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A question
Dear Friends,
It pains me to see that a few of us are ready to slam others on a personal level. We may not agree with the views of others, but we should never get in to the area of attacking any other person. We are all Brahmins and again in the wider world, we are all Human Beings.
Elitism never solved anything in this world. Unless the egalitarianism is mixed with meritocracy, there is a recipe for selfishness and arrogance.
'Love' is a magic word. And our religion is based on that. It came about and created a Varna called the Brahmins, not to be elitists, but to serve the other Varnas of the society, especially the folks who unfortunately got caught in the whirlpool of their Karmaphala. This is why, our religion more than any other religion was structured to take care of the unfortunate amongst us.
Let us not fight amongst ourselves. If there is ignorance, let us lovingly teach the person as to how to get rid of it. If there is elitism, let us lovingly point out the evils of such thinking. Let us join hands together and embrace our community (Dear Sri Kudumi Ji, I hope you are still among us - Please reread Sri Silverfox's posting - he was not questioning you).
Dear Sri Maruti Ji, your words are against women, and I know you did not mean it (because I know a bit about you now), and they were uttered out of pure frustration on your part. Please come forward and explain to Sowbhagyavathi Chintana Ji, why you uttered such hurtful words and apologize.
This is the first website that I have come across, that caters to the well being of a Tamil Brahmin community, which has been treated with so much contempt by the rest of the people so far. Let us not lose anyone from this Forum, on the grounds that we ourselves do not understand each other.
I apologize if I have offended anyone. I just want us to move forward as a united community, irrespective of whether we have high IQs or not, whether we have talents or not, and whether we are Iyengars, Madhvas, Iyers and whomsoever else or not.
Pranams,
KRS
Dear Friends,
It pains me to see that a few of us are ready to slam others on a personal level. We may not agree with the views of others, but we should never get in to the area of attacking any other person. We are all Brahmins and again in the wider world, we are all Human Beings.
Elitism never solved anything in this world. Unless the egalitarianism is mixed with meritocracy, there is a recipe for selfishness and arrogance.
'Love' is a magic word. And our religion is based on that. It came about and created a Varna called the Brahmins, not to be elitists, but to serve the other Varnas of the society, especially the folks who unfortunately got caught in the whirlpool of their Karmaphala. This is why, our religion more than any other religion was structured to take care of the unfortunate amongst us.
Let us not fight amongst ourselves. If there is ignorance, let us lovingly teach the person as to how to get rid of it. If there is elitism, let us lovingly point out the evils of such thinking. Let us join hands together and embrace our community (Dear Sri Kudumi Ji, I hope you are still among us - Please reread Sri Silverfox's posting - he was not questioning you).
Dear Sri Maruti Ji, your words are against women, and I know you did not mean it (because I know a bit about you now), and they were uttered out of pure frustration on your part. Please come forward and explain to Sowbhagyavathi Chintana Ji, why you uttered such hurtful words and apologize.
This is the first website that I have come across, that caters to the well being of a Tamil Brahmin community, which has been treated with so much contempt by the rest of the people so far. Let us not lose anyone from this Forum, on the grounds that we ourselves do not understand each other.
I apologize if I have offended anyone. I just want us to move forward as a united community, irrespective of whether we have high IQs or not, whether we have talents or not, and whether we are Iyengars, Madhvas, Iyers and whomsoever else or not.
Pranams,
KRS
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Why these questions?
Dear LQ:
I have a question to your question #1:
1. How did you come up with the statistics 10:1? Has somebody done research on this and published this number?
Having asked that question:
1. I believe the number is smaller (Iyengars) because before Sri Ramajuna came on the scene, there was no division;
2. Dont know.
3. Everybody knows my view. We MUST inter-marry; for God's sakes, we are worried about this while people are marrying outside the Brahmin community! In my family, there are several such alliances (Iyer-Iyengar)
4. Why not?
LQ, you keep writing in Hindi, without giving translation! If you want your thoughts to be understood, then you have to provide translation! And what is the reason behind your writing in Hindi?
Dear LQ:
I have a question to your question #1:
1. How did you come up with the statistics 10:1? Has somebody done research on this and published this number?
Having asked that question:
1. I believe the number is smaller (Iyengars) because before Sri Ramajuna came on the scene, there was no division;
2. Dont know.
3. Everybody knows my view. We MUST inter-marry; for God's sakes, we are worried about this while people are marrying outside the Brahmin community! In my family, there are several such alliances (Iyer-Iyengar)
4. Why not?
LQ, you keep writing in Hindi, without giving translation! If you want your thoughts to be understood, then you have to provide translation! And what is the reason behind your writing in Hindi?
