S
s007bala
Guest
>>I'm just a pure " I " with no adjectives like swami, not an aasami too.<<
MM,then what is impure " I ",..rofl.Same side goal..khe khe
MM,then what is impure " I ",..rofl.Same side goal..khe khe
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Brahmin Girls Marrying (Attracted towards) NB Boys
- Thread starter rprasad79
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M
malgova.mango
Guest
SB,
QED- don't use swami... too too big.
for "I" is there any impurity?
all names are adjective - so too malgova
QED- don't use swami... too too big.
for "I" is there any impurity?
all names are adjective - so too malgova
S
s007bala
Guest
QED? whats the expansion M M?
sb
sb
M
malgova.mango
Guest
QUINT-ESSENCE-DESCRIPTION ... I think ...
S
s007bala
Guest
Ponga sir M M,ippo enn mandai kayarddhu...all big big words for my puny brain
sb
sb
I have personally seen in every caste, the elders feel so proud of their culture, customs, traditions, festivals and the varied rituals (started by their ancestors in an unknown past). They have their own peculiar usages of speech, including addressing. They have some age-old stories or anecdotes on their elders - alive or not alive and this they keep on telling everyone they meet, on every occasion that is considered relevant. These are mostly in praise of the individuals concerned.
Even dress-codes and food preparation are unique to each caste or sub-sect. Therefore, it is hard to believe that these can be easily discarded - much less forgotten. If someone says so, I will not take their words at face value.
Before passing judgement on which amongst the above-described aspects is good or bad, superior or inferior, stereotyped or progressive and meaningful or meaningless, let us accept them first as they are.
When a person leaves his/her parents, he/she is not just quitting one family or one bond, but leaves a hoary past behind, only to start a fresh lineage or heredity.
This is on one side experimenting with an unknown and on the other, throwing away the security or the protection of the known. Success or failure, only the time will tell.
My only suggestion is this:
Most of the love marriages are emotional bonds and may not last long or may last but may not prove to be as successful as was dreamt of by both the parties. Therefore, the arranged marriages are the safe bet. But, if two hearts really unite, regardless of what is in store for them in future and endure their relationship without any decay or
split, it is their decision and they only are responsible for it. In Indian context, even today, the marriage bond is mostly entering into an irreversible/irrevocable agreement for a life time. Hence, the pros and cons, gains and losses and pleasures and pains and finally, the achievements and sacrifices are to be looked into in depth, preferably with a help of a third party, in whom the boy as well as the girl repose full faith and confidence.
This applies to all kind of love marriages.
Even dress-codes and food preparation are unique to each caste or sub-sect. Therefore, it is hard to believe that these can be easily discarded - much less forgotten. If someone says so, I will not take their words at face value.
Before passing judgement on which amongst the above-described aspects is good or bad, superior or inferior, stereotyped or progressive and meaningful or meaningless, let us accept them first as they are.
When a person leaves his/her parents, he/she is not just quitting one family or one bond, but leaves a hoary past behind, only to start a fresh lineage or heredity.
This is on one side experimenting with an unknown and on the other, throwing away the security or the protection of the known. Success or failure, only the time will tell.
My only suggestion is this:
Most of the love marriages are emotional bonds and may not last long or may last but may not prove to be as successful as was dreamt of by both the parties. Therefore, the arranged marriages are the safe bet. But, if two hearts really unite, regardless of what is in store for them in future and endure their relationship without any decay or
split, it is their decision and they only are responsible for it. In Indian context, even today, the marriage bond is mostly entering into an irreversible/irrevocable agreement for a life time. Hence, the pros and cons, gains and losses and pleasures and pains and finally, the achievements and sacrifices are to be looked into in depth, preferably with a help of a third party, in whom the boy as well as the girl repose full faith and confidence.
This applies to all kind of love marriages.
S
s007bala
Guest
Shri Pannvalan
Education for girls and boys are of equal quality.Parents need to understand,the exposure present generation are getting.We cannot and should not force sampradayas,unless we explain it,in scientific manner.
