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What we do not know about Gadaffi, the dictator.

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suraju06

Well-known member
The media has successfully painted Gaddafi as a hard-core dictator, tyrant whatever you want to call him. However, the media as usual has also failed to show the kind, giving Gaddafi we never heard of. Gaddafi unlike most dictators I will refrain from naming them has managed to show his humane side, the very side we dream of seeing in other dictators who just talk and talk.

I consider Libyans lucky to a certain extent and one wonders with the new democratic rule they cry for will it improve or worsen life for them. Yes, Gaddafi has spent millions of Libya`s money on personal ventures but is the average Libyan poor? We know others who take a country and destroy it until you feel like there is no hope of restoring this country… looting some prefer to call it. Did Gaddafi loot Libya in any way?
Now let us get to the unknown facts about the Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi:

1. There is no electricity bill in Libya; electricity is free for all its citizens.
2. There is no interest on loans, banks in Libya are state-owned and loans given to all its citizens at 0% interest by law.
3. Home considered a human right in Libya – Gaddafi vowed that his parents would not get a house until everyone in Libya had a home. Gaddafi’s father has died while him, his wife and his mother are still living in a tent.
4. All newlyweds in Libya receive $60,000 Dinar (US$50,000) by the government to buy their first apartment so to help start up the family.
5. Education and medical treatments are free in Libya. Before Gaddafi only 25% of Libyans are literate. Today the figure is 83%.
6. Should Libyans want to take up farming career, they would receive farming land, a farming house, equipments, seeds and livestock to kick-start their farms – all for free.
7. If Libyans cannot find the education or medical facilities they need in Libya, the government funds them to go abroad for it – not only free but they get US$2,300/mth accommodation and car allowance.
8. In Libyan, if a Libyan buys a car, the government subsidized 50% of the price.
9. The price of petrol in Libya is $0.14 per liter.
10. Libya has no external debt and its reserves amount to $150 billion – now frozen globally.

11. If a Libyan is unable to get employment after graduation the state would pay the average salary of the profession as if he or she is employed until employment is found.
12. A portion of Libyan oil sale is, credited directly to the bank accounts of all Libyan citizens.
13. A mother who gave birth to a child receive US$5,000
14. 40 loaves of bread in Libya costs $ 0.15
15. 25% of Libyans have a university degree
16. Gaddafi carried out the world’s largest irrigation project, known as the Great Man-Made River project, to make water readily available throughout the desert country.
Which other dictator has done much good to his people besides
 

Visalakshi Ramani

Well-known member
dear Mr. Raju,

I think Libya must be renamed as 'Utopia'.

The info you have given is too good to be true.

If it is true ....:suspicious:

Then why do people brand Gaddafi as a tyrant?

Why do they celebrate his death?

Why do they want to be photographed with his corpse?

I am really and totally confused for the first time in my entire life!!! :confused:

In fact what more can honest citizens ask for than all these perks, gifts and concessions ???
 
OP
OP
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suraju06

Well-known member
Dear Visalakshi Ramani,

That is the power of media which is controlled by super powers. Most of the goodies mentioned here in the case of Libya are also applicable to some of the other Arabian countries ruled by the sultans. Because the population is sparse and crude commands a fancy price in the commodity markets the kitties are overflowing. There is an urgency to spend because avenues are there. It is a dream world there.

Cheers.
 

Visalakshi Ramani

Well-known member
Dear Mr. Raju,
Wow! the money part is explained by you very well!
Are the sultans curbing the personal freedom then?
There must be SOME cause for the general hatred!
I am :confused: still!!!
 
OP
OP
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suraju06

Well-known member
Dear Visalakshi Ramani,

In a dictatorship because of the very nature of of the scheme of things the dictator is the point at which the buck stops. He is responsible for everything good or bad that is happening. When he has a powerful external enemy who uses every trick in the book to topple him and sends in the NATO bombers to strafe him you know what will be the end of that dictator. He ends up in a gutter as it happened in the case of Gaddafi. some sultans survive because they are more than friendly to the Super power. People do not remember their personal freedom until some one reminds them about it. Hatred is an opiate and its sales figures depends purely on the enterprising seller.
 

Visalakshi Ramani

Well-known member
Dear Mr. Raju,
Can we compare the person who learns to befriend the powerful people and survive to Ettappan and the one who does not know the art of survival to Kattabomman?


