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The writer sujatha and thirumathi sujatha

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kunjuppu

Well-known member
i came to canada when sujatha was in his prime. it is only the past 3 years that i managed to read many many of his novels - thanks to the web and toronto public library.

it is amazing, that this man, has fans that cut across castes creeds age groups genders and professions. he is admired by so many that i think at this moment in time, he is #1 name recognized tamil writer.

personally, i did not find a depth or fluidity in his writings, but he brought a new genre to tamil - science fiction. the women were liberated. the settings mostly urban, but his srirangam stories brought out the smell and feel of that place.

if manushyaputhiran is what he is now, he will acknowledge that everything is due to sujatha. there is a kindness in sujatha, though as he grew older, i have read, he became more morose and depressed, and felt that as a tambram, aware that he is part of a marginalized and shrinking group, and very upset with that.

but what is surprising is this posting from jeyamohan today re mrs. sujata, in an off the record interview, frankly discussing her husband. wow!!!! this from an indian woman - 70 year old tambram. what liberation! who else can know a husband better than the wife - sharing just about everything with him. many public figures, have a rather dark private self.

here are some samples of thirumathi sujatha on her husband, spoken 'off the record'

அவரை விட்டு பிரியணும்னுதான் நினைச்சேன்… அம்மா மடில படுத்து பல நேரம் அழுதிருக்கேன்… அவரோட வாழ பிடிக்கலைனு கதறியிருக்கேன்… ஆனா, குழந்தைகளோட ஒரு பொண்ணு தனியா வாழறது நல்லதுக்கில்லைனு அம்மா தடுத்துட்டாங்க… அவங்களை சொல்லி குற்றமில்லை. அந்தக் காலம் அப்படி. இந்தக் காலம் மாதிரி சமூக சூழல் இருந்திருந்தா நிச்சயம் அவரை விட்டு பிரிஞ்சிருப்பேன்…’’
———–
‘’அவரோட எழுத்துக்களை நான் படிச்சா திட்டுவாரு… சொல்லப் போனா புத்தகங்களை பெண்கள் படிக்கறதே அவருக்கு பிடிக்காது… சமையலறை, குடும்பத்தைத் தாண்டி பெண்கள் வெளிய வரக் கூடாதுங்கிறது அவர் கொள்கை…
———-
‘’அக்கிரகாரத்துல தன் பாட்டி வீட்லதான் அவர் வளர்ந்தாரு. அதனால அக்கிரகாரத்தை தாண்டி அவர் சிந்தனை வளரவேயில்லை. கடைசி காலம் வரைக்கும் அவருக்குள்ள இருந்தது அந்த அக்கிரகார சிறுவன்தான்…’’

it is not going change my views of sujatha or his writings. but interesting to know, how human the great writer was.

and a portion of jeyamohan's reply to a fan about this subject..

சுஜாதா பற்றி நீங்கள் என்ன நினைக்கிறீர்கள்? அவரது பிம்பம் ஒன்று உங்கள் மனதில் உருவாகி வந்துள்ளது. அதை கொஞ்சம் அவர் உருவாக்கினார். கொஞ்சம் ஊடகங்கள் உருவாக்கின. கொஞ்சம் நீங்களே உருவாக்கி கொண்டீர்கள் அது உடையாமல் இருக்கவேண்டுமென விரும்புகிறீர்கள். அப்படி உடையாமல் அதை பர்த்துக்கொள்ளவேண்டியது உலகத்தின் கடமை என நினைக்கிறீர்கள் , இல்லையா? நடக்கிற காரியமா அது?

ஓர் இலக்கிய வாசகனாக நீங்கள் உண்மையின்பக்கம் நிலைத்திருக்கவேண்டும் இல்லையா? உண்மையை வழிபட வேண்டும். உண்மையை தேடவேண்டும் இல்லையா? பிறிதொருவர் பற்றிய உண்மையை இந்த அளவுக்கு அஞ்சும் நீங்கள் எப்படி உங்களைப்பற்றிய உண்மையை தேடிசெல்ல முடியும்? எப்படி அதை எதிர்கொள்ள முடியும்? அப்படி முடியாவிட்டால் நீங்கள் வாசிக்கும் இலக்கியத்திற்கு என்னதான் அர்த்தம்?


நானறிந்தவரை சுஜாதா மிக ஆசாரமானவ்ர். தென்கலை அய்யங்காராக மட்டுமே தன்னை உணர்ந்தவர். அது ஓர் உண்மை. அதை எதிர்கொள்ள ஏன் அஞ்சவேண்டும்? இப்போது அவரது மனைவில் அவரைப்பற்றிச் சொல்லும் எல்லாமே உண்மையாக இருக்கும் என்றே நான் நினைக்கிறேன். ஏனென்றால் என் அப்பா அப்படித்தான் இருந்தார். சுஜாதா அவரது தலைமுறை. அவரது தலைமுறையில் அப்படி இல்லாதவர்கள் மிகமிக அபூர்வம். அதற்காக நான் என் அப்பாவை வெறுத்துவிட்டேனா என்ன? அவரை ஆராதிப்பதை விட்டுவிட்டேனா என்ன? அப்படி வெறுக்க ஆரம்பித்தால் சென்ற தலைமுறையில் எத்தனை பேர் நமக்குத் தேறுவார்கள்?

