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China annexes 60 square km of India in Ladakh as simmering tensions erupt between two superpowers

prasad1

Well-known member
China has occupied more than sixty square kilometres of Indian territory in eastern Ladakh, according to a senior Indian Army source, in a dramatic escalation of the simmering tension between the two Asian superpowers.
 

Iyest

Active member
It is probably less now since they have backed off a bit in the past few days. During the 10 years between 2004 and 2014 there was a lot more land grab. The Shyam Saran report in 2013 openly acknowledges that. Though we shall never know the exact loss there are many reports that we lost around 650 sq km of territory. Manmohan Singh for whatever reason did not even raise the matter with China at that time! Nor was there any demand from anybody to make the report public or debate the issue in Parliament. Those who are old enough to remember 1962 will recall that we had fiery debates for a few years after the humiliating defeat. A really scary possibility is that China is funding all our major parties and our media. Then they can easily define and shape any debate. Even Anil Ambani was a victim of Chinese loans that he could not repay. Let us hope that they have not penetrated so deeply into our society.
 
Be careful about China. Their penchant desire for expansionism is well known since the occupation of hapless and helpless Kingdom of Tibet and subsequent gulping of our territory in 1962 ( in spite of Hindi Chini Bai Bai slogan) - a treacherous annexation. It shows its dominating and super power attitude by creating islands in the south China sea as its own territory in spite of International Court's verdict against it. It is encircling India as it cannot tolerate India becoming super power. China wants to rule the entire world.
In another context I had written in this Forum "as a conversation article" about China's role in the spread of COVID19. It is reproduced below: Only one member commented that " So before going overboard with pointing fingers at China (or following blindly politicians) be careful, it will come and bite us back. " I dont agree with the comment for it is not politics when we say the facts and the truth.
India is a big market for China. They cannot afford to lose the big market. You have to make them understand that India cannot be bullied again.. Please BOYCOTT Chinese Goods. (Please read the enclosed file also)
 

Attachments

prasad1

Well-known member
Be careful about China. Their penchant desire for expansionism is well known since the occupation of hapless and helpless Kingdom of Tibet and subsequent gulping of our territory in 1962 ( in spite of Hindi Chini Bai Bai slogan) - a treacherous annexation. It shows its dominating and super power attitude by creating islands in the south China sea as its own territory in spite of International Court's verdict against it. It is encircling India as it cannot tolerate India becoming super power. China wants to rule the entire world.
In another context I had written in this Forum "as a conversation article" about China's role in the spread of COVID19. It is reproduced below: Only one member commented that " So before going overboard with pointing fingers at China (or following blindly politicians) be careful, it will come and bite us back. " I dont agree with the comment for it is not politics when we say the facts and the truth.
India is a big market for China. They cannot afford to lose the big market. You have to make them understand that India cannot be bullied again.. Please BOYCOTT Chinese Goods. (Please read the enclosed file also)
When you write as a conversation. it is like an e-mail. It only goes to that person.
You must post in the Forum for the general public to see your post.


Your post may be meaningful, at least to you, but there may be counterpoints. In the forum people can have various views.
 
Thank you Sir for your guidance. I was under the impression that conversation may be read by all members. Now I got the point. I dont dispute about the various views expressed by others. They have every right to dissent. In order to have healthy discussion I had mentioned about the different view point expressed. However I want to reiterate that as far as China is concerned we should be very very careful. Right from the day they occupied Tibet till today I have analysed their moves and if I bring forth here all their moves, point by point, it will be very voluminous. Briefly I have mentioned the important aspects.
Once again I request all Indians, please promote Indian goods instead of Chinese Goods, from our national view point.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
Thank you Sir for your guidance. I was under the impression that conversation may be read by all members. Now I got the point. I dont dispute about the various views expressed by others. They have every right to dissent. In order to have healthy discussion I had mentioned about the different view point expressed. However I want to reiterate that as far as China is concerned we should be very very careful. Right from the day they occupied Tibet till today I have analysed their moves and if I bring forth here all their moves, point by point, it will be very voluminous. Briefly I have mentioned the important aspects.
Once again I request all Indians, please promote Indian goods instead of Chinese Goods, from our national view point.
Yes, you should promote products made in the country, or for that matter products produced locally.
But in the 21st century, we can not survive being isolationist.

