yogi sudhdhnanda bharathiyar dided his 24 hrs into 4 parts and spent 6 hrs in reading, 6 hrs in writing, 6 hrs inmeditation and 6hrs sleep
Though it is difficult to follow this, we should give importance to reading and writing and thinking in our own simple way.
that will help us to get peace and also impart peace t others.
We should observe our children and see whether they are intersted in the rituals. then we should encourage that otherwise small dozes of nama japam sangeetham and bhajan should be given.
we r in between our forefathers and our children. We should remember the root and have the catholicity and enrgy to understand the younger generation and act accordingly No particular rule or code of conduct can be given.
I have just blabbered what came to my mind
vasaga dosham khandhavyaha (Excuse the mistakes please)
 
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pvraman

Active member
I am really thankful to the replies by you.

Each reply is class of its own and gives a multi-dimensional approach to get clarity. Anandb sir, Your reply gives me strength to pursue what I would like to do. Tvvaradan sir's replies are having good information which is unknown to me. Kunjuppu sirs immediate reply is encouraging, Pannvalan sir is more practical.

As per the manusmriti itself explained that this is the yug of liberality.

1.86. In the Krita age the chief (virtue) is declared to be (the performance of) austerities, in the Treta (divine)
knowledge, in the Dvapara (the performance of) sacrifices, in the Kali liberality alone.

1.87. But in order to protect this universe He, the most resplendent one, assigned separate (duties and)
occupations to those who sprang from his mouth, arms, thighs, and feet.

So, I feel we should encourage others to respect the one who is doing their basic duty selflessly who lives with simplicity and not who is successful financially, What we as a brahmin are doing to encourage this? How it can be done? Always the kids are important. Are we teaching the kids respect the one who is simple or who is wealthy? how we teach the kids and children, what is really to be appreciated. Everything starts from there. How we are going to be an example.

May we encourage them who teaches sanskrit, Ved. Enroll the kids to (during summer holidays atleast) in those Badashalas. Help the poor to get the job. Free coaching class for the poors. (scholarly Anbargal can have a place in each village & locality in City spend one hour atleast to teach the the poor, we are supposed to do that.) High earning anbargal can contribute a little to the poor and needy. Apart from that we acquire the knowledge of appreciating others not by their financial status or success and but by the simplicity.

Its really hard. But as i think many people already would be doing it. I am interested to know such people who does community service like that.

Doing sandhi, learning ved for ones own discipline, and the application part is more important. If we have such names, org who does the selfless work, we can encourage others to contribute something (Not only Money, help in anyway they are comfortable to do). And this can only be done collectively.

Tamil is established by Agathiya Muni with well structured Grammer and equal to Sanskrit. No doubt is there. Its a greatest language.

The thing is that the original ved many texts are in in sanskrit, and reading the original in the same language will avoid lot of misinterpretations. Thats my humble idea.

Please forgive me if I am wrong in my choice of words. I will continue once i read your replies few more times. (sorry, I am not a bright student)


PV
 
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pvraman

Active member
Dear Kunjuppu sir, Pannvalan Sir.. thanks for your replies. Very informative and encouraging.

Dear Anandb sir and tvvaradan sir, let me go through it with its full understanding. Pardon me for some more time before i reply..
Thanks a lot

PV
 
Namaskaram shri pvraman,

A little bit from what I have learnt, heard and experienced: (in blue)


Hinduism - What is the Ultimate destination it advises us to visualize and achieve? I mean - Swarga & Naraga?. What is the path it laids out to achieve that. Peace? or material gains?. I understand our Swarga is a place where there is no emotions and only eternal peace. Achieving peace itself is a great thing. And it advocates to do our duty, No pursuit to achieve material goals. In Brief it advises us to have a simple life. Isn't it?

Dharma/Artha/Kama/Moksha - Dharmarthakamamoksha - are the 4 universal categories under which all human aspirations lie. Dharmam is to do service and extend goodness so that we become more enlightened in our next birth. Artha denotes all material pursuits which satisfy our needs. Kama includes all pursuits which satisfy all our wants. Moksha is liberation from all of the above.

