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Brahminical conundrum: Tradition vs Modernity

prasad1

Gold Member
Gold Member
I like you both Mr. KRS and Mr. TBS. I too would like to know personally each and everyone. I PM them and carry the personal conversation off the thread, and in private.

I do not want this thread to be hijacked.
I mean no disrespect to anyone, and I am not the moderator. It is simply a request.
 

tbs

Well-known member
Sri tbs Sir,

It would be interesting if you elaborate on your Ph.D. Thesis.

By the way, have you read one Professor Grissom’s book on the great dialogue between Advaitha and Visishtadhvaitha called ‘The seven great untenables’?. It was his Ph.D. Thesis from the University of Madras and is still available on Amazon.

Thank you Sir.
hi sir,

we can discuss separately....i did my M phil thesis about adavaita and visistadaitha theory of knowledge..

i can discuss later...thanks sir...
 

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
hi sir,

we can discuss separately....i did my M phil thesis about adavaita and visistadaitha theory of knowledge..

i can discuss later...thanks sir...
I think you also had studied the Kama Sutra in your Mphil if I am not mistaken! LOL
 

tbs

Well-known member
I think you also had studied the Kama Sutra in your Mphil if I am not mistaken! LOL
LOL.....but i read original sanskrit text kama sutra....when i was student....just info

i will discuss later....not in this thread...i dont want deviate the topic..
 

a-TB

Well-known member
Sri a-TB Sir,

Thank you for your kind response.

I do not call Vedic Astrology as ‘Science’, in the modern sense. That is why, I termed it as ‘Meta Physics’ in one of my previous posts.

While there are lots of research, with some people testing the rules of the discipline, there are no, as you correctly pointed out, systematic research findings published in peer reviewed journals, following modern scientific methods, as far as I know.

I gave the examples of modern medicine regarding diagnostics and therapy only to say how we combine science and art. In fact the reason for the double blind study is to negate or at least mitigate the placebo effect.

I think that there are several reasons why Vedic Astrology is not studied in the modern scientific way. There are lots of quacks out there, ‘practicing’ it, just to make money. So, the discipline is tarnished. There are no ‘qualification‘ tests and graduations in the field (I heard that some academic institutions have started this in India and elsewhere), but I do not know the efficacy of such systems. Most people who are competent in the field get this knowledge through our traditional method, in Gurukulams, and they do not publish.

I am an exception, and as it is my hobby, not an avocation, I know the limits of my knowledge - my self assessment of my capability is analagous to being in the sixth or seventh standard of education in a high school, in a scale of education from first standard through getting a Ph.D. I learnt it by myself, from reading and applying.

So, I am very careful when I predict. You are right, my experience is ‘anecdotal’, but I have seen many such ‘anecdotals’ from other Vedic Astrologists.

Yes, Jyotish is one of the six disciplines of Vedanga. Others deal with the sound, pronounciation, meters, grammar etc. of Vedic language. if interested, please see Wikipedia.

Jyotish has three parts, predictions based on horoscopes, Mundane astrology for countries, societies and determinations of auspicious times to perform Vedic rites. All three are dependent on the exact calculations of the positions of heavenly bodies using astronomy.

The predictive part has many treatises, but the main one is ascribed to a Rishi named ‘Parsara’, who is said to be the father of the Rishi ‘Agastya’. There are other systems, one by another Rishi ‘Jaimini’, etc. Rishis, it is said, got the knowledge from looking inward, tapping it from Atma.

You correctly observed that I have reverence for this field. Yes, I have utter reverence for all the knowledge generated by our forefathers on whose shoulders we stand on. They knew things that only now the modern science is starting to open enquirers in to. Let me tell you a few examples to illustrate:

They are finding only now about the medicinal merits of eating certain foods as turmeric and other spices and vegetables wherein our ancestors knew about them long ago. Another simple exercise that I used to take it for granted whenever I used to visit Ganesha temple - to do ‘Thoppukarnam’. Now we learn that such an exercise is a very beneficial exercise to develop one’s brains. Another one is that we are told to recite any Japa 108 times with the Lord’s name, as it is beneficial. Now you learn through science that distance between the Sun and the Moon to the earth are approximately 108 times of the diameter of each respectively. We can only fathom, how this number may have something to do with creation. I can go on and on, including how 0, the decimal system, concept of infinity, which form the foundation of modern science were formulated on the concept of cosmology as understood by our forefathers.