Trade figures suggest that India is the biggest importer of Chinese consumer goods. India imports almost seven times more from China than it exports to it. India has huge trade deficit with China – its largest with any country. In 2018-19, India’s exports to China were mere $16.7 billion, while imports were $70.3 billion, leaving a trade deficit of $53.6 billion.

It needs to be acknowledged that China’s exports to India account for only 2% of its total exports, so even if Indians boycott all the goods imported from China, it will not make as big an impact on China. Data also suggests that China is India’s largest trading partner, but the trade is heavily skewed in favour of China. Thus initiating a trade war when Indian manufacturing ability is limited is not going to favour India.

The range of goods that we import from China is massive: consumer durables such as electronic goods, smartphones, industrial goods, vehicles, solar cells, and essential pharmaceutical products including tuberculosis and leprosy drugs and antibiotics, among many others.

In 2017-18, almost 60% of India’s import requirements of electrical and electronic equipment was met by China. In our smartphone industry, out of the five bestselling phone brands in India, four are Chinese – Xiaomi, Vivo, Realme and Oppo. These four brands combined dominate over 60% of the smartphone market in India. On the other hand, 30% of India’s automobile components are met from China and about 90% of the country’s toy market is occupied by Chinese products. Similarly, 50% of the demand in the country’s bicycle market is met by imports in which China has a large share. Thus, some of the key sectors of the Indian economy are critically dependent on China.
Jingoism and hyper-nationalism can never provide a solution to the problems that stare us in our face and hence efforts should be made to resolve regional disputes through dialogue and consultation. This makes it imperative to maintain close exchanges at the highest levels to iron out differences.

Increasing mutual investment and encouraging Indian companies to participate in the China International Import Expo will strengthen bonds between these two economic giants. We must acknowledge that China has a strategic role to play in India’s growth.

COVID-19 has taught us that a battered economy effects us all collectively in a globalised era. Thus, aspiring for a strong India-China relationship is important not only for the mutual benefit of the people of India and China, but also for the region and the world.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
When Prime Minister Narendra Modi, in his address to the nation, gave a clarion call for an ‘Atmanirbhar Bharat’ last month, an undercover tirade seemed to have developed amongst the masses against the products that we import.

But it is empty slogan and stirs the masses for nationalism. But we are not even self-sufficient in arms.
A plausible reason for this is that India lacks a defence industry of its own sufficient to meet its external challenges and to keep pace with its expanding strategic interests. The need to modernise has indeed been one major reason for India’s status as top spender on arms imports. But there are other factors at work too.

India is still struggling to upgrade its arms manufacturing sector, despite this being a priority for over a decade. Continued reliance on foreign suppliers exposes the lack of a clear-cut vision of its defence industry.

The country’s hand was forced slightly: humiliating defeat in a war with China in 1962 and America’s refusal to share high-tech weapons meant India needed to upgrade its military capability. Given the Cold War dynamics of the time, the USSR stepped in and eventually the Indian armoury was full of Russian weapons.

India even today is importing small arms and ammunitions. A critical need that must be indigenous is left to the Import sector.
 

Iyest

Active member
When Prime Minister Narendra Modi, in his address to the nation, gave a clarion call for an ‘Atmanirbhar Bharat’ last month, an undercover tirade seemed to have developed amongst the masses against the products that we import.

But it is empty slogan and stirs the masses for nationalism. But we are not even self-sufficient in arms.
A plausible reason for this is that India lacks a defence industry of its own sufficient to meet its external challenges and to keep pace with its expanding strategic interests. The need to modernise has indeed been one major reason for India’s status as top spender on arms imports. But there are other factors at work too.

