• Welcome to Tamil Brahmins forums.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our Free Brahmin Community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Why does every religion need to follow some rituals?

prasad1

Active member
One of the primary goals of religious establishments is to amass power by controlling their followers.

Rituals and rules are an easy way of exerting such control and conditioning the followers to mindlessly obey without question. I fact, the more ridiculous and unnatural the rituals/rules are -- the better they are at asserting control.
Consider a religion that requires "thou shalt always watch TV sitting down" vs. another that requires "thou shalt always watch TV in the lotus position with your left eye blindfolded"... Clearly -- if all followers of the 2nd religion actually follow the rule, the religion has asserted tremendous power over its followers. Once control is established and asserted it can be used for much more "useful" purposes.

Another important reason for rituals and bizarre rules is to differentiate one religion from another and make followers' identity more closely associated with their religion. If you look differently (wear special garments, have markings on your body) or behave differently (must only eat food that was prepared in a certain way, can't eat/drink certain things) then you ARE different.

An interesting side effect of this is a tremendous opportunity for profit. When rituals and rules are sufficiently complicated -- oversight by the religious establishment to make sure all rules are observed correctly becomes necessary (consider "Kosher" or "Halal" certification!) and these services are never cheap.

Then you need a priest, Guru, or a witch doctor.

Exact logic is followed by Governments. They create laws that are complicated, and then you need lawyers.
Similarly, Tax laws are created such that you need accountants and layers to find you the loopholes.

If the Income-tax code was made simple say 10%, you will need an army of lawyers and tax accountants to file your taxes.
 
hi

every religion has 3 main parts......1 RITUALS......2 SPIRITUAL.......3 PHILOSOPHY.....in all these spritual/philosophy

will be more similar....only rituals are different.....mainly rituals based geographical conditions of

religion originated....so mainly hinduism/buddhism/jainism/sikhism follow more similar....

judaism/christianity/islam many rituals are similar too...
 
Why religion? We have rituals every where. For example On Independence Day and RepublicDay we hoist flag and sing national anthem. Religions also prescribe many rituals with some logic. Later we give more prominence to rituals. If we know the background we can truly appreciate it.
 
Why religion? We have rituals every where. For example On Independence Day and RepublicDay we hoist flag and sing national anthem. Religions also prescribe many rituals with some logic. Later we give more prominence to rituals. If we know the background we can truly appreciate it.

Wash your feet, when coming from outside are good hygiene, that is not a ritual imposed from outside. I may change it on my own with a sanction from a third party. All practices are not rituals.
Practices that we follow can be of our own desire. The practices fostered by others are rituals.
 
Why religion? We have rituals every where. For example On Independence Day and RepublicDay we hoist flag and sing national anthem. Religions also prescribe many rituals with some logic. Later we give more prominence to rituals. If we know the background we can truly appreciate it.

You are right. According to Cambridge dictionary the following meaning with example is given for ritual.

a set of actions or words performed in a regular way, often as part of a religious ceremony

A ritual is also any act done regularly, usually without thinking about it:

Example: My morning ritual includes reading the newspaper while I drink my coffee

What we often consider as habits are rituals. And sure many of them can be destructive. Such as Drinking/smoking every day.
 
One of the primary goals of religious establishments is to amass power by controlling their followers.

Rituals and rules are an easy way of exerting such control and conditioning the followers to mindlessly obey without question. I fact, the more ridiculous and unnatural the rituals/rules are -- the better they are at asserting control.
Consider a religion that requires "thou shalt always watch TV sitting down" vs. another that requires "thou shalt always watch TV in the lotus position with your left eye blindfolded"... Clearly -- if all followers of the 2nd religion actually follow the rule, the religion has asserted tremendous power over its followers. Once control is established and asserted it can be used for much more "useful" purposes.

Another important reason for rituals and bizarre rules is to differentiate one religion from another and make followers' identity more closely associated with their religion. If you look differently (wear special garments, have markings on your body) or behave differently (must only eat food that was prepared in a certain way, can't eat/drink certain things) then you ARE different.

An interesting side effect of this is a tremendous opportunity for profit. When rituals and rules are sufficiently complicated -- oversight by the religious establishment to make sure all rules are observed correctly becomes necessary (consider "Kosher" or "Halal" certification!) and these services are never cheap.

Then you need a priest, Guru, or a witch doctor.

Exact logic is followed by Governments. They create laws that are complicated, and then you need lawyers.
Similarly, Tax laws are created such that you need accountants and layers to find you the loopholes.

If the Income-tax code was made simple say 10%, you will need an army of lawyers and tax accountants to file your taxes.


Once a person I knew told me about a ritual done by some black magic practitioners in a state in South India where they use Kutti Shatan for their witch craft.

