Inter Cast marriages and rituals & cremonies

[Visakan]

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I would like to know are there any provision in Hindu dharmasastras to conduct Inter cast marriages if the boy's TB parents are compelled to go ahead with marriage with an NB girl.Of course,it is with consent of NB parents.And the boy's parents would like take the girl in their fold and treat her like any other brahmin daughter-in-law.Boy's parents are pious and following brahmin customs&rituals. Any guidance from gurus of mutt in this regard for parents?Or do they have to fend themselves on their own?

 

[Raji Ram]

This is a question often raised in our forum!

Tambrahm boys find it difficult to get matches from the same community and end up staying alone or marrying non-brahnm girl.

Accept the daughter in law gracefully and give her equal rights that any other girl from the same community will receive.

Times are changing and hence be generous.

All the best!

 

[Visakan]

This is a question often raised in our forum!

Tambrahm boys find it difficult to get matches from the same community and end up staying alone or marrying non-brahnm girl.

Accept the daughter in law gracefully and give her equal rights that any other girl from the same community will receive.

Times are changing and hence be generous.

All the best!

Yes Madam
Thank you for your kind words. Boy's parents are very much inclined to treat her on equal par and want her to become one among them.But being a middle class TB and would like to continue their brahminical tradition, custom and rituals,they are a bit worried about any opposition they may encounter in the name Sasthra and customs from any quarters. Anyway they are going ahead with ICM for their son. I just wanted to know the stand of gurus of our mutt and sastras on ICM.

 

[Lotusinsanskrit]

the boy's parents would like take the girl in their fold and treat her like any other brahmin daughter-in-law.

Here it goes. Why TB boys parents wanted to conduct it in tb way of marriage. In fact going ahead with marriage of their style will be simple and best without any embarassing any side. They conduct marriage with purohits and in this type of inter marriage customs many sastrigal will not conduct the rituals and they only direct purohits and they will conduct as per the rituals wanted by the parents. If boys parents insists on TB way they will be some less mantras by purohits than the marriages conducted by sastrigal. Also girls parents getting embarassed with madisar for amma and removing shirt for appa though the girl may like to wear madisar like any costume change.

I feel it is better to conduct in NB way instead of insisting TB way and when you accept the NB girl and what is there to accept their way.

 

[Raji Ram]

Best is Arya samaj way!

We had one such wedding of tambrahm boy and girl, in our extended family, since the groom's mother hated to wear madisār and groom born and brought up in the USA disliked huge Homam!

The basic rituals were nicely conducted (with translation of mantrās in English) in 45 minutes. Small Agni in a metal holder; one priest from Arya samaj; groom was clad in sharwani set and bride in 6 yards silk saree!

It was nice to watch the simple wedding procedures!

Groom's mother refused to accept dowry in any form, including the traditional seer bhakshaNams!

We enjoyed the "no fuss" wedding 12 years back!

 

[Brahmanyan]

All rituals from birth to death are described in detail in Dharma Sastras that we (or supposed to) follow. Most of us in South follow Apasthamba or Bhodayana Suthra.
Our marriages are conducted by the boy's side. Once the girl is gifted to the boy in "kanya dhana" the boy has to take her to their house and perform required rituals as per their family traditions and marry her. To my understanding there no specific mention of intercaste wedding. There are many instances in our epics of Brahmins marrying girls from other castes. For instance Mighty Ravaneswara was the son of Sage Vishravas and Princess Kaikeshi a Dythya or Ashura. He was a great exponent of Vedas. Till present days Brahmana Sambandham was common in Malabar families.
All these have no relevance in today's world. If the boy and the girl want to marry out of love, please bless them and help to lead a successful married life.
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.

 

[tbs]

Best is Arya samaj way!

We had one such wedding of tambrahm boy and girl, in our extended family, since the groom's mother hated to wear madisār and groom born and brought up in the USA disliked huge Homam!

The basic rituals were nicely conducted (with translation of mantrās in English) in 45 minutes. Small Agni in a metal holder; one priest from Arya samaj; groom was clad in sharwani set and bride in 6 yards silk saree!