To me, this knowledge is sacred. Like you are taught ‘Matha, Pitha, Guru Deivam’. Hence the reverence. Thank you for listening.
KRS Sir, Thanks again for detailed message, sharing your views.

Ancient teaching and its wisdom is only getting known in the western world in the background of lots of misinformation.

However, the idea of prediction by stars and planet seem inconsistent not only with science but teachings of Vedanta itself using my limited understanding of both.

The idea of Time being illusion seem to be the current thinking in science and has been so in Vedanta studies.

I have read that only the Present moment alone is reality and there is no such thing as future. So can Vedanga support something that is rejected by Vedanta?

Predictions in science is limited to analysis of well known quantities and use of statistics. Prediction in Astrology insisting on connections to position of planets and stars has not been undertaken by anyone in serious science studies. I suspect it is not for the lack of trying. They may have found no correlation (just a speculation )

The 'mundane Astrology' (using your term) predictions about Covid 19 has been wrong in every case I have heard about.

With these objections and with respect, I disagree with the premise of Astrology in today's practice being able to predict life events. I do acknowledge many like you who swear the validity based on their own personal experience.

Being a scientist by training ( and I am not) and being a student of Ramana Maharishi's teaching I suppose you have found a way to find consistency in science, vedanta and Astrology in your mind. All the best to you.
 

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
Dear a -TB,

Regarding Time being an illusion ...Time as you must be knowing is a serial NOW.
Its always only the PRESENT.

Past impressions and Future anxious thoughts wont be experienced hence technically Astrology would be rendered non functional in the serial NOW...but this is only for a person who has gone beyond the idea of time and lives in the eternal NOW and the Golden Mean.
Such a person does not feel the time axis hence astrology is of no use to him/her.
Living in the Eternal NOW/ Golden Mean produces " Time Dilation" effect for some.

Again its not that the laws of physics dont apply to such a person..for eg a person living in the Eternal NOW and Golden Mean still experiences laws of physics like gravity etc and also whatever physical effect exerted by celestial bodies( planets) on the solar system, in other words astronomy applies in the physical sense but astrology doesnt..astrology needs the times axis..astronomy doesnt.
 

KRS

Well-known member
KRS Sir, Thanks again for detailed message, sharing your views.

Ancient teaching and its wisdom is only getting known in the western world in the background of lots of misinformation.

However, the idea of prediction by stars and planet seem inconsistent not only with science but teachings of Vedanta itself using my limited understanding of both.

The idea of Time being illusion seem to be the current thinking in science and has been so in Vedanta studies.

I have read that only the Present moment alone is reality and there is no such thing as future. So can Vedanga support something that is rejected by Vedanta?

Predictions in science is limited to analysis of well known quantities and use of statistics. Prediction in Astrology insisting on connections to position of planets and stars has not been undertaken by anyone in serious science studies. I suspect it is not for the lack of trying. They may have found no correlation (just a speculation )

The 'mundane Astrology' (using your term) predictions about Covid 19 has been wrong in every case I have heard about.

With these objections and with respect, I disagree with the premise of Astrology in today's practice being able to predict life events. I do acknowledge many like you who swear the validity based on their own personal experience.

Being a scientist by training ( and I am not) and being a student of Ramana Maharishi's teaching I suppose you have found a way to find consistency in science, vedanta and Astrology in your mind. All the best to you.
Sri a-TB Sir,

I really appreciate the calmness and maturity with which you have been discussing this topic with me. Much appreciate it.

I think I have communicated what all I can regarding Vedic Astrology. Further discussions on this topic, in my opinion, will only produce diminishing returns. So, if you agree with this premise, I would like to move on, agreeing to disagree. That is okay. We had honest discussions.

But, I need to clarify the connection between Vedanta and Vedic Astrology.