தலைமுறைகள் தோறும் மதிப்பீடுகள் மாறுகின்றன. நம்முடைய அடுத்த தலைமுறைக்கு நாம் பிற்பட்ட மதிப்பீடு கொண்டவர்களாகத்தான் தெரிவோம். மனிதர்களை அவர்கள் வாழ்ந்த காலச்சூழலை வைத்துப் புரிந்துகொண்டால் இத்தகைய மனக்குழப்பங்களில் இருந்து தப்ப முடியும். எனக்கு சுஜாதா ஒரு பழைமைவாதி என நன்றாகவே தெரியும். அது எனக்கு அவர் மீதிருந்த மதிப்பை சற்றும் குறைக்கவில்லை. எனக்கு அவர் இலக்கியவாதி அல்ல, ஆனால் ஒரு வகையில் அவர் என் ஹீரோதான்.


truth. how often we shun the truth, in the name of culture, religion, decency or convenience? is truth really worth while pursuing destroying icons? or can true icons withstand unpleasant truths?

jeyamohan

losangelesram
 
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kkumar29

Guest
Mr. Kunjuppu,

I have been a great admirer of Sujatha's writing from the time he started writing when he was posted in Delhi. I remember the fights my sister and I used to have to grab the issue of ananda vikatan when his serialized story "ரோஷன் எங்கே" was being published.

Regarding the comments by his wife about to be publised, I think the publisher of "தினகரன்" is tying to sensationalize the interview. It could also be because he was an Iyengar, they might be wanting to cut him down to size (posthumously I might add), since most of the Dravida sympathizers in Tamil Nadu believe that brahmins are not tamilians. Every wife, at some time or the other in her marriage, has complained about her husband. Sometimes these complaints have been quite drastic and if quoted out of context may paint the picture of the husband as being an ogre. Taking into consideration where Sujatha grew up, he would have retained some of the thinking of those times. I still think he was the one writer who revived the interest in people of all walks of life to read tamil books. As you have pointed out he not only introduced science fiction to tamil readers but he also wrote articles/essays explaining "brahma Sutra".

What ever his personal views were regarding women, to me he was and still is one of the great writers of tamil literature.

K. Kumar
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member
dear kumar,

thank you for your response. i agree with Jmo, that the private life of an author is and could be different from his public posture.

Sujatha, the author, par excellence, we admire and follow. Whatever Sujatha, the person may be, could be of interest to some, not many. This does not in any way reduces the importance of his contribution or the influence of his works. As Jmo concludes, his private life is his (Sujatha's) business - and the only time, Jmo would be interested in it from an integrity viewpoint, is if there is any rumour that Sujatha did not author his books himself. No one has ever suggested that.

Now, I find, that we tend to deify our heros. whether it be authors, politicians, cricketers, actors, scientists or adminstrators. what is in it in our culture, that instead of judging them solely on their area of excellence, we expect them to be morally straight forward and pay the taxes honestly (!).

In Sujatha's case that he was a practising srivaishnavite iyengar with the beliefs and prejudices of his time. there is nothing wrong with that. that he wrote science fiction or about liberated women, has nothing to do with his private life. those are stories and well written. why should Sujatha live the life of his stories.

Charlie Chaplin married 7 times, James Joyce was gay, Eleanor Rooseveldt was gay while her husband Franklin Delano had dalliance with his niece and later his secretary...history is full of such stories. But all that does not deny the greatness of men, in their chosen profession and their contribution to society.

That Dinakaran can publish and be damned about mrs Sujatha's lament, is a matter of interest to a publication. I would, if I were Dinakaran, publish the same. But as Sujatha's admirer, it would not make an iota of difference, in my admiration of his writings or my regard or affection for him.

Perhaps, Kumar, you can explain to me, the distress of his admirers, and the increasing accusation of பிராமண துவேஷம் whispered. in fact you yourself have felt that way. would mrs Kumar feel the same? (knowing that she is not a tambram). hope you dont mind.

thank you.
 
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kkumar29

Guest
Dear Mr. Kunjuppu,

I pretty much feel the same way. His personal life is none of my business and his writing should be judged on its merits. To me he was an extremely good modern writer appealing to a wide variety of folks.

My wife does not know Tamil. However one thing I would say with certainty is that she would agree with both of us that a writer should be judged by his writing and not by his personal life/believes.

I just would like to add a few points about the comments on பிராமண துவேஷம். In my lifetime, I have seen, after the emergence of the Dravida parties to the forefront there has been a concerted effort to diminish the contribution of brahmins to the tamil literature. They don't give enough credit to U.V. Swaminatha Iyer (தமிழ்த் தாத்தா). They don't recognize சுப்ரமணிய பாரதி as much as they recognize பாரதி தாசன். They don't give due credit to கி வா ஜகந்நாதன் as much as they sing praises to M. Karunanidhi. They in fact went as far as to change the scripts. (writing லை instead of a கொக்கி joined before ல). The reason given was that the old style was propagated by the brahmin community and discounting letters like ஸ்ரீ, ஷ etc. because they represent brahmin tamil.

