How does Karma theory explain Massacare of Kids and the agony of their Parents

[P.J.]

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How does Karma theory explain Massacre of Kids and the agony of their Parents


Recently we read news about massacre of over 130 School Children and few Teachers by mindless act of Taliban in Pakistan.

Our hearts go to the affected families, and terrorism anywhere is not acceptable.

I wonder ,how does this act explain the Theory of Karma or Fate?

Surely, all of them are not disdained to die at a particular time as per astrology, neither their parents were to suffer the agony of losing their loved ones.

In such cases, does Karma theory is valid ; or it is all our own imagination and there is nothing like Karma or Fate?

 

[renuka]

At times dragging in the Karma theory can seem "insensitive and disrespectful".

We humans only tend to drag in Karma theory if the situation does not involve our own kith and kin.

If it happened to someone else than everyone gets very technical and starts speculating the possible Karmic causes that led to a tragic incident.

When a close one or a loved one or a kith or kin dies..does Karma theory pop up in our brains?

No it does NOT!

Reason is becos of grief! The mind goes blank and does not want to register any thought and we can only hope the person's soul rests in peace.

So why not apply the same thinking to others who are not related to us?

Why try to drag in Karma theory here.

The cause of death for these kids were The Act of Terrorism!

That's all.

Next should be steps to be taken and this is a real wake up call to all countries that this could happen elsewhere too and the enemy could be anywhere and we should NOT take safety for granted.

Each country should learn how to combat terrorism and foster moderation in thought,word and deed.

Keep thinking of Karma and find no answer and that leads to no action too!

 

[P.J.]

You seems to think that you are the upholder of morality in this Forum, whereas everyone in this Forum is also concerned more about it.

I have already expressed my deepest sympathy for affected families in another thread.

 

[renuka]

You seems to think that you are the upholder of morality in this Forum, .

Morralityy? That is such a boring word! I do not even know how to spell it!

The fact remains that Karma can never answer any question and only cause unnecessary speculation.

 

[zebra16]

Morralityy?
The fact remains that Karma can never answer any question and only cause unnecessary speculation.

This seems to be an abrupt U-turn from the reams and reams of web pages consumed in this forum. The karma theory has resurfaced many times in this forum and your goodselves along with Sri Sangom, Sri TKS and Sri Sravana have been the most active
participants in those threads.

To begin with, karma theory is surely a speculation or a concept or a hypothesis. How else can one verify its veracity without application to actual happenings? The posts of Sri Sangom and Sri Sravana as also your posts in the past did not seem to indicate the discussion as "unnecessary" speculation or useless or mere time-pass.

 

[renuka]

This seems to be an abrupt U-turn from the reams and reams of web pages consumed in this forum. The karma theory has resurfaced many times in this forum and your goodselves along with Sri Sangom, Sri TKS and Sri Sravana have been the most active
participants in those threads.

To begin with, karma theory is surely a speculation or a concept or a hypothesis. How else can one verify its veracity without application to actual happenings? The posts of Sri Sangom and Sri Sravana as also your posts in the past did not seem to indicate the discussion as "unnecessary" speculation or useless or mere time-pass.

Dear Zebra ji,

The Karma theories were discussed without an actual incident and mostly it was about Maya/Karma/Brahman and pure philosophy.

So have fun with my multiple U turns... you might see more soon and I do not stop at Zebra Crossings!LOL

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Does Karma theory relevant to Islam? Does it not relate Hindu philosophyonly?

 

[mkrishna100]

THE usual explanations given by Terrorists who undertake these tasks are "we are repaying you in the same way you are hitting us" .Many terrorits feel that they want their agressors to get the same or even worse pain and hence they choose these soft targets " .I do not know whether the Terrorits know Karma Theory or not but they surely follow the Newton's Third law i.e "Every Action has an equal and opposite reaction " .

