Legalising lgbt is blasphemy of hinduism

[GNANA SUNYAM]

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160 years ago it was the British Raj.

The idea that homosexuality is ‘western’ is based on another western import – Christianity.
On the other end of the spectrum, several countries impose the death penalty for homosexual acts, per the application of some interpretations of Shari'a law. As of 2015, these include Afghanistan, Brunei, Mauritania, Sudan, Iran, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates, Yemen and northern Nigeria.

could you please provide evidence that homosexuality is based on christianity or islam?

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

Divine Judgement for the sin of Sodom!

was passed upon Sodom and Gomorrah and two neighboring cities, which were completely consumed by fire and brimstone. Neighboring Zoar (Bela) was the only city to be spared. In Abrahamic religions, Sodom and Gomorrah have become synonymous with impenitent sin, and their fall with a proverbial manifestation of divine retribution.[6][7][Jude 1:7] Sodom and Gomorrah have been used historically and today as metaphors for vice and homosexuality, although a close reading of the text and other Ancient Near Eastern sources suggest that this association may be incorrect.[8]

The story has therefore given rise to words in several languages. These include the English word sodomy, which is used in sodomy laws to describe sexual "crimes against nature", namely anal or oral sex (particularly homosexual), or bestiality.[9][10][11] Some Islamic societies incorporate punishments associated with Sodom and Gomorrah into sharia.[12]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodom_and_Gomorrah

 

[a-TB]

Dear Folks,

LGBT should not be seen in isolation to understand the problem. We need to see this not in isolation but as part of a larger mindset and abnormalities. Even in our forum we see the same people aligning themselves with one another for a seemingly different types of problems. In my view there are two different basic personalities. I may be simplifying a bit but it overall captures the truth. One is materialists and the other is humanists. They may also be classified as selfish and selfless or greedy and content or cold and warm atheist and theist or lgbt and straight. As I said there is some simplification in this but the black and white is clear.

Dear folks:

The above is one of the most 'spiritually' immature statement. Let us locgicall unpack what Mr Sravana has said

a. LGBT should be seen as an abnormality
b. World is classified in such matters as black and while because it is clear that way
c. What is unstated is that Sravana obviously is in the normal camp.
d. Abnormal people, especially LGBT acts are to be criminalized (which is the topic of this thread) because what they do in the privacy of their world without harming anyone is the business of the 'normal ones'. They are deemed abnormal human beings and need to be treated as a criminal.

The above kind of logic has been used to advance slavery, putting down women over centuries and in extreme cases leads to the idea of sterilizing the world of these 'abnormal people' (example - Hitler).

Such 'self proclaimed normal people' with immature ideas want to criminalize a status which a person find themselves from birth. Such a thinking leads to caste discrimination, untouchability and basic lack of respect for human beings or even all beings

If that is normal (wanting to criminalize what a person is born as) - Oh God I dont want to be normal.

Narrow minded comments are abundant in the forum with the kind of posts we see above.

Outside this forum, Hindus I know are far more accepting of others.

 

[a-TB]

Dear Folks,

The curse of the world is that, it is following the western system and logic which is so narrow in scope and lacking in depth. India has to resort to its thinking methods and not ape the western systems, to forge ahead.

Another spiritually immature, narrow minded and divisive expression. East and west has nothing to do with gay, lesbian, transgender feelings. Mr Prasad has given many references, Madam Renuka has provided well thoughtout responses. and it will be useful to do some research and read instead of being caught up in own ego and prejudices

 

[a-TB]

why are christian evangelicals dead against lgbtq?

who are the 'true' christians?

what is the stand of pope/roman catholics/church on this issue?

if christian doctrine is anti-lgbtq, could you please confirm with evidence from their scriptures?

You must know answer to these since you seem to have been heavily influenced by Christianity (based on what you write here).

Please do your own research and if they refute what I have stated I can engage with you.

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri a-TB,

I understand your outburst. I accept your view it is in nature that one is a gay. There are many other conditions that are due to nature. The point is, if any one of them may not be in the interest of the society at large, they have to be restrained or better corrected.