I personally feel that this might be yet another attempt. They can't diminish his popularity but this might be another way to belittle his writings indirectly. I know you are an admirer of JMO and I have occasionally gone to browse his website. I definitely detected an antibrahmin flavor there, which is his right. However in general I feel that there is definitely an anti brahmin bias in the so called tamil literati of modern times.

I am not a tamil brahmin fanatic but at the same time I like to call a spade a spade.

Cheers,
K. Kumar
 

Govinda

New member
Dear Mr. Kunjuppu,

I pretty much feel the same way. His personal life is none of my business and his writing should be judged on its merits. To me he was an extremely good modern writer appealing to a wide variety of folks.

K. Kumar

I agree the knowledge or works of such people have benefitted the masses in the external world. But, noone can escape one's own shortfalls, based on karma, birth and situations.
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member
Dear Mr. Kunjuppu,

I pretty much feel the same way. His personal life is none of my business and his writing should be judged on its merits. To me he was an extremely good modern writer appealing to a wide variety of folks.

My wife does not know Tamil. However one thing I would say with certainty is that she would agree with both of us that a writer should be judged by his writing and not by his personal life/believes.

I just would like to add a few points about the comments on பிராமண துவேஷம். In my lifetime, I have seen, after the emergence of the Dravida parties to the forefront there has been a concerted effort to diminish the contribution of brahmins to the tamil literature. They don't give enough credit to U.V. Swaminatha Iyer (தமிழ்த் தாத்தா). They don't recognize சுப்ரமணிய பாரதி as much as they recognize பாரதி தாசன். They don't give due credit to கி வா ஜகந்நாதன் as much as they sing praises to M. Karunanidhi. They in fact went as far as to change the scripts. (writing லை instead of a கொக்கி joined before ல). The reason given was that the old style was propagated by the brahmin community and discounting letters like ஸ்ரீ, ஷ etc. because they represent brahmin tamil.

I personally feel that this might be yet another attempt. They can't diminish his popularity but this might be another way to belittle his writings indirectly. I know you are an admirer of JMO and I have occasionally gone to browse his website. I definitely detected an antibrahmin flavor there, which is his right. However in general I feel that there is definitely an anti brahmin bias in the so called tamil literati of modern times.

I am not a tamil brahmin fanatic but at the same time I like to call a spade a spade.

Cheers,
K. Kumar

thank you kumar for your kind reply. pray let me give my perspectives on that.

re Jmo and antibrahminism - my personal opinion is Jmo is post antibrahmin. he is often accused of an apologist for hindutva, which too, he denies, and i agree. i consider him, among the most intelligent of today's tamil intellectuals, with most of his criticis, do not even understanding his writings. they are not easy to read, and i myself usually abandon many of his web posts just due to difficulty of comprehension. so, the ever vindictive and vitriolic tamil web world and dravidian writers, have reserved the fondest and frothiest epithets for Jmo, only next to Charu Nivedita (!).

in angadi theru, the film for which Jmo wrote the script, there is a scene where an obvious middle class brahmin lady dismisses the service of an orphan girl, on her reaching maturity. a (NB) reader accused him of bias against brahmins, which he denied, with this explanation: the tambrams actually treat their own worse than what they did to this servant girl. Jmo was recollecting our own past, two generations ago, when during the monthly periods, the women used to be consigned to a dark room or back of the house, fed on leftovers and considered unclean enough, not even to be within the sight of the men. concepts and memories of our community, among the NB and such (Jmo being a nair, I consider him 'such') are age old and have not yet caught up with our own current attitudes and norms. this is the reality. repeat Jmo calls a spade a spade, and no one has escaped his critical examination - which often is balanced with a fair amount of positive stuff too. no one is 100% condemned or deified - something akin to my own way of looking at things ie the eternal grey :)

re dinakaran, unleashing another round of பிராமண துவேஷம், with the publishing of thirumathi sujatha's outpourings, i would only have to look around at the various publications including vikatan (i subscribe online and there is enough editions to keep me almost fully occupied) whose own articles, some of them border on libel - and this too against the likes of MK or JJ or SoniaG. compared to that mrs sujatha is small fry, and that too, a 'has been'.

personally, i do not consider mrs sujatha's outpouring all that sensational. any married woman of 40+ years, including mrs K, would, given an opportunity, expressed views similar to what mrs S said. it is the way it is, and an honest opinion of her husband, only gives another dimension to his character. which is an interesting topic by itself. definitely not defamatory, except by the over sensitive zealots, who deify sujatha the writer. and there appears to be a good crowd of this - again cutting across age, caste, religion and geography. but that group definitely does not include me :)

one final note - my request re mrs Kumar, was under the mistaken impression, that she was a tamil christian. i dont think, anyone, but a tamil, can understand the intricacies of our caste politics, and hence any opinion of your spouse, if she be a non tamil indian christian would be superficial at the most. and if she is white, then non issue, for in my view, most whites i know, have travelled beyond and live in what i consider a 'post christian attitude and environment'. this only to explain the reason of my query. hope you did not mind.

