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Reservation in Elite Institutes

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new_tbguy

Member
calling

something backward and forward to me is a step backwards
I think this issue should be addressed based on economic standards
but then again there are more Communties who fit both
so what do u do ?
 
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sriniranga

Active member
This is injustice to FC Financially backward people

Here i am wring about the Forward cast economy, what make sc to give quota for obc's only. The rulers basically politicians like ministers should not injustice to any community or society.. then only people will belive them.. if one community population is more based on the vote bank they done this type of injustice to society.. Are u thinking is it ashame based on the powers.. the people those who are mentioning olderdays, now the people should ashame about their activities and implementation of the quotos.. That quotas should be in general for financially back ward class peoples.. There are n number of FC peoples are pulling the reksha,driving auto, Even they could not able to survy in the society(financially). What the government going to do for them, Because these governments only think of vote back coz those people are not going to vote them.Here we the forward cast people raise voice agains these injustice criminals..
something backward and forward to me is a step backwards
I think this issue should be addressed based on economic standards
but then again there are more Communties who fit both
so what do u do ?
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
'Caste not sole factor for backwardness'

Pioneer News
April 11

The Supreme Court on Thursday held caste as one of the determining but not the sole factor to decide social and educational backwardness of an individual.

"Determination of backward class cannot be exclusively based on caste. Poverty, social backwardness, economic backwardness, all are criteria for determination of backwardness," Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan said.

The list of socially and economi cally backward classes (SEBCs) is not solely based on caste, hence their identification is not violative of Article 15(1) of the Constitution, he said.

"When SEBCs are determined by giving importance to caste, it shall not be forgotten that a segment of that caste is economically advanced and they do not require the protection of reservation," he said.

However, the five-judge Bench, upholding the Central Act to provide 27 per cent reservation to OBCs in Central institutions, discarded the contention of anti-quota activists that castes cannot be used even as one of the criteria for identifying SEBCs.

"Caste plays an important role in determining the backwardness of an individual. In society, social status and standing depend upon the nature of the occupation followed," the Chief Justice said. "Caste is often used interchangeably with class and can be called as the basic unit of social stratification," he said.

The petitioners had contended that caste cannot be the basis for reservat ion as with the change in time, the caste system has undergone change and many persons have shifted their traditional occupations and have become doctors, engineers and lawyers.
 
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sriniranga

Active member
Let see about the policies.

Now u are talking about the Law of implimenting the Supreme court Order. Policy is different .. i read in times of india , Arjun said Institutions can decide the percentage of the marks.. Where is the statics about the financial position of the OBC, I am sure that All OBC are more finance than Current Forward Class people, Since they are earning in Offices and have their forefather lands in their villages. IF obc population is more means it is issue for them , because i got the info that each couples have more that 10 childs in the villages, Tell me how many Fc and Bramin people having more that 3 childs in the current world.
'Caste not sole factor for backwardness'

Pioneer News
April 11

The Supreme Court on Thursday held caste as one of the determining but not the sole factor to decide social and educational backwardness of an individual.

"Determination of backward class cannot be exclusively based on caste. Poverty, social backwardness, economic backwardness, all are criteria for determination of backwardness," Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan said.

The list of socially and economi cally backward classes (SEBCs) is not solely based on caste, hence their identification is not violative of Article 15(1) of the Constitution, he said.

"When SEBCs are determined by giving importance to caste, it shall not be forgotten that a segment of that caste is economically advanced and they do not require the protection of reservation," he said.

However, the five-judge Bench, upholding the Central Act to provide 27 per cent reservation to OBCs in Central institutions, discarded the contention of anti-quota activists that castes cannot be used even as one of the criteria for identifying SEBCs.

"Caste plays an important role in determining the backwardness of an individual. In society, social status and standing depend upon the nature of the occupation followed," the Chief Justice said. "Caste is often used interchangeably with class and can be called as the basic unit of social stratification," he said.