In Mid 90s after 3 or 4 years of Rajiv Gandhhi's assassination LTTE's Spokesman Anton Balasingham said Rajiv died not due to LTTE but due to his own Karmas ( he was referring to the IPKF atrocities ) and for which Dr.Subramanya Sawmi replied that Law of Karma is perfectly neutral and it will also reflect on the LTTE and Dr.Swamy started a diplomatic war on LTTE and saw to it that it got banned in India and other Western Countries and the heat of that LTTE realized only in 2006 when SL was waging a power attack against LTTE and hammering it in all directions under Rajapaksa ( with radar and satellite support from India ) the same Anton Balasingham was desperately crying to India through a TV Interview that 'India is our Fatherland and must be magnanimous to forget the past and move ahead " and while Balasingham died after a few months , the LTTE and its entire leadersip was wiped out in May 2009 and Dr.Swamy had the last laught but poor Anton Balasingham was not alive to see how his own pet Karma theory works full circle .

So now if the Terrorits who killed the children talk about Karma Theory or Newton's Third law they must remember that both will work equally on them in a different time and situation and they must remember how the Karma Theory worked for LTTE .

 

[mkrishna100]

Does Karma theory relevant to Islam? Does it not relate Hindu philosophyonly?

Does Newton Third Law adopt different yardsticks for Hindu's ,Muslims , Christians , Sikhs or Atheists ?

 

[sangom]

To me it appears that this ghastly massacre is only a part of the bigger picture, and that picture starts from the giving birth of the Taliban or the time of the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Almost all the western countries, Iran, Iraq, etc., reportedly aided, in some way or the other, Zia-ul-Haq to create the Afghan Taliban. Taliban ruled Afghanistan also for a few years (1996-2001, thanks to Google!). Then Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda came on the scene.

Pakistan found perhaps that what was useful to their interests in Afghanistan would help them in annexing the whole of Kashmir also and this attitude went to the extent of closeness to Al Queda, Bin Laden taking his final shelter in Pakistan, getting killed by US forces, etc.

Now Waziristan has become a problem for Pakistan and it has come down heavily on the rebel forces there, while still giving protection to the Mumbai attack plotters. It is such ambivalent attitude of Pakistan which has caused this massacre of innocents.

From the Karma theory point of view all these children and adults had their longevity only till yesterday. We cannot trace the past history which gave rise to all these births, but if Karma theory is accepted, then it has operated here also without any partiality. What is the explanation for the deaths in the Malaysian airlines disappearance, another MH-17 shot down in Ukraine airspace, the Nazi holocaust which killed millions of Jews, the millions who lost their lives in the Vietnam War, the two World Wars, Hiroshima & Nagasaki, and, even the billions who were killed (as per Mahabharata) in the Kurukshetra war? Has not krishna said, I have already killed all these fellows, and you are, Arjuna!, just a token! (mayaiva EtE nihatA: pUrvamEva, nimitta mAtraM bhava savyasAcin). Does it not prove the karma theory?

 

[sarang]

Adu avan thalaiezhutthu. This is the last word one says. So only karma has the answer for all happenings.

The fact remains that Karma can never answer any question and only cause unnecessary speculation.

 

[sarang]

Newtonian action and reaction are in the physical domain; in religio/spiritual domain it is action and reward; for example some get 72 virgins for killing an infidel.
These killers have been brainwashed that by killing school children they will go to heaven and get pleasure. According to us they have committed a heinous sin.

Does Newton Third Law adopt different yardsticks for Hindu's ,Muslims , Christians , Sikhs or Atheists ?

 

[sravna]

Dear Shri P.J.





Dear Shri P.J.

Let me also say that it is very tragic event and deeply saddened that that such a brutality was committed.

Deaths do occur at the same time though at different places and so different causes. In this case, it is the same cause. That I think is the difference.

 

[CHANDRU1849]

Does Newton Third Law adopt different yardsticks for Hindu's ,Muslims , Christians , Sikhs or Atheists ?

Now only, I understand from your statement that Karma Theory is nothing but Physics and not related to any religious philosophy, hitherto I believe.

Thank you for enlightening me.

 

[P.J.]

Dear Shri P.J.





Dear Shri P.J.

Let me also say that it is very tragic event and deeply saddened that that such a brutality was committed.

Deaths do occur at the same time though at different places and so different causes. In this case, it is the same cause. That I think is the difference.