i thank you and wish you a g'day :)

ps.. when i was young i was a supporter of periyar thamizh, only because the script appeared logical. i dont think we should claim ownership to the erstwhile, but no longer used கொக்கி. i listen to the local tamil fm radio, 12 hours a day, and 18 hours during the weekend and have become used to நட்டம் கட்டம் instead of நஷ்டம் கஷ்டம். when the term பேருந்து replaced பஸ், it sounded odd..but the other day, raji had a post about சீருந்து. took a few seconds to understand that it meant a car. so too with the periyar tamil - once we get used to it, it is ok and made logic. re வடமொழி words, i dont feel any proprietriship over it.

yes i agree re thamizh thaaththa..time will give him due recognition. that i am sure. for without him, there would be no tamil pride today. no?
 
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kkumar29

Guest
My response is in blue.

thank you kumar for your kind reply. pray let me give my perspectives on that.

re Jmo and antibrahminism - my personal opinion is Jmo is post antibrahmin. he is often accused of an apologist for hindutva, which too, he denies, and i agree. i consider him, among the most intelligent of today's tamil intellectuals, with most of his criticis, do not even understanding his writings. they are not easy to read, and i myself usually abandon many of his web posts just due to difficulty of comprehension. so, the ever vindictive and vitriolic tamil web world and dravidian writers, have reserved the fondest and frothiest epithets for Jmo, only next to Charu Nivedita (!).

in angadi theru, the film for which Jmo wrote the script, there is a scene where an obvious middle class brahmin lady dismisses the service of an orphan girl, on her reaching maturity. a (NB) reader accused him of bias against brahmins, which he denied, with this explanation: the tambrams actually treat their own worse than what they did to this servant girl. Jmo was recollecting our own past, two generations ago, when during the monthly periods, the women used to be consigned to a dark room or back of the house, fed on leftovers and considered unclean enough, not even to be within the sight of the men. concepts and memories of our community, among the NB and such (Jmo being a nair, I consider him 'such') are age old and have not yet caught up with our own current attitudes and norms. this is the reality. repeat Jmo calls a spade a spade, and no one has escaped his critical examination - which often is balanced with a fair amount of positive stuff too. no one is 100% condemned or deified - something akin to my own way of looking at things ie the eternal grey :)

I admit that I am not an avid follower of Jmo or his wrtitings. I did have difficulty following what he writes the few times I visited his blog (when you had mentioned it in one of your posts). So I will take your word. I personally don't have any opinion about him. I am not a defender of what was wrong with our community. I only wish our community would correct those mistakes and move forward.

re dinakaran, unleashing another round of பிராமண துவேஷம், with the publishing of thirumathi sujatha's outpourings, i would only have to look around at the various publications including vikatan (i subscribe online and there is enough editions to keep me almost fully occupied) whose own articles, some of them border on libel - and this too against the likes of MK or JJ or SoniaG. compared to that mrs sujatha is small fry, and that too, a 'has been'.

personally, i do not consider mrs sujatha's outpouring all that sensational. any married woman of 40+ years, including mrs K, would, given an opportunity, expressed views similar to what mrs S said. it is the way it is, and an honest opinion of her husband, only gives another dimension to his character. which is an interesting topic by itself. definitely not defamatory, except by the over sensitive zealots, who deify sujatha the writer. and there appears to be a good crowd of this - again cutting across age, caste, religion and geography. but that group definitely does not include me :)

I completely agree with you. Dinakaran editors may be making a mountain out of a mole hill, with some hidden agenda. I only speculated whether it was the antibrahmin bias.

Regarding Mrs Sujatha's comments, I have heard every woman in the previous generation in my family make similar comments, that if they had the freedom and acceptance of the society they would have left their husbands long ago to fend for themselves. So I have no opinion on the comment one way or the other.

one final note - my request re mrs Kumar, was under the mistaken impression, that she was a tamil christian. i dont think, anyone, but a tamil, can understand the intricacies of our caste politics, and hence any opinion of your spouse, if she be a non tamil indian christian would be superficial at the most. and if she is white, then non issue, for in my view, most whites i know, have travelled beyond and live in what i consider a 'post christian attitude and environment'. this only to explain the reason of my query. hope you did not mind.

Mrs Kumar, is a Kerala syrian christian and doesn't know tamil. But even if she was a tamilian christian, I feel she wouldn't be able to undertand the nuances of the brahmin culture unless she was born into a brahmin family :).

i thank you and wish you a g'day :)

ps.. when i was young i was a supporter of periyar thamizh, only because the script appeared logical. i dont think we should claim ownership to the erstwhile, but no longer used கொக்கி. i listen to the local tamil fm radio, 12 hours a day, and 18 hours during the weekend and have become used to நட்டம் கட்டம் instead of நஷ்டம் கஷ்டம். when the term பேருந்து replaced பஸ், it sounded odd..but the other day, raji had a post about சீருந்து. took a few seconds to understand that it meant a car. so too with the periyar tamil - once we get used to it, it is ok and made logic. re வடமொழி words, i dont feel any proprietriship over it.