What the tools and guidelines it provides - Have we understood it properly? Like Manusmriti. Though Brahmins are given the most important place, is that easy to be a brahmin as compared to other varnas as per the guidelines. I think Brahmins are to follow strictest rules than others and hence, it is not only easy to be a brahmin it requires lot of self discipline to be a brahmin.

Brahmanas should aspire for moksha; that is the goal. Though this does not mean that other varnas are excluded from it. Shasthras are the means to provide the key to it. Not mere learning, but living by what we have learnt.

We analyse the things through the prism of material gains and we blame our poor state to others. Yes the world is changing. Certain things will never change like eating through mouth. But if you leave the values to accommodate the mindless changes, where is our wisdom?
.
.
.
Based on Manusmriti script (From a little what I understand), one varna can be moved to other varna after rebirths and deeds as described. If we apply this logic, the brahmins could once be sudras, vysyas, kshatrias. The point, I want to make it, being a brahmin, we have greater responsibility in the society than anyother varna. The fall of our values, is the fall of basic concept of Hinduism.

Varna denotes the basic svabhava of individuals. Our shasthras say that one should choose an occupation which befits his natural abilities. One who aspires for kama and is tamasic is a shudra; one who aspires for kama and artha and is selfish in nature is a vaishya; one who aspires for kama and artha and dharma and is rajasic in nature is a kshatriya; one who aspires for moksha and is sattwic in nature is a brahmana. The aspirations could, possibly be tuned in the present lifespan which would earn a higher varna birth in the next janma.

So, the guardian of our vedic religion is the brahmana varna. As he is inclined towards spirituality and liberation from the life-death cycle, he is not naturally interested in material pursuits. But then how would he survive? As a result, it was the dharma (bounden duty) of the state (the king in those days) to serve the brahmana, honour him and provide for him. Thus brahmanas in those days had no necessity to pursue material goals.

Times have changed; today the state (government) is the first enemy of the brahmana. So survival is the first priority; hence we digressed a bit. But then, in order to survive in a challenging world, one had to be competent. In order to be so, one should excel in what one does. Hence, we sought to master that which would give us priority - Western education. We digressed a bit more. We mastered it, as was natural, but then found lots of opposition from varias areas - social and political. Then we sought to explore opportunities outside our homeland. Now we had digressed enough to lose track of our original intent. Then to earn respect among the western peers, we aped their manners, their culture, and their thoughts. We have converted to mlecchas.

In the midst of all this, suddenly we are forced to think of our roots. It could happen by chance, by observing the few who are still true brahmanas, or by discussing the long gone virtues of our culture. Our mind is then torn between two thoughts- one which compels us to follow the materialistic path, as it has proved fruitful so far. The other is the nostalgia and a feeling of hypocrisy which threatens to consume the remainder of our life (applies only to the conscientious). Some are capable of brushing this away as their minds are convoluted enough to crave only for material belongings. Some, try to mend their way to catch up on where their forefathers had missed out. The remaining spend their lives in eternal internal turmoil.


Irrespective of sub-sects we should know sanskrit to know the vedas. How many of us Know? I am guilty ridden, because i dont know. I am 41. I want to start learning now.

Sanskrit is the key to unlocking the shasthras. No amount of translation would help. So it is essential for every brahmana to learn sanskrit. And it is never too late to learn. You should start now - is my suggestion. Personally, I have an elemental knowledge of sanskrit. I am learning it now.

Secondly, a true brahmin should learn veda and teach veda, then who will support his family. Now the question is we should seek job to accommodate our basic requirement or rich life style?.

