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What is religion?

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prasad1

Well-known member
This post is only for people who think they belong to a group called Hinduism or sanatan Dharma. If you do not believe in this classification then please skip this thread.

Religion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values.
Max Müller characterized many other cultures around the world, including Egypt, Persia, and India, as having a similar power structure at this point in history.What is called ancient religion today, they would have only called "law". The Sanskrit word Dharma sometimes translated as "religion", also means law.

Is Sanatan Dharma a religion or way of life? Is personal philosophy and spirituality, outside of Dharma?
 

sangom

Well-known member
This post is only for people who think they belong to a group called Hinduism or sanatan Dharma. If you do not believe in this classification then please skip this thread.

Religion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values.
Max Müller characterized many other cultures around the world, including Egypt, Persia, and India, as having a similar power structure at this point in history.What is called ancient religion today, they would have only called "law". The Sanskrit word Dharma sometimes translated as "religion", also means law.

Is Sanatan Dharma a religion or way of life? Is personal philosophy and spirituality, outside of Dharma?

We do not find the word "sanaatana dharma" so often in scriptures as the usage "dharmah sanaatanah". In most such usages, imho, this word stood for "ancient custom", "practice right from the ancient ages" and similar ideas. The use of the word "sanaatana dharma" is comparatively recent and you will find some discussion about it in this thread.

I will request you to read this post http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/genera...natana-dharma-when-did-start-2.html#post92432 by Shri SAIDEVO to understand the implication of what Sanatana Dharma was in the ancient times, which is now fancied as the "golden age".
 

nannilam_balasubramanian

Well-known member
Religion

In a broad overview, Religion is nothing but a system of faith in own's mind.
Hindu Religion has its own sanctity like other religions. Sri Ramakrishna has
mentioned in one of his sermons that tie the "Advaida Gnanam" in the
edge of your dhothi/dress and do your duty and follow your karma without
looking for a profit or loss. Apart from that he further mentions that one should
remember the truth that they are away from him.

Lord Krishna in Bhagavad Gita says:

Yathaha Pravruththir Boodanam
Yena sarvamitham thatham
Svakarmana Thamabyarchya
Siddhim Vinthathi Manavaha

Entha Paramporulil irunthu sakala ouirkalum oondanatho
Entha Paramaathavinal intha ulagam Muzhuvathum Nirainthullatho
Antha Paramathmavai, thanathu eyalbana kadamaigalal vazhipattu
parama siddiyai manithan adaikiran

Prapathathinal varum ellavatrraiyum Eswara Prasadamaga erru
uyar lakshiyamana 'Ellam Kadavule' enbathai unara muyala vendum.

This is what our Religion tells us.

Krishnarpanam

Balasubramanian
 

guruvayurappan

Well-known member
dear balu sir !
it will be better you give the meaning in tamil font.i have to take a lot of effort to read reoeatedly to find the tamil varthai. artham anartham akividakoodathu allava?
thanks,
narayanan
 

sangom

Well-known member
dear balu sir !
it will be better you give the meaning in tamil font.i have to take a lot of effort to read reoeatedly to find the tamil varthai. artham anartham akividakoodathu allava?
thanks,
narayanan

Shri narayanan,

Shri Balu has quoted the sloka 18-46 from Bhagavadgeetha:

யதஃ ப்ரவ்ருத்திர் பூதாநாம் யேந ஸர்வம் இதம் ததம் |
ஸ்வகர்மணா தம் அப்யர்ச்ய ஸித்திம் விந்ததி மாநவஃ || 18-46

But the unsaid part is about what is "தனது இயல்பான கடமைகள்" in the seemingly innocuous commentary portion, viz., தனது இயல்பான கடமைகளை வழிபட்டு பரம சித்தியை மனிதன் அடைகிறான்.
Balu sir, being a staunch orthodox brahmin, perhaps, tries to say that the four-castes system is the way to பரம சித்தி! He does not give the previous five slokas, 18-41 to 45. Even though tedious, I am giving the slokas and their English meaning (not commentary).

ब्राह्मण क्षत्रिय विशां शूद्राणां च परंतप ।
कर्माणि प्रविभक्तानि स्वभावप्रभवैर्गुणैः ॥ १८-४१
brāhmaṇa kṣatriya viśāṃ śūdrāṇāṃ ca paraṃtapa |
karmāṇi pravibhaktāni svabhāvaprabhavairguṇaiḥ || 18-41
ப்ராஹ்மண க்ஷத்ரிய விசாம் சூத்ராணாம் ச பரம்தப |
கர்மாணி ப்ரவிபக்தாநி ஸ்வபாவப்ரபவைர்குணைஃ || ௧௮-௪௧

O paramtapa! the respective duties of brahmins, kshatriyas, vaisyas and sudras have been fixed with reference to the qualities of their inherent natures, or prakruti.