What is the basis for a man being attracted to women or vice versa? Does nature have a purpose for it other than making it a mere attraction? Definitely it does as it helps in sustaining human race and so is the case with any species. What about the attraction between a man and a man or a woman and a woman? Does nature have a higher purpose than the perverted one? I am not sure .If you think of one let me know. A man-man or a woman-woman relationship can happen as friendship which is a noble one and without perversions.

I believe that nature gives purpose to everything in its creation and there are ones that are creative and one that are destructive. This tension is necessary for learning deep truths which is the ultimate purpose of the physical-mental reality. So one cannot easily escape by saying that it is in one's nature for being in a certain way. If the act or thought is destructive it will be restrained and corrected by the other members of the society. Many devious plots are done in a bedroom and devious and abnormal behaviour arises out of actions in ones bedroom. If it does stop at bedroom, nobody cares. But there is an animal called the mind. It can be triggered anytime and at any place.

So kindly look at the larger picture and be not biased in your support for something that cannot be approved by the majority of the society for the good of the society.

 

[sravna]

Legitimizing LGBT is not only a blasphemy of hinduism but a blasphemy of mother nature

 

[renuka]

Sravna..I am surprised you have not gone beyond halal and haram.

LGBT is not perversion...on a personal experience I can tell this since the person I am talking about is dead now...
I once had a transgender as a patient when I was an intern in the hospital...he looked effiminate..worked as a male sex worker..was dying of AIDS.

The senior docs used to ask him.." hey how come you are in the male ward..are you male or female?"

Nurses never respected him..I was the only one who used to be nice to him..he told me all his childhood abuses...being chased out of family cos they were muslims and called him a sinner

He couldnt get a job..had to resort to being a sex worker.

.daily he would ask the nurses to help.him buy food but they would refuse..even though he gave the money cos he was weak to walk about but at times desired some tasty food.

I used to buy for him...he told me he had stopped praying cos he felt he was a.sinner...I told him no..you are not..others made you feel that way.

I still remember him touching my feet crying saying if only others understood he was different..he would have never got into vice.

The next day he started doing namaz 5x a day.
So Sravna...that person was not a pervert..he didnt need to stop being a transgender...he needed acceptance.


I am not writing this to show off that i am kind or anything but just to let you know that you have no idea how much damage non acceptance does to a human.

Its not about being spiritual..its about being human.

 

[prasad1]

could you please provide evidence that homosexuality is based on christianity or islam?

JJji has a perfect response with post#102.
Thank you JJji.

A sodomy law is a law that defines certain sexual acts as crimes. The precise sexual acts meant by the term sodomyare rarely spelled out in the law, but are typically understood by courts to include any sexual act deemed to be "unnatural" or immoral. In practice, sodomy laws have rarely been enforced against heterosexual couples, and have mostly been used to target homosexuals. The Middle Assyrian Law Codes (1075 BC) state: If a man has intercourse with his brother-in-arms, they shall turn him into a eunuch. This is the earliest known law condemning the act of male-to-male intercourse in the military.


Most sodomy related laws in Western civilization originated from the growth of Christianity during Late Antiquity.

Starting in the 12th Century, the Roman Catholic Church launched a massive campaign against sodomites, especially homosexuals. Between the years 1250 and 1300, homosexual activity was radically criminalized in most of Europe, even punishable by death.

In England, Henry VIII introduced the first legislation under English criminal law against sodomy with the Buggery Act of 1533, making buggery punishable by hanging, a penalty not lifted until 1861.

Following Sir William Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England, the crime of sodomy has often been defined only as the "abominable and detestable crime against nature", or some variation of the phrase. This language led to widely varying rulings about what specific acts were encompassed by its prohibition.

G_Sji you could have done the search as A_TBji suggested.

Sodomy is illegal in Iran and is punishable by death.

LGBT in Islam is influenced by the religious, legal, social, and cultural history of the nations with a sizable Muslim population, along with specific passages in the Quran and hadith, statements attributed to the Islamic prophet Muhammad.

In recent times, extreme prejudice persists, both socially and legally, in much of the Islamic world against people who engage in homosexual acts. In Afghanistan, Brunei, Iran, Mauritania, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, Somalia (in some southern regions), Sudan, United Arab Emirates and Yemen, homosexual activity carries the death penalty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodomy_law


How many more citations are needed?

Mr. GSji you can take a camel to water, but you can not make it drink it. Similarly, I can not change your mind.

