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Marriage in Same Gothra if performed by Girls mothers Sister & Her husband

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sangom

Well-known member
There is a girl belonging to Bharadwaja Gothram wants to marry a boy of the same gothram. Girl's mother's sister and her husband belonging to a different gothram wants to perform the marriage rituals for that girl. Will it be agreeable as per Tamil Brahmin Sastras.

Shri Srinivas,

If a girl wants to marry a boy for which there is no objection from any quarters why should it be ensured that it is according to Tamil Brahmin Sastras? Why are we, tabras, so much obsessive about "sastram"?
 

wrongan

Active member
[h=2]Marriage in Same Gothra if performed by Girls mothers Sister & Her husband[/h]
There is a girl belonging to Bharadwaja Gothram wants to marry a boy of the same gothram. Girl's mother's sister and her husband belonging to a different gothram wants to perform the marriage rituals for that girl. Will it be agreeable as per Tamil Brahmin Sastras.---------------first of all there is nothing called tamil brahmin sastras.ie no sastras for each languages.Secondly sastras say "SAstraya ya cha sukaya cha."That means it is for the wellbeing of all.When once you have determined to break one tradition ie same gotra marriage then why do you worry about other things.It is like going towards east for your destination lying on west,then questioning the way siders whether you can go by train or bus.:mad2:​
 
R

Ramacchandran

Guest
The girl can migrate to other gothra, go for adoption to her uncle! This was done by a Brahmin girl family some 30 years back in my place!
 

prasad1

Well-known member
Do you even know the meaning of Gothra? It is like a alumni of a gurukul. So this ban of sagothra marriage is only among Brahmins of south India. If a sastrigal would object change location, change pujari, or go to some northern state for marriage. You can also bribe the priest.
 

wrongan

Active member
Do you even know the meaning of Gothra? It is like a alumni of a gurukul. So this ban of sagothra marriage is only among Brahmins of south India. If a sastrigal would object change location, change pujari, or go to some northern state for marriage. You can also bribe the priest.

But not to Punjab or Hariyana as for I know because both bride and bride groom may not have their head over their neck.for marrying a sa gothran.
 

H.Krishnamurthy

Active member
There is a girl belonging to Bharadwaja Gothram wants to marry a boy of the same gothram. Girl's mother's sister and her husband belonging to a different gothram wants to perform the marriage rituals for that girl. Will it be agreeable as per Tamil Brahmin Sastras.
No sir,
Leave alone Sastras even scientifically it is wrong.
Such marriages will have impact on the kids which this pair give birth to.
Either kids will have physical or mental troubles.
One of my close friends relatives , got married and was a Love marriage. happened against the wish of the Bride's parents. Groom's parent acceepted the marriage for 2 reasons . First being the bride also belongs to Iyer community second the parents were tottally depending on his son for their lively hood hence don't want to go against the wishes of their son. But the girl was not aware of her Gothram and the Boy's parent were aware that both belong to same Gothram.
The result the pair gave birth to Mangaloid kids and the reason quoted by Doctors is it is the problem of Geen.
Now nothing can be done and the pair is living with 2 mangaloid kids of age 14 and 11 years and the real sad part is both are girls and the first one matured a year back. Even during the monthly event of the Girl , the mother to take care of changing Napkin and other requirements like.
Please donot do this mistake.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
No sir,
Leave alone Sastras even scientifically it is wrong.
Such marriages will have impact on the kids which this pair give birth to.
Either kids will have physical or mental troubles.
One of my close friends relatives , got married and was a Love marriage. happened against the wish of the Bride's parents. Groom's parent acceepted the marriage for 2 reasons . First being the bride also belongs to Iyer community second the parents were tottally depending on his son for their lively hood hence don't want to go against the wishes of their son. But the girl was not aware of her Gothram and the Boy's parent were aware that both belong to same Gothram.
The result the pair gave birth to Mangaloid kids and the reason quoted by Doctors is it is the problem of Geen.
Now nothing can be done and the pair is living with 2 mangaloid kids of age 14 and 11 years and the real sad part is both are girls and the first one matured a year back. Even during the monthly event of the Girl , the mother to take care of changing Napkin and other requirements like.
Please donot do this mistake.


