Time For Brahmins To Change At Least in Marriages

[Raji Ram]

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RRji
1. That does not answer the basic issue-How to make brahmin girls accept brahmin boys with their accomplishments and faults ?

2. How to bring down the marriage age of boys.?.........

1. Who am I to make girls accept boys? :lol:

2. The boys who are well educated and have high income jobs in early twenties easily get their partners from fresh engg. graduates!

Since the age difference is only one to three years, the boys who postpone their marriage to late twenties keep waiting for ever! :yawn:

 

[sangom]

RRji
That does not answer the basic issue-How to make brahmin girls accept brahmin boys with their accomplishments and faults ?

How to bring down the marriage age of boys.?

Girls are able to find a match at any age . But no one wants these old boys[if they can be called boys].

Who is to blame for this crisis in brahmin community.?

The changes you have suggested are slowly happening as they are decided by economics and convenience mostly and religion does not come in the way.

Shri krish Sir,

The brahmin community has to blame itself, and no one else, for this predicament. We started educating our daughters very high (as high as the parents could afford to), our girls studied well, passed out with flying colours and secured very well-paying jobs. When many people swear by the wisdom of our forefathers in many things, why did not our Astikas obey the dictum, "na stree swAtantryaM arhati"?

Sorry for intruding.

 

[jaisiyaraam]

Time For Brahmins To Change At Least in Marriages
...
They are sore that their parents have taken their views seriously!
...

Dear Forumanians,

I believe that kids (after reaching adulthood) are smart enough to take care of themselves.
And should be bold enough to face the consequences of their actions (choices & decisions).

I believe that parents should not bear the cross for the actions of their kids and they should not entertain / tolerate ungrateful kids.

I have very much personal experience ie my family & near relatives where parents regret & suffer for the actions of their children (35+ yrs) even in their ripe old age and on death bed. This is a disgrace & shameful on the kids part.

I have seen may idiotic kids blaming their parents for the failure of their marriage (love or arranged).

I may be misqouting KG in this context but I believe parents should treat their kids as "individuals" that can think on their own and face the consequences on their own and that parents should not suffer for the mistakes of their kids:

Kahlil Gibran​

​

Your children are not your children.​

They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.​

They come through you but not from you,​

And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.​

Thanks,
Jai SiyaRaam

 

[krish44]

1. Who am I to make girls accept boys? :lol:

2. The boys who are well educated and have high income jobs in early twenties easily get their partners from fresh engg. graduates!

Since the age difference is only one to three years, the boys who postpone their marriage to late twenties keep waiting for ever! :yawn:

All boys cannot be very well educated and high earning. At best 10 percent assuming a normal distribution.Does it mean,no brahmin girl will marry others.?

Do you know most boys who are in mediocre jobs such as call centres ,simple accounts or administrative types , school or college teachers ,no girl

wants. Many parents advertise that boys have flats in their name etc to establish they can offer a decent life to the girls marrying them with no takers.Most of these

boys have neither the initiative to find a match themselves nor they are prepared to marry in other castes. They are so lovingly brought up by their mothers that

they cannot also not separately live away from parents. So many of this type of boys are floating around .

Only if girls are prepared to get into this type of families -this will call for some sacrifice-these boys can find a match.

Of course RRji with her persuasive and soft skills can melt any girls heart and make them marry this type of boys.lol

 

[krish44]

Shri krish Sir,

The brahmin community has to blame itself, and no one else, for this predicament. We started educating our daughters very high (as high as the parents could afford to), our girls studied well, passed out with flying colours and secured very well-paying jobs. When many people swear by the wisdom of our forefathers in many things, why did not our Astikas obey the dictum, "na stree swAtantryaM arhati"?

Sorry for intruding.

Sangomji

One cannot say let women become uneducated idiots so that they can marry male half educated idiots who are available in plenty..

 

[biswa]

I think Sangomji in his wisdom might have said his words in utmost irony.

There should be no discrimination based on gender of child. Why is being educated and independent a bad thing compared to being uneducated, jobless and just being a dependent housewife? Just so that some males can get married?

 

[Raji Ram]

.......... Of course RRji with her persuasive and soft skills can melt any girls heart and make them marry this type of boys.lol

​Krish Sir has made my day, though I consider his statement the best joke of the day!!

 

[Raji Ram]

I think Sangomji in his wisdom might have said his words in utmost irony.