I did not complain about the ease of use or otherwise. I was told by insiders who were involved in the process that a number of these changes were brought in to isolate the brahmin Tamil ( This is only hearsay from people I respect who were from the inner circle of people like Manian, KVJ etc).

yes i agree re thamizh thaaththa..time will give him due recognition. that i am sure. for without him, there would be no tamil pride today.
no?

I feel really sad that due recognition is not being given to the people who were pioneers in tamil works due to this anti brahmin bias. This same crowd celebrates Kanimozhi as a wonderful poet :-(

It was nice having this chat.

K. Kumar
 

Raji Ram

Gold Member
Gold Member

Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

Many would not have read your OP which you first posted in the literature section. I am glad to see the same

in G D forum. But even here not many responses! Not many Tamil readers here?!!

To publish something which is supposed to be off-record is something to be ashamed of! There is no need to

expose the private life of any famous personality. Sri. 'Sujatha' was a writer par excellence. His fame will not

diminish by such cheap tricks! :)
 

sangom

Well-known member
Dear Kunjuppu,

Sujatha did not impress me. But probably because he was a "computer-man" or computer engineer (is it true? I am not so sure.) many youngsters of the 70's & 80's fell head over heels, and admiring 'sujatha' became a sign of your being a forward person. Somehow I could not do this.

If what his wife now says is true, then that fellow needs to be completely forgotten - at least posthumously, by those who clamour for gender equality, women's lib and all that.n'est pas?
 

Raji Ram

Gold Member
Gold Member
....... If what his wife now says is true, then that fellow needs to be completely forgotten - at least posthumously, by those who clamour for gender equality, women's lib and all that.n'est pas?
Dear Sangom Sir,

That sounds rather rude! Sujatha was a writer who brought a new style of writing and I too feel his influence, especially

when I write 'inna piRa' for 'etc'! Personal life should never hinder with fame of the wroters. You should be aware of many

of the Carnatic musicians who were 'kudi magans'! Did their popularity diminish by such acts? They are praised ONLY for

their greatness in music. That is all. :thumb:

P.S: Sujatha and Pushpa Thangadurai set the new wave writing but the latter used to write vulgar, imho.
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member

Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

Many would not have read your OP which you first posted in the literature section. I am glad to see the same

in G D forum. But even here not many responses! Not many Tamil readers here?!!

To publish something which is supposed to be off-record is something to be ashamed of! There is no need to

expose the private life of any famous personality. Sri. 'Sujatha' was a writer par excellence. His fame will not

diminish by such cheap tricks! :)

dear raji,

i agree with you 100%. sujatha the writer is established. i wonder if you are getting a copy of dinakaran and viewing the interview ?

re tamil patronage, starting with 1950s, urban tamils walked away from tamil to english. i used to study tamil medium (hence the residual interest in tamil) for the first 4 classes, and then moved from triplicane to mandaveli, new neighbourhood where every kid went to convent schools. i dropped two classes to 2nd standard, and went to anglo indian high school english education. mine was a mixed neighbourhood with equal no of NB, and lot of xtians. all went to st bede's high school, and along went i :) losing two years in the bargain.

mrs K went to a convent school and took hindi. her tamil, to put it mild, is atrocious, and she herself will agree. all my cousins took tamil as second language, but opted for the english medium, and even my generation, tamil was fading fast. my nephews and nieces, 'dont even go there'. i dont even know what language they master - the way they kill english tamil and chennaislang which can be classified as a language of its own.

recently, sujatha aRa kattalai, presented prizes for outstanding contributions by young and first time writers/poets, the gifts given away by mrs S. not one tamil brahmin among the youth. so, to put it short, there is no crop of new tambram writers blossoming. the men of fame like asokamithran, is in his 80s, and he was lamenting recently, that there was no one to hand over the baton, as tambrams as a community have faded culturally in tamil literature. so far i know only P.A.Krishnan, as a relatively new writer, and he is 60+!!!

you should read krishnan's கலங்கிய நதி& புலினகர் கொன்றை; both modern tamil classics. i do not know, whether the dravidian politics had any influence on the abandonment of tamil, or was it part of economic uplift with english option as a sure way up. i would tend to think of the second more than the first. just because, in the 50s thru 70s, delhi apparently had so many tamil clubs and sabhas. today there is one sabha - this news from a budding carnatic musician working in delhi and need to come to madras to get katcheri chances. all the chldren of the erstwhile delhi tamils are now in usa australia singapore uk or germany, i guess.

in the tamil webdom, there is serious talk about the erosion of tamil. among NBs. the younger generation, are aping the tambrams, and opting for english education. add to it, these are also switching to western food like kentucky fried chicken and pizza, much to the chagrin of those who make மீன் கொழம்பு & நாட்டுக்கோழி கறி :) the consolation for these chettinadu hoteliers may be seen inthe behaviour of many toronto tambrams - there is an anjappar here, and a good percentage of the clientale are the children of tambrams :)

thank you dear lady.
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member


P.S: Sujatha and Pushpa Thangadurai set the new wave writing but the latter used to write vulgar, imho.