 

[prasad1]

Legitimizing LGBT is not only a blasphemy of hinduism but a blasphemy of mother nature

I thought you were an "expert" in spiritualism.
Does anyone know the ENTIRE HINDUISM?
Hinduism has so many facets that no one knows all of it. If you do not know all of Hinduism, how can you know that something is against Hinduism?

According to Dictionary Blasphemy:

the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God

So now you are proclaiming yourself to be the protector of God?


As far as knowing mother Nature, you are not even started baby steps. Mother nature has so many secrets that discoveries are made every day, and I have already stated some in my earlier posts.

You should quit when you are ahead because you are only showing your ignorance of science, religion, philosophy etc.

You are also exposing your weakness of being ...........

 

[Janaki Jambunathan]

Legitimizing LGBT is not only a blasphemy of hinduism but a blasphemy of mother nature

Mother is proud ! Why lament about blasphemy of mother nature?

https://goo.gl/images/5dJw3x

 

[GNANA SUNYAM]

Divine Judgement for the sin of Sodom!

was passed upon Sodom and Gomorrah and two neighboring cities, which were completely consumed by fire and brimstone. Neighboring Zoar (Bela) was the only city to be spared. In Abrahamic religions, Sodom and Gomorrah have become synonymous with impenitent sin, and their fall with a proverbial manifestation of divine retribution.[6][7][Jude 1:7] Sodom and Gomorrah have been used historically and today as metaphors for vice and homosexuality, although a close reading of the text and other Ancient Near Eastern sources suggest that this association may be incorrect.[8]

The story has therefore given rise to words in several languages. These include the English word sodomy, which is used in sodomy laws to describe sexual "crimes against nature", namely anal or oral sex (particularly homosexual), or bestiality.[9][10][11] Some Islamic societies incorporate punishments associated with Sodom and Gomorrah into sharia.[12]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodom_and_Gomorrah

the cities of sodom and gomorrah were destroyed even before moses, believed to be the founder of judaism, was born and obviously even before Jesus Christ, believed to be the founder of christianity was born.

in all probability these religions did not exist during the time sodom and gomorrah were destroyed.

 

[GNANA SUNYAM]

You must know answer to these since you seem to have been heavily influenced by Christianity (based on what you write here).

Please do your own research and if they refute what I have stated I can engage with you.

the title to my thread is 'legalising ... blasphemy of hinduism' and not 'legalising...blasphemy of christianity'.

numerous churches in the west permit lgbtqs to attend their services.

a very popular christian preacher in a Larry King show, when asked about his opinion on homosexuality, said, 'i dont think that is God's best'. that sounds a lukewarm, non-committal, diplomatic statement.

this is as much the research I could make with my limited resources sir.

perhaps my findings hardly contain strength/substance to refute your claims.

could you please table more of your findings sir, perhaps quotes from scriptures of so-called abrahamic religions?

 

[prasad1]

The question of withholding Human rights to LGBTQ people hides a far-reaching discrimination that is practiced by some in society.
May it be on the basis of religion, caste, the color of skin, shape of their eyes etc.
They also practiced this kind of discrimination against Disabled (or differently enabled) person.
A disability is an impairment that may be cognitive, developmental, intellectual, mental, physical, sensory, or some combination of these. It substantially affects a person's life activities and may be present from birth or occur during a person's lifetime.

Families did not know how to cope with birth defects and they had to live by begging.

I remember that is was not long ago that people afflicted with leprosy were isolated to leper colonies.
A simple treatment was available but no one cared.

I admire the Christian Missionaries including Mother Theresa, who took upon themselves to care for them.
We who sat on the sidelines dare now to question the motives of those great people.

Similarly, LGBTQ people who are born that way, and have a different lifestyle are being stigmatized.

 

[a-TB]

Dear Shri a-TB,

I understand your outburst. I accept your view it is in nature that one is a gay. There are many other conditions that are due to nature. The point is, if any one of them may not be in the interest of the society at large, they have to be restrained or better corrected.

What is the basis for a man being attracted to women or vice versa? Does nature have a purpose for it other than making it a mere attraction? Definitely it does as it helps in sustaining human race and so is the case with any species. What about the attraction between a man and a man or a woman and a woman? Does nature have a higher purpose than the perverted one? I am not sure .If you think of one let me know. A man-man or a woman-woman relationship can happen as friendship which is a noble one and without perversions.