One needs to understand what Vedanta teaches. It teaches one about the Supreme reality and how to realize this reality. This requires one to disassociate oneself from the body/mind complex and to transfer that identity to that of Atman.

So, what does body/mind identification do? It creates Samsara cycle, with Karma generating Papa and Punya, and generating rebirths. So, this is the Relative Reality to a human being, who mistakingly thinks it is the Absolute one. And Samsara is not an illusion in the material world. It is very real, generating Karma (action) during a life time, with a person thinking that he/she is the doer.

Vedic Astrology is a tool to help us to navigate through Samsara, telling us how to perform various rituals, at auspicious times, predicting good and bad times in a person’s life etc. I see this as the contributions by some great Rishis towards helping us to navigate through the treacherous journey through Samsara out of great compassion. So, we can start towards what Vedanta teaches, practicing Dharma.

As Srimathi Dr. Renuka Ji pointed out, once one ‘realizes’ one is ‘That’, then nothing else matters to one. The material world still functions around that person and on that person’s mind and body, but they do not affect the realized person, because he is the Atman/Brahman.

I tried to explain as much as my knowledge would permit me. Thank you.
 
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prasad1

Gold Member
Gold Member
Ancient teaching and its wisdom is only getting known in the western world in the background of lots of misinformation.

However, the idea of prediction by stars and planet seem inconsistent not only with science but teachings of Vedanta itself using my limited understanding of both.

The idea of Time being illusion seem to be the current thinking in science and has been so in Vedanta studies.

I have read that only the Present moment alone is reality and there is no such thing as future. So can Vedanga support something that is rejected by Vedanta?

Predictions in science is limited to analysis of well known quantities and use of statistics. Prediction in Astrology insisting on connections to position of planets and stars has not been undertaken by anyone in serious science studies. I suspect it is not for the lack of trying. They may have found no correlation (just a speculation )

The 'mundane Astrology' (using your term) predictions about Covid 19 has been wrong in every case I have heard about.

With these objections and with respect, I disagree with the premise of Astrology in today's practice being able to predict life events.
Constellations are illusions too. Some of the galaxies and stars that we see in the sky sent their light millions of years ago and maybe dead by now. The constellations keep changing their shape, so it is imaginary. If at all it is the cloud, that should be important to our future (it may bring rain),
Secondly "time of birth" is fraught with arbitrary decisions.
For normal birth, how do you decide the "time of Birth":
Is it, when conception took place?
Is it when the head pops out?
Or when the umbilical cord is cut?

For cesarean delivery:
What is the time of birth?
All this depends on the Midwife or other family member remembering and recording the Time of birth, how dependable is that?

When you start with questionable data, based on some mythical Constellations, even if you do rigorous calculations, you end up with wrong conclusions.


Society needs to understand astrology carries nothing of value or truth. Individuals tend to believe in enough nonsense; do not add astrology to the list.
 
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a-TB

Well-known member
Sri a-TB Sir,

I really appreciate the calmness and maturity with which you have been discussing this topic with me. Much appreciate it.

I think I have communicated what all I can regarding Vedic Astrology. Further discussions on this topic, in my opinion, will only produce diminishing returns. So, if you agree with this premise, I would like to move on, agreeing to disagree. That is okay. We had honest discussions.

But, I need to clarify the connection between Vedanta and Vedic Astrology.

One needs to understand what Vedanta teaches. It teaches one about the Supreme reality and how to realize this reality. This requires one to disassociate oneself from the body/mind complex and to transfer that identity to that of Atman.

So, what does body/mind identification do? It creates Samsara cycle, with Karma generating Papa and Punya, and generating rebirths. So, this is the Relative Reality to a human being, who mistakingly thinks it is the Absolute one. And Samsara is not an illusion in the material world. It is very real, generating Karma (action) during a life time, with a person thinking that he/she is the doer.

Vedic Astrology is a tool to help us to navigate through Samsara, telling us how to perform various rituals, at auspicious times, predicting good and bad times in a person’s life etc. I see this as the contributions by some great Rishis towards helping us to navigate through the treacherous journey through Samsara out of great compassion. So, we can start towards what Vedanta teaches, practicing Dharma.