Sri sravana Sir


In certain cases the Logic of Karma theory does not fit in and can be difficult to debate; one sometimes feel Karma is an unproven concept when mass murders tales place like a Holocaust; where nature takes away thousands of life like earth quake or Tsunami; where human error takes the hundreds of life like plane accidents.

Karma Theory is ‘man made’ as even Bhagavad-Gita has to offer only this:

Whatever happened, happened for the good; whatever is happening, is happening for the good; whatever will happen, will also happen for the good only. You need not have any regrets for the past. You need not worry for the future. The present is happening...

 

[SANDHYAV]

To begin with, karma theory is surely a speculation or a concept or a hypothesis. How else can one verify its veracity without application to actual happenings? The posts of Sri Sangom and Sri Sravana as also your posts in the past did not seem to indicate the discussion as "unnecessary" speculation or useless or mere time-pass.

for a less intelligent man, karma theory can be absolute science, let it become popular by threads such as this.

 

[Jaykay767]

Karma theory perfectly explains this tragic carnage !!.All the people involved in this tragedy were playing out the effect of Karma accumulated over different life times. Just coz a specific event was more tragic than the other does not invalidate the Karma theory.

People with similar Karma are generally are either born or come together in a specific village, country or place, so their collective destiny is played out depending on what happens in that place !!

Our Rishis were truly geniuses in figuring out how this world works, how the souls transit across multiple worlds, how the good & bad actions carry across life times as Karma Phalas etc..

To those who believe Karma cannot be proven – I would suggest them to go ahead & enjoy their lives like never before for the next 1 or 2 yrs & exhaust all their Good karmas & gain a lot of bad karma. They can do anything they love to do, drink, drugs,sex, extra-marital affairs, & in parallel gain a lot of bad karma – by abusing people, sack a few people if they are managers in their jobs, etc..

I can take a bet that they will be hit by an accident,disaster, tsunami or some untoward incident in their lives.. As Krishna says in the Gita – Good Karma gained by following Dharmam is the true “Kavacha Kundalam” that protects us all our lives !!

 

[SANDHYAV]

They can do anything they love to do, drink, drugs,sex, extra-marital affairs, & in parallel gain a lot of bad karma – by abusing people, sack a few people if they are managers in their jobs, etc..

WELL SAID. i can only add inaction ( lack of performance to one's skills) to this list, so this theory reaches a bigger spectrum, than just Prison Jobs!

 

[P.J.]

People with similar Karma are generally are either born or come together in a specific village, country or place, so their collective destiny is played out depending on what happens in that place !!

!!

This part of the Theory is questionable!!

 

[tbs]

hi

deaths are mainly 2 types....AKAALA MARANAM.(ALPAYUSH )....NORMAL MARANAM...DUE TO AGE..LIKE WEAR AND TEAR....

atma does not have death...ONLY THE PHYSICAL BODY....so physical body due to the KARMA OF KARTA....ATMA IS

IS LIKE....NAAHAM KARATA...NAAHAM KARAYITA....generally every physical body comes to the earth with MANUFACTURING

DATE AND EXPIRY DATE....so some body comes with early expiry date with many reasons...like suicide/war/disease etc...

LIFE IS PRE DESTINED.....DEATH IS ALSO PRE DESTINED....BELIEVE IT OR NOT...ITS REALITY...

 

[P.J.]

hi

deaths are mainly 2 types....AKAALA MARANAM.(ALPAYUSH )....NORMAL MARANAM...DUE TO AGE..LIKE WEAR AND TEAR....

atma does not have death...ONLY THE PHYSICAL BODY....so physical body due to the KARMA OF KARTA....ATMA IS

IS LIKE....NAAHAM KARATA...NAAHAM KARAYITA....generally every physical body comes to the earth with MANUFACTURING

DATE AND EXPIRY DATE....so some body comes with early expiry date with many reasons...like suicide/war/disease etc...

LIFE IS PRE DESTINED.....DEATH IS ALSO PRE DESTINED....BELIEVE IT OR NOT...ITS REALITY...

Your Answer has nothing to explain about OP!!