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
1. It was merely my assumption, based on number of Iyers I knew vs. number of Iyengars I know. I could be way off the mark.
3. Personally, I don't give a damn whether Iyers married Iyengars or Iyengars married catholics or catholics married muslims. I was just curious.
Hindi (Hindustani) has served as defacto mother tongue to me so I keep breaking into it to express myself better. You might have noticed that whenever honorable members post something in chaste tamil, I maintain studious (?) / ignorant silence.
Allow me to translate with my limited abilities:
"Is situation ke liye kuch naghme mulahiza farmaiye:" = "Savour these songs for such situation."
Koi Hum Dum Na Raha = No (life) partner left
Koi Sahara na raha = No ally left
Hum kisike na rahe = I am no longer for anyone
Koi hamara na raha = No one is left any longer for me
Background: This is one of the several lovely songs sung by the great Kishore Kumar in some film of 70's. Poetry reads fine and song was quite popular.
"Chalte Chalte, Yun hi koi , mil gaya tha, sare raah chalte chalte..."
Another lovely song of film "Pakeezah" by Kamaal Amrohi and was made in 1971. It was the last movie of the great actress Meena Kumari who committed suicide soon after completion of this movie. Movie became a super hit. Film has several lovely songs, one of which was "chalte chalte..." Exact meaning is difficult to faithfully translate but would go like "...I met some one ...on my way...met some one...."
3. Personally, I don't give a damn whether Iyers married Iyengars or Iyengars married catholics or catholics married muslims. I was just curious.
Hindi (Hindustani) has served as defacto mother tongue to me so I keep breaking into it to express myself better. You might have noticed that whenever honorable members post something in chaste tamil, I maintain studious (?) / ignorant silence.
Allow me to translate with my limited abilities:
"Is situation ke liye kuch naghme mulahiza farmaiye:" = "Savour these songs for such situation."
Koi Hum Dum Na Raha = No (life) partner left
Koi Sahara na raha = No ally left
Hum kisike na rahe = I am no longer for anyone
Koi hamara na raha = No one is left any longer for me
Background: This is one of the several lovely songs sung by the great Kishore Kumar in some film of 70's. Poetry reads fine and song was quite popular.
"Chalte Chalte, Yun hi koi , mil gaya tha, sare raah chalte chalte..."
Another lovely song of film "Pakeezah" by Kamaal Amrohi and was made in 1971. It was the last movie of the great actress Meena Kumari who committed suicide soon after completion of this movie. Movie became a super hit. Film has several lovely songs, one of which was "chalte chalte..." Exact meaning is difficult to faithfully translate but would go like "...I met some one ...on my way...met some one...."
Last edited by a moderator:
H
hariharan1972
Guest
Tamil Kathukkonga Sir
SF,
I can also vouch for LQ's tamil handicap. When we met in Bangalore for a 'spiritual' evening, we hardly spoke in tamil. It was English & Hindi.
Having said that, LQ, i hope you will seriously attempt to learn your ancestor's language. If not for anything, you will gain access to the treasure of literature that tamil has.
A easy 3 step tamil learning process, i can think for you are :
a) Watch Sun Music Channel daily for 2 hours
b) Get a full collection of Udit Narayan's tamil songs & listen to it daily for 1 hour
c) Buy a good English-Hindi-Tamil reckoner
Pray why (a) & (b) you may be wondering ?
Simple !
Once you have an earful of 'taaaamil comperes speaking in taaaamil' and listen to Udit's - 'kadal pissassse...kaadal pisssssasse...yedo sow ki yam par..va...illl....ye', you will be washed off all the tamil grammatical errors & would come clean.
Once you have grammatical mistakes out of the way, learning would be child's play for you isn't it ?
PS : Time is nearing for our next 'spiritual meeting'
SF,
I can also vouch for LQ's tamil handicap. When we met in Bangalore for a 'spiritual' evening, we hardly spoke in tamil. It was English & Hindi.
Having said that, LQ, i hope you will seriously attempt to learn your ancestor's language. If not for anything, you will gain access to the treasure of literature that tamil has.
A easy 3 step tamil learning process, i can think for you are :
a) Watch Sun Music Channel daily for 2 hours
b) Get a full collection of Udit Narayan's tamil songs & listen to it daily for 1 hour
c) Buy a good English-Hindi-Tamil reckoner
Pray why (a) & (b) you may be wondering ?
Simple !
Once you have an earful of 'taaaamil comperes speaking in taaaamil' and listen to Udit's - 'kadal pissassse...kaadal pisssssasse...yedo sow ki yam par..va...illl....ye', you will be washed off all the tamil grammatical errors & would come clean.