When there is no work to do they keep the Kutti Shatan busy by making it count the grains of a huge heap of sand so that it remains under control.


So likewise humans follow rituals to keep ourselves under control.
Once we understand why we need it and move beyond that we could discard it.


Ok! now coming to medical logic...the brain learns by two types of memory systems.
1)Procedural memory
2)Declarative memory.


Procedural memory develops firsts slightly before the Declarative memory.
In procedural memory we pick up life long skills in a repetitive format and this is of utmost importance in learning.

This part of memory is higher in children hence children learn faster than adults.

So any ritual is a repetitive format that actually helps the neuronal function of the brain.
There is really nothing to complain of any ritual cos it serves as a good neuronal work out.
 
Last edited:
I have a feeling that some people are confusing between religious or group rituals and individual choice rituals.
Everybody has some personal choice rituals, that they follow. You check for your wallets, keys, etc when you leave your house. There is nothing wrong with that.
But when you perform absolutely meaningless rituals without understanding the meaning behind the practice, then it is out of guilt or superstition. Maybe it is time to rethink the ritual.

If you still think that washing your hand before eating with the hand is the same as waiting for a widow, or a black not to cross your path, then this post is not for you.
 
I have a feeling that some people are confusing between religious or group rituals and individual choice rituals.
Everybody has some personal choice rituals, that they follow. You check for your wallets, keys, etc when you leave your house. There is nothing wrong with that.
But when you perform absolutely meaningless rituals without understanding the meaning behind the practice, then it is out of guilt or superstition. Maybe it is time to rethink the ritual.

If you still think that washing your hand before eating with the hand is the same as waiting for a widow, or a black not to cross your path, then this post is not for you.

hi



But when you perform absolutely meaningless rituals without understanding the meaning behind the practice, then it is out of guilt or superstition. Maybe it is time to rethink the ritual.

nothing is meaningless...if we are ignorant....understanding is very important....but some cases

not everyone has to understanding everything...in many cases..vadhyar says...we follow it...there

is no SOP for ritual....sometimes its KARTHA's responsibility to understand.....like in Taiteriya Upanishad..

in veda says...SATYAM VADHA...DHARMAM CHARA...its order....just follow the directions...dont ask

more questions....every religion same.....in ten testamends of BIBLE....rituals to follow...or in SURA of

ISLAM..but many cases...other religious follow the GURU WORDS as it is,,,,no questioning./understanding..

ONLY HINDUISM IS MORE ILICHAVAYAN....just my opinion..
 
But when you perform absolutely meaningless rituals without understanding the meaning behind the practice, then it is out of guilt or superstition. Maybe it is time to rethink the ritual.

nothing is meaningless...if we are ignorant....understanding is very important.

Yes. Understanding of rituals that are destructive like daily smoking, drinking, drugs etc are very important. But still it cannot be forced. Not understanding the meaning of all religious rituals is not so critical. Every book and teacher in any case often gives a slightly different explanation so one can never be certain of the correct meaning. Besides on matters of faith, one does not have to convince anybody else whether a ritual is being done with understanding or is based on faith. It is not anybody else’s business.
 
hi

rituals are FAITH based....nobody can be forced....not all are doing AVANI AVITTAM regular...BUT SOME

ARE VERY REGULAR AVANI AVITTAM FOR MANY DECADES.... i know ....my father used to AVANI AVITTAM

WITH ALL AGRAHARAM GROUP REGULAR......even my grand father not so regular....so ITS PURELY

FAITH BASED....NOT FOR EVERYONE...
 
hi



But when you perform absolutely meaningless rituals without understanding the meaning behind the practice, then it is out of guilt or superstition. Maybe it is time to rethink the ritual.

nothing is meaningless...if we are ignorant....understanding is very important....but some cases

not everyone has to understanding everything...in many cases..vadhyar says...we follow it...there

is no SOP for ritual....sometimes its KARTHA's responsibility to understand.....like in Taiteriya Upanishad..

in veda says...SATYAM VADHA...DHARMAM CHARA...its order....just follow the directions...dont ask

more questions....every religion same.....in ten testamends of BIBLE....rituals to follow...or in SURA of

ISLAM..but many cases...other religious follow the GURU WORDS as it is,,,,no questioning./understanding..

ONLY HINDUISM IS MORE ILICHAVAYAN....just my opinion..

I noticed Hinduism does not use the phrase " If God wills" ( Insha Allah) which is said after we decide to do anything to remind ourselves that we humans plan but only God determines if it will actually happen.