India is still struggling to upgrade its arms manufacturing sector, despite this being a priority for over a decade. Continued reliance on foreign suppliers exposes the lack of a clear-cut vision of its defence industry.

The country’s hand was forced slightly: humiliating defeat in a war with China in 1962 and America’s refusal to share high-tech weapons meant India needed to upgrade its military capability. Given the Cold War dynamics of the time, the USSR stepped in and eventually the Indian armoury was full of Russian weapons.

India even today is importing small arms and ammunitions. A critical need that must be indigenous is left to the Import sector.

It is not so much lack of understanding of the problem or even lack of know how, though it is true we don't have the latest technology. The large elephant in the room is corruption.

Every import comes with a minimum of 10% cut translating into hundreds of crores, not to mention foreign trips for discussions, 'evaluation' etc. Few bureaucrats and army officers are free of this disease. Who would want a local product from a PSU that doesn't offer any of these 'perks'? Tests are doctored to favour imports. Bofors is just the tip of the iceberg. But for a Defense Minister like Parrikar even the LCA would have been given a quiet burial.

The large foreign defense firms are very good at planting paid stories in our media about how 'inferior' our domestic products are compared to theirs.

Not to say that our public sector is great. Union labour with high wages and low productivity have made them white elephants.

Perhaps we should allow more private firms in defense. At least the technical know how and the money spent remain within the country. Not to speak of providing employment.
 

Iyest

Active member
Be careful about China. Their penchant desire for expansionism is well known since the occupation of hapless and helpless Kingdom of Tibet and subsequent gulping of our territory in 1962 ( in spite of Hindi Chini Bai Bai slogan) - a treacherous annexation. It shows its dominating and super power attitude by creating islands in the south China sea as its own territory in spite of International Court's verdict against it. It is encircling India as it cannot tolerate India becoming super power. China wants to rule the entire world.
In another context I had written in this Forum "as a conversation article" about China's role in the spread of COVID19. It is reproduced below: Only one member commented that " So before going overboard with pointing fingers at China (or following blindly politicians) be careful, it will come and bite us back. " I dont agree with the comment for it is not politics when we say the facts and the truth.
India is a big market for China. They cannot afford to lose the big market. You have to make them understand that India cannot be bullied again.. Please BOYCOTT Chinese Goods. (Please read the enclosed file also)
Without a doubt we are the most stupid people on earth. We have been running a trade defecit of around $50 billion a year just in the last decade alone. With a portion of this annual 'donation', China funds the military development of Pakistan, terrorist training and infrastructure in Pakistan, and even nuclear weapons. In return hundreds of our civilians (particularly in Kashmir) and our jawans are killed! We are therefore funding our own death and destruction. China does not have to spend a single rupee!

In recent years I have seen China virtually destroy our solar cell manufacturing industry by dumping their products. The same is true for toys, cheap electronic components, and even some clothing. Soon even our flag will be imported from China.
 

Janaki Jambunathan

Well-known member
When Prime Minister Narendra Modi, in his address to the nation, gave a clarion call for an ‘Atmanirbhar Bharat’ last month, an undercover tirade seemed to have developed amongst the masses against the products that we import.

But it is empty slogan and stirs the masses for nationalism. But we are not even self-sufficient in arms.
A plausible reason for this is that India lacks a defence industry of its own sufficient to meet its external challenges and to keep pace with its expanding strategic interests. The need to modernise has indeed been one major reason for India’s status as top spender on arms imports. But there are other factors at work too.

India is still struggling to upgrade its arms manufacturing sector, despite this being a priority for over a decade. Continued reliance on foreign suppliers exposes the lack of a clear-cut vision of its defence industry.

The country’s hand was forced slightly: humiliating defeat in a war with China in 1962 and America’s refusal to share high-tech weapons meant India needed to upgrade its military capability. Given the Cold War dynamics of the time, the USSR stepped in and eventually the Indian armoury was full of Russian weapons.

India even today is importing small arms and ammunitions. A critical need that must be indigenous is left to the Import sector.
Well we can see the selectivity of left liberals who are silent on this report Is it not an agenda?