dear raji,

you are talking to an ardent pushpa thangadurai fan here :) vulgarity is in the eyes of viewer. no? would you consider the nudes of goya as vulgar? kamasutra vulgar?

as a teenager, i used to look forward to the கிளு கிளு feeling every week reading kadhir. srivenugopalan aka PT, did the இல்லை மறை காய் pretty good..aka soft core porn ;)

vulgar is a harsh word. i protest. obviously you must have read it to understand the vulgarity? :) which is perfectly ok by me.
 

Raji Ram

Gold Member
Gold Member

Dear Kunjuppu Sir,

May be the male readers love Pushpa Thangadurai. But describing the intimate activities is vulgar according to me.

I read one or two stories and stopped reading P T stories. :)

P.S: I have not read kamasutra or any such stuff. And இல்லை மறை காய் writer is Maniyan according to me!
 

sarang

Well-known member
Is it ethical to publish off the record interview; we can expect sun tv to broadcast

Is it ethical to publish 'off the record' interview; we can expect sun tv to broadcast secret camera video shots. Who can talk about ethics to sun tv and dinakaran and nakkeeran?

Some excerpts from Losangeles Ram, one of the responses in Jayamohan's blog.

அந்த 71 வயது மூதாட்டியைப் பேட்டி என்கிற பெயரில் 'ஆஃப் தி ரெகார்ட்' சொல்லப்பட்ட சில பல பர்சனல் விஷயங்கள் தினகரனின் 'வசந்தம்' இதழில் வரும் ஞாயிறன்று பூதாகாரமாக எழப் போகின்றன என்பது கேட்டு அதிர்ந்து போய் அவர்களை பெங்களூரிலிருந்து தொடர்பு கொண்டேன்.

ஆனால் "என்னதான் நடந்தது?" என்று நான் கேட்கக் கேட்க, குரல் உடைந்து அழவே ஆரம்பித்தார்.

"எந்தப் பத்திரிகை, என்ன பேட்டின்னு கூட சரியா விசாரிக்காம சும்மா பேசிண்டிருந்தேன், கொஞ்சம் உளறவும் செஞ்சேன்" அதையும் சொன்னார். அப்படிப்பட்டவர்

எழுத்தாளர் சுஜாதா பிராமின் என்பதால் இப்படிச் செய்கிறார்களா? அல்லது கேட்பார்தான் யாருமில்லையே என்று அவர் மீதும் அவர் குடும்பத்தார் மீதும் சேற்றை வாரி இறைக்கிறார்களா?

ஆனாலும், ஒருவிதமான மன அமைதியில்லாமல் இப்போது தவிக்கும் மூதாட்டியை இப்படியெல்லாம் பேட்டி என்ற பெயரில் அசிங்கப்படுத்துவது மிகவும் கண்டிக்கத்தக்கது.

சுஜாதா நினைவை பூஜிக்காவிட்டாலும், அசிங்கப்படுத்தாமல் இருக்கும் அளவுக்குக்கூட நமக்கு கலாசாரம், பெருமை, அறிவு இல்லையா?

https://www.facebook.com/losangelesram/posts/10201180569656870
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member
here is a more complete gist of the interview...i do not find anything wrong in it. like any arranged marriage, the woman had to adjust to the husband's house .. it looks like she grew up a princess, and had to settle for a housewife. she is perfectly ok in her views.

i have instances in my own family, where marriage was hell, and the woman got liberated and ended up with a outstanding career and personal satisfaction after the husband's death. she was suppress so much!!

. பொதுவா கலை உலகைச் சேர்ந்தவர்கள் வேற உலகத்துல வாழ்வாங்கன்னு சொல்வாங்க. அதை என் கணவர் விஷயத்துல கண்கூடாப் பார்த்தேன். அவரோட மனநிலை எப்ப, எப்படி மாறும்னு யாருக்கும் தெரியாது. தன்னோட அந்தரங்கத்துக்குள்ள அவர் யாரையும் அனுமதிச்சதில்லை. எப்பவும் எழுதறது, படிக்கறது, ஸ்டோரி டிஸ்கஷன் என்று ஒரு வட்டத்துக்குள்ளையே இருப்பார். மனைவி, குழந்தைங்க பத்தின சிந்தனை அவருக்குக் கிடையாது. சுருக்கமாச் சொல்லணும்னா பசங்க என்ன படிச்சாங்க, எப்படிப் படிச்சாங்கன்னு கூட அவருக்குத் தெரியாது. பசங்களாப் படிச்சாங்க.... அவங்களா வேலையைத் தேடிகிட்டாங்க... அவங்களா பிடிச்ச பெண்ணைத் திருமணம் செய்துகிட்டாங்க... மத்தபடி அப்பாவா அவர் எந்த ஸ்டெப்பும் எடுத்ததில்லை.