Once you have grammatical mistakes out of the way, learning would be child's play for you isn't it ?
PS : Time is nearing for our next 'spiritual meeting'
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
Teluwa irrukku
We had been to Suleri fallls near Kodaikanal during April this year. The 'falls' is about 1/2 KM away from the place where vehicles are parked. On the way, I found one guy selling some kind of liquid from a earthern pot carried at the back of his bicycle. People came to him with bottles, got their fill and left.
I asked him what that liquid was. He said - "Saar, teluwa irrukku." A repeat query resulted in same reply.
My previous experience with tamil told me that 'teluwa irrukku' basically denotes the clear fluid part of Rasam, i.e, top part of rasam from the vessel without paruppu etc.
Later, it struck me as to what 'teluwa irukku' could have meant ! UNREFINED COUNTRY LIQUOR or TODDY !!
So much for ancestor's language !
We had been to Suleri fallls near Kodaikanal during April this year. The 'falls' is about 1/2 KM away from the place where vehicles are parked. On the way, I found one guy selling some kind of liquid from a earthern pot carried at the back of his bicycle. People came to him with bottles, got their fill and left.
I asked him what that liquid was. He said - "Saar, teluwa irrukku." A repeat query resulted in same reply.
My previous experience with tamil told me that 'teluwa irrukku' basically denotes the clear fluid part of Rasam, i.e, top part of rasam from the vessel without paruppu etc.
Later, it struck me as to what 'teluwa irukku' could have meant ! UNREFINED COUNTRY LIQUOR or TODDY !!
So much for ancestor's language !
Dear Sri Hariharan and Dear Sri LQ Ji,
Seems to me that I would thoroughly enjoy to the core such 'spiritul meetingd' with you both!
With love and respect,
Pranams,
KRS
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
My two naya paisa (I'm hardcore 'desi') on this issue:
At the cost of inviting the wrath of honorable members, I must confess that during our trip to Kodaikanal, Thekkady etc with (NI) friends, we liberally used the term 'Chintana' for such spiritual meetings.
So it seems, Chintana is extremely popular with tambrams !
Hari, are you with me ?
At the cost of inviting the wrath of honorable members, I must confess that during our trip to Kodaikanal, Thekkady etc with (NI) friends, we liberally used the term 'Chintana' for such spiritual meetings.
So it seems, Chintana is extremely popular with tambrams !
Hari, are you with me ?
This sense of humor makes me go back to my undergrad campus life!
Who are 'NI' friends?
And why go to Kodaikanal/Thekkady for spiritual meetings? (Unless of course there is a pun on the word 'spiritual')
In any case, glad you had a good time.
Chintana.
H
hariharan1972
Guest
Come thru an evolution
LQ,
Ofcourse, i am fully with you.
However, given my humble background & modest beginning, i couldn't afford to start with 'Chintans'.
When i started my career in the sleepy town of Mysore, we had what we used to call "Satyanarayana Pooje" (note the ending "e" for the kannada effect). Typically this will be "hosted" by a colleague whose wife is away to maikke....
We used to "strategise" the vehicle parking so that the neighbourhood maami doesn't come to know of what our "colleague was upto" when the lady of the house was away. If she comes to know, for the sin of hosting us, he would go without food for 10 days...
So we used to resort to "random parking"...like parking atleast 10 mtrs away, parking in front of a shop, pooling vehicles to minimise the no. of vehicles etc....
Also the kind of "community service" & "synchronisation" that one got to see during such "poojas" was unbelievable....one guy bringing soda, another snacks, another 'doomra paan' it was perfectly co-ordinated.
Once i moved to bangalore, we had weekly & some times even "daily bhajans"
Ofcourse now we are busy with our own lives, the sessions have reduced to 'Quarterly stock takes' at most.
There was a time when "official chintans" were the order of the month, but with a rising rupee, all such "fringe benefits" suffer a cut.
LQ,
Ofcourse, i am fully with you.
However, given my humble background & modest beginning, i couldn't afford to start with 'Chintans'.
When i started my career in the sleepy town of Mysore, we had what we used to call "Satyanarayana Pooje" (note the ending "e" for the kannada effect). Typically this will be "hosted" by a colleague whose wife is away to maikke....
We used to "strategise" the vehicle parking so that the neighbourhood maami doesn't come to know of what our "colleague was upto" when the lady of the house was away. If she comes to know, for the sin of hosting us, he would go without food for 10 days...
So we used to resort to "random parking"...like parking atleast 10 mtrs away, parking in front of a shop, pooling vehicles to minimise the no. of vehicles etc....