I believe that nature gives purpose to everything in its creation and there are ones that are creative and one that are destructive. This tension is necessary for learning deep truths which is the ultimate purpose of the physical-mental reality. So one cannot easily escape by saying that it is in one's nature for being in a certain way. If the act or thought is destructive it will be restrained and corrected by the other members of the society. Many devious plots are done in a bedroom and devious and abnormal behaviour arises out of actions in ones bedroom. If it does stop at bedroom, nobody cares. But there is an animal called the mind. It can be triggered anytime and at any place.

So kindly look at the larger picture and be not biased in your support for something that cannot be approved by the majority of the society for the good of the society.

Dear Mr Sravana:

It is hard to debate you if most if not every sentence is full of logical holes drenched with narrow minded ideas.

Let me show a few examples, do not have time to go over every sentence. But you will get the drift.

Sentence 1: You can call it outburst. I was calling your comments with reasons that they are narrow minded, immature and divisive. I have not seen any refutation to that but only label it as outburst.

Sentence 2. This is silly. It is like me saying ' we have days and nights' and you agree to my 'view'. That will be absurd. You dont have to agree to my view because nature is what it is. It is not my view and you are a nobody like me to agree to it.

Sentence 3: There are not conditions. There is only nature, we are part of the nature. We cannot want nature to be different. We can only correct our wrong ideas and conclusions about nature.

Sentence 4: It is an absurd statement or downright arrogance to say what in nature for 'good of the society'. You are a nobody like me and cannot determine what in nature is good for a society. That is the kind of thinking that let a Hitler of the world to get rid of Jews. Let us not go there

You should be able to read what people have written here by others, understand their points and then put down your rebuttals.

No one can say why gay, or bisexuality exist in nature. No one can say why every couple is not able to conceive a child.

You have stated a belief that if tested is immature because it is harmful to peace, lacks acceptance of fellow beings and divisive. It is bad for the society. I am not talking about nature but the expression of your beliefs/ego. So you should understand the effect of your beliefs.

Examine your beliefs and you will find they are flawed. No 'spiritual progress' is possible with divisive thinking and wanting to criminalize nature. Gay people cannot be converted anymore than straight people cannot be made to develop gay love.

Learn to see human beings as equal. That is the first step to any spiritual progress.

 

[a-TB]

Legitimizing LGBT is not only a blasphemy of hinduism but a blasphemy of mother nature

Another flawed statement. India is not equal to Hinduism. Supreme court of India is not equal to Hinduism. Anyway Hinduism as far as I know (and I can be corrected) never criminalized homosexuality. The intolerance has its roots in Christianity and Islam that misguided Hindus ape.

 

[a-TB]

the title to my thread is 'legalising ... blasphemy of hinduism' and not 'legalising...blasphemy of christianity'.

numerous churches in the west permit lgbtqs to attend their services.

a very popular christian preacher in a Larry King show, when asked about his opinion on homosexuality, said, 'i dont think that is God's best'. that sounds a lukewarm, non-committal, diplomatic statement.

this is as much the research I could make with my limited resources sir.

perhaps my findings hardly contain strength/substance to refute your claims.

could you please table more of your findings sir, perhaps quotes from scriptures of so-called abrahamic religions?

Hinduism as far as I know never criminalized people for gay interests. Only today's Indian court decriminalized. So the title is flawed.

Churches consider everyone is destined to go to Hell unless saved. So they want anyone to come to Church and be converted.

Popular preachers are scoundrels if you care to research into their personal lives. They want maximum followers.

You are welcome to continue to do your search. One popular preacher said God made Adam and Eve and not adam and steve.

That is the level of discourse you will get from these people. They are incapable of debating.

 

[prasad1]

There is a misconception that you are living in Religion.
In India:
Some Hindus think that they and others live in their brand of Hinduism, Similarly, some Muslims think that all live in their brand of Islam, and others think all Indians have to live by their standards.


But all countrymen governed by the constitution of India alone. They may follow any religion, that has very little to do in eyes of the law (with some exceptions).