 

[renuka]

To those who believe Karma cannot be proven – I would suggest them to go ahead & enjoy their lives like never before for the next 1 or 2 yrs & exhaust all their Good karmas & gain a lot of bad karma. They can do anything they love to do, drink, drugs,sex, extra-marital affairs, & in parallel gain a lot of bad karma – by abusing people, sack a few people if they are managers in their jobs, etc..

I can take a bet that they will be hit by an accident,disaster, tsunami or some untoward incident in their lives.. As Krishna says in the Gita – Good Karma gained by following Dharmam is the true “Kavacha Kundalam” that protects us all our lives !!

This is the reason why I said at the beginning NOT to drag in Karma Theory when there is loss of lives like this unfortunate incident!

People start heartlessly speculating that death like this is becos of past BAD Karma and label anyone who had an unfortunate death as a sinner!


I hope PJ sir can open his eyes now and realize why I objected to this thread in the 1st place.

Would we be saying that bad people die in Tsunami,accident etc if it happens to ourselves or our own kith and kin?

After all even Ramakrishna Paramahansa died of Throat Cancer, Swami Ramatheerta drowned...so what do we have to say? They partied hard and led reckless lives too?


So give it a break guys...none of us know anything for sure and do not be too sure that a Tsunami,accident or anything cant HIT us anytime.

Do not think that death only occurs to others and not to us.

Why think of Karma and speculate why anyone died..the fact is many children died...try to at least imagine yourself in that situation!

What if it was one's own child that had died?

Would you even say this or start a thread about Karma?


I think you know the answers.


BTW Jaykay..then why complain of racism in the USA? May be its the bad karma of those who undergo racism?

May be they abused people in a previous birth so they are suffering racism.

So dont complain that some face racism in the USA.

If your Karma theory holds right for thos who die in Tsunami, accident etc..so that way the racism karma theory should also hold good.

 

[JR]

Namaste Renuka,

I thought of adding my 2 cents to what you said in post #22 above:

Karma theory is not supposed to make one insensitive to others' and one's own grief, rather it is supposed to give 'solace' to people who are in the midst of undue problems. This is the reason why people believe in and pay a visit to those who supposedly perform 'past life regressions' and so forth... when they know they had done some misdeed in their past life owing to which they are suffering now, kinda like a 'payback', it offers them some type of consolation - a form of 'solace'. Please note, not everyone needs or feels comfortable with this form of solace, but what people who believe in it feel is real for them.

btw: If our own children, kith/kin suffer, we still call in karma, this time 'of our own'!

I don't have anything else to offer on this topic.

 

[renuka]

Namaste Renuka,

I thought of adding my 2 cents to what you said in post #22 above:

Karma theory is not supposed to make one insensitive to others' and one's own grief, rather it is supposed to give 'solace' to people who are in the midst of undue problems. This is the reason why people believe in and pay a visit to those who supposedly perform 'past life regressions' and so forth... when they know they had done some misdeed in their past life owing to which they are suffering now, kinda like a 'payback', it offers them some type of consolation - a form of 'solace'. Please note, not everyone needs or feels comfortable with this form of solace, but what people who believe in it feel is real for them.

btw: If our own children, kith/kin suffer, we still call in karma, this time 'of our own'!

I don't have anything else to offer on this topic.

Dear JR,

I feel the best is to leave the Karma theory out of such incidents so that we do not become judgmental.

The best is just try to help out as much as we can.

If we cant help physically at least we can say a silent prayer for the departed.

If we have nothing good to say or feel the best is to remain silent.

I note that many who are follow "Karma" theory and speculate are heartless.

 

[JR]

Dear JR,

I feel the best is to leave the Karma theory out of such incidents so that we do not become judgmental.

The best is just try to help out as much as we can.

If we cant help physically at least we can say a silent prayer for the departed.

If we have nothing good to say or feel the best is to remain silent.

I note that many who are follow "Karma" theory and speculate are heartless.

Dear Doc,

That may be a speculation on our part (reg. the heartless portion). It may be that karma theory offers the best consolation for the loss, don't you think?