I am deeply troubled by your ignorance, In addition your audacity to post on a public forum such scary, wrong and dangerous consequence. I wish you would remove it.

For a community that marries their cousin, uncle and many close relations you claim a sagothra marriage as if it is incest. Gothram is like an alumni and nothing more. Check your facts before posting.

In the world 99% of unions take place without the consideration of Gothrams. There are rules against incest in most of the countries. Even in animal world they try to avoid incest.
Gotram is a useless burden we carry.
 
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kunjuppu

Well-known member
No sir,
Leave alone Sastras even scientifically it is wrong.
Such marriages will have impact on the kids which this pair give birth to.
Either kids will have physical or mental troubles.
One of my close friends relatives , got married and was a Love marriage. happened against the wish of the Bride's parents. Groom's parent acceepted the marriage for 2 reasons . First being the bride also belongs to Iyer community second the parents were tottally depending on his son for their lively hood hence don't want to go against the wishes of their son. But the girl was not aware of her Gothram and the Boy's parent were aware that both belong to same Gothram.
The result the pair gave birth to Mangaloid kids and the reason quoted by Doctors is it is the problem of Geen.
Now nothing can be done and the pair is living with 2 mangaloid kids of age 14 and 11 years and the real sad part is both are girls and the first one matured a year back. Even during the monthly event of the Girl , the mother to take care of changing Napkin and other requirements like.
Please donot do this mistake.

HK,

marrying your mama son daughter or athai son daughter is 50% same genes. saha gothram is supposed to mean that you descended from same family tree milleniums ago. ok?

anyone can have handicapped kids. it is not the monopoly of saha gothram marriages. please do understand this and do not spread this type of 'knowledge' to, especially your loved ones.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
HK,

marrying your mama son daughter or athai son daughter is 50% same genes. saha gothram is supposed to mean that you descended from same family tree milleniums ago. ok?

anyone can have handicapped kids. it is not the monopoly of saha gothram marriages. please do understand this and do not spread this type of 'knowledge' to, especially your loved ones.

I fully agree with you, but I would not characterize it as "knowledge" it is misinformation, and a dangerous one at that,
 

sangom

Well-known member
I fully agree with you, but I would not characterize it as "knowledge" it is misinformation, and a dangerous one at that,

One of my daayatis (my cousin, generation-wise) married his chithi's daughter. The "thaathaa" was a very very powerful and orthodox-to-the core brahman who had very great command of men (adiyaalkkal) and money too. But since the concerned parties - boy, girl and their parents were for the marriage - the old man also acceded to it. My cousin lived for 70+ years, died of hear attack, my manni is still alive, nearing 80 and satabhishekam and her 3 daughters, their kids are all normal, brilliant like my cousin, and two of the grandchildren have been married this year.

This cousin's younger brother married his niece, had 3 daughters one was afflicted by polio but is a qualified M.D. doctor now. The other two daughters died leaving very healthy children, one due to stiffening of the intestine, and the other due to a very tragic married life. I begin to shed tears whenever I think of that girl, she was the same age as my first son and they used to play together.
 

kunjuppu

Well-known member
sangom,

i think every family has someone marrying their chithi or perima son or daughter.

my father's first cousins, one perimma son married chithi daughter. oh about 60 years ago. 6 children, all healthy and living well. lots of grand children. the hubby lived to 75 and his wife passed away recently, again late 70s.

they had a very very comfortable life in rural mysore but in his midlife the man took some dubiuos investments, which promised very high returns with very high risks. risk won, return lost. dont know if we can blame that on chithi daughter marriage :)

this was a love marriage, murmured by the huge brood of sisters (9) and everyone even in those days bowed to the power of love.

so, fittingly, i will play, 'power of love' here :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbO3dfF9uuE&ob=av2e
 
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H.Krishnamurthy

Active member
I am deeply troubled by your ignorance, In addition your audacity to post on a public forum such scary, wrong and dangerous consequence. I wish you would remove it.

For a community that marries their cousin, uncle and many close relations you claim a sagothra marriage as if it is incest. Gothram is like an alumni and nothing more. Check your facts before posting.