The petitioners had contended that caste cannot be the basis for reservat ion as with the change in time, the caste system has undergone change and many persons have shifted their traditional occupations and have become doctors, engineers and lawyers.
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
SC questions effectiveness of quota policy
Saturday April 12 2008 00:00 IST

PTI


NEW DELHI: Even though the Supreme Court allowed 27 per cent reservation for the OBCs in Central educational institutions, it has raised questions on the effectiveness of such a policy for bringing equality in society.

"There is no deletion from the list of other backward classes. It goes on increasing... is it that backwardness has increased instead of decreasing?

"If the answer is yes, as contended by the respondents (Centre and other pro-quota parties), then one is bound to raise eyebrows as to the effectiveness of providing reservations or quotas," Justices Arijit Pasayat and CK Thakker said.

"The inequalities are to be removed. Yet the fact that there has been no exclusion raises a doubt about the real concern to remove inequality," he said while pointing out that since the concept of OBC came into picture there has been no deletion of any caste from the category.

The Court asked the Centre to deliberate whether the reservation policy followed since Independence had been effective in achieving the desired result.

"If after nearly six decades the objectives have not been achieved, necessarily the need for its continuance warrants deliberations," the Court said.

"It is to be noted that some of the provisions were intended to be replaced after a decade but have continued. It directly shows that backwardness appears to have purportedly increased and not diminished," the judges said, adding that the affirmative action had got somewhat complicated in India on account of caste politics.
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
Centre can’t digest quota without cream
RADHIKA RAMASESHAN
New Delhi, April 11: The Centre is likely to challenge the exclusion of the “creamy layer” from the 27 per cent quota for Other Backward Classes in central higher educational institutions.

Sources said the government would “go through the motions” of filing a review petition because of pressure from UPA partners, although it was likely to be trashed unless heard by a bench larger than the five-judge team that gave the verdict.

Parties from Bihar and Tamil Nadu today questioned the rationale of keeping out the “creamy layer” — families with an annual income above Rs 2.5 lakh — and the purpose behind the quota that excludes them.

“We have won the battle and lost the war,” a Congress minister said.
The sources said the Centre did not have much space to make a case for including the “creamy layer” but had noted the “anomalies” in the court’s observations.

For instance, it has recommended a marginally lower cutoff for OBC students but directed the government to fill up vacancies under the quota with students from the general category.

“At least a concession could have been made so that applicants from the ‘creamy layer’ could have filled in the vacancies,” the minister said.
He said the Centre could, at best, tweak the “creamy layer” criteria by raising the income cap to Rs 5 lakh so that candidates from not too well-off homes got some kind of a level playing field.

Health minister Anbumani Ramadoss of the PMK raised the matter at a cabinet meeting. After congratulating HRD minister Arjun Singh, who was “unusually bubbly and energetic”, he asked if the Centre proposed to let the “creamy layer” issue pass.

Ramadoss was backed by the DMK, the RJD and the Lok Janshakti Party.

The Prime Minister said the government would have to read the judgment closely before responding. The Congress was non-committal, but its 30-odd OBC MPs looked set to stand by colleagues from other parties.

“Just because three or four of us have done well for ourselves, can we overlook the discrimination and suffering most of us were subject to for centuries?” Congress MP V. Hanumantha Rao asked.

RJD leader D.P. Yadav said: “The creamy layer is an iron grille gate for the OBCs, it will shut us out of reservation. It means four or five of our boys and girls might make it to the IIMs and medical colleges while the rest will continue to plough the field and work the cattle.”

Sources said the Centre would be asked to spell out its stand on April 15, the day the House reconvenes. The Centre may move the court tomorrow.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080412/jsp/frontpage/story_9129010.jsp
 
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sriniranga

Active member
Suppose if i joined job in india My anual income is less than 5 laks. can i include in this quota as obc.. althought i am forward cast.. what is this injustice for the forward cast and bramin people..Are the people those will earn 3 lak from ordinary job and earn 2 lak from field are they come under cremy layer or not.. If the farmer earning 3 lak in the field and they have 8 childrens.. what they will do in that case.. if those 8 child occupied the iim and iit quotas what for the other families kids and the forward kids. Now a days every guyes are doing hard work and brillient (Obc/bc/st/st/Fc) and Obc/bc/st/st getting more marks what happned to the FC people.. FC people dont want to study or dont want to take food..