Dear Visalakshi Ramani,

In a dictatorship because of the very nature of of the scheme of things the dictator is the point at which the buck stops. He is responsible for everything good or bad that is happening. When he has a powerful external enemy who uses every trick in the book to topple him and sends in the NATO bombers to strafe him you know what will be the end of that dictator. He ends up in a gutter as it happened in the case of Gaddafi. some sultans survive because they are more than friendly to the Super power. People do not remember their personal freedom until some one reminds them about it. Hatred is an opiate and its sales figures depends purely on the enterprising seller.
 
OP
OP
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suraju06

Well-known member
Dear Mr. Raju,
Can we compare the person who learns to befriend the powerful people and survive to Ettappan and the one who does not know the art of survival to Kattabomman?

Though this may sound fatalistic, Kattabomman can only be a Kattabomman while ettappan can only be a Ettappan. They are wired and designed that way. They have no freedom to interchange the circuitry.

Cheers.
 

B.Krishnamurthy

Active member
I also got a mail in another Forum,the contents of what Shri.Suraj 06 has written in the first post in this thread.
I also got another mail in the same forum about the ownership of major TV channels and major Newspapers in India.
It is possible to manipulate news and keep important news from the knowledge of common people.
It is all disturbing.The people of middle east are paying a heavy price because of their leaders and some western countries who want to control the natural resorces of the World.
As a diversion,I enjoy "Libyan Music" specially Children's lyrics in youtube.com along with my grand kids.
 

Visalakshi Ramani

Well-known member
Please arrange the words given below in the increasing order of falsehood!

Lies, damed lies, blasphemies, statistics and media reports.


lies < damned lies,

damed lies <
blasphemies,

blasphemies <
statistics

statistics < mass media reports.

[ The symbol < stands for lesser than / smaller than]

Mass media reporters can make a mole hill out of a mountain and vice versa.

The most powerful tool is in the world is in the hands of the most unscrupulous people in the world.

Reminds me of the classic tale in which a sword is given in the hands of a drunken monkey which also got stung by a scorpion!!!

 
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amala

Well-known member
Hopefully the Libyan ingrates rejoicing his death regret it when their new leader makes them pay for the utilities unlike Ghaddafi...oh well...
 

biswa

New member
If Gaddafi was so good, why didn't he hold free and fair elections? Surely he would have won hands down? Same applies to the Communist Party in China. What are you afraid of?
 

prasad1

Well-known member
If Gaddafi was so good, why didn't he hold free and fair elections? Surely he would have won hands down? Same applies to the Communist Party in China. What are you afraid of?

I do think that democracy is not the most efficient form of government, but it the best among the available forms of government.

So if you have to pick between a democratic government vs a benevolent dictator it will be like picking the less of personal freedom or economic progress.

Mr. Gaddafy was not a benevolent dictator, Mr. Lee kwan yew was one and the country did well under him. Most of the dictators have been evil people.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
A benevolent dictator, who is working for the people, and betterment of the entire country, and does not accumulate personal power or is not enriching his family, even make sure that country is managed after he/she is gone.

Lee Kwan Yew built Singapore. He also put in place all the trappings of a multi-party democracy but was effectively the benevolent dictator who controlled every aspect of life for over 40 years (31 years officially as Prime Minister and for a decade afterwards).

Benevolent dictatorship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

C RAVI

Well-known member
Is there any valid proof of all the good offerings of Gadaffi that all been listed out in OP??

AFA I could come to know, couple of years before, through my GM, who lived in Libya between 1995-2001, Libyan citizens were very much upset by Gadaffi's strategies and policies. People were deliberately kept ignorant of the outside world. Hardly people would look/appear well groomed and wealthy. The media was absolutely under his control (obviously) and there was nothing transparant to justify his claims. Hid did offer some social welfare schemes but not as much as any other oil rich countries kings offered/offering.

Considering the detailed listing of great social schemes of Gadaffi's regime in OP as the truth, I am surprised as what else and how sensible can be the reasons for such civil unrest in Libya against Muammar Gadaffi's regime, making him undergo a pathetical death? Why there was no international unity call and group support, signing group petition against mistreatment to Gadaffi?


If dethronig Gadaffi was an outsider's sting operation, what made the citizens of Libya to support such actions against their great leader who offered so much for their easy living/wellbeing?


I am really confused :noidea:


 

biswa

New member
A benevolent dictator, who is working for the people, and betterment of the entire country, and does not accumulate personal power or is not enriching his family, even make sure that country is managed after he/she is gone.

Lee Kwan Yew built Singapore. He also put in place all the trappings of a multi-party democracy but was effectively the benevolent dictator who controlled every aspect of life for over 40 years (31 years officially as Prime Minister and for a decade afterwards).

