Hello. I’m wondering if anyone knows about the population of Iyers or the different subcastes like Vadama, Vathima, Brahacharanam, and Ashtasahasram. I’ve seen very different estimates—some very low, some very high. I’ve also heard that sometimes people identify with these subcastes even if their backgrounds are mixed, or that intermarriage might affect how people report their identity, which could influence population numbers. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Iyer Population
- Thread starter NRI_bramin
- Start date
Oh that's unfortunate. Any ideas where I could go to find the numbers? Like an agraharam might know?
First we should have a near accurate population data of Tamil speaking brahmins- in TN, Kerala and all other India states. Then we should get and add the NRI TamBrams.
When even this macro data itself is not available or not attempted, then how can we think of the micro data.
Now the situation requires that we simply forget about the sub divisions, but unite( in all practical and theoretical sense and terms) at the level of Tamil speaking Brahmins as an entity. Then that should become part of the umbrella Brahmin community in India and world as a whole.
It is not at all impossible. It has to start as a sincere attempt even as a small trickle from the States wise, country-wise local chapters of the Tamil Brahmin community associations or organisations.
The initial responses may not be fast and enthusiastic. But constant follow up at all levels and layers of at least the somewhat well networked Kerala, TN and other states organisations can start. Then by and by things will fall into place. The community has very much technically minded sincere persons who can make things very easy and fast by devising suitable applications and formats.
When even this macro data itself is not available or not attempted, then how can we think of the micro data.
Now the situation requires that we simply forget about the sub divisions, but unite( in all practical and theoretical sense and terms) at the level of Tamil speaking Brahmins as an entity. Then that should become part of the umbrella Brahmin community in India and world as a whole.
It is not at all impossible. It has to start as a sincere attempt even as a small trickle from the States wise, country-wise local chapters of the Tamil Brahmin community associations or organisations.
The initial responses may not be fast and enthusiastic. But constant follow up at all levels and layers of at least the somewhat well networked Kerala, TN and other states organisations can start. Then by and by things will fall into place. The community has very much technically minded sincere persons who can make things very easy and fast by devising suitable applications and formats.
I doubt anyone will have. Data collection, especially like this, is next to impossible without getting into logistical issues. Not to mention the political trouble also.
For a long time, I had "lobbied" the association in mylapore along with a few other ex-members. They did not even bother speaking to us.
Anyone have a base estimate? It doesn't have to be accurate. 1 million Iyers? Maybe about 250k of each subsect? Or is it unevenly distributed? Any data or estimates would be helpful
As per this Quora thread, estimates suggest Iyers constitute less than 3% of the state's population. Some sources cite the combined population of all Brahmins (including Iyers and Iyengars) as being around 4.25 million, or roughly 5% of the total population, but this figure also lacks official confirmation.
I saw that statistic. The amount of veg in Tamil Nadu is 2.35% and since veg is a main aspect of brahmins, I believe some of the 4.25 million is not truly brahmin but mixed. So u also happen to know the intercaste marriage rate? I think it's possible to calculate using that.
prasad1
Active member
My research of the internet provides me: Tamil Brahmins as a whole (including both Iyers and Iyengars) make up less than 3% of Tamil Nadu’s total population.
Among them, Iyers, who follow the Smartha tradition and the Advaita Vedanta philosophy of Adi Shankara, are the primary Smartha group.
In certain regions like the Cauvery Delta districts—Thanjavur, Nagapattinam, Tiruvarur, and Tiruchirapalli—Iyers can form up to 10% of the local population.
In Nagercoil, they reportedly make up 13% of the city's population.
So while exact numbers are hard to pin down, Smartha Brahmins likely constitute less than 2% of the state’s population overall, with regional concentrations in historically significant temple towns.
Approximate Estimates:
In India, Brahmins make up less than 5% of the total population.
In the diaspora, estimates suggest that 10–15% or more of emigrated Indians may be Brahmins, depending on the country and migration wave.
All these statistics for what purpose?
What is it that you want to learn from this birth-based caste system? Does it have any significance?
One Baniya Modi is enough to become the Prime Minister. Caste has no meaning except for quota politics. What you achieve and become is your own karma. Caste is more divisive.
Among them, Iyers, who follow the Smartha tradition and the Advaita Vedanta philosophy of Adi Shankara, are the primary Smartha group.
In certain regions like the Cauvery Delta districts—Thanjavur, Nagapattinam, Tiruvarur, and Tiruchirapalli—Iyers can form up to 10% of the local population.
In Nagercoil, they reportedly make up 13% of the city's population.
So while exact numbers are hard to pin down, Smartha Brahmins likely constitute less than 2% of the state’s population overall, with regional concentrations in historically significant temple towns.
Approximate Estimates:
In India, Brahmins make up less than 5% of the total population.
In the diaspora, estimates suggest that 10–15% or more of emigrated Indians may be Brahmins, depending on the country and migration wave.
All these statistics for what purpose?
What is it that you want to learn from this birth-based caste system? Does it have any significance?