शमोदमस्तपः शौचं क्षान्तिरार्जवमेवच ।
ज्ञानं विज्ञानमास्तिक्यं ब्रह्मकर्म स्वभावजम् ॥ १८-४२

śamodamastapaḥ śaucaṃ kṣāntirārjavamevaca |
jñānaṃ vijñānamāstikyaṃ brahmakarma svabhāvajam || 18-42

சமோதமஸ்தபஃ சௌசம் க்ஷாந்திரார்ஜவமேவச |
ஞாநம் விஜ்ஞாநமாஸ்திக்யம் ப்ரஹ்மகர்ம ஸ்வபாவஜம் || ௧௮-௪௨

The duties, according to the inherent nature of a brahmin are peace, self-restraint, observing religious auterities, cleanliness, tranquility, humility, spiritual knowledge, empirical knowledge and belief in existence of a future world.

शौर्यं तेजॊ धृतिर्दाक्ष्यं युद्धेचाप्यपलायनम् ।
दानमीश्वरभावश्च क्षात्रकर्म स्वभावजम् ॥१८-४३

śauryaṃ tejo dhṛtirdākṣyaṃ yuddhecāpyapalāyanam |
dānamīśvarabhāvaśca kṣātrakarma svabhāvajam ||18-43

சௌர்யம் தேஜொ த்ருதிர்தாக்ஷ்யம் யுத்தேசாப்யபலாயநம் |
தாநமீச்வரபாவஸ்ச க்ஷாத்ரகர்ம ஸ்வபாவஜம் ||௧௮-௪௩

The duties of kshatriyas according to their inherent nature are bravery, brilliance, courage, intentness, not running away even from battle, generosity, and exercising authority.

कृषि गोरक्ष वाणिज्यं वैश्यकर्मस्वभावजम् ।
परिचर्यात्मकं कर्म शूद्रस्यापि स्वभावजम् ॥ १८-४४

kṛṣi gorakṣa vāṇijyaṃ vaiśyakarmasvabhāvajam |
paricaryātmakaṃ karma śūdrasyāpi svabhāvajam || 18-44

க்ருஷி கோரக்ஷ வாணிஜ்யம் வைச்யகர்மஸ்வபாவஜம் |
பரிசர்யாத்மகம் கர்ம சூத்ரஸ்யாபி ஸ்வபாவஜம் || ௧௮-௪௪

Agriculture, tending cattle, and trading are the duties according to the inherent nature of a vaisya whereas service is the duty as per the inherent nature of sudra.

स्वे स्वे कर्मण्यभिरतः सं सिद्धिं लभते नरः ।
स्वकर्म निरतः सिद्धिं यथा विन्दति तच्छृणु ॥ १८-४५

sve sve karmaṇyabhirataḥ saṃ siddhiṃ labhate naraḥ |
svakarma nirataḥ siddhiṃ yathā vindati tacchṛṇu || 18-45

ஸ்வே ஸ்வே கர்மண்யபிரதஃ ஸம் ஸித்திம் லபதே நரஃ |
ஸ்வகர்ம நிரதஃ ஸித்திம் யதா விந்ததி தச்ச்ருணு || ௧௮-௪௫

One who gets engrossed in the performance of his duty befallen him according to one's inherent natural qualities as above, acquires by that alone, the ultimate perfecion. Hear how a man acquires perfection by adhering to duties as per his inherent qualities (described above).

The above were the latest seal of scriptural approval for the pernicious caste system within Hinduism. I don't think Balu sir understood the context of the particular sloka which appealed to him as the sum and substance of "religion in a broad view". If he did so after knowing, I can only say, sad !
 
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nachi naga

Guest
in india at least what it is called now and the ancient geography of maha bharat are entirely different.imho recent saints sages have told us,in the beginning only sanathana dharma existed.owing to clannish mentality,small or big groups formed with language,food,culture,seasons etc.universally english is popular and people strive to learn it.similiarly our religion is fundamentally broadbased structural dos and donts for peace harmony amity prosperity.unity in diversity.the diverse braod based groups get classified as in lord krishnas exposition.lord krishna never ever identified himself as a vaishnava or shaivaite instead showed the glorious path.imho.

hindu or hinduism is of recent coinage,maybe 1200 years give or take.so we are organised now with jagath gurus,acharyas,bhagavan.the ultimate in our religion is becoming one with the creator sustainer destroyer.the goddess fulfll our desires.

the freedom thats given to our hindu religion is mind boggling and its now a wonderfully adhered in many parts of the world with tweakings neccessary to adapt and adopt to local situations.i am a proud hindu and a humble servant of all hindus.india is the womb of all religions existing in the world today. :) sollungo nam matham onru,andru indru.
 
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prasad1

prasad1

Well-known member
Nachi naga#8 wonderful post. Enjoyed reading it. Thanks sir.
"The Sanskrit word Dharma sometimes translated as "religion", also means law."
Is a part of religion a precursor to a state constitution. I agree religion has other parts, like practice, spirituality, after death, etc. Some of those other parts are purely cultural. Is the moral value derived from religion.
 