So I have started using a Sanskrit version of " If God wills"
Yadi Bhagawan Icchati Tarhi Bhavati
 
I noticed Hinduism does not use the phrase " If God wills" ( Insha Allah) which is said after we decide to do anything to remind ourselves that we humans plan but only God determines if it will actually happen.

So I have started using a Sanskrit version of " If God wills"
Yadi Bhagawan Icchati Tarhi Bhavati

hi

BHAGAVD ICCHA GARIYASI... BHAVAD SANKALPAM.....LOL
 
I noticed Hinduism does not use the phrase " If God wills" ( Insha Allah) which is said after we decide to do anything to remind ourselves that we humans plan but only God determines if it will actually happen.

So I have started using a Sanskrit version of " If God wills"
Yadi Bhagawan Icchati Tarhi Bhavati
Instead my grand mother used the phrase "pozhaichukadandal parthukkalam" (பொழச்சுக்கடந்தால் பார்த்துக்கலாம்).
When we plan some future event !
Brahmanyan
Bangalore.
 
Last edited:
Sabdhakosh describes ritual as " a sequence of activities involving gestures, words, actions, or objects, performed in a sequestered place and according to a set sequence. Rituals may be prescribed by the traditions of a community, including a religious community. Rituals are characterized, but not defined, by formalism, traditionalism, invariance, rule-governance, sacral symbolism, and performance".
In other words its symbolic exhibition of ones belief. It may be in religious ceremonies or secular exhibition like flag hoisting, army march past etc.
Brahmanyan
Bangalore.
 
hi

the beauty of RITUALS in all religions/faith based on PANCH TATVA....its symbolic FIVE ELEMENTS....

water/fire/air/earth/sky.....so no RITUAL CAN DO WITHOUT THESE FIVE ELEMENTS.....in reality....

all RITUALS BASED ON NATURAL ELEMENTS....NOT ANY PARTICULAR GOD/GODDESS...purely

NATURAL WORSHIP.....if you read MANTRAPUSHPAM.....no god/goddess name with be there...

vedas based on Natural worshipers....later god/goddess came in ritual part...just my opinion..
 
I noticed Hinduism does not use the phrase " If God wills" ( Insha Allah) which is said after we decide to do anything to remind ourselves that we humans plan but only God determines if it will actually happen.

So I have started using a Sanskrit version of " If God wills"
Yadi Bhagawan Icchati Tarhi Bhavati
In sankalpam we always say parameswara preethyartam which more less means the same.
 
Instead my grand mother used the phrase "pozhaichukadandal parthukkalam" (பொழச்சுக்கடந்தால் பார்த்துக்கலாம்).
When we plan some future event
My mother used to say
நாளைக்கு பொழச்சுக்கடந்தால் ராமா ராஜ்யம்

When ram's ராஜ்யம் itself uncertain (what about us When we postponed to tomorrow in our saying)
 
One of the primary goals of religious establishments is to amass power by controlling their followers.

Rituals and rules are an easy way of exerting such control and conditioning the followers to mindlessly obey without question. I fact, the more ridiculous and unnatural the rituals/rules are -- the better they are at asserting control.
Consider a religion that requires "thou shalt always watch TV sitting down" vs. another that requires "thou shalt always watch TV in the lotus position with your left eye blindfolded"... Clearly -- if all followers of the 2nd religion actually follow the rule, the religion has asserted tremendous power over its followers. Once control is established and asserted it can be used for much more "useful" purposes.

Another important reason for rituals and bizarre rules is to differentiate one religion from another and make followers' identity more closely associated with their religion. If you look differently (wear special garments, have markings on your body) or behave differently (must only eat food that was prepared in a certain way, can't eat/drink certain things) then you ARE different.

An interesting side effect of this is a tremendous opportunity for profit. When rituals and rules are sufficiently complicated -- oversight by the religious establishment to make sure all rules are observed correctly becomes necessary (consider "Kosher" or "Halal" certification!) and these services are never cheap.

Then you need a priest, Guru, or a witch doctor.

Exact logic is followed by Governments. They create laws that are complicated, and then you need lawyers.
Similarly, Tax laws are created such that you need accountants and layers to find you the loopholes.

If the Income-tax code was made simple say 10%, you will need an army of lawyers and tax accountants to file your taxes.
You have articulated the basics in a simple and straightforward manner. It's the priest class which arrogated to itself all the powers for which the entire Brahmin community is under attack. We must reform ourselves without an external agencies doing that for us.
 
You have articulated the basics in a simple and straightforward manner. It's the priest class which arrogated to itself all the powers for which the entire Brahmin community is under attack. We must reform ourselves without an external agencies doing that for us.
It's the priest class which arrogated to itself all the powers for which the entire Brahmin community is under attack

hi

every religion has priest class and all the powers within them....fir example in judaism....priest

is higher than a king....in catholic christianity...pope is priest....in islam ...mulla/moulvi is

a priest....so not only brahmins....
 