Centre can’t digest quota without cream
RADHIKA RAMASESHAN
New Delhi, April 11: The Centre is likely to challenge the exclusion of the “creamy layer” from the 27 per cent quota for Other Backward Classes in central higher educational institutions.

Sources said the government would “go through the motions” of filing a review petition because of pressure from UPA partners, although it was likely to be trashed unless heard by a bench larger than the five-judge team that gave the verdict.

Parties from Bihar and Tamil Nadu today questioned the rationale of keeping out the “creamy layer” — families with an annual income above Rs 2.5 lakh — and the purpose behind the quota that excludes them.

“We have won the battle and lost the war,” a Congress minister said.
The sources said the Centre did not have much space to make a case for including the “creamy layer” but had noted the “anomalies” in the court’s observations.

For instance, it has recommended a marginally lower cutoff for OBC students but directed the government to fill up vacancies under the quota with students from the general category.

“At least a concession could have been made so that applicants from the ‘creamy layer’ could have filled in the vacancies,” the minister said.
He said the Centre could, at best, tweak the “creamy layer” criteria by raising the income cap to Rs 5 lakh so that candidates from not too well-off homes got some kind of a level playing field.

Health minister Anbumani Ramadoss of the PMK raised the matter at a cabinet meeting. After congratulating HRD minister Arjun Singh, who was “unusually bubbly and energetic”, he asked if the Centre proposed to let the “creamy layer” issue pass.

Ramadoss was backed by the DMK, the RJD and the Lok Janshakti Party.

The Prime Minister said the government would have to read the judgment closely before responding. The Congress was non-committal, but its 30-odd OBC MPs looked set to stand by colleagues from other parties.

“Just because three or four of us have done well for ourselves, can we overlook the discrimination and suffering most of us were subject to for centuries?” Congress MP V. Hanumantha Rao asked.

RJD leader D.P. Yadav said: “The creamy layer is an iron grille gate for the OBCs, it will shut us out of reservation. It means four or five of our boys and girls might make it to the IIMs and medical colleges while the rest will continue to plough the field and work the cattle.”

Sources said the Centre would be asked to spell out its stand on April 15, the day the House reconvenes. The Centre may move the court tomorrow.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080412/jsp/frontpage/story_9129010.jsp
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
Dear Sriniranga,

You have to appreciate the fact that the Supreme Court has tried to put a break in the efforts of the ruling clique to continue to divide the Hindu society on stale grounds of casteism. Remember they have argued their case on the basis of 1937 census when there was no Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh etc. as a separate country.

According to the judgement, if there are not enough candidates filling up the 27% from the non-creamy OBCs then those seats will have to come to all which would be the 'forward' class plus the OBC and MBC irrespective of the fact they are creamy or not.

The ruling clique wants that if there are not enough candidates from the non-creamy OBC to fill the 27% then it should be filled by the creamy OBC which is not acceptable to the Supreme Court.

To give you an example, let us say there are a total of 100 seats of which 27 are reserved for non-creamy OBC. If only 20 non-creamy candidates apply for them then there is a surplus of 7 seats which will then go to the most qualified candidates who may be 'forward' or OBC or SC/ST irrespective of the fact they are creamy or not. The ruling clique wants to ensure that this surplus 7 should go to the creamy OBC which is quite unreasonable and based purely and unashamedly on casteist politics and not on the arguments of handicap on which the original reservation was instituted.

It is now the problem for the anti-Brahmin rulers to devise means by which the creamy layer OBC would supersede the so called 'forward' class. But if they do try to favour the creamy layer to the detriment of others they could then be challenged in the court.

I do think the verdict of the Supreme Court is in our favour. Ideally there should be no reservation at all after 60 years of 'independence'. However I do think this is a set back to the enemy and a small success for us.
 