Now the world is rolled over to rich and materialistic life style. The highly knowledgeable race, we too fallen victims. Our Education system make us respect the Money. It is totally against Hindu Philosophy. But if we dont work for money, how to take care our family? Our system Killed Bharathiyar who tried to live as a true brahmin, many days he starved. The question is we should change to the changed times and live with the flow, or We should come back to the original and great tradition?. When we fight for a place in job it makes brahmin as a group not varna.

I think, logically, if we are to follow true Hinduism, we should stop running behind materialistic gains, and stop looking up people who are rich and stop comparing. We should realize that one who follows this simplistic value is superior to all. We should help others to realize this goal. When they see Brahmin is something to boast, or superior, naturally others will get jealousy. But when they see a true brahmin they will help voluntarily and many of them will also respect their respective varnas in this birth. According to me, brahmin should follow the most difficult way of life.

It is in my mind for a long time. I think, our ancestors left us with great wealth. We have to realize.

I still feel, instead of blaming the govt and other community, in this Kaliyug, we should be the start of all changes.

We should create a directory and take the pledge of members who would like to live like a true brahmin.

I have tried to opine on some of your above queries in my earlier paras. I think we should go along with the flow while not being corrupted by it. Our primary responsibility is the study of VEDAS and living by it to the extent possible. Some may think it impractical; yet others may laugh at us. But I think this is our way.

The present education system is a sin, and targets the ways to make money even unethically.

1. Revive badashala.
2. In the first half of the day, Teach & Learn Sanskrit, Veda and sacred scripts and understand.
3. In the second half of the day, follow the Normal education system barring history and geography (which is already in the vedas)
4. Teach, preach the value of simplicity and actual aim of our life. When the fight for materialistic goal lowers, then all the so called social economic imbalance will go surely.
5. We should create a trust and we should seek for funds not only from Brahmins and from other Varnas. There are always good people in all varnas who can help fund revival of badashalas.

We should create a trust and start schools which have a new curriculum that embodies both your points 1 & 2. It is not impossible; the difficulty is that many do not think like you and me.

Since we are too deep in this materialistic world so much so that we are fighting for reservations, now the time is we should have the new outlook of our existence, Our true responsibilities towards the world, if we are true follower of Hinduism.
.
.
.

I am in search of this, i am confused. For a long time, i am very uncomfortable when i started to read Bhagvat Geeta. I feel ashamed. I need your help to make me clear, come out of my ignorance. When I questioned my view towards this life, i am really bewildered.

Now that you have realized, there is nothing to be ashamed of. I was in this stage some years ago. The only solution is in action. I found that my inner mind did not allow me to concentrate on other pursuits. My inclination has changed, still changing.....

First we should revive ourselves and then the society... As individuals we are free to go our way, but then we are bound by dharma to help the other.
 
Hinduism.....a way of life

my notes in blue
The purpose of this topic is to learn the real difference of our Sanathana Dharma from the other religions.

I recall an anecdote retold to me my grandfather.

A missionary of another religion aproached our Acharya in propogation of his faith.He tried to convince Acharya that those who believe in his faith's Lord will be liberated after death.

Acharya smiled agreeingly and asked back? When your faith was started and liberator began his service?
About2000 yrs.

Acharya said ,very good.let it be even 4000 yrs.When mankind originated in this earth?

'About thousands and thousands of years ago.'

Acharya smiled and said "that means all those men and women did not get liberated? Don't worry, our Sanatana Dharma was there then itself till date,today, and tomorrow also.It took care of them and will similarly take care hereafter also. Thanks'.

Irrespective of sub-sects we should know sanskrit to know the vedas. How many of us Know? I am guilty ridden, because i dont know. I am 41. I want to start learning now.

Secondly, a true brahmin should learn veda and teach veda, then who will support his family. Now the question is we should seek job to accommodate our basic requirement or rich life style?.

Why to take up such big tasks and tension? Many Good souls have spent their life and made things very simple for us. Lot of books are written by them in simple languages (in which we are more comfortable). Today's vibrant youth are taking pains to give them in tablet forms with the help of modern technology .Internet is the 15 th worls somewhere among Bhooloka,Bhuvarloka,suvarloka OR atala,vital,sutal....where all these wisdom is now getting parked and disseminated.