Every itty bit,i drag science.Otherwise our religion,is totally religious fiction.So,parents need to coach.For that parents themselves have to be coached.Thankfully online websites have cropped up.Giving wealth of information.
After seeing life in USA,Australia,Canada......i am just widening my thinking.In fact,now i feel,only Boy & Girl are the only two criteria.Then Manas poruthham.With supervised dating system in common place.You know,we need to re-innovate ourselves.Of course i am talking for western target audience.In India,i know,we still have all our customs & traditions in tact.So,something has to be thought of....
sb
Education for girls and boys are of equal quality.Parents need to understand,the exposure present generation are getting.We cannot and should not force sampradayas,unless we explain it,in scientific manner.
Every itty bit,i drag science.Otherwise our religion,is totally religious fiction.So,parents need to coach.For that parents themselves have to be coached.Thankfully online websites have cropped up.Giving wealth of information.
After seeing life in USA,Australia,Canada......i am just widening my thinking.In fact,now i feel,only Boy & Girl are the only two criteria.Then Manas poruthham.With supervised dating system in common place.You know,we need to re-innovate ourselves.Of course i am talking for western target audience.In India,i know,we still have all our customs & traditions in tact.So,something has to be thought of....
sb
tbs
0
hi all ,
namaskarams... THERE ARE 3D' s IN SICENCE.. means 3 dimensions
in physics. but in reality 3D's means according to indian value system..DEVOTION ...DEDICATION... DITERMINATION... but
according to western system...DATING...DIVORSE ..DESTROY..
here we can add onr more D value...dating/drugs...so
we need devotion to god/ dedication to work/ determination
to achieve a good human beings to society by materially
with spirituality..
Regards
tbs
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M
malgova.mango
Guest
sb
how about "GIST" aka "in a nut shell" - your brain is no punny - you may be BS (Brahma Sri) who knows.
Regards
how about "GIST" aka "in a nut shell" - your brain is no punny - you may be BS (Brahma Sri) who knows.
Regards
Talking about meeting of girls and boys, most Christians especially the Catholics also value the family system. Reader's digest was a magazine devoted to family values. Catholics do not approve of divorce. We are definitely not alone in wanting to preserve family values and tradition.
Dances under the supervision of the parents used to be arranged for this mingling of girls and boys. The parents sat around and decided who will dance with whom. When we took part in the dances of CSU (Catholic students union), Hindus had a tough time getting girls to dance with, since the parents would not permit that. All of us considered them as spoil sport.
Dances under the supervision of the parents used to be arranged for this mingling of girls and boys. The parents sat around and decided who will dance with whom. When we took part in the dances of CSU (Catholic students union), Hindus had a tough time getting girls to dance with, since the parents would not permit that. All of us considered them as spoil sport.
The biggest handicap we have in our community is the over dependence on matching of horoscopes. There is no statistics available to prove that marriages with matched horoscopes are in any way better than the one without. If you know the girl and her family what prevents you from getting that girl married to your son? Same case with Boys.
In the old days we had a system of "Poo pottu parkirathu". The system I know is you make two packets of Vibhuti and Kumkum and place them before the Deity in a temple. The priest chooses a packet. If it is Kumkum the alliance is O.K. That is how my parents got married. They had decades of happy married life. Till death so us apart was applicable to them.
Let everyone who reads this post ask himself/herself. Do you not know of Tamil Brahmin families where the husband and wife are not compatible?
Please think. Is it not better to get a bride/Groom whose family you know than getting an unknown Bride/groom through ads.?
Let us get rid of this obsession with horoscope matching.
Is it human to let two incompatible people go through decades of misery because the community does not believe in Divorce? I have seen families like that. It tells very badly on the children. Now that the stigma attached to divorce is gone, the younger people prefer divorce over misery. What is wrong with that? No one in the world gets married to get divorced later. Divorce is psychologically one of the worst things that a human being could go through.