There should be no discrimination based on gender of child. Why is being educated and independent a bad thing compared to being uneducated, jobless and just being a dependent housewife? Just so that some males can get married?

Not to worry, Biswa Sir!

Sri T K S posted a thread about robots.
May be, the boys can find beautiful robots as their mates, soon!! :decision:

 

[yesmohan]

Time For Brahmins To Change At Least in Marriages

P.J. Sir, Why you mention at least in marriages?

What are the other spheres.. you wish changes ?

 

[krish44]

I think Sangomji in his wisdom might have said his words in utmost irony.

There should be no discrimination based on gender of child. Why is being educated and independent a bad thing compared to being uneducated, jobless and just being a dependent housewife? Just so that some males can get married?

You know biswaji.
There is a mindset in many brahmin families. Even if a girl child has the potential, they would not like her to get a high level of education ,their logic being it is difficult

to find grooms better educated than them. I had a colleague,who encouraged his son to get into IIT and PG abroad but his daughter was equally if not more brilliant.

He made her join an ordinary engg college near his home so that she could be under his watchful eye , besides he refused to let her do post graduation she desired.

The daughter could not put up with her parents, married her classmate and vanished for good.Most brahmin families treat a female child inferior to male. It is a

mindset

 

[sarang]

Every community in india has this problem; a colleague of mainw, jain discontinued his girl's education at school level, because finding a groom with higher qualification will be difficult. Among sindhis and parsees too there are more girls with higher educational qualification than the potential grooms. Jains and sindhis join family business or start new business without completing degree level. Parsee girls marrying outide the community is common.

 

[rishikesan]

Dear Young women ( currently in the Marriageable age) I do not know whether at all any Brahmin Girls read the comments being written by experienced Elders.in this Forum? Most probably not ? So what is being written by me ,to be read by the parents of such daughters with an open mind,. All are writing useful comments , But how many of those comments would apply to the Brahmin Girls waiting to be married ? The attitude has turned so complicated that not only the parents feel helpless to convince their own daughters What is right & what is wrong ? All the comments posted on the Topic are well known to ALL, & these comments are to be read by those girls But who can get it done ?
So it becomes FUTILE Exercise leading to more complications, & what we expect cannot happen .Out of my observation, i have considered that the following has to be thought of by the Girls & also their partners to be married to them :-
1)Minimum age difference should be ensured , atleast 3 to 4 years. Because if Both are same age, as years pass & getting older,both will face problems ,/ & realize that if age difference had been there the Lady would be helpful to her husband in many ways It is a FACT of Life Can we ignore ?
Note If any one think of projecting the advantages of difference of minimum age & publisiize for the benefit of All, it will be a True Service to our Community
Rishikesan/ A. Srinivasan

 

[Raji Ram]

.........Most brahmin families treat a female child inferior to male. It is a mindset

You are mistaken, Krish Sir! Almost all the parents of intelligent girls educate them very well. Three of my music students

were sent abroad for Master's degree and only one got an NB mate. Other two got tambram guys!

 

[Raji Ram]

Time For Brahmins To Change At Least in Marriages

P.J. Sir, Why you mention at least in marriages?

What are the other spheres.. you wish changes ?

P J Sir mentioned? :nono:

The Q should be asked to Sri. Ramani.

Image from the source of the OP (viz),

ramanan50.wordpress.com/ time-for-brahmins-to-change-at-least-in-marriages

 

[Raji Ram]

The above blog has this picture and it talks more than 1000 words! :thumb:

 

[XLR8R]

I know of case in my own family when one of my Cousins daughter who after studying here went to USA for further studies and is putting conditions after conditions for her marriage and to such an extent that for more than 3 years she is only rejecting every proposal saying the boy is short or too tall and if he is the same height she finds him bald or bit fat and if physically he is perfect then by qualifications she finds fault and if qualifications is also matching then she says he is in another city and if he is in the same city ( or willing to relocate to the same city ) then she says his salary is not good enough and if by chance everything works out well she says she does not like Rahu Ketu ( i.e the new name for the inlways ) i.,e the inlwas are not up to her taste etc and poor parents have got fed up & lost hope and told her to find a match for herself and they also gave ther the green signal that if she wants she can find a groom from other Caste also but at the same time warned her that every year she keeps rejecting she is growing older and soon she will end up also in the rejection category .

I have increasingly seen that south Indian girls in general and Tambrahms in specific are getting more and more demanding day by day. I consider this as the result of their upbringing, they are not open minded enough and only their environment and upbringing are responsible for this.