In the world 99% of unions take place without the consideration of Gothrams. There are rules against incest in most of the countries. Even in animal world they try to avoid incest.
Gotram is a useless burden we carry.

Dear Sir,
If you wish to ignore my earlier mail you are most welcome to do so.
Getting married to same Gothra is as good as marriage of a Brother and Sister.
It is not just change of a Guru or a Teacher. This has got a better meaning than that.
Please read Aalayam Magazine of June edition where in the Author have clearly explained about the after effect of getting married with same Gothra.
Your reply quotes that Uncle ( maternal ) means definately not same Gothra.
Cousin is a generalised word it can be Parental or maternal.
1 st one will be same gothra for pre gen Brothers and will be diff for a brother and Sister.
What ever I have written earlier is what ever I have seen/ heard.
You can contact one of my neice now at Tanjore got married to her Athai pullai ( Close relative but diff gothra ). for their experience.
The reasons explained by Doctor is the problem of Geen due to close relation ship of Boy and Girl. ( The Boy had his mother's geen and the girl had more of his Father's geen and they were brother and sister ).
I contacted the father of the Kid of my previous mail. His comments were 'Pl don't do it naan nasama poiten evan ekkedu ketta enakku enna '
Am sorry if I have crossed my limit as I donot have proper answer for defect in new born for parents of diff Gothrams.
 

wrongan

Active member
I fully agree with you, but I would not characterize it as "knowledge" it is misinformation, and a dangerous one at that,
Well you want to criticise our forefathers for giving some advice based on their experiance only .The champions who want others also to ignore sagothra concepts must also know in the cases mentioned by them like these people the GOTHRA chain might have been broken and they stick to some gothra for namesake. Now we are highly intelligent and all are doctors and scientists,Why should not we consult aD.N.A specialist to decode that of both grooms when lovers embark on sa gothra marriage. It would avoid all sorts of mis conception .
 

informed

New member
I am new to this forum, hence veterans please forgive my misunderstanding if any.
All that Sri.Srinivas asked was whether same gothra marriage is allowed as per sasthra or not. I am quite surprised to see so many members debating on whether it is correct or not. This is posted in Traditions folder, so I thought people knowledgeable in sastras would just answer that question, rather than some members trying to advocate pahutharivu vadams.

@Srinivas,
As far as I have learnt, there is no tamil brahmin sastras, but just sastras. As per them, same gothra marriage is not allowed. Hope that clarifies.

Regards
 

kunjuppu

Well-known member
HK,

just to clarify my own position.

i think it is good to marry as far removed from one's relatives. in addition to the beauty of getting to know a different set of families and traditions, the intermingling of widely separated genes produces a healthy result. mostly but not always, as handicapped children are born even to these types of marriages. if you believe in God, then you can console yourself that you are a special parent, as only specially gifted parents can handle handicaps.

but, many a times, 'luvv' happens. 'luvv' is blind. and to keep a young couple apart by virtue of sahagothram, even when they cannot trace a relation within generations, is absurd. it does not make sense, when in our own community the practise of athai magan or mama penn marriage is not only recognized, but in many a cases, encouraged.

to sum up: let us do what makes sense, based on each case. ok?
 

Brahmanyan

Well-known member
HK,

just to clarify my own position.

i think it is good to marry as far removed from one's relatives. in addition to the beauty of getting to know a different set of families and traditions, the intermingling of widely separated genes produces a healthy result. mostly but not always, as handicapped children are born even to these types of marriages. if you believe in God, then you can console yourself that you are a special parent, as only specially gifted parents can handle handicaps.

but, many a times, 'luvv' happens. 'luvv' is blind. and to keep a young couple apart by virtue of sahagothram, even when they cannot trace a relation within generations, is absurd. it does not make sense, when in our own community the practise of athai magan or mama penn marriage is not only recognized, but in many a cases, encouraged.

to sum up: let us do what makes sense, based on each case. ok?

Dear Sri Kunjuppu,

You are correct, I have known cases where inbreeding by marriages within family have played havoc by congenital abnormalities in their children, than Sagothra weddings between different families.