Even learning today's Sanskrit may be not enough. Still pandits and half pundits are debating on what exactly is the meaning of the word 'Kapiddha" in the line " Kapitha jamboo phalasaara bhkshitam" coming in the sloka "Gajaananam Bhoota ganaadhisevitam...."

As Adi Shankaracharya advised in "Bhajagovindam"
let us start by taking one drop of Ganga...to purify ourselves


greetings
 
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pvraman

Active member
I think living like a brahmin who lived in those ages is not tough provided one has the conviction to live like that. ..........................

My suggestion to Shri. PV Raman is to strive and live like a brahmana as said in the scriptures to what ever extent possible and not feel confused or inferior about it. The main thing is the conviction and along with it comes courage. If we start feeling ashamed of our own culture and traditions then even god cannot save us. Tinkering with religion especially ours which is called apauresheya is not welcome as it can only lead to fights. So you cannot define a new brahminical code of conduct as that will still be man made and subject to all kinds of arguments. If one does not believe it is better to step out. That's what a lot of Muslims do calling themselves ex-muslims. A growing number of people all over the world cite their religion as none while still believing in a Supreme Power.

Very encouraging reply and very practical. Thanks very much anandb sir. One who learns the sacred texts, will be guided automatically. That's the backbone of all our deeds.
 
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pvraman

Active member
Namaskaram shri pvraman,

A little bit from what I have learnt, heard and experienced: (in blue)

Namaskaram Sapthajihva Sir,

Your reply has given me great strength, and I am encouraged to think that I did not go Crazy all of a sudden. It gave me immense encouragement to explore the possibilities further. I feel i should devote my free time in social service esp for our community's welfare.

I strongly feel to do, something like Anil did to Rama's task. A small contribution of physical work, (we are in IT age, and great networking), for the welfare of our community.

Thanks very much sir.
 
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pvraman

Active member
my notes in blue
The purpose of this topic is to learn the real difference of our Sanathana Dharma from the other religions.


greetings

Namaskaram suryaKasyapa Sir, thanks for your reply. Indeed we can get all the references books and translations from the net. Thats how my tail got fired-up.

I was enjoying my life. I got into facebook. I made some friends and enrolled in Hinduism group and unknowingly participated in a Hinduism debate, to reply, i started to read the stuff in the net (to counter) and now the debate is hanging, i am here posting my mind .

And the replies shows the class of this forum our forum. Excellent contribution. I am very glad to be here. Thanks

PV
 

KRS

Active member
Dear Sri pvraman Ji,

You have opened a very interesting thread, and this topic has been very close to my heart for a couple of decades now.

Let me pre qualify myself in positioning where I am in the TB spectrum. I am not as progressive as some in this Forum and at the same time, I am not also definitely orthodox. Like Sri Kunjuppu Ji, I have lived outside of India, all in the USA, for the past 40 years. So, you need to take my views within this context. I know you appreciate the orthodox view of our religion as applied to us, the TBs. But that is okay. I am here to just present my view point.

First and foremost, what is Sanathan Dharma? I do not think that it is only the Purva Mimamsa. It is then not just advaitha, visishtadwaitha or dwaitha. It is not the so called 'Brahminism' either. So, what is it?

One has to remember that this grand old philosophy of satisfying the man's yearning to understand his role spawned every imaginable human imagination. We accommodated every philosophy from monism, through materialism. The only requirement was that we acknowledge that the Vedas are the final authority. This is why, Buddhism and Jainism, who otherwise follow closely the edicts of our Vedas are not consdered as branches of Hinduism.

Now, let us look at our own heritage within Hinduism. We played an important part in shaping our religion - philosophically and liturgically - but, then, unfortunately we lost. We lost to the invading hordes, because we did not properly advise the Kshatrias, and this is a long story.