So condemning Divorce wholesale is wrong. When a limb of a human being gets gangrene the doctors advise the patient to amputate the limb. Amputtion is bad. But it is resorted to save the life of the patient. Divorce is like that.
In the old days we had a system of "Poo pottu parkirathu". The system I know is you make two packets of Vibhuti and Kumkum and place them before the Deity in a temple. The priest chooses a packet. If it is Kumkum the alliance is O.K. That is how my parents got married. They had decades of happy married life. Till death so us apart was applicable to them.
Let everyone who reads this post ask himself/herself. Do you not know of Tamil Brahmin families where the husband and wife are not compatible?
Please think. Is it not better to get a bride/Groom whose family you know than getting an unknown Bride/groom through ads.?
Let us get rid of this obsession with horoscope matching.
Is it human to let two incompatible people go through decades of misery because the community does not believe in Divorce? I have seen families like that. It tells very badly on the children. Now that the stigma attached to divorce is gone, the younger people prefer divorce over misery. What is wrong with that? No one in the world gets married to get divorced later. Divorce is psychologically one of the worst things that a human being could go through.
So condemning Divorce wholesale is wrong. When a limb of a human being gets gangrene the doctors advise the patient to amputate the limb. Amputtion is bad. But it is resorted to save the life of the patient. Divorce is like that.
tbs
0
hi Nacchi sir,
Last year when i visited chennai, i came to know a surprise in our new
generation. there are three types of marriages ....we haerd only 2
in old days....1, arranged marriage 2, Love marriage........we all
know that. no more explanations required......but i heard a new
type marriage system called SEMI ARRANGED...means boy/girl
select themselves with love and get permission from parents.
so i like this new system...preferably with parents blessing
boys/girls love succeeded..
regards
tbs:heh:
This was happening in the old days also though not very common. They bribed the astrologer to match the horoscopes. The bribing was done by the boy/girl and many times by the parents. My father always insisted on verifying the matching the horoscopes himself. If it is Pookattal they presented to the deity two packets of Kumkum instead of one with Vhibuti and other of Kumkumam.
"Ayiram poycholliyum oru Kalyanam Pannalam". Yes. They did it.
"Ayiram poycholliyum oru Kalyanam Pannalam". Yes. They did it.
S
s007bala
Guest
>>Please think. Is it not better to get a bride/Groom whose family you know than getting an unknown Bride/groom through ads.?<<
Do we know ourselves first?to say we know other's.It's all a 50-50 chance.It's all Lord's grace.Whether astro-mapping or dating or pre-marital sex living together or ......to have a family,all you need is a man & woman...if there is consent amongst themselves and work things amongst themselves,they need to be together....if they do not like each other and are constantly fighting amongst themselves,then temperorily try being seperate.If it works fine,and still if it does not,go seperate ways.The sanctity thats being given thru religion,is a homogeneous structure.
I see men and women here in USA,living together,begetting children,without any sanctity of church or temple or ...so,as per natural laws,one can live..that is how it was eons before..now its all human made rules and regulations..so that we have a semblance of order,hierarchy....
With one Bhu-LOka,we have gone and created more than 200 countries with borders and millions of languages,millions of religious practices and hold on to them as memories or pass it on to the next generations orally or thru written works...but what exactly is reality..two people,consenting...period.
sb
Do we know ourselves first?to say we know other's.It's all a 50-50 chance.It's all Lord's grace.Whether astro-mapping or dating or pre-marital sex living together or ......to have a family,all you need is a man & woman...if there is consent amongst themselves and work things amongst themselves,they need to be together....if they do not like each other and are constantly fighting amongst themselves,then temperorily try being seperate.If it works fine,and still if it does not,go seperate ways.The sanctity thats being given thru religion,is a homogeneous structure.
I see men and women here in USA,living together,begetting children,without any sanctity of church or temple or ...so,as per natural laws,one can live..that is how it was eons before..now its all human made rules and regulations..so that we have a semblance of order,hierarchy....