8 lane Salem Chennai road project is to add infrastructure to this Defence Corridor. Which is not in place for the past several decades

Left liberals are opposed to this and are real முட்டு கட்டை in these projects!

Damned if you do - Damned if you dont? Poor Modi!


 
The latest events in Indo- China Border. The satellite picture shows they have transgressed into our area and attacked our soldiers and three brave soldiers were killed even when the talks are going on to settle the dispute peacefully. Again I am reiterating the Chinese have a hidden design and trying to bully India. Dont give a character certificate to them. It is imperative that all patriotic Indians should boycott all chineese goods.
 

Iyest

Active member
The latest events in Indo- China Border. The satellite picture shows they have transgressed into our area and attacked our soldiers and three brave soldiers were killed even when the talks are going on to settle the dispute peacefully. Again I am reiterating the Chinese have a hidden design and trying to bully India. Dont give a character certificate to them. It is imperative that all patriotic Indians should boycott all chineese goods.
The official fatalities is now 20 but will go up further to around 150 according to people in the know. Chinese helicopters have been spotted air lifting their casualities. We will never know but their death toll could end up similar to ours.

A 'China Quit India' movement has been initiated by some asking people to boycott all Chinese goods.

It is long overdue.
 
China's true colour is already known. It is the US which has developed China. It wants to overtake US economically, militarily, politically and in all spheres. They are meticulously moving the coin to achieve the No 1 position. One simple example, their step by step movement towards establishing digital currency and replacing dollar with Renmenbi. Since 1960, from Nehrujis era they look at India as their competitor and an obstacle.
In September G 11 conference is to take place; mostly decision may be taken to isolate China. Modiji has accepted to participate in the conference. When the whole world is struggling to come out of Covid 19, including India, and millions are dying and economy in shambles, at this stage to give pinpricks to India in the border and instigating Nepal to redesign its border vis a vis India, is a calculated measure; a hidden agenda and an attempt to caution India not to venture out against China. It is not the time to have tall talks that balance of Trade is in favour of China and in Globalisation, trade with China is inevitable. As Iyest has quoted - " China, Quit India" movement has to start immediately. It can be started on 21.06.2020 - the solar eclipse day (eclipsing the adversary). As a first step please boycott all Chinese goods - however good, great, cheap etc etc may be. WE can list out the items to be avoided. In 3 months we can feel the impact. JAI HIND, JAI BHARAT
 

tbs

Well-known member
hi

when i was posted in arunachal pradesh in indian army..i saw a lot of chinese goods there....still china claims

that arunachat is part of china.....very complicated border issues....i was very close to china border...
 

Iyest

Active member
As Iyest has quoted - " China, Quit India" movement has to start immediately. It can be started on 21.06.2020 - the solar eclipse day (eclipsing the adversary). As a first step please boycott all Chinese goods - however good, great, cheap etc etc may be. WE can list out the items to be avoided. In 3 months we can feel the impact. JAI HIND, JAI BHARAT

Some common sense is appearing on the horizon at last.

The Telecom Ministry has ordered BSNL, MTNL and other private companies to ban all Chinese deals and equipment. Old tenders will be cancelled and China won't be allowed to participate, sources said.


 

renuka

Well-known member
I dont think its about banning products from China or any "enemy country".

That's just superficial reaction which leads no where.

Its heart breaking to know that the soldiers were killed with nail studded rods and many succumbed to injuries much later.

Step up is needed and may be priority should be defense and less emphasis on money spent for building statues and structures.

BTW I see that "response" seems to be less.

Somehow Pakistan Vs India gets more emotions getting worked up but China Vs India seems rather "lukewarm"

I was expecting a harsher statement from Modi.

But the actual surprise is Nepal!
Didn't expect Nepal too be trying to act smart becos big bro China is there.

Wow! I guess "Hinduness" hasnt fostered brotherhood of any kind.
Wonder why Hindu Brotherhood is almost impossible to be fostered.
 

ashok68

New member
This thread is all about border dispute between two countries more especially transgressions / interference in the other country's frontier, involving war, negotiation, treaty etc.