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nannilam_balasubramanian

Well-known member
What is religion

dear balu sir !
it will be better you give the meaning in tamil font.i have to take a lot of effort to read reoeatedly to find the tamil varthai. artham anartham akividakoodathu allava?
thanks,
narayanan

Thank you for your message. I do not know how to type in tamil besides I do not have
a tamil font. I asked my friend to help me in dowloading. In fact, the other day,
Visalakshi Madam suggested me about using italic fonts with coloured letters. I am
yet to do that because I am not proficient in computer operation. I purchased a system
only recently with an idea of doing some work at home but I have not succeeded in that
attempt. Hence to engage my time, while I was tracing, I came across Tamil Brahmins site
To keep myself enagaged, with the little knowledge gained over the years, I thought why
not share some useful information with others.

Balasubramanian
Ambattur
 

guruvayurappan

Well-known member
dear sir !
i very much thank you for giving sri Balasubramanian post tamil font. and giving slokas about varnam. based on this (i was not knowing the slogas ,but aware of duties ),when some body is scolding about some sect i used to say no one 100 % brahmin or sutra or shatriya or vaisya. all varna people are following the same dharma i.e earning money without any norms.all should practice humanity to betterment of our society or state or country or the world.
 

sangom

Well-known member
Thank you for your message. I do not know how to type in tamil besides I do not have
a tamil font. I asked my friend to help me in dowloading. In fact, the other day,
Visalakshi Madam suggested me about using italic fonts with coloured letters. I am
yet to do that because I am not proficient in computer operation. I purchased a system
only recently with an idea of doing some work at home but I have not succeeded in that
attempt. Hence to engage my time, while I was tracing, I came across Tamil Brahmins site
To keep myself enagaged, with the little knowledge gained over the years, I thought why
not share some useful information with others.

Balasubramanian
Ambattur

Shri Balasubramanian,

If you ask your computer mechanic (provided he is amenable, and I say this because you are not proficient in computer operation) there is a freeware software called Barahapad, developed by one brainy Indian youth. You have to google for it, download the software and the font/s and instal all of them. If you have the full set, you can type 12 Indian languages plus English. All very easy. Pl. try. That person deserves our full praise.
 

nannilam_balasubramanian

Well-known member
As regards Hindu Religion, mythology and other established documents pronounce here and there to say that history
goes back to 4000 years or so, but however the documents that could be traced by archeological departments and
others who are associated in research activities mention it as upto 1500 years or so according to some of the
available historical documents. Hindu religion is unique.

Unlike other religions in the world, the Hindu Religion as such does not claim of any single prophet. It has various Mutts and Peedams, etc because of various sub sects within it. It also does not contribute or subscribe to any one dogma, i.e. belief
or set of beliefs put forward by one authority to be accepted as a matter of faith, without giving room to ideas that are not expected to be questioned, secondly it does not believe in any one philosophic concept, as sub sects have different types of formalities, procedures, thirdly it does not follow any one set of religious rites or performances. It does not worship any one God. It does not invite people to embrace in its fold through public audience forum or lectures, it has its own sanctity established thousands of years ago and finally it may be described as a way of live and nothing more. It does not encroach upon other religious rites or appear to envelop the traditional features of other religions.

Balasubramanian
Ambattur
 

sangom

Well-known member
i have downloaded ,but could not use installed ime since i am not having the Microsoft office CD. could you guide me?

Can you be a bit clearer sir? What all have you downloaded and what OS are you using, Win XP or Windows7? What difficulty are you facing?
 

guruvayurappan

Well-known member
i have downloaded google IMe tamil and when i started to follow the instruction to make desk top language toolbar .the message is coming as follows
insert your office 2003 cd or progrmme from your computer.
i am not having CD .it was installed by my computer service man and not having genuine software
 

Iyyarooraan

Well-known member
If you ask a modern guy, he would say that repeating the same duties by son as like his father without changing anything around polluting the air with incense sticks, oil lamps and camphor lights simultaneously making noise (bell sounds) pollution, too.
 
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prasad1

prasad1

Well-known member
If you ask a modern guy, he would say that repeating the same duties by son as like his father without changing anything around polluting the air with incense sticks, oil lamps and camphor lights simultaneously making noise (bell sounds) pollution, too.

Are you saying that "modern guy" does not understand religion? The original thread was started with the idea of finding your opinion of religion. What do you think?
 

Iyyarooraan

Well-known member
Those who know may make just single digit per cent of the lot. Did you ever watch one Madhavan's (actor) ad piece. To refresh. A girl distributes a small bill to passersby and almost all of them threw that bill out before her eyes. When Maddy appears on the scene, he gives a clue as to how to make it readable and crushes the bill and then gives to a passerby. The passerby curiously spreads open the bill and reads it.
 
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nannilam_balasubramanian

Well-known member
I have referred to this point in various books and I am still doing so.
Some say, it is very difficult to conclude to a particular arena and define
Religion as such. Some say that one can not just take the principle of beliefs
and faith in God only or ritual activities based on certain objects/aims that
are being guided through our ancient Vedas or between the culture that is
being practiced.

Balasubramanian
Ambattur
 
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