With one Bhu-LOka,we have gone and created more than 200 countries with borders and millions of languages,millions of religious practices and hold on to them as memories or pass it on to the next generations orally or thru written works...but what exactly is reality..two people,consenting...period.
sb Dear Bala,
Please stop comparing American culture with ours, in sensitive issues like marriage. I too possess liberal views on so many issues, but I am very selective.
I cherish and value the gifts of our ancestors in the areas of culture and tradition and even knowledge, openness and flexibility. These can not be paradoxical or opposite to each other. I am fully conscious of their respective domains and limits too.
Please stop comparing American culture with ours, in sensitive issues like marriage. I too possess liberal views on so many issues, but I am very selective.
I cherish and value the gifts of our ancestors in the areas of culture and tradition and even knowledge, openness and flexibility. These can not be paradoxical or opposite to each other. I am fully conscious of their respective domains and limits too.
S
s007bala
Guest
Shri pannvalan
My point is Indians ancients followed present day Americans or rather present day Americans follow Indians of ancient eras.I see so many clues of the past to allude this truth.We were all tribal people once.Clans.Clannish.Evolved into a social structure.It all depends upon how far back in ancient era one wants to delve deeply.
Today in India,the education imparted is western conceptualised pattern of imparting knowledge.You will have an end result similiar to whats happening in western cultures only.The variety of seed and the variety of land,sort of determines the growth of the seed & land.
While a minority of the citizenry is indulging in Guru-Shisya Parampara and Sampradayas,that is why when faced with trials & trinbulations our political leaders are constantly seeking out Sankara-Acharyas,Babas,Ammas.....becoz the system of governance is British Western Conceptualised of Governave..not the Panchayat system which is a home grown thingy...and so on...
Our youngsters are following Valentines day..but our Vedic practices also mention special days in 365 days/year.Different calendars existed in the sub continent.....
sb
My point is Indians ancients followed present day Americans or rather present day Americans follow Indians of ancient eras.I see so many clues of the past to allude this truth.We were all tribal people once.Clans.Clannish.Evolved into a social structure.It all depends upon how far back in ancient era one wants to delve deeply.
Today in India,the education imparted is western conceptualised pattern of imparting knowledge.You will have an end result similiar to whats happening in western cultures only.The variety of seed and the variety of land,sort of determines the growth of the seed & land.
While a minority of the citizenry is indulging in Guru-Shisya Parampara and Sampradayas,that is why when faced with trials & trinbulations our political leaders are constantly seeking out Sankara-Acharyas,Babas,Ammas.....becoz the system of governance is British Western Conceptualised of Governave..not the Panchayat system which is a home grown thingy...and so on...
Our youngsters are following Valentines day..but our Vedic practices also mention special days in 365 days/year.Different calendars existed in the sub continent.....
sb
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it is easy to express views one way or the other. Only the sufferer knows the pain. The boy or the girl may be of 20+age and matured physically. They may be earning tons of money for themselves or for their company. This does not mean that they are mature enought to choose a partner on their own. Old is gold is true and valid in this aspect. The wisdom of parents/elders who have come a full circle as a teenager, middle-aged and senior citizen will have a better and wholistic look at man-woman relationship which has to be lasting in the interest of bride as well as the groom.
The principle of right to freedom may not work well in all circumstances. Elders may not be as educated as of today's youth. They may not have travelled extensively, may not have known the varying cultures, etc. But their acquired wisdom of adjustments in life and practical difficulties that may arise on account of inter-caste marriage in view of the change in customs and practices will come in handy for sure. After all we can not revert back and so every step needs to be taken carefully.
Time-tested customs and practises of the country can not be just brushed aside as outdated.
Let us hope good things happen to our community as a whole.
Wasn't the thread about Brahmin Girls Marrying (Attracted towards) NB Boys?
I had posted my views on this earlier, but the spiritual underscore did not seem to appeal much, though that was the primary reason for women from other castes/religions to look up to brahmin men in the past.
Well, then let's take a look at the material aspect...many brahmin girls say yes to their parents if the guy is employed well, looks good and seems to allow her a life which would not be bound by too much discipline.