The OP has written what appears to be the typical leftist/materialist viewpoint- looking at it in terms of power and nothing else. The fact of the matter is - a million tonnes of theory does not equal an ounce of practice. So what do you mean by rituals ? From a dharmic view point, you may mean nitya karma- which does not need any purohita- not for anyone who has got the yajnopaveeta. Naimittika karma may or may not need a purohita. So I am not sure what you mean by 'power' here.

Does the OP actually believe in the existence of anything beyond the material world ? If not, the rest of this post, as far as the OP is concerned- would be a waste of my time and words.

One who does not have a regular practice will not be able to understand the subtleties of the nitya/naimittika karma and sadhana and will be trapped and his knowledge restricted to books of people who people who themselves have never understood. Marx for example never understood Sanatana Dharma and wrote all his theory based on his knowledge of the Christian Church in Europe. Naturally, his predictions and theories have not amounted to much so far. They were based on a very limited understanding of history and an even more limited understanding of religion in general and human nature.

Our 'priests' are only required for helping or interceding with certain ceremonies. So for your daily sandhya vandanam, bali/vaishvadaivam, they are not needed. They are only needed for doing say a Ganapathy homa, where even a priest would need others to come and act as purohita when doing it at home. Alternatively, you can do the tantrika homa ( if you have the diksha) without the purohita.You can do a manasika homa/puja without any material or purohita at all..

If you lack the ability to concentrate or spend time on these things, you can give the "power of attorney" to a purohita to do japa, homa, deva-tarpana etc for you. They also help as acharya when you do not know how to do some things.


Our purohita are not the same as the mulla or the catholic priests or even a witch doctor. So a comparison just reveals a lack of proper understanding of our dharma. Our is an experiential dharma. Without the discipline and practice, one must rely entirely on krupa and purva janma punya for this.

Our dharma does not declare that anyone who does not approach our priest is doomed to eternal suffering or snything of the sort.

Posts like this reveal the reason that upanayana and spiritual practice was started at a very young age in our traditions. The body and mind were trained to be aware of more subtle things than that are seen in the material world by the physical senses. For one who has experienced, these questions/doubts/thoughts would not arise.
 
Post#21 Written by a "worldly IGNORANT Brahmin".
The forum rule states very clearly that you do not make a personal attack on other members.
Brahmins account for less than 2% of the population.
Of those Brahmins, less than 10% are practicing the art of Brahminism.
Of those practicing Brahmins, less than 10% understand the significance.
The OP was for the 6 billion people, and may not apply for one individual with an avatar named Shyams.

One lingering question for the all-knowing medhavi who proclaimed that

For one who has experienced, these questions/doubts/thoughts would not arise.

Why are you in this forum? And reading the questions/doubts/thoughts of ordinary mortals?
 
Namaste

Well- I wonder what part of my post can be considered "personal attack". As such you have yourself attacked me as a "worldly ignorant Brahmin", "medhavi" etc. Leave that- It does not matter to me. Ideas matter, people don't particularly on an anonymous internet forum.


So please ponder on a few points :


1. There is no such thing as "brahminism" - there is only dharma. This term was coined by certain leftists and others who want to destroy Hindu/Sanatana dharma using caste as a base, to separate the adherents of Dharma, and convert them to materialism or other faiths they are allied with. This is a term used by only brahmana dveshis and dharma dveshis. Why have you used this term ? Why are you on this forum if you believe that all our ancestors were charlatans who created rituals for getting power ?


2. Does this site have a readership of billions ? Can 6 billion people on this planet read and write. Facebook + Twitter + Google does not add up to 6 billion. So what is the point in attacking the faith of, and disparaging the characters of the ancestors, of all the Brahmins - both Tamil and others on this "tamilbrahmins.com" site ? There are enough people and political parties doing this in TN- why are you doing this on this site ? There are no people of other faiths who are likely to be reading this site- so why target these thoughts on this site ?


3. I have answered your question and refuted your argument. It is not an election. It only matters that I am right. Even if the number of Tamil brahmins who know this is right is just ONE, it doesnt change the right and wrong of things. Even if all the mice in Mesopotamia( as an example) believed that the moon was made of cheese, it would not make it right- would it? So of what relevance are the statistics about brahmana population?


I fully respect the Parabrahman in everyone and have general respect for everyone( and that definetely includes you)- but in the noble Vedic tradition which includes Tarka and Nyana, I do not respect or accept ideas which don't make sense. It is a brahmana's right and duty to fight ideas which are wrong and damage dharma.


Namah Paramatmikayai.
 

Latest ads

Back
Top