To speed forward, here we are in the modern times, where other varnas do not support us, we have taken up jobs that we were not supposed to take to make sure we survive and so on.

And so the question is how we go forward in the context of modern times.

Here I stand on the shoulders of my forefathers who have decided that they will shun the traditional role of Brahmins and made sure that their familes survived. My grand father supported his whole extended family, because he had decided to enter in to the secular world to survive. Let us not vilify these brave souls as 'hypocrites' as some have done so. Our forefathers adjusted. Mainly because they figured out that the world was changing beneath their feet and if they did not change, we would not be discussing today about our roles.

I think, the best we can do is to try to live and adhere to the basic intent of our clan. Be of service to the mankind, be selfless, not being greedy and most importantly support the unfortunate. Times have changed. What we did with Pujas and Yagnas, we need to substitute with modern methodologies. We should do this irrespective of what other Jathis think of or say.

I have more to say, based on your response.

Regards,
KRS
 

anandb

Active member
Dear KRSji,

What we did with Pujas and Yagnas, we need to substitute with modern methodologies. We should do this irrespective of what other Jathis think of or say.
KRS

That is a huge statement to make sir and something which I will not agree. By now, we do know our respective positions so I will not argue endlessly over this. I will just say this. If I were to advise my son I will say this
"You are born a brahmana and as per our Shastras you do have to perform certain karmas as a brahmin is supposed to do. So do as much as possible. This does not mean that you have to forsake other good things like nobility, justice, charity or compassion because there is space for all in a person's life. Nothing is mutually exclusive"

To me the role of a brahmana within Hinduism has increased and not diluted. Means he should now start living as an example for others. This does not come from any superiority complex. The Acharyal said irrespective of times there should be a "வேதம் ஓதும் ஜாதி" all the time because the chanting of the Vedas creates good vibrations and these vibrations are needed now more than anything else. This jathi can be anyone even non-brahmins preserving the Vedas but it should be there. Not forsaken and substituted by something else.

I don't know the situation in the West but in Dubai there are lot of Veda and Sanskrit classes happening. It is heartening to see they are always full and invariably filled with people over 40. A majority are brahmins by caste and come from all walks of life - CEOs to office boys. Most of them come because they feel they have missed it in their early life and want to go back to their roots to understand from where it all came from. So I feel all is not lost still.
 
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pvraman

Active member
Dear Sri KRS Ji,

I am very thankful for your mind stimulating reply. Sir, i came from a poor family, have a great parents who underwent tremendous difficulty to see off their Kadamai, (he had 6 sisters and non working father, Mother, and 3 sons and one daughter - My father was the only earning member!). Many of my relatives helped my father, morally.

Though i had upanayanam, but very late, my father made sure my son had when he was 7 years old. All along we did not do anything a brahmin should be doing. But no regrets. Because as you mentioned, we had to fight for our living.

My father, experienced harassment from his co workers ( as his co workers in the TN state firm, lovingly named him as the only Paappan!), because they were DK,DMK & Communists tholars. Even When my father did not sport kudumi, namam, panca kacham. Name is enough i think. In My time, i did not have that kind of harassment but i could see the students with lower marks get past me in securing seats in technical courses. Thats when I understood, oh I am a brahmin, i did not do well, i am required to do much better. We did not care much. We are well settled now. In my workplace (when I was in India), I absolutely did not have name calling or communal harassment eventhough i was the only brahmin. I have lot of NB friends, and they never made fun of our poojas or customs, because we too respected their customs and participated.

Due to various reasons, We Could not do anything a brahmin has to do. (basic things) My father started to do the basics after he got VRS (12 years before), I started only last year (at 40). I am sure, many of our members would have undergone similar or more worse situations. Despite the difficulties, some of them would have continued to do atleast a little of our duties as a brahmin.

We have experience with our community people being critical unfare and not helpful when my father really needed their support. But We did not know their condition so we did not blame them. There were also some great souls who were kind and supportive. So I had the great opportunity to see the people with various characteristics.