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Ramaa

Guest
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Poverty also a criterion for quota: SC
12 Apr 2008, 0000 hrs IST
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Dhananjay Mahapatra
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TNN[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]
NEW DELHI: The pro-quota lobby may have been aghast by Mayawati’s call for reservation for poor upper caste, but the majority opinion of the five-judge constitution bench of the Supreme Court, which okayed 27% OBC reservation excluding creamy layer, voiced concern for the discrimination faced by the economically backward.

Chief Justice K G Balakrishnan led from the front and said: "Determination of backward class cannot be exclusively based on caste. Poverty, social backwardness, economic backwardness, all are criteria for determination of backwardness."

While discussing exclusion of creamy layer, the CJI said: "One of the main criteria for determining the socially and educationally backward class is poverty."

If the CJI took poverty as one of the main criteria for determination of backwardness, Justices Arijit Pasayat and C K Thakker said: "We cannot turn Nelson’s eye to the poor, those covered by all encompassing expression ‘economically backward class’."

"Should this class of people be kept out of the mainstream of governmental priorities and policies because they belonged to a particular caste?" asked the two judges, who gave their views in a common judgment.

Answering the self-posed question, they said: "If the creamy layer has to be excluded, the economically backward classes have to be included. That would be social balancing and that would be giving true meaning of the objectives of the Constitution."

On the economically backward class, the CJI said: "For example, all the Brahmins are not engaged in highly respectable employment nor are all very wealthy. It may even be that some Brahmins may be servants of members of a lower caste, or it may also be that the personal servant of a rich Brahmin may be a poor."

Carrying this forward, Justice Dalveer Bhandari said: "Can one call a Brahmin sweeper, poor by occupation, socially forward? To do so would be a stretch."

He said history has shown that it was not politically feasible for Parliament to say ‘no’ to reservation, especially when caste is involved. Knowing this inherent weakness, he went on to urge the government to "use exclusively economic criteria to identify OBCs who may avail special provisions".

Justice Raveendran struck a balance. He said if caste-based reservation was continued for an unlimited period, the country would be a caste divided society permanently. "While affirmative discrimination is a road to equality, care should be taken that the road does not become a rut in which the vehicle of progress gets stuck. Any provision for reservation is a temporary crutch. Such crutch by unnecessary prolonged use, shouldn’t become a permanent liability," he said. [/FONT]
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
confusion remains over whether quotas would apply to postgraduate courses

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/2942622.cms

NEW DELHI: The Supreme Court (SC) on Thursday upheld the 27% quota for Other Backward Castes (OBCs) in centrally-funded educational institutions, but ruled that the scheme can be rolled out only after excluding the creamy layer.

However, confusion remains over whether quotas would apply to postgraduate courses, such as those at IIMs. The anti-quota side interpreted the judgement as a “no” from the court for the OBC quota in institutions such as IIMs and other post-graduate courses.

Late in the evening, government leaders told the media that they would seek clarifications from the court on the matter. The five-member bench of the SC delivered four judgements on a number of petitions challenging OBC quotas. One judgement, by Justice Dalveer Bhandari, says, “Once a candidate graduates from a university, the said candidate is educationally forward and is ineligible for special benefits ... for post-graduate and any further studies thereafter.”

This view, however, is not endorsed by Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan in his judgement. The third judgement by Justices Pasayat and Thakker says graduation should be used as a criterion to judge the bakwardness or otherwise of a community.

The court, which brought in the educational criterion, along with social and economic backwardness for determining creamy layer, dealt a blow to the well-off and educationally forward among the OBCs. The government, however, maintained that the OBC quota will be implemented from this year and a notification in this regard will be issued soon.

Already, the CAT results for IIMs are being held back for accommodating OBC candidates. As the implementation would be staggered for existing institutions, IIMs and IITs are prepared for the intake. The Budget, incidentally, had allocated Rs 2,500 crore for capacity building.

The government said funds will not come in the way of the quota rollout. The judgement by the five-member bench headed by Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan is expected to go a long way in empowering the most backward castes (MBCs). The politically-powerful OBCs may be unhappy with the judgement, as it bodes well for the MBCs.