Also the kind of "community service" & "synchronisation" that one got to see during such "poojas" was unbelievable....one guy bringing soda, another snacks, another 'doomra paan' it was perfectly co-ordinated.
Once i moved to bangalore, we had weekly & some times even "daily bhajans"
Ofcourse now we are busy with our own lives, the sessions have reduced to 'Quarterly stock takes' at most.
There was a time when "official chintans" were the order of the month, but with a rising rupee, all such "fringe benefits" suffer a cut.
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
In one of the novels by Robert Ludlum, , I came across the phrase "Obfuscation of truth in the interest of deniability" in the context of spook's world. Somehow, the phrase imressed me and I stored it at the back of my mind to use it some day.
It appears that obfuscation is quite wide spread with different people attaching different meanings !
Lage raho panditji, lage raho !
It appears that obfuscation is quite wide spread with different people attaching different meanings !
Lage raho panditji, lage raho !
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
NI = North Indian
Why restrict humour to campus life only ? Spirits do lift your morale, especially when it comes in the form of spiritual gatherings !
Why restrict humour to campus life only ? Spirits do lift your morale, especially when it comes in the form of spiritual gatherings !
This sense of humor makes me go back to my undergrad campus life!
Who are 'NI' friends?
And why go to Kodaikanal/Thekkady for spiritual meetings? (Unless of course there is a pun on the word 'spiritual')
In any case, glad you had a good time.
Chintana.
Good humour
Hariji,
"Once you have an earful of 'taaaamil comperes speaking in taaaamil' and listen to Udit's - 'kadal pissassse...kaadal pisssssasse...yedo sow ki yam par..va...illl....ye', you will be washed off all the tamil grammatical errors & would come clean."
That was really nice.
I don't understand why music directors especially ARR need to go for these "Thamizhkkolai"-singers while we have our own great talents. I accept that Udit Narayan and other such singers sing very well. But there are a lot of upcoming new talents thanks to reality music shows of various channels.
LQji,
"We had been to Suleri fallls near Kodaikanal during April this year"
I think it is "Suruli falls". Being in Madurai, I want to visit there and one more Kumbakkarai falls. But we really dont know whether there would be water always and it would be suitable for families to enjoy. As you'd visited can you kindly give some details?
Hariji,
"Once you have an earful of 'taaaamil comperes speaking in taaaamil' and listen to Udit's - 'kadal pissassse...kaadal pisssssasse...yedo sow ki yam par..va...illl....ye', you will be washed off all the tamil grammatical errors & would come clean."
That was really nice.
I don't understand why music directors especially ARR need to go for these "Thamizhkkolai"-singers while we have our own great talents. I accept that Udit Narayan and other such singers sing very well. But there are a lot of upcoming new talents thanks to reality music shows of various channels.
LQji,
"We had been to Suleri fallls near Kodaikanal during April this year"
I think it is "Suruli falls". Being in Madurai, I want to visit there and one more Kumbakkarai falls. But we really dont know whether there would be water always and it would be suitable for families to enjoy. As you'd visited can you kindly give some details?
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OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
Nothing great, just a small tricke from mountain river. You may have seen better falls elsewhere. Possibly, since we had been there in dry months, waterfall had reduced to trickle. If you happen to go in wetter months, waterfall volume may be better.
Lots of people take bath in the falls.
Remember to carry a change of clothes, towel and the works.
You can see vineyards (grape fields) on the way. I wonder where the 'teluwa' thing came from ?
Lots of people take bath in the falls.
Remember to carry a change of clothes, towel and the works.
You can see vineyards (grape fields) on the way. I wonder where the 'teluwa' thing came from ?
H
hariharan1972
Guest
Thelivu
LQji,
"Thelivu" (not 'teluwa') is fresh toddy prepared from Palm extracts. Fermented Toddy becomes Kallu.
So in horlicks parlance - Thelivu is "Pullikka vendam appadiye chaapidalam" (not reqd to turn sour, can drink it direct)
There is saying in tamil that "pana marathu adiyala paala kudichallum kallnu dhan ulagam ninaikkum". Translated this means - even if you drink milk standing under the shade of a palm tree, people would suspect it to be toddy. So kallu has a 'dravidian' history which runs deep.
Thelivu pattri ungallukku thelivu pirandhadha ? (Are you clear about thelivu now ?)
LQji,
"Thelivu" (not 'teluwa') is fresh toddy prepared from Palm extracts. Fermented Toddy becomes Kallu.