For this reason, YES, Brahmins have to change in marriages, but I disagree with many points said in this thread:

1) Early marriage, by any and all metrics, no longer works in a modern society. A lot of ladies still believe that it is anathema for a woman to give birth after 30. A well-settled, financially well-off, and emotionally mature family is essential for overall development of a child. My parents were over 30 when I was born and though I am not a strict brahmin, I still have ZERO bad habits despite no one ever being strict with me: This was a direct result of my parents' maturity and experience due to which they were able to handle me better than younger parents could [examples: thousands of people around my age (late teens, early twenties) who still do not have a grip or direction in their lives].

2) The match problem: Let's face it, everyone needs a match. It is a MYTH that you do not get matches as you grow older. While you are at it, let's also throw away this notion of girl needing to be 3-5 years younger than the boy. Those old differences no longer apply in a society where the difference between a boy and a girl is only physical.

hi

it happens in most cases...especially girls.....i know one story in USA....she is eldest and doing MD in USA....first she said...

she wants complete her study....then residency....then she wants independent for sometimes....then she said she does

not believe in marriage certificate/thali etc....she tried some other white guys.....now she fed up...still single....above 45 yrs...

now she wants marriage and children.....wht to do the parents?.....dadyy kept quiet now....she warned many times to get

married.....she was rehecting mood then....now mom is worried too much?....now her younger brother and younger sister got married

with 2 kids each....but the eldest still single.......i think more career oriented gals suffer more....

Don't worry, career oriented men suffer as much or more. Moreover, "trying" people and failing, not having a grip on what is needed, not getting committed or having a plan in time - all are signs of either extreme bad luck or extreme indecisiveness. Her actions indicate a lack of patience, not a storehouse of the same. Again, a lot of our personality depends on our education, upbringing and environment and this is what has happened here.

late marriage brings its own problems - I see more expectant/despondant couples in fertility clinics.

For each problem, there is a solution, and for each situation, there is one solution and one added problem. There are certain advantages to late marriage as well, and I feel they outweigh the flaws. Everyone remembers the childbirth scenario, no one wants to remember that an older parent will in 99% cases do better than a younger one at raising children.....

afford to pick and choose.They are coldly setting terms with minimum financial commitments while exercising their choice of mate..

That is a direct result of their upbringing, and the males' upbringing as well. Only innocents suffer in this. That being said, just ban arranged marriage and half these issues will go away.

How to make brahmin girls accept brahmin boys with their accomplishments and faults ?

You can't. Neither do I accept demanding girls of any community who look at me with my finances in one eye and my physical features in another. This won't fly in any educated society. If they are like that it's because YOU raised them that way.

But no one wants these old boys[if they can be called boys].

This nonsense about marriage age persists solely because people do not have faith on themselves and would rather believe hearsay and quack talk. One can get married at ANY age (period!) and maybe having kids is an issue, but really, do you marry as a contract to have kids? Kids are born as a consequence of love and feelings, not as some kind of contractual obligation. If you feel you should be parents, and if you feel you are too old to have kids, kindly do the world a favour and adopt one of the thousands of orphans sitting in orphanages in your nation.

religion does not come in the way.

Religion is, unfortunately, still more significant than we think, and we are still as backward as is possible.

The boys who are well educated and have high income jobs in early twenties easily get their partners from fresh engg. graduates

And pray tell what does the boy or girl get by marrying a "fresh engg. graduate" girl to a well educated high income job? The girl loses her chance at excellence and freedom and the boy, loses his ambition.

Forgive me for wanting to study higher, as a Ph.D. student, I should not be made to suffer matrimonially. If I am, it's because of conditions my society creates. I do not, and never will, subscribe to false notions like higher female maturity, or gender roles (man works, woman cooks) or some such nonsense. I did not study co-ed all these years just so that I can be relegated to a provider in an ordinary household and not let women get their due (or give me my due too).

Sometimes, I worry about the mentalities we have in this nation. We clearly do not understand gender equality very well.....

The brahmin community has to blame itself, and no one else, for this predicament. We started educating our daughters very high (as high as the parents could afford to), our girls studied well, passed out with flying colours and secured very well-paying jobs. When many people swear by the wisdom of our forefathers in many things, why did not our Astikas obey the dictum, "na stree swAtantryaM arhati"?