As Srimathi Dr. Renuka Ji pointed out, once one ‘realizes’ one is ‘That’, then nothing else matters to one. The material world still functions around that person and on that person’s mind and body, but they do not affect the realized person, because he is the Atman/Brahman.

I tried to explain as much as my knowledge would permit me. Thank you.
Dear Mr KRS Sir,

Thank you for sharing your understanding. Since joining the forum and seeing such topics I have taken time to research on my own. That has helped me not necessarily to know the truth but makes me question if the logic of what is shared here or elsewhere true in my quest for clarity.

The contradictions in logic raised earlier stands in my mind though you may not see that.

Just sticking to the point you just shared, I wonder how you reconcile these two things

A. You say ' samsara is not an illusion in the material world'. But the material world itself is illusion per Sankara (and also per Ramana Maharishi's teaching to the best I could discern). Believing in Astrology is about strengthening the illusion contrary to the teachings of Vedanta

If you want to be in rocket to go to space, is it possible to also keep one leg in your house. Believing and practicing Astrology (keeping one leg in your house) while dedicating life to the teaching of Bhagavan Ramana (like going to space) is a contradiction.

B. I did some Google search. Ramana Maharishi never advocated Astrology as a means, He refused to get into commenting about Astrology or any worldly things and directed one into self inquiry.

Here is a link . I do not know how authentic the anecdote is. But it shows consistency with what I have heard. He rejected all beliefs and directed people to *solely* focus on self inquiry.


The point made is not rehash of prior descriptions of contradictions. Leaving aside whether Astrology is true or not, being immersed in Astrology and expecting to study Vedanta seem to be a contradiction to me.

I could not find online any serious and respected Vedanta teacher that advocated Astrology as a means to study Vedanta, Astrologers claim that but seem to be not supported by Sankara in his teachings.

Again you dont have to respond necessarily but shared these thoughts only as a suggestion for your self enquiry

Best,
 

a-TB

Well-known member
Constellations are illusions too. Some of the galaxies and stars that we see in the sky sent their light millions of years ago and maybe dead by now. The constellations keep changing their shape, so it is imaginary. If at all it is the cloud, that should be important to our future (it may bring rain),
Secondly "time of birth" is fraught with arbitrary decisions.
For normal birth, how do you decide the "time of Birth":
Is it, when conception took place?
Is it when the head pops out?
Or when the umbilical cord is cut?

For cesarean delivery:
What is the time of birth?
All this depends on the Midwife or other family member remembering and recording the Time of birth, how dependable is that?

When you start with questionable data, based on some mythical Constellations, even if you do rigorous calculations, you end up with wrong conclusions.


Society needs to understand astrology carries nothing of value or truth. Individuals tend to believe in enough nonsense; do not add astrology to the list.
Constellations are in three dimension. Based on our ability to see we see a two dimensional picture. There is no other relationships between the stars that are said to be in a constellation.

But we cannot question beliefs based on people's personal experience. If beliefs are not causing harm we can respect in leave them as they are. Just like beliefs in religion and their practices
 

KRS

Well-known member
Sri Prasad1 Ji,

1. We use the constellations to fix the moon’s position especially and and the ascendant and other planets positions on the fixed zodiac in which the solar system itself is rotating on. Yes, the light from each constellation is very important in fixing the positions. What happens if in the future one of the constellations disappear? I am sure if that happens and our solar system still exists, adjustments will be done based on observation of results.

2. Usually the birth time is recorded when the baby comes out. But our Rishis knew that errors in recording can happen. That is why, when a person’s horoscope is first cast, it is verified for correct birth time, by an event based calculation method which was explained by Rishi Parsara himself. The calculations are quite detailed and no good astrologer worth his salt will predict without asserting himself/herself that the birth time is correct. By the way, no one’s horoscope should be cast till the person crosses the age of 10.

May I humbly submit that one should at least know the broad details of of a discipline before dismissing it on the basis of ignorance?