The court has asked the government to review the OBC list every five years, besides keeping the creamy layer out. This would mean castes, which have benefited from quotas, would be out of the reservation list eventually.

The development will disappoint dominant backward castes like Yadavs, Kurmis, Lodhs, Mauryas, Ezhavas, Vanniyars, Goundars, Idigas and Kurubas. It is likely to see increased competition between the OBCs and the MBCs.

In recent years, the MBCs have begun grouping as a major political force, aiding anti-OBC political parties. The OBC-dominated parties in the ruling alliance, which have already appropriated the quota bill’s authorship, may pressure the government to take steps to circumvent the creamy layer ruling.

As far the court’s order, it found nothing amiss in the 93rd amendment. “We hold that the 93rd amendment to the Constitution does not violate the basic structure of the Constitution so far, as it relates to aided educational institutions,” it ruled.

The court, however, deferred a decision on reservation for SCs, STs or Socially and Economically Backward Classes in private unaided educational institutions on the basis of the amendment.

The judgement, which has addressed the issue of merit, said there should only be a 5% difference (10%, according to another judgement) between the cut-off marks for the OBCs and general category candidates.

“The government shall examine as to the desirability of fixing cut-off marks in respect of the candidates belonging to the OBCs. By way of illustration, it can be indicated that five-mark grace can be extended to such candidates below the minimum eligibility marks fixed for general categories of students.

This would ensure quality and merit would not suffer. If any seats remain vacant after adopting such norms they shall be filled up by candidates from general categories,” said Justice Pasayat and Thakker in their combined verdict.

The judgement may have hit the OBC faces in politics and bureaucracy, but land-owning classes could find a way to wriggle out of the situation. As agricultural income is tax-free and many continue to elude land ceiling, some in the creamy layer could continue to enjoy the quota benefits.
 
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sriniranga

Active member
Fair one - This way Quota should implement

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...riterion_for_quota_SC/articleshow/2947852.cms

Poverty also a criterion for quota: SC
12 Apr 2008, 0000 hrs IST , Dhananjay Mahapatra , TNN
NEW DELHI: The pro-quota lobby may have been aghast by Mayawati’s call for reservation for poor upper caste, but the majority opinion of the five-judge constitution bench of the Supreme Court, which okayed 27% OBC reservation excluding creamy layer, voiced concern for the discrimination faced by the economically backward.

Chief Justice K G Balakrishnan led from the front and said: "Determination of backward class cannot be exclusively based on caste. Poverty, social backwardness, backwardness, all are criteria for determination of backwardness."

While discussing exclusion of creamy layer, the CJI said: "One of the main criteria for determining the socially and educationally backward class is poverty."

If the CJI took poverty as one of the main criteria for determination of backwardness, Justices Arijit Pasayat and C K Thakker said: "We cannot turn Nelson’s eye to the poor, those covered by all encompassing expression ‘economically backward class’."

"Should this class of people be kept out of the mainstream of governmental priorities and policies because they belonged to a particular caste?" asked the two judges, who gave their views in a common judgment.

Answering the self-posed question, they said: "If the creamy layer has to be excluded, the economically backward classes have to be included. That would be social balancing and that would be giving true meaning of the objectives of the Constitution."

On the economically backward class, the CJI said: "For example, all the Brahmins are not engaged in highly respectable employment nor are all very wealthy. It may even be that some Brahmins may be servants of members of a lower caste, or it may also be that the personal servant of a rich Brahmin may be a poor."

Carrying this forward, Justice Dalveer Bhandari said: "Can one call a Brahmin sweeper, poor by occupation, socially forward? To do so would be a stretch."

He said has shown that it was not politically feasible for Parliament to say ‘no’ to reservation, especially when caste is involved. Knowing this inherent weakness, he went on to urge the government to "use exclusively economic criteria to identify OBCs who may avail special provisions".