When I was in Gujarat, I noticed something funny. I saw LLB girls married to B.Com qualified men. In arranged marriage. Same age, girl older, girl younger - the end result was still the same. That's because, before cash or qualification, the background and decency of the persons took more importance. I then wondered why our TBs did not understand this. I take this as a crowning fault of a typical Tambrahm upbringing, that they have been unable to explain the importance of karma, decency and pedigree to their children - the end result is that TB men and women have been marrying for as shallow reasons as can be described (some are seen in this very thread!).

Educating or not educating your girl has nothing to do with it. Your own teachings has a lot to do with it. It's time to let go of old diktats of Tamil Brahminism and adopt a more secular, open-minded approach to everything in life.

Why you mention at least in marriages?

What are the other spheres.. you wish changes ?

There are many ways in which they can change. I do not see the long-term survival of the community if they don't.

Even if a girl child has the potential, they would not like her to get a high level of education ,their logic being it is difficult

to find grooms better educated than them.

And who gives the logic that a girl HAS to marry a better educated man?

What makes you think a B.Tech from one institute is actually better than a BSc from another?

Why this shallow thinking? Where did it come from? Clearly, we claim to be Brahmins but have forgotten that education is not what is written on the paper but what goes inside our head....

 

[renuka]

I would still advocate marrying before the age of 30 for females.

A bride needs to look young and fresh..one starts to look kind of mature after 30 not to mention fertility problems for both older females and males these days.People need to use their brains to plan their life.

BTW what is so hard for girls to get married before the age of 30? Why the heck do they want to wait so long for?

I do not believe in all this so called building a career and delay marriage.

When I finished my studies and started internship..then my parents were already looking at the proposals that came for me.
It takes a few years to find a suitable groom..so no harm starting looking for matches early cos it might take a few years before the right one comes.

So what is so hard to work and get married?
Some of my classmates got married even during final year of studies and some got married right away after finishing studies and started internship too.

Everyone of them are successful today..so this whole delay tactics to build career is just cock and bull in my opinion.

Even these present day many female doctors get married right away after internship..some of my relatives too got married right away.

BTW by delaying marriage..and girls still in their late 30's what do they do for sex?

Dont they want to gun it? Why wait so long? Get married!

 

[Vaagmi]

XLR8R your post # 41. Well said.

 

[mkrishna100]

Some of my classmates got married even during final year of studies and some got married right away after finishing studies and started internship too.

True that still happens and one of my relatives got married within a year of completing her MBBS . Mostly non TB Girls get married quickly and the problem is mainly with current TB Girls .In the case of my relative who got married quickly both the Girl and her parents were ready for Marriage and the Girl was ready to relocate where her husband was and so this solved the problem and she felt being an MBBS she can practice Medicine whereever she wants with not much complications .No idea how things will work out later as in another case a Freshly passed out BE Girl from my family got immediately married and also has a kid now and she is regretting why she got married and blaming her parents for the same and her younger sister ( who has also completed her BE ) is now resiting marriage after seeing her sisters protests and frustrations .In the end no magic formula . Each person has to evaluate their personal life with professional life and make choices accordingly .

 

[sangom]

Sangomji

One cannot say let women become uneducated idiots so that they can marry male half educated idiots who are available in plenty..

If what we are crying about is "male half educated idiots", then it is better that we wind up this discussion itself. Idiocy does not depend on the level of (academic) education, nor is there a "fully educated" condition; education is without end!

 

[krish44]

XLR8R#41

Suddenly somebody wakes up to blast all around .

what I could surmise was XLBR thinks -no harm in late marriages.Age or Age difference between sexes do not matter. Nor superior education or job of boy visavis

girl,no need

for boy to be the only provider,girl can also chip in. If after marriage at older age -no children, then adopt one .

Do away with arranged marriages if things are to improve for the better. Love marriages,gender equality,secular,open minded[what do secular ,open minded mean -a

christian/muslim in my relative circle?] ought to be the basisl of all marrying -any other belief is brahmin mindset not desirable.wah

Parents are responsible if any boy or girl thinks differently than as detailed above .

XLBR can put out a 10 point program like a political party to be adhered to by all brahmins.

Brahmins will all get reformed and make their children go on a spouse hunt after they are thirty and some may even get a match thru this process. Why not?

I am here .I like such ideas as it relieves many parents the tasks of finding a suitable match for their children. Only how many will have enterprise and drive to find a

match for themselves after they are 30 years.