One thing to say that one is not interested or does not believe in something. Please do not dismiss something based on your ignorance about it, as you did once before.
 

KRS

Well-known member
Dear Mr KRS Sir,

Thank you for sharing your understanding. Since joining the forum and seeing such topics I have taken time to research on my own. That has helped me not necessarily to know the truth but makes me question if the logic of what is shared here or elsewhere true in my quest for clarity.

The contradictions in logic raised earlier stands in my mind though you may not see that.

Just sticking to the point you just shared, I wonder how you reconcile these two things

A. You say ' samsara is not an illusion in the material world'. But the material world itself is illusion per Sankara (and also per Ramana Maharishi's teaching to the best I could discern). Believing in Astrology is about strengthening the illusion contrary to the teachings of Vedanta

If you want to be in rocket to go to space, is it possible to also keep one leg in your house. Believing and practicing Astrology (keeping one leg in your house) while dedicating life to the teaching of Bhagavan Ramana (like going to space) is a contradiction.

B. I did some Google search. Ramana Maharishi never advocated Astrology as a means, He refused to get into commenting about Astrology or any worldly things and directed one into self inquiry.

Here is a link . I do not know how authentic the anecdote is. But it shows consistency with what I have heard. He rejected all beliefs and directed people to *solely* focus on self inquiry.


The point made is not rehash of prior descriptions of contradictions. Leaving aside whether Astrology is true or not, being immersed in Astrology and expecting to study Vedanta seem to be a contradiction to me.

I could not find online any serious and respected Vedanta teacher that advocated Astrology as a means to study Vedanta, Astrologers claim that but seem to be not supported by Sankara in his teachings.

Again you dont have to respond necessarily but shared these thoughts only as a suggestion for your self enquiry

Best,
Sri a-tb Sir,

Couple of things.

As I said, Vedanta is beyond Samsara. But Vedanta is not for everyone. Only ‘Mumukshus’ will turn to Vedanta for answers. And, even though nowadays you can pick up books on them and read, But, for a person who wants to pursue this knowledge, one needs to have a Guru, as the teaching is not just about a ‘subject’. By the way, Guru will materialize if one qualifies to be a ‘Mumukshu’.

The vast majority of the population have not progressed to this point. So, for them simple worship is enough. This is what Lord Krishna said in Gita. One has to keep in mind that major part of Vedic Astrology is to calculate the auspicious times to start activities, not so good time periods etc. Predictive part is a small portion of this discipline. So our temple worships, muhurthams etc. are done using this.

Bhagawan Ramana is beyond all time and material universe. But he respected many of his followers observing auspicious times etc.

Thanks.
 

a-TB

Well-known member
Sri a-tb Sir,

Couple of things.

As I said, Vedanta is beyond Samsara. But Vedanta is not for everyone. Only ‘Mumukshus’ will turn to Vedanta for answers. And, even though nowadays you can pick up books on them and read, But, for a person who wants to pursue this knowledge, one needs to have a Guru, as the teaching is not just about a ‘subject’. By the way, Guru will materialize if one qualifies to be a ‘Mumukshu’.

The vast majority of the population have not progressed to this point. So, for them simple worship is enough. This is what Lord Krishna said in Gita. One has to keep in mind that major part of Vedic Astrology is to calculate the auspicious times to start activities, not so good time periods etc. Predictive part is a small portion of this discipline. So our temple worships, muhurthams etc. are done using this.

Bhagawan Ramana is beyond all time and material universe. But he respected many of his followers observing auspicious times etc.

Thanks.
Mr KRS Sir

I understand that Vedanta is beyond Samsara and cannot be obtained by reading books.

However, I have heard that it is a lone journey. The world has many things - money, power, religion, temples, fights, thieves, murderers, philonthopists and what not. They need not come in the way of one's commitment to progress.

So if one has taken Bhagavan as Guru and aspire to succeed (and hence consider oneself as a Mumukshu), should one not give up samsaric beliefs like Astrology that come in the way of making true progress?

It seems a question worth thinking about for any true seeker
 

KRS

Well-known member
Mr KRS Sir

I understand that Vedanta is beyond Samsara and cannot be obtained by reading books.