One Baniya Modi is enough to become the Prime Minister. Caste has no meaning except for quota politics. What you achieve and become is your own karma. Caste is more divisive.
I'm just wondering if there are still agraharams that exist. I know the structure is there but rather people still live in agraharams like they used to. I want to visit one and see how it is. My assumption was that Tam brahmins that are mixed probably don't live here because they aren't that strict. I wanted to know first if tam brahmins even exist as a group or if there was like 10,000 left because that was one of the statistics I saw on the Internet. I figured a good starting point would be to see the amount of Tamil brahmins that exist and the intercaste rate than calculate to see if it's even realistic to assume people live like that. I know most brahmins are modernized and highly educated but I'm sure some chose to stay behind.
Lotusinsanskrit
Active member
If you want to visit agraharams it is better to go to Palghat rather than TN which is hardly exists. There you can see for eg. Kalpathi, Nurani etc., Even in wiki these agraharams shown as Brahmins living. And also you can have somewhat pleasant look like olden agraharams and people also speak Brahmins Tamil mixed in Malayalam accent.
I have a minor question regarding Vadama Iyer tilak practices. I know the Vadama sect wears a small crescent shaped u tilak made out of gopichandanam around their kunkumum pottu while also wearing a vibuti tripundra. However, recently, I heard from a Vadama friend that Vadamas wear only tripundra in the morning and a full u-shaped tilakam with a red pottu in the center in the evening. If this correct, does anyone know why Vadamas do not wear tripundra in the evening and instead wear gopichandanam? Thanks.
In Tamil Nadu, Iyers are more in numbers compared to Iyengars and Madhwas.
Among Iyers, earlier it was Vadamas occupied first position in terms of population.
However, contrary to belief, Brahacharaham Iyers excel in all fields, whether it is science, arts, literature and even cinema. Many thought that Vadamas are very successful. It is actually the other way around.
All Nobel Laurets, the Chairman of TATA Group, the current two Central Ministers from TN, majority of Carnatic Musicians like GNB, Musiri, Flute Mali, Lalgudi, T N Krishnan, MSG, Vinayakram, Bombay Jeyasree, Ranjani Gayathri, Palghat Raghu and so on. Writers like Bakakumaran, Ramamirdham, film actor Ranjan, Javert Sitharaman, music directors S V Venkataraman, Kunnakudi and even KVM.
Bharathiar and Ramana Maharishi also belonged to that sect.
It is really interesting to see their success rate. It is quite amazing.
Among Iyers, earlier it was Vadamas occupied first position in terms of population.
However, contrary to belief, Brahacharaham Iyers excel in all fields, whether it is science, arts, literature and even cinema. Many thought that Vadamas are very successful. It is actually the other way around.
All Nobel Laurets, the Chairman of TATA Group, the current two Central Ministers from TN, majority of Carnatic Musicians like GNB, Musiri, Flute Mali, Lalgudi, T N Krishnan, MSG, Vinayakram, Bombay Jeyasree, Ranjani Gayathri, Palghat Raghu and so on. Writers like Bakakumaran, Ramamirdham, film actor Ranjan, Javert Sitharaman, music directors S V Venkataraman, Kunnakudi and even KVM.
Bharathiar and Ramana Maharishi also belonged to that sect.
It is really interesting to see their success rate. It is quite amazing.
What happened to the agraharams in TN?
It is sad that politics have resulted in so much cultural destruction. There is so much misunderstanding today due to ignorance.
prasad1
Active member
The causes of the decline of agraharams in Tamil Nadu are various.
Scattered Existence: The traditional agraharams hardly exist in Tamil Nadu, suggesting they are no longer intact or as prevalent as they once were.
Emigration/Modernization: Most Brahmins are modernized and highly educated, and therefore may have moved away, which implies that urbanization and a shift in lifestyle are major factors.
Political Factors: This could refer to various social and political movements over the decades that have challenged the traditional, exclusive nature of these communities.
Maybe they have served their purpose and are discarded just like worn clothing.
This is my opinion; I have never stayed in Tamil Nadu or in an Agraharam.
Scattered Existence: The traditional agraharams hardly exist in Tamil Nadu, suggesting they are no longer intact or as prevalent as they once were.
Emigration/Modernization: Most Brahmins are modernized and highly educated, and therefore may have moved away, which implies that urbanization and a shift in lifestyle are major factors.
Political Factors: This could refer to various social and political movements over the decades that have challenged the traditional, exclusive nature of these communities.
Maybe they have served their purpose and are discarded just like worn clothing.
This is my opinion; I have never stayed in Tamil Nadu or in an Agraharam.
prasad1
Active member
What is the profession of the residents? Is it like a show village for visitors? or is it a functioning community? Does it have a caste limit?
Lotusinsanskrit
Active member
Any agraharam in TN only gurukkal/bhattars are living to take care of the temples/to do puja in nearest temples but other people living are of not like earlier livelihood but samathuvapuram only.
prasad1
Active member
There is no disrespect intended. A crude comparison: Very similar to seeing wild animals in a zoo, as opposed to seeing them in the wilderness.