It was nice to watch the simple wedding procedures!

Groom's mother refused to accept dowry in any form, including the traditional seer bhakshaNams!

We enjoyed the "no fuss" wedding 12 years back!

hi

i conducted ARYA SAMAJ WEDDING some yrs back.... no priest required....even ladies can do

havan .....

 

[Lotusinsanskrit]

What I told is practical situation in TN. First you ask your sastrigal (I hope you would have and that is why you got this doubt). Recently I have come across this situation and that is why I felt NB way is good.

One family they have conducted daughter and son marriages with a short span of difference in 15 days. First daughter married to our family and hence the question does not arise but the son got married to NB girl and the girl visited our family marriage and noted every minute details and after 15 days they got married and arranged in TB way and starts the issue that their sastrigal directed purohit who conducts marriage in brahminical way but there are less manthras. Purohits also conduct marriages with Agni Homan only but short. In girls side there is no vratam no madisar for amma and no shirt removal for appa as they felt embarassed. Afterwards girl asked this doubt why it is shorten than the previous marriage. Even at times purohit only said in Tamil instead of manthra like in kasi yathra etc ,

That is why I say NB style which is almost same as Arya samaj style. But atleast in this every one will be free to conduct.

I have seen that also in one of the other marriage in my family.

Afterwards anyway nowadays youngsters live on their own style and only at the time of marriage we wanted to follow.

 

[Visakan]

What I told is practical situation in TN. First you ask your sastrigal (I hope you would have and that is why you got this doubt). Recently I have come across this situation and that is why I felt NB way is good.

One family they have conducted daughter and son marriages with a short span of difference in 15 days. First daughter married to our family and hence the question does not arise but the son got married to NB girl and the girl visited our family marriage and noted every minute details and after 15 days they got married and arranged in TB way and starts the issue that their sastrigal directed purohit who conducts marriage in brahminical way but there are less manthras. Purohits also conduct marriages with Agni Homan only but short. In girls side there is no vratam no madisar for amma and no shirt removal for appa as they felt embarassed. Afterwards girl asked this doubt why it is shorten than the previous marriage. Even at times purohit only said in Tamil instead of manthra like in kasi yathra etc ,

That is why I say NB style which is almost same as Arya samaj style. But atleast in this every one will be free to conduct.

I have seen that also in one of the other marriage in my family.

Afterwards anyway nowadays youngsters live on their own style and only at the time of marriage we wanted to follow.

Dear Sir,
Thank you for your elaborate reply.The marriage(love!) I was referring will be in the family of one of my relatives.The marriage will take place in his home town next month. As they wish to conduct the marriage of their son in brahminical way, for which the girl's side also agreed, the issues are cropping up. They are trying their best not to embarass the girl's side by working around sensitive and tricky issues/situations.
I really appreciate you and other members for their suggestions.
I pray for the smooth conduct of the marriage and everyone concerned are happy.

 

[Visakan]

All rituals from birth to death are described in detail in Dharma Sastras that we (or supposed to) follow. Most of us in South follow Apasthamba or Bhodayana Suthra.
Our marriages are conducted by the boy's side. Once the girl is gifted to the boy in "kanya dhana" the boy has to take her to their house and perform required rituals as per their family traditions and marry her. To my understanding there no specific mention of intercaste wedding. There are many instances in our epics of Brahmins marrying girls from other castes. For instance Mighty Ravaneswara was the son of Sage Vishravas and Princess Kaikeshi a Dythya or Ashura. He was a great exponent of Vedas. Till present days Brahmana Sambandham was common in Malabar families.
All these have no relevance in today's world. If the boy and the girl want to marry out of love, please bless them and help to lead a successful married life.
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.

Dear Sir,
Yes, it is love marriage.But can't you cite anybody else from epics other than Ravana!
Regards

 

[venkhatraman]

With folded hands I offer my Pranams to all the persons who participated in the not so liked subject. Without any prejudice or bias, you have all, understood the reality and lent your support. Let the blessings of Lord Ramanuja shower on you.