However, I have heard that it is a lone journey. The world has many things - money, power, religion, temples, fights, thieves, murderers, philonthopists and what not. They need not come in the way of one's commitment to progress.

So if one has taken Bhagavan as Guru and aspire to succeed (and hence consider oneself as a Mumukshu), should one not give up samsaric beliefs like Astrology that come in the way of making true progress?

It seems a question worth thinking about for any true seeker
Sri a-TB Sir,

A very good question. Since you asked me this question, I will respond in terms of my personal story.

I will not call myself a ‘Mumukshu’. I am just a Jeeva floating aimlessly in the river of Samsara. I do not seek the ‘knowledge’. I just want to to be at ‘peace’. And I am not attracted to any physical Sadhanas, like Hatha Yoga or Pranayama etc.

I have to tell you a bit about my personal story. I have had very singular and unlikely events happening in my life. Both good and bad. So, I found myself at a stage in life, at the verge of quitting on life. I knew instinctively at that time (though did not know it then), longing for something where I can live ‘normally’. I had ‘VirakthI’, and needed to get out of it. And then Bhagwan showed up. Yes, again in a unique and singular event. More I knew about his teaching, more I have resonance with them. They work for me.

I enjoy certain things in life. This keeps my Virakthi at bay. But now over a decade of following the introspection as Sadhana, I am at a point where I can leave them, if they are not there. More and more, I see many of the things I used to be interested in are falling by the way side. I am at peace, and as I have said before, my Sadhana, which is ongoing all times is 1. Follow ahimsa and 2. Practice ‘Who am I?’ That’s all.

Vedic Astrology is something I practiced all my life. Very much so in my younger days. Nowadays, I do it very rarely, only when a few of family members and a couple of friends come for advice. I see it as something I can help with. They come to me because majority of my predictions happened to have come true.

I have practiced this discipline with extreme caution. I rely on my intuition on taking my clients. If my inner voice tells me not to read one’s horoscope, I do not. In several of such cases, subsequent events proved my ‘wisdom’, so to say.

So, again, I am not qualified to expound on our scriptures. Am at a stage where, if I can be of help, I do. Otherwise, I am a selfish person looking for contentment. Hope this explains.
 
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a-TB

Well-known member
Sri a-TB Sir,

A very good question. Since you asked me this question, I will respond in terms of my personal story.

I will not call myself a ‘Mumukshu’. I am just a Jeeva floating aimlessly in the river of Samsara. I do not seek the ‘knowledge’. I just want to to be at ‘peace’. And I am not attracted to any physical Sadhanas, like Hatha Yoga or Pranayama etc.

I have to tell you a bit about my personal story. I have had very singular and unlikely events happening in my life. Both good and bad. So, I found myself at a stage in life, at the verge of quitting on life. I knew instinctively at that time (though did not know it then), longing for something where I can live ‘normally’. I had ‘VirakthI’, and needed to get out of it. And then Bhagwan showed up. Yes, again in a unique and singular event. More I knew about his teaching, more I have resonance with them. They work for me.

I enjoy certain things in life. This keeps my Virakthi at bay. But now over a decade of following the introspection as Sadhana, I am at a point where I can leave them, if they are not there. More and more, I see many of the things I used to be interested in are falling by the way side. I am at peace, and as I have said before, my Sadhana, which is ongoing all times is 1. Follow ahimsa and 2. Practice ‘Who am I?’ That’s all.

Vedic Astrology is something I practiced all my life. Very much so in my younger days. Nowadays, I do it very rarely, only when a few of family members and a couple of friends come for advice. I see it as something I can help with. They come to me because majority of my predictions happened to have come true.

I have practiced this discipline with extreme caution. I rely on my intuition on taking my clients. If my inner voice tells me not to read one’s horoscope, I do not. In several of such cases, subsequent events proved my ‘wisdom’, so to say.

So, again, I am not qualified to expound on our scriptures. Am at a stage where, if I can be of help, I do. Otherwise, I am a selfish person looking for contentment. Hope this explains.
Dear Mr KRS Sir

I think ever since you came to this forum to contribute again I find that there is a lot to learn from you in terms of your style and openness.