இந்த மனநிலையை மனைவியான என்னிடமும் செலுத்தினார். நான் சாப்பிட்டனா....தூங்கினனா... எனக்கு என்ன வேணும்... எதையும் அவர் கேட்டதில்ல...செஞ்சதில்ல..அவர் எழுதினதை நான் படிச்சா அவருக்குப் பிடிக்காது. ........

குடும்பத்தைத் தாண்டிப் பெண்கள் வெளில வரக்கூடாதுனு நினைப்பார். இதுக்குக் காரணம், அவர் வளர்ந்த விதம்.

அவரோட உலகம் ரொம்பச் சின்னது. ஸ்ரீரங்கத்ல பாட்டி வீட்லதான் வளர்ந்தார். அந்த அக்ரஹாரம்தான் அவருக்கு எல்லாம். அதைத் தாண்டி அவர் சின்ன வயசுல வந்ததில்லை. வளர்ந்தபிறகு கூட மனதளவுல அந்த அகரஹாரப் பையனாத்தான் இருந்தார்.

ஆனா எங்க வீட்ல அப்படிக் கிடையாது. பெண்களுக்கு எல்லா உலக விஷயமும் தெரியணும், அவங்களும் படிக்கணும்னு நினைச்சாங்க. அப்படித்தான் என்னை வளர்த்தாங்க. எங்க தாத்தா ஆங்கிலேயர் கிட்ட வேலை பார்த்தவர். அதனால எங்கம்மாவுக்கு ஆங்கிலத்தையும், அறிவியலையும் தாத்தா ஸ்பெஷலா ஒரு ஆங்கிலோ இந்திய டீச்சரைப் பிரைவேட்டா நியமிச்சு படிக்க வச்சார்.

என் தங்கை டாக்டருக்குப் படிச்சுட்டு அமெரிக்காவுல இருக்கா. ஒரு தம்பியும் அமெரிக்கால செட்டிலாயிட்டான். இன்னொரு தம்பி சென்னைல நல்ல வேலைல இருந்து ரிடையர் ஆகியிருக்கான்.

இப்படிப்பட்ட குடும்பத்துலதான் 20 வருஷங்கள் வளர்ந்தேன். திடீர்னு கல்யாணமாகி வேறொரு சூழல் அமைந்சதும் முதல்ல ஒண்ணும் புரியலை. கிட்டத்தட்ட பத்து வருஷங்கள் ரொம்பச் சிரமப் பட்டேன். அப்புறம் என் கணவரோட உலகம் எனக்கு பழகிடுச்சு. அவரோட உலகத்துக்குத் தகுந்த உயிரினமா வாழ ஆரம்பிச்சேன்.

பலநாட்கள் அம்மா மடில படுத்து அழுதிருக்கேன். திரும்பி வந்துடறேன்னு கதறிருக்கேன். ஆனா, குழந்தைகளோட ஒரு பொண்ணு தனியா வாழ முடியாது அட்ஜஸ்ட் பண்ணிக்கன்னு சொன்னாங்க. அந்த காலகட்டம் அப்படி. அதுவே இன்றைய சூழ்நிலையா இருந்திருந்தா எங்கம்மா கிட்ட யோசனை கேட்டிருக்க மாட்டேன். குழந்தைகளோட தனியா வந்திருப்பேன்...

அவருக்கு மனைவி குழந்தைகள் மேல அனுப்பு இல்லைன்னு சொல்ல முடியாது. ஆனா, அதை வெளிப்படுத்தத் தெரியாது. வெளிப்படுத்தாத அன்பால யாருக்கு என்ன பயன்? உறவுன்கர சக்கரம் சுழல அன்புதானே அவசியம்? அவரை முழுசாப் புரிஞ்சிக்க எனக்குப் பத்து வருஷங்களாச்சு. அதுக்குப் பிறகு, என்னோட சுயத்தை விட்டுட்டு, அவருக்காகவும், பிள்ளைகளுக்காகவும் வாழ ஆரம்பித்தேன். அவருக்கு ரெண்டு பைபாஸ் சர்ஜரி நடந்தது. அதனால அவரால எங்கயும் போக முடியாது. துணையா நான் இருந்தேன்.....

எங்களுக்கு ரெண்டு பசங்க. ரெண்டு பேருமே அமெரிக்காவுல வேலை பார்த்துகிட்டு இருந்தாங்க. அவர் காலமானதும் பெரியவன் சென்னைக்கு வந்துட்டான். சின்னவன் அமெரிக்காவுலதான் இருக்கான். எனக்கு வர்ற மருமகள் தமிழ்ப்பெண்ணா இருக்கணும்னு ஆசைப் பட்டேன். அது நடக்கலை. பெரியவன் பஞ்சாபிப் பெண்ணையும், சின்னவன் ஜப்பானியப் பெண்ணையும் விரும்பிக் கல்யாணம் செஞ்சுகிட்டாங்க. ஆனா ரெண்டு மருமகள்களுமே தங்கமானவங்க.. என்னைக் கைல வச்சுத் தாங்கறாங்க.....