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri a-TB,

I would like to emphasize that creations of nature can also be destructive. Nature also creates things that needs to controlled and corrected. That is the way nature works . To make us think about defending ourselves, whether it is an earthquake , a cyclone , a cancer, anger or a perverted mind.

Kindly think about it.

 

[prasad1]

the title to my thread is 'legalising ... blasphemy of hinduism' and not 'legalising...blasphemy of christianity'.

Do you know a typical Hindu?
Do you have a book accepted by all Hindus that define the norms of a Hindu?
Can you compare the Hinduism practiced by Tribesman in Mizoram with the Hinduism practiced by an Iyengar in Sri Rangam? How much of a commonality there is? Can they even understand each other? So how can you be the champion of Hinduism? How can you disparage others?

 

[a-TB]

Dear Shri a-TB,

I would like to emphasize that creations of nature can also be destructive. Nature also creates things that needs to controlled and corrected. That is the way nature works . To make us think about defending ourselves, whether it is an earthquake , a cyclone , a cancer, anger or a perverted mind.

Kindly think about it.

Dear Mr Sravana:
Nature is known by what we sense and by laws of nature we identify. Constructive or destructive is a point of view. Floods kill but it can also refresh soil for propagation of life. Same with Volcanoes.

Nature does not have ego but humans do, who are arrogant to think they control the nature.

Nature can never be controlled. One law of nature is used to have desired effect that humans want from the effect of another law. In other words you can only do what Nature allows.

Will you be able to introspect and set aside your ego in understanding this?

We can build houses using laws of nature to protect better from another of nature's act - earthquakes or flood. Same with cancer or any other events.

But perversion is defined by human ego. If a person is harmful to another being , (example - pedophiles, bestiality) that has to be stopped by the society.

If two gay people do something that is within their nature without hurting anyone else, then for some other ego to criminalize can be called a perverted ego. The society has to protect itself against such egos because they are dangerous to peace loving people.

I am personally turned off by the gay acts of two men. But that does not make them any less human. I know many people who are gay and they are no different than anyone else I know. It is a mystery to me why these men find other men attractive.

If you do not love all beings the way they are (provided they do not cause harm to others) then there can be no real spiritual progress. Religions singing name of some God pervert their God by their hatred ego towards others.

Think about these points

 

[a-TB]

Dear GNANA SUNYAM:We all enjoy anonymity in this forum. I value that just like you do. But without letting go of your privacy , could you please state if you are a Hindu. The title and some of your statements can be better understood if we know your religious background. If you are a Christian or Christian sympathizer or have other agenda, the forum rules allow full membership to you (I think(. It is all about certain level of transparency needed for a good discussion.

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri a-TB,

Let us be honest and not defend something just because it is our stated position. Perversion of mind exists. How would we define perversion? Something that nature makes us learn but unlearn later. What would nature want us to unlearn? Something that operates only at the level of lower reality or in other words something that has to do only with the physical reality.

A homosexual attraction is based more on physical attraction and is different from friendship which is more at the mental level.

What do you think?

 

[a-TB]

Dear Shri a-TB,

Let us be honest and not defend something just because it is our stated position. Perversion of mind exists. How would we define perversion? Something that nature makes us learn but unlearn later. What would nature want us to unlearn? Something that operates only at the level of lower reality or in other words something that has to do only with the physical reality.

A homosexual attraction is based more on physical attraction and is different from friendship which is more at the mental level.

What do you think?

Dear Sravana:

If something causes wilful harm (only human ego can do this) then that is perversion of the mind. Because that mind wants to cause harm to others who are minding their business. That is the only kind of perversion that exists.

Our body and mind is nature. Our ego has to learn to love all beings for what they are. Forget your perversion about lower and upper reality - they are used to cause harm to others like your stated position about wanting to criminalize gays.

All sexual attraction is based on both body and mental level. The distinction is in your head and prevents you not to see other human beings for what they are

 

[sravna]

You misunderstand what I said. I did not say I hate or cannot like gay people. Personally I show no hatred towards others nor put down their views without consideration.

I would like to not label those who practice homosexuality and let that be their distinguishing aspect of such people. There are so much to a person than his sexual preference. But the sexual preference is a perversion just as reveling in others miseries is. I condemn both and all such equally and cannot and should not be granted social approval.