Justice Raveendran struck a balance. He said if caste-based reservation was continued for an unlimited period, the country would be a caste divided society permanently. "While affirmative discrimination is a road to equality, care should be taken that the road does not become a rut in which the vehicle of progress gets stuck. Any provision for reservation is a temporary crutch. Such crutch by unnecessary prolonged use, shouldn’t become a permanent liability," he said.



confusion remains over whether quotas would apply to postgraduate courses

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/2942622.cms

NEW DELHI: The Supreme Court (SC) on Thursday upheld the 27% quota for Other Backward Castes (OBCs) in centrally-funded educational institutions, but ruled that the scheme can be rolled out only after excluding the creamy layer.

However, confusion remains over whether quotas would apply to postgraduate courses, such as those at IIMs. The anti-quota side interpreted the judgement as a “no” from the court for the OBC quota in institutions such as IIMs and other post-graduate courses.

Late in the evening, government leaders told the media that they would seek clarifications from the court on the matter. The five-member bench of the SC delivered four judgements on a number of petitions challenging OBC quotas. One judgement, by Justice Dalveer Bhandari, says, “Once a candidate graduates from a university, the said candidate is educationally forward and is ineligible for special benefits ... for post-graduate and any further studies thereafter.”

This view, however, is not endorsed by Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan in his judgement. The third judgement by Justices Pasayat and Thakker says graduation should be used as a criterion to judge the bakwardness or otherwise of a community.

The court, which brought in the educational criterion, along with social and economic backwardness for determining creamy layer, dealt a blow to the well-off and educationally forward among the OBCs. The government, however, maintained that the OBC quota will be implemented from this year and a notification in this regard will be issued soon.

Already, the CAT results for IIMs are being held back for accommodating OBC candidates. As the implementation would be staggered for existing institutions, IIMs and IITs are prepared for the intake. The Budget, incidentally, had allocated Rs 2,500 crore for capacity building.

The government said funds will not come in the way of the quota rollout. The judgement by the five-member bench headed by Chief Justice KG Balakrishnan is expected to go a long way in empowering the most backward castes (MBCs). The politically-powerful OBCs may be unhappy with the judgement, as it bodes well for the MBCs.

The court has asked the government to review the OBC list every five years, besides keeping the creamy layer out. This would mean castes, which have benefited from quotas, would be out of the reservation list eventually.

The development will disappoint dominant backward castes like Yadavs, Kurmis, Lodhs, Mauryas, Ezhavas, Vanniyars, Goundars, Idigas and Kurubas. It is likely to see increased competition between the OBCs and the MBCs.

In recent years, the MBCs have begun grouping as a major political force, aiding anti-OBC political parties. The OBC-dominated parties in the ruling alliance, which have already appropriated the quota bill’s authorship, may pressure the government to take steps to circumvent the creamy layer ruling.

As far the court’s order, it found nothing amiss in the 93rd amendment. “We hold that the 93rd amendment to the Constitution does not violate the basic structure of the Constitution so far, as it relates to aided educational institutions,” it ruled.

The court, however, deferred a decision on reservation for SCs, STs or Socially and Economically Backward Classes in private unaided educational institutions on the basis of the amendment.

The judgement, which has addressed the issue of merit, said there should only be a 5% difference (10%, according to another judgement) between the cut-off marks for the OBCs and general category candidates.

“The government shall examine as to the desirability of fixing cut-off marks in respect of the candidates belonging to the OBCs. By way of illustration, it can be indicated that five-mark grace can be extended to such candidates below the minimum eligibility marks fixed for general categories of students.

This would ensure quality and merit would not suffer. If any seats remain vacant after adopting such norms they shall be filled up by candidates from general categories,” said Justice Pasayat and Thakker in their combined verdict.

The judgement may have hit the OBC faces in politics and bureaucracy, but land-owning classes could find a way to wriggle out of the situation. As agricultural income is tax-free and many continue to elude land ceiling, some in the creamy layer could continue to enjoy the quota benefits.
 
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sriniranga

Active member
I can not understand your, please explain in detail
something backward and forward to me is a step backwards
I think this issue should be addressed based on economic standards
but then again there are more Communties who fit both
so what do u do ?
 