Thanks for sharing your story.

I find that today in India , Astrology has taken a life of its own and often creating himsa. There are new Doshas invented every so often.


In this forum, I learnt about a new dosha with a very startling name like Kala Sarpa Dosha LOL This was introduced in the last 50 + years and now there are many more variants. These Doshas supposedly affect millions based on being born between certain weeks of a given year.

People who believe are stuck doing all kinds of Pariharams.

I know of people spending a lot of money to Vastu-proof of their homes which is such waste of energy. Sani and Guru Payarchi are major events in temples. All these fear driven life is really against progress.

I know of fine alliances being thrown off due to comments of Astrologers. Later whatever wedding happened resulted in divorces and the Asstrology did not protect them in that case I am aware of.

To me it appears the field as practiced today has resulted in Himsa, My comments are not about individual practices and beliefs but the impact of the field on the larger society.

While I do not always agree with this Jaggi Vasudev , sometimes he has a way of explaining certain points well .



Once again thank for sharing your personal journey. In the end it is a lone journey.

Thank you!
 

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
Sri a-TB Sir,

A very good question. Since you asked me this question, I will respond in terms of my personal story.

I will not call myself a ‘Mumukshu’. I am just a Jeeva floating aimlessly in the river of Samsara. I do not seek the ‘knowledge’. I just want to to be at ‘peace’. And I am not attracted to any physical Sadhanas, like Hatha Yoga or Pranayama etc.

I have to tell you a bit about my personal story. I have had very singular and unlikely events happening in my life. Both good and bad. So, I found myself at a stage in life, at the verge of quitting on life. I knew instinctively at that time (though did not know it then), longing for something where I can live ‘normally’. I had ‘VirakthI’, and needed to get out of it. And then Bhagwan showed up. Yes, again in a unique and singular event. More I knew about his teaching, more I have resonance with them. They work for me.

I enjoy certain things in life. This keeps my Virakthi at bay. But now over a decade of following the introspection as Sadhana, I am at a point where I can leave them, if they are not there. More and more, I see many of the things I used to be interested in are falling by the way side. I am at peace, and as I have said before, my Sadhana, which is ongoing all times is 1. Follow ahimsa and 2. Practice ‘Who am I?’ That’s all.

Vedic Astrology is something I practiced all my life. Very much so in my younger days. Nowadays, I do it very rarely, only when a few of family members and a couple of friends come for advice. I see it as something I can help with. They come to me because majority of my predictions happened to have come true.

I have practiced this discipline with extreme caution. I rely on my intuition on taking my clients. If my inner voice tells me not to read one’s horoscope, I do not. In several of such cases, subsequent events proved my ‘wisdom’, so to say.

So, again, I am not qualified to expound on our scriptures. Am at a stage where, if I can be of help, I do. Otherwise, I am a selfish person looking for contentment. Hope this explains.
Dear KRS ji,

From what I have understood and observed, those who have had an " Arjuna moment" and surrendered to God or in some cases the Guru...they usually dont really get to " decide" the course of their life.

What they do or practice on daily basis is almost as if is already " mapped" out for them and they effortlessly sail sans an aim or goal through life YET everything falls in place in the most conducive manner..almost as if some unseen force or God or Guru has " hijacked" their life for the best journey that no airlines of life can offer.

Then one realizes that the journey isn't about rules or rigidity or orthodoxity or right/ wrong and whatever one does on daily basis has its expiry date..that is some could be doing some form of Yoga then suddenly the idea of Yoga itself just gets deleted from the mind of the person..then may be one would be practicing Astrology till the it also sheds from the mind someday.

Its like a tree in eternal autumn..where the leaves keep shedding at an unknown rate in equanamity in an inner engineering mode.
 

KRS

Well-known member
Dear Mr KRS Sir

I think ever since you came to this forum to contribute again I find that there is a lot to learn from you in terms of your style and openness.

Thanks for sharing your story.

I find that today in India , Astrology has taken a life of its own and often creating himsa. There are new Doshas invented every so often.