Back to the present, I don't think we are too modern to ignore the basics. Its a state of mind. And one need not stretch oneself to balance the life. As you rightly said. I also see the things could be possible only when we attempt to do it. We can not say nothing is impossible. When we measure our times, when we are happy and when we are sad, and emotional imbalances, and from the morning to night, how much time you are at peace, and what is the reason... every thing, and one can understand its not money or thing that bring the happiness. Its a state of mind. I teach my children this things. when their IB Classmates bring Blackberry and Iphone, i discussed with my children in great detail, why we should fall prey when there is absolutely no need to have a phone. (the school is only 5 minutes walk from the home and they provide office phone to call home!). They initially had problem (peer pressure) but now they understand very well and they don't want it. We started to ridicule the advertisements and my son would say, see, how they act to sell this products. So, my painful task was to make them understand what is really required and what is not. It takes lot of your patience though. Should we blindly follow or set an example.

What is the Modern world. When others have the state of art communication device we can have black and white phone and do the same job. Again its once choice.

Sorry for making it so lengthy. I had to mention this to give you an idea why the first note was posted.

I think, apart from attempting to learn the holy scripts, I wish to take part in social activity which will be aimed at encouraging the vedic study and try to help the needy as for as possible with the networking. I am taking reference to your last para. I Believe this is possible. The will to spend our (atleast, extra) time towards the basic things. (Many people already may be doing it without any advt.). My thought process is like this. And I from your replies, get good idea, how to go about it without starving the family. I have all ears to your valuable comments. I think many readers will also benefit by reading your replies.

Thanks
PV
 
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pvraman

Active member
That is a huge statement to make sir and something which I will not agree.

.

Dear Sri Anandb Sir,

That's another Gem, Sir, I am glad to get the advise from wise people. I hope, like me, there are so many who will also benefit from your views and suggestions.

It gives strength to read that we should do our duties as for as possible without compromise. We should be the change we want to see in others. Our duty is not limited only to our community. We should have broader view and work for the welfare of other community too. Thats what we are....
Thanks
PV
 
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KRS

Active member
Dear anandb ji,

I think within the context my words did not convey the intended message. I am never against the 'Vedam oodum Jathi'. What I meant was that, when we say we need to become 'brahmins' again, some of us imply that we go back to the life that was described by MahaPeriaval in a chapter titled 'A day in the life of a Brahmin'.

Each one of us is different. We follow what we can follow in terms of our culture and traditions. This is why whenever I read statements like 'you are not a Brahmin if you do not do this' or 'you are not a Hindu if you don't do this', etc. right in this Forum.

This is what I call a 20 percenter berating a 10 percenter of not following traditions.

In fact, I think that we all have a duty to assist and help those who go to Patasala and keep the flame of our traditions alive.

Hope this explains.

Regards,
KRS




That is a huge statement to make sir and something which I will not agree. By now, we do know our respective positions so I will not argue endlessly over this. I will just say this. If I were to advise my son I will say this
"You are born a brahmana and as per our Shastras you do have to perform certain karmas as a brahmin is supposed to do. So do as much as possible. This does not mean that you have to forsake other good things like nobility, justice, charity or compassion because there is space for all in a person's life. Nothing is mutually exclusive"

To me the role of a brahmana within Hinduism has increased and not diluted. Means he should now start living as an example for others. This does not come from any superiority complex. The Acharyal said irrespective of times there should be a "வேதம் ஓதும் ஜாதி" all the time because the chanting of the Vedas creates good vibrations and these vibrations are needed now more than anything else. This jathi can be anyone even non-brahmins preserving the Vedas but it should be there. Not forsaken and substituted by something else.

I don't know the situation in the West but in Dubai there are lot of Veda and Sanskrit classes happening. It is heartening to see they are always full and invariably filled with people over 40. A majority are brahmins by caste and come from all walks of life - CEOs to office boys. Most of them come because they feel they have missed it in their early life and want to go back to their roots to understand from where it all came from. So I feel all is not lost still.
 