இதுவரைக்கும் கணவன், மாமனார், மாமியார், அம்மா, அப்பா, பிள்ளைகள்னு மத்தவங்களுக்காகவே வாழ்ந்துட்டேன். இப்பதான் எனக்காக வாழ ஆரம்பிச்சுருக்கேன். கோயில், யாத்திரைகள்னு பொழுது போகுது. அமெரிக்காவுல இருக்கற சின்னவன் வீட்டுக்கும், தம்பி, தங்கைகள் வீட்டுக்கும் போய் வர்றேன்...விருப்பப்பட்ட புத்தகங்களைப் படிக்கிறேன். என்னோட நேரங்கள் எனக்கானதா செலவாகுது. பெரிய எதிர்பார்ப்புகள் எனக்குக் கிடையாது. அதனாலேயே சந்தோஷமா இருக்கேன். ஏன்னா, எதிர்பார்ப்பு இருந்தாதான் ஏமாற்றம் ஏற்படும். என் வாழ்க்கை எனக்குக் கத்துக் குடுத்த பாடம் இது..."

என்று சொல்லும் திருமதி சுஜாதா கடைசிவரை யாருக்கும் பாரமாக இருக்கக் கூடாது என்பதில் கவனமாக இருக்கிறாராம். இவர் விலங்கியல் துறையில் பட்டப் படிப்பு முடித்தவராம்.
 
K

kkumar29

Guest
Dear Kunjuppu,

Based on the interview, I don't see anything wrong. She is expressing her experiences, which is no different to what I have heard / seen in my own family. My own mother's experience was very similar. Invariably in arranged marriages of those times, it is the woman who had to adjust. "அவரோட உலகத்துக்குத் தகுந்த உயிரினமா வாழ ஆரம்பிச்சேன்". I wonder whether there are instances of men doing what is in the quotes :)

I guess I was wrong to attribute ulterior motives to the publisher. I offer my sincerest apologies to the editor of Dinakaran.

K. Kumar
 
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K

kunjuppu

Well-known member
Dear Kunjuppu,

Based on the interview, I don't see anything wrong. She is expressing her experiences, which is no different to what I have heard / seen in my own family. My own mother's experience was very similar. Invariably in arranged marriages of those times, it is the woman who had to adjust. "அவரோட உலகத்துக்குத் தகுந்த உயிரினமா வாழ ஆரம்பிச்சேன்". I wonder whether there are instances of men doing what is in the quotes :)

I guess I was wrong to attribute ulterior motives to the publisher. I offer my sincerest apologies to the editor of Dinakaran.

K. Kumar

dear kumar,

this brings to one aspect of my query (in general and to no one in particular) re our indian need to deify our heros to God level. ie these cannot have any human failure. we have to give them 100% purity.

that gandhiji experimented with sex, that nehru was sleeping with lady mountbatten, that bharathidasan treated his wife no worse than sujatha.

but you should see the responses in the web world - ranging from anger, to disappointment to charges of brahmana dvesham. it is forgotten that the writer's public posturing as a modern secular scientific thinking writer hid a more human individual with certain warts, which for that time, since his wedding was no more a crime than failure to make a cup of coffee for his wife.

true, public figures in india keep their private lives very covered - for example we do not simply know if periyar, rajaji, venkataraman, annadurai or karunanidhi are decent husbands or not. but it was with pleasant surprise, that i learned that C.Subramaniam, had a love marriage, and was a lovvy dovvy couple. :) this from his son, in an interview in the hindu, a few months back. but nowhere i could find a pix of mrc CS. :(

all in all, it is more a reflection of the tamil society and its reaction to the interview, that is more interesting. than the content of the interview itself. that is what i think.

thank you.
 
K

kkumar29

Guest
Mr. Kunjuppu,

You are right. I think it may be that an average middle class Indian is brought up into thinking that they would lead an ordinary life, providing for their family and then fading out. They relate to somebody who achieves which they are unable to and start idolizing them. Put them on a very high pedestal and start thinking that if any human flaws in their hero is acknowledged, then they are being somehow disloyal to them. Then I think they resort to the maxim "offense is the best form defence" and start attacking the messenger rather than accept the facts. I guess it is more out of disappointment that their hero didn't measure to the image they had built up.

I can pen a lot more of my views regarding the tamil society but there will be posts that will condemn me to the darkest of places.

So I will leave it at that.

Thanks,
K. Kumar
 
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K

kunjuppu

Well-known member
..
I can pen a lot more of my views regarding the tamil society but there will be posts that will condemn me to the darkest of places.

dear kumar,

you disappointment me so much. are you afraid of the dark(ness)? at the end of the dark tunnel, is there not light? take a step, venture into the deeper self and come out with some home truths.

i am quite sure you will fellow travellers here, to accompany you on this journey :)
 

amala

Well-known member
Isn't it better to read from a Tamil(ian) views on Tamil society (I take it its not just tambrahm) rather than from an outsider? Re: Sujatha, I never quite could understand why he had a female pseudonym.
 
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