It is reported that it was agreed that overall situation would be handled in responsible manner by both sides and each would try to would implement disengagement and better understanding. Neither side would take any action to escalate matters & ensure peace as per bilateral agreements & protocols

While India does not want land of China or Pakisthan will definitely defend every stone, every inch of its territory.

As has been committed by our leaders, the sacrifice of our jawans will not be in vain

Let us stand in solidarity and support our leaders who will hopefully ensure peace.
 
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Iyest

Active member
This thread is all about border dispute between two countries more especially transgressions / interference in the other country's frontier, involving war, negotiation, treaty etc.

While India does not want land of China or Pakisthan will definitely defend every stone, every inch of its territory.
Seniors like me are still waiting for this to happen. May be it will happen in my lifetime, probably not.
Forget stones, forget inches. So far we have lost vast areas

Gosthana (Aksai Chin)
Gilgit Baltistan
At least 600 sq km between 2004 and 2014
At least 60 sq km since May.

We have had the Fiery Nehru, Iron Lady Indira, Brave Vajpayee, and 56 Inch Modi. How many inches and stones have we defended successfully? And about Sleepy Gowda, Weepy Singh, and Mounam Singh, the less said the better. They were shivering to even discuss the matter.

As has been committed by our leaders, the sacrifice of our jawans will not be in vain
So far they have unfortunately been in vain for over 60 years. Sad but true.

Let us stand in solidarity and support our leaders who will hopefully ensure peace.
Of course peace is always ensured if one side refuses to fight no matter what happens, regardless of how many soldiers are killed or how much territory is lost.

Our leaders (and many people) cannot understand the difference between timidity and friendship. Until a few days back all we heard was that the LAC has been peaceful for 45 years. Nice sales job. But what was the cost? How many sq kms were quietly surrendered to China during these 45 years?

Any nation that cannot even defend its own borders will never be respected and will be repeatedly humiliated. And why would smaller nations trust India over China to protect them?

China is able to influence even Sri Lanka. Even small countries like Nepal have now become aggressive. They see India as a weakling.

Simply shouting about being a 2 Trillion economy or demanding a permanent seat at the Security Council is not enough.
 

ashok68

New member
Seniors like me are still waiting for this to happen.
It is nice to note that seniors like you are still waiting for this to happen. Most of the seniors were silent and slept over such sensitive issues for nearly sixty years and now you expect a 'BAND-AID' TO RESOLVE THE ISSUE OVER NIGHT.

Can you answer me why do you went on 'KUMBAKARNAN' sleeping mode for all these sixty years...??

Cases relating to IPC or Cr PC, at times, takes twenty years to get judgement in local courts. We had a CM who was convicted in a Disproportionate Assets case which took twenty nearly years to get judgement issued.

These are relating to Border Disputes which involves application of Foreign policy and we have Government ruled by a Party which was elected with thumping majority. And such Border disputes can be resolved only either through diplomatic channels or through military.

There is interreference of international law in solving such disputes among the neighbouring countries.

While local disputes takes decades, why talk about cases of International Border Disputes/LAC, etc

What for the International Arbitration and Tribunals are there…?

Why more countries refer their cases to International Court of Justice….?

We need to accept and abide by such judgement of such Courts/Tribunals, etc

We have executed number of peace and Tranquility Agreements so far.

And there are Border Co-operation Agreements executed between the countries.

Military level talks at various levels are at times, likely or unlikely to yield any positive result.

Whether to use force or to use diplomatic channel will be decided by the leaders convening an All Party Meeting and a decision will be taken, taking into consideration the interest of the nation and welfare of the public.

In a major development, it is reported that Chinese army on Thursday returned from its customer ten Indian soldiers which include four Officers.

This is NOT certainly time to issuing provocative language and revenge.

This is certainly an hour of extending hour of co-operation.

I would request my friend to reduce the volume....:)
 
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