Dear PV Raman,

"Thou shalt know the Truth and the Truth shall set you free"

I may not be old enough to impart gyan to you. I may not be your peer to guide, advise or counsel you. I cannot use grandiloquent language. But in simple words I have some humble requests to you .

I discern you believe in the existence of God. Please also believe (trust and rely upon) Him in everything. Seek first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and the rest shall be added unto you. Agape, which is God's love is the greatest; greater than Storge (love of parents, elders), Phileo (love of kith, kin and friends) and Heros (love of wife). God loves you and you love God, putting Him above the rest. Give God first place in your life and He will put you first in everything. Do not believe in 'religion', 'ism's and 'ity's. After all they are English man's terminologies. We are not obliged to subscribe to english man's terms and perceptions. Be open to all scriptures, read them and try to understand them. Do not perceive any scripture as alien. Either every scripture is yours or everything is alien. Shed all identities imposed on you by the world and aspire to be the highest of all beings, HUMAN BEING, that God created you to be. We have all fallen short of the glory of God by making religions, castes and communities and by affiliating ourselves with one or other of these illusions and false identities.

Please continue your good work and care two hoots for criticism. Love the other person as you love your own self. You are the other person and the other person is you. This is an eternal Truth prevalent since the creation of the world. Please rise and raise yourselves to reach that level where you would pray to God for your persecutors who persecuted you unjustly and unfairly, "Father, forgive them for they know not what they are doing". Please do not fret about tomorrow for tomorrow will take care of itself. Sufficient unto the day are the sorrows of today. Please live one day at a time.

I have many more requests to you and I shall make them to you in bits and pieces if you are receptive.

Thanks
With Phileo
Nagesh
 
Mr. nagesh,

Your points about love notwithstanding, there are some subtle messages in your post - referring to agape and phileo and then speaking about all or none (wrt scriptures).

The father is not 'the father' that you are talking about. What shri pvraman has opened up is his spiritual enquiry, in line with the duties required of a true brahmin.

The vedhas and the smrithis are the only enlightened way to reach HIM.

We have all fallen short of the glory of God by making religions, castes and communities and by affiliating ourselves with one or other of these illusions and false identities
I think the apostles are to be blamed for creation of isms.

The original vedhic dharma had no name at all. The 'ism' branding was done later, by external forces.

The one dharma which has is unique in its own way, and without a parallel is the sanathana/vedhic dharma.

One need not know any other scriptures to get enlightened.

I have many more requests to you and I shall make them to you in bits and pieces if you are receptive.
Trust you are receptive too...
icon7.gif


Regards,
 
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pvraman

Active member
Dear PV Raman,

"Thou shalt know the Truth and the Truth shall set you free"

Thanks
With Phileo
Nagesh

Dear Mr Nagesh Ji,


Thanks for your reply. I believe in god and i submit to the god and I understand, i am now here, because of the almighty, I firmly believe that our veda's and other holy scripts can cover entire human race in the world.

When we extrapolate the times, from the past, to the present and future, we see lot of changes are taking place around us. Is it a evolution of morality, virtues or values OR deterioration of virtues & values which is giving a MODERN World, we say we grow when we grow on good areas, if we grow on our bad areas its called tumor.

Dr Young from PH miracle centre, New Biology founder (I was introduced to his concept of disease a year ago), says, the present medical theory and medicines are all from the Highly organized Medical Industry and based on the Pasteur theory that the virus and bacteria are from out side, it has to be killed by medicines.

But the real biologist, Bechamp's theory that bacteria including cancer cells are inside and not coming from outside, One who keeps the body in a alkaline state, can never get infected by anything. One can keep the body in alkaline state only by Food Control. His food control and more recently MIND CONTROL, this theory was not attractive to the Powerful lobbyist (which is not going to yield any benefit). Now, after new virus and failures in Medical industry, Mr Bechamp's theory is coming to the light and gaining importance.