S

Saab

Guest
As I see there are four important parts in the Supreme Court judgement:

1. Creamy layer to be excluded;
2. Graduates considered creamy layer;
3. No big gap between cut-off for OBCs and general category students (say 5 marks?!)
4. Review quota list every 5 years.

Also the Supreme Court is yet to rule on the reservation demands of the government in unaided institutions. Here is the moot point. If the Supreme Court tells the Government to keep their hands off the unaided institutions, then Brahmins can start universities and restrict entry only to Brahmins. (So will others such as Christians and Muslims) I think that would be a welcome start but we have to wait and see.
 
S

Saab

Guest
I think the Madrassas come under the 'denominational' schools. This is one privilege that has been given to the Muslims but denied to the Hindus I think. I would like some informed members to throw some light on this.
 
R

Ramaa

Guest
It looks like the Congress is bent on subverting the Supreme Court judgement by opting to raise the income limit. Will the Supreme Court accept this idea?

Arjun fears creamy layer exclusion may skim poll profit


Pallavi Ghosh / CNN-IBN


New Delhi: After the initial euphoria, the Congress and its allies now fear that exclusion of the creamy layer from the 27 per cent OBC reservation may prevent their parties from benefiting from the Supreme Court judgement.
Now apart from the allies, HRD Minister Arjun Singh too is pitching for raising the income limit for creamy layer.
“We are not going to sweep it under the carpet,” Arjun says about the slab increase option.
After being raised from Rs 1 lakh in 2004, the income criterion for creamy layer now rests at Rs 2.5 lakh.
Arjun Singh even met the Prime Minister on Saturday suggesting another raise in the slab.

But the OBC-dominated allies of the Congress are not satisfied with that. They want the entire creamy layer to be included.
“We were given full permission to get it implemented, but except five states, all others defied it. Creamy layer should be included in the 27 per cent quota judgement,” Railway Minister Lalu Prasad Yadav says.
But for the inclusion to be implemented, the government may have to file a review petition.
Sources reveal that Law Minister HR Bhardwaj is not too keen on this. Congress is itself in two minds over the issue. Some within the Congress argue that the raising the slab will actually help the party as it may soften the anger of the upper castes against the party.
But then there are OBC leaders who want a redefinition of the creamy layer. The say the move might give their party some electoral benefit.
The HRD Minister himself seconds that opinion.
“I don't know, it should. It won't harm us,” he says.
However, the fact remains grand old party of India is in a dilemma. While some feel that including the creamy layer would further alienate the upper caste vote bank, but there is mounting pressure from allies as well.
 
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RVR

Well-known member
It is difficult to stop this since the highest court of the land has approved the legislation. However private universities have started coming up in a big way and we can create world class university if all of us join together and contribute to the cause. Cash may be required but it is not going to be the only limitation. All of us can devote our time and contribute to the success of the institution. We can even locate the institution outside Tamilnadu and get minority institution status. I request all the members to think further on the subject, discuss and evolve a mechanism to achieve our goals
 

Nacchinarkiniyan

Well-known member
Getting admission to IIT and IIM is not the end of it all. You have to go through the terms. May be our politicians can manipulate even that.

But then it is all useful only if you can get placed. May be they can get Government jobs. But in the private sector caste does not help.

There are many IIT graduates who are jobless. I do not know now about IIM. But earlier on a number of them wrote the state Bank of India exam. Some failed in that also.

It reminds of the number of students who got admission to M.S in U.S. Universities(1970s)becuse of their money and how the U.S. universities had to tackle these rich men's sons.
 
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sriniranga

Active member
Yes , Diffnately OBC politicians will manupulate the things to include the creamy layer inside the quota. If that is happned some of our top Branim or FC people should file the petision in the SC itself. It will be helpful..


I belive in US this type of quoto or creamy layer wont work out, Any way i will discuss few of my friend and write about the operation of universities in US..


Getting admission to IIT and IIM is not the end of it all. You have to go through the terms. May be our politicians can manipulate even that.

But then it is all useful only if you can get placed. May be they can get Government jobs. But in the private sector caste does not help.