Only in the last 20-30 years there are many brahmins moving into unconventional professions which yield more money. Of course good looks is something that is individual. Normally in brahmin families there have been too much discipline expected of the bride, while the brahmin boy has enjoyed much more relaxation. Times are changing fast, the relaxation is being extended both ways in the recent years. Of course the relaxation (for both) is also diluting the culture in many places, but it has been accepted by many as a necessary evil in order to keep the family together.
I would say there would be a natural reversal, whereby brahmin boys will be sought after by the time, today's new borns reach their marriageable age.
But, if we want to keep the tradition alive and stable, the only way is to groom the children into spiritual ways of life while they live the lives of a householder.
I had posted my views on this earlier, but the spiritual underscore did not seem to appeal much, though that was the primary reason for women from other castes/religions to look up to brahmin men in the past.
Well, then let's take a look at the material aspect...many brahmin girls say yes to their parents if the guy is employed well, looks good and seems to allow her a life which would not be bound by too much discipline.
Only in the last 20-30 years there are many brahmins moving into unconventional professions which yield more money. Of course good looks is something that is individual. Normally in brahmin families there have been too much discipline expected of the bride, while the brahmin boy has enjoyed much more relaxation. Times are changing fast, the relaxation is being extended both ways in the recent years. Of course the relaxation (for both) is also diluting the culture in many places, but it has been accepted by many as a necessary evil in order to keep the family together.
I would say there would be a natural reversal, whereby brahmin boys will be sought after by the time, today's new borns reach their marriageable age.
But, if we want to keep the tradition alive and stable, the only way is to groom the children into spiritual ways of life while they live the lives of a householder.
Hello Ram
I agree with you that brahmin girls are getting married to NB boys arranged by love. Success rate is 5%. Percentage of failure 95%. I completely understand feelings of your FIL.
In my family circles, I can confirm that we are looking for a girl for those 12 boys. All 12 boys have completed education well and working and earning decently to take care of family and their parents. These boys are very caring, orthodox and modern to the need of situation, well read.
Yet when we approach girl's parents, their demands are always 100% more than what each of these boys are at present financially. On this expectation from parents of girls, keep them waiting to find a so called very well settled boys, make the girls frustrated and our brahmin girls explore options to find out the way out. Parents of girls start discussing marriage plan when girl start going to first year of college so the situation are exactly the way you have described. In the process, visit any matrimony site and ratio of girls available to boys is 33 to 100!!. Worst scenario.
Rather than blaming girls in our community, Parents should be educated to opt for a reasonable boy based on family and cultural values and his ability to lead a decent family life and not only concentrate on financial background. I am sure this would lead to a quicker decision and we can provide the girls in our community the necessary comfort our girls need biologically and morally.
Good luck to all these 12 wonderful boys......
I agree with you that brahmin girls are getting married to NB boys arranged by love. Success rate is 5%. Percentage of failure 95%. I completely understand feelings of your FIL.
In my family circles, I can confirm that we are looking for a girl for those 12 boys. All 12 boys have completed education well and working and earning decently to take care of family and their parents. These boys are very caring, orthodox and modern to the need of situation, well read.
Yet when we approach girl's parents, their demands are always 100% more than what each of these boys are at present financially. On this expectation from parents of girls, keep them waiting to find a so called very well settled boys, make the girls frustrated and our brahmin girls explore options to find out the way out. Parents of girls start discussing marriage plan when girl start going to first year of college so the situation are exactly the way you have described. In the process, visit any matrimony site and ratio of girls available to boys is 33 to 100!!. Worst scenario.
Rather than blaming girls in our community, Parents should be educated to opt for a reasonable boy based on family and cultural values and his ability to lead a decent family life and not only concentrate on financial background. I am sure this would lead to a quicker decision and we can provide the girls in our community the necessary comfort our girls need biologically and morally.
Good luck to all these 12 wonderful boys......
Dear Rajan,
1. Girls of the present times want to play an equal role in choosing their future life-
partner. But, they do not know how to go about it exactly.