There is a relationship of this small bit to our original subject.

Food control - As he describes is not that easy.

We should not eat, All fruites, Meat, Corn, Musroom, Banana... there is a big list. And what we have to eat, there is a big list too-- all vegs, and selected nuts. (Ph miracle).[I followed 10% of it and found great improvement in overall well being). So the bottom line is the modern world is not one thing to boast.

Whereas there are new things which came to our knowledge which confirms that, sticking to our root is the best way to live.

Like above, it is not easy. As everybody know, in order to achieve good health (physically - we have to avoid yummi things) like wise to achieve mentally, we should avoid Yummi things too as for as possible.

A smoker, will give up smoking when he is attacked by cancer. So, a harsh adverse effect only will change everything upside down. Its happening already. Because of our MODERN world, have we not suffered social imbalance, new 'dis-eases' , viruses.

We respect natural evolution. But human created are not natural. A collective stupidity will not make a Wrong a right,like in the case of Pasteur vs Bechamp.

My intention of this post is to place this queries, We should care about how the people changes, based on their own convenience Not Based on the natural evolution, We need lot of Gurus, Guides who should Yell and Tell that what is happening is not a natural evolution, you lazy people made it up. Instead of going with the Adharma flow, blaming on the time, we should spend a minute, how to go back to our values, What facility we are going give to ouR NEXT GEN so that atleast they can be in a postion to take pass and try to see where we are heading!. Now we should start thinking and practicing within our family make them realize, Which should be respected with awe, which should be rejected (however attractive may it be).. It should start from oneself.

The God created us and all human beings, In Bhagvat Geeta, Lord Krishna says, "Ya, I, created you folks and give guidelines how you should conduct, but i don't have control on you on daily basis (I have many other job, man!!) so, better tighten your belt and better follow....".

So, Sir, I welcome you to give your opinion, should we take a pause and walk towards the roots, may not be on the same path we have walked but, Can take a detour also OK..... OR March forward towards the cliff. We can do the modern work, but is it an excuse for not following the right thing? Can we not go adopt to the modern world without compromising our roots?.

When we think the about truth, Now a days, it will make us realize really what we are. We have a greater responsibility towards not only our community but for others too.

I hope our comments will ultimately give me an action plan... That's what my aim is.

[* out of subject - Do we have a directory of people who knows sanskrit in Tamilnadu. How to create one? Kindly give your suggestion.(I am going to stay in Madurai from next year! asked for V-Transfer and got it. :happy:.]


[more reading about bechamp:
Bechamp Or Pasteur: A Lost Chapter ... - Google Books)
 
Dear Sapthajihva,

Greetings.

To clear any misgivings, there is no subtle message in my post.

The father is not 'the father' that you are talking about.

Who is the 'Father' I'm talking about?

The vedhas and the smrithis are the only enlightened way to reach HIM.

The one dharma which has is unique in its own way, and without a parallel is the sanathana/vedhic dharma.

One need not know any other scriptures to get enlightened.

That's your subjective, narrow minded opinion. Please introspect. Answer your own conscience (not me), had you been born and raised in an orthodox christian or muslim family, would you still proclaim this?

I think the apostles are to be blamed for creation of isms.

Please do not jump to conclusions, as is characteristic and typical of orthodox brahmins. Apostles never created isms. Men like you made isms out of what the Apostles preached. Come out of your shell gentleman.


The original vedhic dharma had no name at all. The 'ism' branding was done later, by external forces.

Why did you subscribe to it? Is it because the external forces are white skinned after all?


Trust you are receptive too...
icon7.gif

Rest assured.

Regards,
Nagesh
 
Dear P V Raman,

I had forgotten to include one important quote in my previous post. It is as follows:

"Epporul yaar yaar vai ketpinum, apporul meipporul kaanbadhu arivu"

....Thiru Valluvar.
 
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