There are many IIT graduates who are jobless. I do not know now about IIM. But earlier on a number of them wrote the state Bank of India exam. Some failed in that also.

It reminds of the number of students who got admission to M.S in U.S. Universities(1970s)becuse of their money and how the U.S. universities had to tackle these rich men's sons.
 

Nacchinarkiniyan

Well-known member
Sorry. That comment about U.S. universities was about the situation when a horde of students whose parents were/are businessmen landed in U.S for doing M.S in Engineering. Since they had already made up the money (cost.Rs.3,00,000 around in 1969) by way of dowries and since they were anyway going to sit in Mulji Jedha market, they had no interest in completing the course.

So by the time we left, these guys were just settling down and enjoying their stay in U.S.

Does it make sense. Or am I going Waco. ( you know where that is?)
 
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KRS

Well-known member
Dear Sri Nacchinarkiniyan Ji,
I came to the U.S. on Sepetember 21st, 1970 to get my Masters/Ph.D. and I remember meeting several guys (don't remember any 'gals') who were financed by their rich dads (I had to secure a fellowship to study as I had lost my dad when I was five and did not have the money to self finance).

I distincly remember being astonished when one of these 'guys' drove up oneday in a new shining Ford Pinto! His dad bought him that car, he said, because he told his dad that mass transportation was not available in our college town! He proved to be the most popular among the Indian students, ferrying us all around town for grocery/department store shopping during the week ends. If I remember correctly, he did graduate and went back to India.

Well, sir, Waco does not have a 'h' but being in Texas, I very well know where it is. Did you by chance, go to Baylor?

Pranams,
KRS


Sorry. That comment about U.S. universities was about the situation when a horde of students whose parents were/are businessmen landed in U.S for doing M.S in Engineering. Since they had already made up the money (cost.Rs.3,00,000 around in 1969) by way of dowries and since they were anyway going to sit in Mulji Jedha market, they had no interest in completing the course.

So by the time we left, these guys were just settling down and enjoying their stay in U.S.

Does it make sense. Or am I going Waco. ( you know where that is?)
 
OP
OP
S

sriniranga

Active member
Now the politicians started manupulated about implementation of quota

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Creamy_layer_order_wont_be_contested/articleshow/2949788.cms

Creamy layer order won't be challenged
14 Apr 2008, 0328 hrs IST , TNN



NEW DELHI: Anxious for a swift rollout of the OBC quota in central educational institutions, the government is learnt to have decided not to challenge Supreme Court’s directive to keep the "creamy layer" out of the ambit of the reservations.

Sources said that the "no" to "creamy layer" can be challenged only before a larger bench and the procedure will delay the implementation of the quota, frustrating the prospective beneficiaries who have waited since March last year when the top court ordered a freeze.

"We will tell allies who have been asking us to seek a review that appealing the verdict will only complicate matters," said a senior Congress source. Government’s keenness for a quick rollout came out clearly in HRD minister Arjun Singh’s interview to a news agency on Sunday.

"The overall structure of the judgement is very positive," said Singh while parrying a query about whether government will go in for a review. "There is no such thing at present", he said, adding that the "basic issue has been resolved".

Though the minister who worked in tandem with pro-quota partners like DMK and PMK to ensure that government remained focused on quota acknowledged the differences over what constitutes "creamy layer" and whether they should be kept within the arc of the reservations, the tone of his remarks suggested that the government’s priority now is on early implementation of delayed quotas.

The agency report also said that the minister steered clear of demands by allies like the DMK for a "fair and just" review of the criteria to define the creamy layer.

Government sources said that government has to clear the procedural hurdles of extending the applicablity of "creamy layer" — so far limited to job reservations — to educational quota and working out the cut-off mark for filling up the seats earmarked for OBCs.

In his interview to the agency, however, Singh was confident that the implementation would not pose difficulties. "It is implementable," he asserted


</SPAN>
 
OP
OP
S

sriniranga

Active member
Please let me know

Dear all
Any one Please let me know how much our Bramin Population in India. How many percentage are under poverty line even could not able to study.
 
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