So in horlicks parlance - Thelivu is "Pullikka vendam appadiye chaapidalam" (not reqd to turn sour, can drink it direct)
There is saying in tamil that "pana marathu adiyala paala kudichallum kallnu dhan ulagam ninaikkum". Translated this means - even if you drink milk standing under the shade of a palm tree, people would suspect it to be toddy. So kallu has a 'dravidian' history which runs deep.
Thelivu pattri ungallukku thelivu pirandhadha ? (Are you clear about thelivu now ?)
H
hariharan1972
Guest
Vittudunga
Kothaiji,
Neenga ippadi pannalama ?
Yenna kallu la Ph.D vanga vechiduveenga pola irukke ? Yenakku therinja varaikkum neenga sonnadhu seriye....
Aamam yenakku oru sandegam !
"Kall"azhagar irukkira ooril irundha neengal, "sundara chennai tamizh" pesum ooril irundha yennidam vina yezhuppalama ?
Apparam innondraiyum sollik-kollgiren....naan appappo sapta/sapdugira IMFL sathiyama sollaren, Kallai yen nuni naaakkum suvai paardhadhillai....
indha conversation galai yellam mela irukkira 'ummachiyum' suresh sir um gavanithukkondirikirargal....adhanala indha topic aa ithoda niruthikkolgiren.
Kothaiji,
Neenga ippadi pannalama ?
Yenna kallu la Ph.D vanga vechiduveenga pola irukke ? Yenakku therinja varaikkum neenga sonnadhu seriye....
Aamam yenakku oru sandegam !
"Kall"azhagar irukkira ooril irundha neengal, "sundara chennai tamizh" pesum ooril irundha yennidam vina yezhuppalama ?
Apparam innondraiyum sollik-kollgiren....naan appappo sapta/sapdugira IMFL sathiyama sollaren, Kallai yen nuni naaakkum suvai paardhadhillai....
indha conversation galai yellam mela irukkira 'ummachiyum' suresh sir um gavanithukkondirikirargal....adhanala indha topic aa ithoda niruthikkolgiren.
Hari Sir,
Naan kettathu Padhaneer paththi. I've explained its uses also. Neenga athaiyellaam vittutteengale.
And I'm in "Kall"azhagar's city for the past 8 months only. Before that I was in North India for 11 yrs.
Enakku "Yaadhum oore yaavarum kelir". My father was in PWD. So before completing 10th std., I had changed 10 schools. To my luck, my husband was in Indian Air Force so we were on wheels only.
So I am Jack(or Jane) of all places but master of none.
Naan kettathu Padhaneer paththi. I've explained its uses also. Neenga athaiyellaam vittutteengale.
And I'm in "Kall"azhagar's city for the past 8 months only. Before that I was in North India for 11 yrs.
Enakku "Yaadhum oore yaavarum kelir". My father was in PWD. So before completing 10th std., I had changed 10 schools. To my luck, my husband was in Indian Air Force so we were on wheels only.
So I am Jack(or Jane) of all places but master of none.
OP
OP
lotus_quartz
Guest
Lagta hai panditji ke dil mein umangen uth rahi hain !
Pesh hai:
Dastuur ibaadat kaa duniyaa se niraalaa ho
Dastuur ibaadat kaa duniyaa se niraalaa ho
ik haath mein maalaa ho ik haath mein pyaalaa ho
puujenge saliiqe se andaaz magar apanaa ho
yaad-e-khudaa dil mein saaqii ne sambhaalaa ho
mastii bhii taqaddus bhii ek saath chale donon
ik simt ho maikhaanaa ik simt shivaalaa ho
masjid kii taraf se tuu jaanaa na kabhii saaqii
zaahid bhii kabhii teraa na chaahanevaalaa ho
vo duub ke mar jaayen madiraa kii suraahii mein
maashuuq ne gar dil kii mahafil se nikaalaa ho
ik haath mein maalaa ho ik haath mein pyaalaa ho
Pesh hai:
Dastuur ibaadat kaa duniyaa se niraalaa ho
Dastuur ibaadat kaa duniyaa se niraalaa ho
ik haath mein maalaa ho ik haath mein pyaalaa ho
puujenge saliiqe se andaaz magar apanaa ho
yaad-e-khudaa dil mein saaqii ne sambhaalaa ho
mastii bhii taqaddus bhii ek saath chale donon
ik simt ho maikhaanaa ik simt shivaalaa ho
masjid kii taraf se tuu jaanaa na kabhii saaqii
zaahid bhii kabhii teraa na chaahanevaalaa ho
vo duub ke mar jaayen madiraa kii suraahii mein
maashuuq ne gar dil kii mahafil se nikaalaa ho
ik haath mein maalaa ho ik haath mein pyaalaa ho
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