 

[pbkhema]

Mariages between brahmins Kshatriyas Vaisyas and Sidras were commo and accepted by Manu
The Children take the cast of the father
In such marraiges he Gandarva form of marraige by exchanging Garlands is done and then the Spathapathi or Circumbulation of the Agni seven times is done

 

[Narendra KV]

All marriage shastras come to us from the Grihya Sutras.

The outline for marriage is common for all castes and communities within the Hindu fold. The Sankhyayana and Ashvalayana Gruhya Sutra [we follow in South India] mention the following steps - [1] Nishchitartha [engagement] - all negotiations and conditions put forth by both families are documented and the engagement is finalized]; [2] Punyaha & Nandi - seeking permission from ancestors for this ritual to go ahead; [3] Devara Puja [seeking divine intervention to go ahead]; [4] Kushmanda Homa; [5] Gowri Puja; [6] Kanya Dhana [7] Kankana Bhandha; [8] Laja Homa; [9] Sapthapadi and [10] Mangalya dharana.

All these shastras have specific reasons and are meant for the prosperity of the couple and long & happy relationship. A good purohit would be able to give a scientific explanation behind these shastras. Most communities follow these customs, in their own tradition [sampradaya]. Within each community itself, traditions vary from one family to another. Since it is more a social event, rather than a religious one, many other rites and traditions have also evolved around the above framework.

Whether Brahmin or NB, any good purohit / vaadhyaar can take you through these steps.

I read a post about Gandharva form of marriages for inter - caste couple. It is a kind of marriage, but not suggested. Marriage is a contract between the couple in Abrahamic religions and for them these kind of marriages are OK. In our Sanathana belief, a husband and wife are sahadharmins. All the punya and paapa are shared during the marital life. For a couple to become eligible for that position they have to perform some rites. In the best interest of the couple, the shastras are best performed.

 

[sridhar1953]

This is a million dollar question. If the boy is brahmin, and girl is from NB family, not much of an issue. If its otherwise, then there might be some issues.
My suggestion is (for both cases), make it a common ritual, accepting the traditions of both families. Make it as simple as possible with solemn vow before Agni, as the fulcrum of the entire function.
No use gloating about our traditional weddings practices in such cases. Give and take policy is the best solution. Explain the meaning of rituals to the Non-Brahmin partner so that they participate with faith and sincerety.

If the brahmin is between a Hindu and a Non-Hindu, well there is no discussion on this point.

 

[NVG Iyer77]

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[NVG Iyer77]

This is a million dollar question. If the boy is brahmin, and girl is from NB family, not much of an issue. If its otherwise, then there might be some issues.
My suggestion is (for both cases), make it a common ritual, accepting the traditions of both families. Make it as simple as possible with solemn vow before Agni, as the fulcrum of the entire function.
No use gloating about our traditional weddings practices in such cases. Give and take policy is the best solution. Explain the meaning of rituals to the Non-Brahmin partner so that they participate with faith and sincerety.

If the brahmin is between a Hindu and a Non-Hindu, well there is no discussion on this point.

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[NVG Iyer77]

All marriage shastras come to us from the Grihya Sutras.

The outline for marriage is common for all castes and communities within the Hindu fold. The Sankhyayana and Ashvalayana Gruhya Sutra [we follow in South India] mention the following steps - [1] Nishchitartha [engagement] - all negotiations and conditions put forth by both families are documented and the engagement is finalized]; [2] Punyaha & Nandi - seeking permission from ancestors for this ritual to go ahead; [3] Devara Puja [seeking divine intervention to go ahead]; [4] Kushmanda Homa; [5] Gowri Puja; [6] Kanya Dhana [7] Kankana Bhandha; [8] Laja Homa; [9] Sapthapadi and [10] Mangalya dharana.