I feel good that someone has woken up suddenly to hit out and challenge the system. Good luck to you.....

 

[Raji Ram]

......... And pray tell what does the boy or girl get by marrying a "fresh engg. graduate" girl to a well educated high income job? The girl loses her chance at excellence and freedom and the boy, loses his ambition.

Q directed at me.

I have seen a few boys getting married to fresh graduates, take them to the U S of A along with them, help them to get master's

degree and live happily! Who said married girls can't study? In fact, the condition laid by these fresh graduates is that the boy

should help them get the master's degree in U S of A. :thumb:

If the girl is in India, she can search for a job where the boy is placed. Many well placed Ambis lose good profiles just because

THEY are unable to relocate to the place where the girl is working! :sad:

 

[XLR8R]

It takes a few years to find a suitable groom..so no harm starting looking for matches early cos it might take a few years before the right one comes.

So what is so hard to work and get married?
Some of my classmates got married even during final year of studies and some got married right away after finishing studies and started internship too.

As I have stated already, early and late marriage have specific advantages and tradeoffs. It is wrong for us to push either over the other as being better. This is what I actually wanted to say. But since this is a modern era of digital technologies, internet, and fast (mis) information, it is easy for younger minds to get influenced. This calls for smart thinking and a good deal of maturity as a parent to raise children properly. Unfortunately, younger age marriage goes against this requirement. Obviously, this point is just ONE facet of the debate.

Only how many will have enterprise and drive to find a

match for themselves after they are 30 years.

Obviously, both the drive and the passion will arrive once people stop pushing everyone to get married at 23/24 . That way, both the supply and the demand are maintained and not influenced by external factors.

Everyone of them are successful today..so this whole delay tactics to build career is just cock and bull in my opinion.

Since I spent years living with devout and spiritual Jains, let me give you one idiom: It is one thing to be successful on your own efforts, another to be successful based on someone else's support. Only you can save yourself. Getting married is not and never will be the solution. Where I am, I see married women who 1) live with spouse and are studying - the question for everyone is WHY, and the questions for her are how do I manage the house AND my studies? 2) live away from spouse and are studying/working - they are depressed as ever because the separation is too much to handle often.

I can tell with a certain degree of resoluteness that each one wishes that they had married later than they did (and I am at a top university). Marriage changes things, because marriage is not about two people - it's about two families. Familial responsibilities WILL increase after marriage in 90% cases and this WILL cause career to slow down.

BTW by delaying marriage..and girls still in their late 30's what do they do for sex?

There is something called self-control. Someone religious enough and well-versed in spirituality knows how to practise it. It often appears sex is a central part of our existence, when the reality is that it is but a drop in the ocean.....

I have seen a few boys getting married to fresh graduates, take them to the U S of A along with them, help them to get master's

degree and live happily! Who said married girls can't study? In fact, the condition laid by these fresh graduates is that the boy

should help them get the master's degree in U S of A.

Yes, this is the well-known "free ticket" formula. My reverse question to you is: Why can girls not do the same? I have seen it happen, but not in a single Tamil (let alone Brahmins).

As for relocating, I believe both the boy and the girl should be equally willing to relocate. There should be NO compromises on this end, and no double standards either.

 

[XLR8R]

XLR8R your post # 41. Well said.

Thank you sir.

 

[tbs]

I would still advocate marrying before the age of 30 for females.

A bride needs to look young and fresh..one starts to look kind of mature after 30 not to mention fertility problems for both older females and males these days.People need to use their brains to plan their life.

BTW what is so hard for girls to get married before the age of 30? Why the heck do they want to wait so long for?

I do not believe in all this so called building a career and delay marriage.

When I finished my studies and started internship..then my parents were already looking at the proposals that came for me.
It takes a few years to find a suitable groom..so no harm starting looking for matches early cos it might take a few years before the right one comes.

So what is so hard to work and get married?
Some of my classmates got married even during final year of studies and some got married right away after finishing studies and started internship too.

Everyone of them are successful today..so this whole delay tactics to build career is just cock and bull in my opinion.

Even these present day many female doctors get married right away after internship..some of my relatives too got married right away.

BTW by delaying marriage..and girls still in their late 30's what do they do for sex?

Dont they want to gun it? Why wait so long? Get married!

hi doctor mam,

you know better than anybody....you stayed and studied.....just lesbians are more in the hostels...lol