In this forum, I learnt about a new dosha with a very startling name like Kala Sarpa Dosha LOL This was introduced in the last 50 + years and now there are many more variants. These Doshas supposedly affect millions based on being born between certain weeks of a given year.

People who believe are stuck doing all kinds of Pariharams.

I know of people spending a lot of money to Vastu-proof of their homes which is such waste of energy. Sani and Guru Payarchi are major events in temples. All these fear driven life is really against progress.

I know of fine alliances being thrown off due to comments of Astrologers. Later whatever wedding happened resulted in divorces and the Asstrology did not protect them in that case I am aware of.

To me it appears the field as practiced today has resulted in Himsa, My comments are not about individual practices and beliefs but the impact of the field on the larger society.

While I do not always agree with this Jaggi Vasudev , sometimes he has a way of explaining certain points well .



Once again thank for sharing your personal journey. In the end it is a lone journey.

Thank you!
Sri a-TB Sir,

Thank you for the compliment. I do not think folks who felt my heavy hand of moderating in the years past, when I was a moderator in this Forum would agree. Those were the days of fiery exchanges, as some of you old timers may remember. Sri Praveen Sir, as then is doing a yeoman’s job even today for our community. Anyways, if it helps, I am glad that whatever I do is of any assistance.

You know, when the process of fission was discovered, the potential was to generate power. But then nothing in this world exists without the opposite. Hence the nuclear bombs.

So it is with everything in life, including Vedic Astrology. The knowledge is always given to benefit, But as always, it is perverted for adharmic ends.

This is where one needs to understand that one can not worry about the rest of the world. As the Bhagwan often said, don’t worry about the society as Ishwara is responsible for it. There is so much work to introspect to understand ourselves, and without that understanding we probably can not look at the world with compassion, with all of its foibles, weaknesses, evil and what not. This is where I am.

So, when I look at Sadhguru with this perspective, I have no quibbles with it. He seems to be ordained by Ishwara to bring good to this world. So, he seems to address your concerns about people using Vedic Astrology in a wrong manner. This does not in any way negate my experiences.

So, one understands, the underlying factor is Love. Love for humanity. But more importantly love for oneself first, because it gives one empathy.

I read what I wrote above, and I caution you. It is again from the perspective of a old man, whose only claim is that learning from a checkered life of 70 plus odd years. Thank you.
 

KRS

Well-known member
Dear KRS ji,

From what I have understood and observed, those who have had an " Arjuna moment" and surrendered to God or in some cases the Guru...they usually dont really get to " decide" the course of their life.

What they do or practice on daily basis is almost as if is already " mapped" out for them and they effortlessly sail sans an aim or goal through life YET everything falls in place in the most conducive manner..almost as if some unseen force or God or Guru has " hijacked" their life for the best journey that no airlines of life can offer.

Then one realizes that the journey isn't about rules or rigidity or orthodoxity or right/ wrong and whatever one does on daily basis has its expiry date..that is some could be doing some form of Yoga then suddenly the idea of Yoga itself just gets deleted from the mind of the person..then may be one would be practicing Astrology till the it also sheds from the mind someday.

Its like a tree in eternal autumn..where the leaves keep shedding at an unknown rate in equanamity in an inner engineering mode.
Srimathi Dr. Renuka Ji,

What you observed and understood must be correct.

I am a simpleton, trying to make sense of this world. Life is hard. But then, it is also a blessing. And I was blessed to have my Guru coming in to my life, and more importantly that I recognized it,

So, with Bhagwan’s grace, I am at a place where I am at peace. What more a person can ask?
 

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
Srimathi Dr. Renuka Ji,

What you observed and understood must be correct.

I am a simpleton, trying to make sense of this world. Life is hard. But then, it is also a blessing. And I was blessed to have my Guru coming in to my life, and more importantly that I recognized it,

So, with Bhagwan’s grace, I am at a place where I am at peace. What more a person can ask?
Dear KRS ji...
Then the lyrics of this song would resonate well with you.


Translation is in this link if anyone needs it.
 

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