Regards,
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 

Nara

Well-known member
...Cousin is a generalised word it can be Parental or maternal.
1 st one will be same gothra for pre gen Brothers and will be diff for a brother and Sister.
Dear HK sir, what about children of sisters of different gothra, why are they forbidden from marrying? Gothra being different sagothra problem does not arise.

Cheers!
 

wrongan

Active member
I am new to this forum, hence veterans please forgive my misunderstanding if any.
All that Sri.Srinivas asked was whether same gothra marriage is allowed as per sasthra or not. I am quite surprised to see so many members debating on whether it is correct or not. This is posted in Traditions folder, so I thought people knowledgeable in sastras would just answer that question, rather than some members trying to advocate pahutharivu vadams.

@Srinivas,
As far as I have learnt, there is no tamil brahmin sastras, but just sastras. As per them, same gothra marriage is not allowed. Hope that clarifies.

Regards
As you have rightly said there is no place for revolutionary explanations to Sastras.The sastras are like comand by an authority
which you have to obey and there is no alternative.Coming to the point I reproduce the provisions on this subject in VAITHYA NATHA DEEKSHADEEYAM.
which is widely followed.It is in Granthalipi.{kula dwayam parithyajyam dhathasya thu viseshathaha.aachane cha pradhane cha thasya puthrow na dhoshabag.}
meaing in case of adopted child you have to avoid marrige with born gothra and as well adopted gothra.thus it is clearly emphacised that for the purpose avoiding
sagothra marriage temporary adoption also is prohibited.
 

prasad1

Well-known member
As you have rightly said there is no place for revolutionary explanations to Sastras.The sastras are like comand by an authority
which you have to obey and there is no alternative.Coming to the point I reproduce the provisions on this subject in VAITHYA NATHA DEEKSHADEEYAM.
which is widely followed.It is in Granthalipi.{kula dwayam parithyajyam dhathasya thu viseshathaha.aachane cha pradhane cha thasya puthrow na dhoshabag.}
meaing in case of adopted child you have to avoid marrige with born gothra and as well adopted gothra.thus it is clearly emphacised that for the purpose avoiding
sagothra marriage temporary adoption also is prohibited.

According to you if someone With exalted name like "deekshadar" you follow it. It is your interpretation of "tradition". So many Hindu traditions have become illegal or been abounded, for instance child marriage, sati, etc. So our culture evolves, gotra is a useless burden. You are free to do what ever pleases you.
To me in "tradition" almost nothing is sacrosanct, and all "tradition" is mithya (temporary). Traditions were created for a society thousands of years ago, and modified to suit the person, class, or clan in power at that time. If a "tradition" is proposed by supreme authority it must be uniform and universal.
 

informed

New member
According to you if someone With exalted name like "deekshadar" you follow it. It is your interpretation of "tradition". So many Hindu traditions have become illegal or been abounded, for instance child marriage, sati, etc. So our culture evolves, gotra is a useless burden. You are free to do what ever pleases you.
To me in "tradition" almost nothing is sacrosanct, and all "tradition" is mithya (temporary). Traditions were created for a society thousands of years ago, and modified to suit the person, class, or clan in power at that time. If a "tradition" is proposed by supreme authority it must be uniform and universal.
That sounds too rude and childish. The question is 'with respect to sastras'. I guess wrongan answered it crystal clear. To understand the credibility of Vaidyanaatha Deekshiteeyam, anyone can google or reach out to Kanchi matam or even any patashala in TN.
 

wrongan

Active member
According to you if someone With exalted name like "deekshadar" you follow it. It is your interpretation of "tradition". So many Hindu traditions have become illegal or been abounded, for instance child marriage, sati, etc. So our culture evolves, gotra is a useless burden. You are free to do what ever pleases you.
To me in "tradition" almost nothing is sacrosanct, and all "tradition" is mithya (temporary). Traditions were created for a society thousands of years ago, and modified to suit the person, class, or clan in power at that time. If a "tradition" is proposed by supreme authority it must be uniform and universal.
your reply shows your immaturity.what you know about a deekshidar is different from what I have Mentioned.If you have time and patience please refer to some deekshdar you know and get it clarified.Please go deep into any subject before pointing your finger.
 
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