2. In order to assert themselves, the girls goad their parents to put so many
counter-demands to the boys' parents. These are sometimes astonishing and
shocking.
3. In so called elite families, marriages are fixed between the social status and
income of the boy and that of the girl. Thus, it is no longer a marriage of minds.
4. The urban girls have become so calculative and selfish that they put so many
conditions to the boy beforehand and remain stubborn in their stance. In this,
I don't want to blame the young girls alone. Their parents who boast that they
have brought up their daughter like a boy (male) with total independence are to
share the blame too.
I do not support the old hypothesis that the boys' side must have an upper hand
in marriage affairs. My only wish is both the boys and girls and their respective relatives must behave sensibly and conduct themselves with decency and decorum.
Is that a big dream?
1. Girls of the present times want to play an equal role in choosing their future life-
partner. But, they do not know how to go about it exactly.
2. In order to assert themselves, the girls goad their parents to put so many
counter-demands to the boys' parents. These are sometimes astonishing and
shocking.
3. In so called elite families, marriages are fixed between the social status and
income of the boy and that of the girl. Thus, it is no longer a marriage of minds.
4. The urban girls have become so calculative and selfish that they put so many
conditions to the boy beforehand and remain stubborn in their stance. In this,
I don't want to blame the young girls alone. Their parents who boast that they
have brought up their daughter like a boy (male) with total independence are to
share the blame too.
I do not support the old hypothesis that the boys' side must have an upper hand
in marriage affairs. My only wish is both the boys and girls and their respective relatives must behave sensibly and conduct themselves with decency and decorum.
Is that a big dream?
Dear Mr. Pannvalan
Agree with you that old hypothesis that boys side should not have upper hand and there should be equal understanding from both sides.
What I am experiencing that girls side is having upper hand and showing high handedness in dealing with parents of boys....
I have no issue at all about girls coming up on their own, checking facts beforehand or expressing out their ambition or expections well in advance. I appreciate the way brahmin communitiy as a whole in this regard.
However, when it comes to marriage old hypothesis which you are referring to for boys side is now being transfered to girls side.
I can only wish your dream comes true!
Agree with you that old hypothesis that boys side should not have upper hand and there should be equal understanding from both sides.
What I am experiencing that girls side is having upper hand and showing high handedness in dealing with parents of boys....
I have no issue at all about girls coming up on their own, checking facts beforehand or expressing out their ambition or expections well in advance. I appreciate the way brahmin communitiy as a whole in this regard.
However, when it comes to marriage old hypothesis which you are referring to for boys side is now being transfered to girls side.
I can only wish your dream comes true!
S
s007bala
Guest
Brahmin girls are very progressive minded.So,the curiosity of non-brahmin boys.Especially in TN girls know Brahmin men are being subjected to persecution and are in no position to safeguard them from verbal teasing,pinching in buses,generally with deliberate coaching of Kazhagams over the years,brahmins being ridiculed.No brahmana is any longer proud of his heritage and contributions.Truly a disgusting state of affairs in TN.I really empathise with the girls.
sb
sb
Dear Bala,
Your inference is not correct. Brahmin girls of TN do not marry boys of other communities, only to avoid marrying a Brahmin boy. They just get attracted to a person of their choice, regardless of his caste and other identities.
It is also true that many brahmin girls (may be less than 10%) prefer to be independent and they think one way of establishing their independence is to marry a boy from another caste. This thinking of theirs mostly ruins their personal life forever.
But, before wisdom dawns on them, everything is over. How pitiable!
Your inference is not correct. Brahmin girls of TN do not marry boys of other communities, only to avoid marrying a Brahmin boy. They just get attracted to a person of their choice, regardless of his caste and other identities.
It is also true that many brahmin girls (may be less than 10%) prefer to be independent and they think one way of establishing their independence is to marry a boy from another caste. This thinking of theirs mostly ruins their personal life forever.
But, before wisdom dawns on them, everything is over. How pitiable!
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