All these shastras have specific reasons and are meant for the prosperity of the couple and long & happy relationship. A good purohit would be able to give a scientific explanation behind these shastras. Most communities follow these customs, in their own tradition [sampradaya]. Within each community itself, traditions vary from one family to another. Since it is more a social event, rather than a religious one, many other rites and traditions have also evolved around the above framework.

Whether Brahmin or NB, any good purohit / vaadhyaar can take you through these steps.

I read a post about Gandharva form of marriages for inter - caste couple. It is a kind of marriage, but not suggested. Marriage is a contract between the couple in Abrahamic religions and for them these kind of marriages are OK. In our Sanathana belief, a husband and wife are sahadharmins. All the punya and paapa are shared during the marital life. For a couple to become eligible for that position they have to perform some rites. In the best interest of the couple, the shastras are best performed.

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[NVG Iyer77]

All rituals from birth to death are described in detail in Dharma Sastras that we (or supposed to) follow. Most of us in South follow Apasthamba or Bhodayana Suthra.
Our marriages are conducted by the boy's side. Once the girl is gifted to the boy in "kanya dhana" the boy has to take her to their house and perform required rituals as per their family traditions and marry her. To my understanding there no specific mention of intercaste wedding. There are many instances in our epics of Brahmins marrying girls from other castes. For instance Mighty Ravaneswara was the son of Sage Vishravas and Princess Kaikeshi a Dythya or Ashura. He was a great exponent of Vedas. Till present days Brahmana Sambandham was common in Malabar families.
All these have no relevance in today's world. If the boy and the girl want to marry out of love, please bless them and help to lead a successful married life.
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[NVG Iyer77]

This is a question often raised in our forum!

Tambrahm boys find it difficult to get matches from the same community and end up staying alone or marrying non-brahnm girl.

Accept the daughter in law gracefully and give her equal rights that any other girl from the same community will receive.

Times are changing and hence be generous.

All the best!

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[NVG Iyer77]

I would like to know are there any provision in Hindu dharmasastras to conduct Inter cast marriages if the boy's TB parents are compelled to go ahead with marriage with an NB girl.Of course,it is with consent of NB parents.And the boy's parents would like take the girl in their fold and treat her like any other brahmin daughter-in-law.Boy's parents are pious and following brahmin customs&rituals. Any guidance from gurus of mutt in this regard for parents?Or do they have to fend themselves on their own?

ALL OF YOU may please find attached, the reference from the Ancient Texts (smritis and puraan)
It answers the topic in scientific way.
Hope it helps

Regards
Natarajan Iyer

 

[sowmyaeshan]

This is a question often raised in our forum!

Tambrahm boys find it difficult to get matches from the same community and end up staying alone or marrying non-brahnm girl.

Accept the daughter in law gracefully and give her equal rights that any other girl from the same community will receive.

Times are changing and hence be generous.

All the best!

I would like to know are there any provision in Hindu dharmasastras to conduct Inter cast marriages if the boy's TB parents are compelled to go ahead with marriage with an NB girl.Of course,it is with consent of NB parents.And the boy's parents would like take the girl in their fold and treat her like any other brahmin daughter-in-law.Boy's parents are pious and following brahmin customs&rituals. Any guidance from gurus of mutt in this regard for parents?Or do they have to fend themselves on their own?

Arya samaj wedding or registrar marriage.Why to make the arrangements in such a way that one side is totally uncomfortable and unaware about rituals

 

[sowmyaeshan]

This is a million dollar question. If the boy is brahmin, and girl is from NB family, not much of an issue. If its otherwise, then there might be some issues.
My suggestion is (for both cases), make it a common ritual, accepting the traditions of both families. Make it as simple as possible with solemn vow before Agni, as the fulcrum of the entire function.
No use gloating about our traditional weddings practices in such cases. Give and take policy is the best solution. Explain the meaning of rituals to the Non-Brahmin partner so that they participate with faith and sincerety.

If the brahmin is between a Hindu and a Non-Hindu, well there is no discussion on this point.

Thats what is done in Arya Samaj wedding. Only requirement is to be a Hindu