Benevolent dictatorship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I have a weakness for the benevolent dictator model, probably because I think of myself as the benevolent dictator! :D

That said one wonders what Libya would have been without Gaddafi or Singapore without Lee Kwan Yew. In any scientific experiment one needs a control. Of course we know what India has done with its brand of democracy...
 

prasad1

Well-known member
I have a weakness for the benevolent dictator model, probably because I think of myself as the benevolent dictator! :D

That said one wonders what Libya would have been without Gaddafi or Singapore without Lee Kwan Yew. In any scientific experiment one needs a control. Of course we know what India has done with its brand of democracy...

I suppose you can only compare with their neighbors. So let us compare Singapore with Malaysia.

Since its independence in 1965, Singapore did not look back except to find out just how far its economy has come—a 189-fold growth—giving a boost on its GDP per capita, totaling to US$36,537 from last year’s US$512.Nevertheless, Malaysia, not understanding the significance of optimizing its human capital, has an economic expansion at one-third the rate since 1965 and had its GDP per capita of US$6,975 in 2009, breaking away from 1965’s GDP at US $335.

Singapore May Outdo Malaysia
 

kunjuppu

Well-known member
I suppose you can only compare with their neighbors. So let us compare Singapore with Malaysia.



Singapore May Outdo Malaysia

prasad,

hope you are not rooting for singpo over malaysia, any day.

these are like apples and oranges, and BOTH are contemptuous of india.

let us look at the situations of the tamils in both these countries.

lee kwan yew, described india, as a bad example to be avoided. his initial enthusiasm for socialism waned away, when he visited new delhi in the 1960s and saw the bastees. 'not that' for singpo, he said.

malay tamils are the worst discriminated in that stratfied society based on ranks, bestowed by the state (datuk, datuk sri, datuk sri sri... etc). i do not mean the tambrams who are recent immigrants. i mean the descendents of the (rubber, tin) plantation workers who migrated there century and more ago.

that the malay tamils are wedded to tamil nadu at the hip, is a fact. a malay or singpo tamil speaks tamil just like those in tamil nadu (unlike sri lanka). some say, that it is their inability or unwillingness, to divorce themselves from their identification to the tamil nadu of rajanikanth or MGR is their undoing.

after all, no one likes fellow citizens to have extra national allegiance. in india, any muslim waving a pakistani flag is suspect. i guess in malaysia or singpo, any tamil jaiying for jayalalitha, is an equal suspect.

when will we ever learn. in rome, do as the romans.

:)

comparing singpo with malaysia, is of no use to us indians. or tambrams. one is moon. the other is sun. both far far away from tamil nadu. india.

so why bother?

might as well, for an academic exercise, compare usa with canada or argentina with burkina faso!!
 
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sangom

Well-known member
that the malay tamils are wedded to tamil nadu at the hip, is a fact. a malay or singpo tamil speaks tamil just like those in tamil nadu (unlike sri lanka). some say, that it is their inability or unwillingness, to divorce themselves from their identification to the tamil nadu of rajanikanth or MGR is their undoing.

after all, no one likes fellow citizens to have extra national allegiance. in india, any muslim waving a pakistani flag is suspect. i guess in malaysia or singpo, any tamil jaiying for jayalalitha, is an equal suspect.

when will we ever learn. in rome, do as the romans.

:)
Kunjuppu,

I think the problem with Singapore Tamils is that they do not intrinsically vibe with the 'discipline' there. The Tamils are also behind trade unions and generally the tamils shirk work. These are some factors which an Indian Tabra brahmin executive one told me as to why he would love to dismiss all tamils from his singapore banch.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
Mr Kunjuppu post#21
had moved on to discussing Dictator, benevolent Dictator, Democracy etc. Then we discussing about Singapore's growth. So my post was purely from the economic point of view. I have no knowledge of the social system of Malaysia and Singapore except as a tourist.
 

amala

Well-known member
Over the years I have found that people from India, whether they still live in India or New Zealand (both tb and non tb) would like to believe certain things about local Msian and Spore Tamils. Nothing otherwise would dissuade them from their rigid, somewhat snooty opinions of Tamils/Indians of the Malay archipelago. So best leave it at that.

And Shri Sangom am so not surprised at your Indian tabra's opinion of Spore Tamils. Nothing we all haven't heard before :)
 

kunjuppu

Well-known member
oh well, here is some more stuff about gadaffi that some of us might not have known, but cannot claim to be ignorant anymore... after reading the below article.

:)

Gaddafi
 
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