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High Drama In Democracy: What Happened to the Lokpal Bill in the RS?

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Yamaka

New member
Is this the Midnight Massacre of Democracy?

Both in India and US, the politics is very much broken.. This is a Sign of Times that in democracy, it is much harder to pass any meaningful legislation. The Chinese are laughing... Can't you hear it? LOL.

This idea of an Anti-Corruption Super Ombudsman has been in the works for nearly 45 years.. Only this week, the idea crystallized in the form of a Bill.

Congress led UPAII has majority in the Lower House, and BJP led NDA has majority in the Upper House (this may be similar to the Senate in the US). BJP out of power in the last two election cycles, is bent upon obstructing anything and everything that the UPA does.

Congress passed this Bill in the Lower House, but it could not muster a majority in the Upper House, solely because of the cheap dirty politics played by BJP and its Allies (Very similar to Republicans in the US Senate).

The TMC (Mamata Banerjee's a Left Wing Party) opposed bringing the State Employees under this Lokpal Bill. For this, the Bill gives a CHOICE to the States to opt out and create their own version of Lokyuktha, which is there in the Bill passed in the Lower House...

But, somehow, TMC joined hands with BJP in bringing this issue of "Federal Structure" to disrupt the passage of this historic Bill.

Even if this Bill gets passed and the Lokpal becomes the Law of the Land, its full implementation will be harder to reduce the rampant endemic corruption in India.

Because most Indians have very low Integrity and Professionalism. Most of them GIVE and/or take BRIBES in their daily lives. That's considered as a Cost of Doing Business with the Govt or the Private Sector, which is as corrupt as the Govt, and as bad as most of the NGOs, including that of Anna Hazare, the self proclaimed Gandhian who spends about Rs 200,000 of the NGO's money to celebrate his own birthday. LOL.

Corruption is everywhere and anywhere: Starting from the highest of places like the Supreme Court to the lowest of places like Village Panchayat.

Dr. MMS's Govt tried honestly to bring the corruption down via this Lokpal Bill. But he failed. He can bring back this very bill after convincing parties like TMC and others.

There's still hope. BJP's true face is now clearly seen by the Aam Admi, who will punish them again in 2014 General Election. Watch out, Arun Jaitley and Susma - two Opposition leaders whose job is to engage in Dirty Double Talk in the Parliament.

Wait & watch.

:)

 
Dear Yamaka
This ia a rat and mouse game, whether it is BJP or Congress.
Tell me a single leader in India who works tirelessly for the welfare of the country.
When you are talking about BJP what about congress who are the forefathers of the all the foul play played by them.
Every party is working for their elevation to capture power and enjoy at the cost of poor people.
Where is Parliament, constitution? It is only for the benefit of dirty politicians and rich and influential peopl in the country.
Tell me any honest man in the country having the courage to go to police station and give a simple complaint without fear.
Why are you always supporting the congress at Centre and DMK at State?
Whoever comes, the fate of people in downdrodden will not change.
 

sangom

Well-known member
Dear Y,

I agree that BJP played its role as typical opposition. But UPA or Congress also was not very sincere in its anti-corruption motives. For example, it has not included NGOs in its present bill, probably because of political pressure from all parties; most parties and leaders thrive due to the funds from NGOs.

I do not, however, think that the part played by BJP will have any impact for it (or against it) in the next general elections. See the crowds thinning at AH's antics and even in Ramlila maidan.

Corruption in India is co-existent with the country. All attempts to eradicate or even reduce it, will only tend to increase and further make its tentacles spread.
 

Brahmanyan

Well-known member
The first Janlokpal Bill was introduced by Mr Shanti Bhushan in 1968 and passed by Lok Sabha in 1969,but failed to get through Rajya Sabha.Subsequently, Lokpal bills were introduced in 1971, 1977, 1985, 1989, 1996, 1998, 2001, 2005 and in 2008, but they were never passed. 42 years after its first introduction, the present Lokpal bill also faced the same fate.

Any one who follows Politics in India know well that the present Party in Power is past master in the art of subverting the spirit of the Constitution. This has been done methodically for years by amendments to Constitution from the earlier days of their rule. They broke written promises given at the time accession of Princely States with Republic of India. They inserted words even in the preamble of the Constitution. They perpetuated Caste by reservations. It is a well known fact Party in power will never allow or create a strong ombudsman or Lokpal to prevent and punish corrupt people in power either bureaucrats or politicians. When they found a Chief Election Commissioner was strong, they diluted the Commission by appointing two more ECs to suit their convenience. (One of them is a Central Minister now). Similarly facing the heat of exposition of Scam after Scam by CAG in his audit Reports, there is the talk of adding more members to CAG to dilute the institution. Now in the present form of the Bill introduced, Lokpal will have Nine members, half of them appointed on the basis of Caste and religion ! It is common knowledge such Bill will be declared against spirit of Constitution by the Courts.

We have already got a Prevention of Corruption Act 1988, which has shown that it is not adequately armed to prevent corruption. If need be it can be amended and strengthened suitably to be more effective in its purpose.

If the ruling party is serious in bringing a strong Lokpal Bill, then it is their duty to see that the Bill is passed in Parliament. Why should they blame opposition parties, which are not happy with the Government Lokpal Bill.

I was watching the proceedings of Rajya Sabha continuously yesterday (29th Dec). I was impressed by the quality of debate especially by Mr.Arun Jaitley and Mr. Abhishek Manu Singhvi were superb in its content. Eminent lawyer Mr. Ram Jethmalani was in his best form.

Interestingly the word "Lokpal" was coined in 1963 by Dr. L.M.Singhvi, a Member of Parliament and father of Mr.Abhishek Manu Singhvi, during a debate on grievance redressal mechanisms in the Parliament.

How I wish our Parliamentarians show such interest in all discussions and debates in our precious democratic institution, the Parliament.

Regards,
Brahmanyan,
Bangalore.
 
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Yamaka

New member
Dear Yamaka
This ia a rat and mouse game, whether it is BJP or Congress.
Tell me a single leader in India who works tirelessly for the welfare of the country.
When you are talking about BJP what about congress who are the forefathers of the all the foul play played by them.
Every party is working for their elevation to capture power and enjoy at the cost of poor people.
Where is Parliament, constitution? It is only for the benefit of dirty politicians and rich and influential peopl in the country.
Tell me any honest man in the country having the courage to go to police station and give a simple complaint without fear.
Why are you always supporting the congress at Centre and DMK at State?
Whoever comes, the fate of people in downdrodden will not change.

Hi Raman:

India's politics simply reflect what's happening with the People of India - same as the case in the US or anywhere else.

For good or bad, India has many National Parties, and hundreds of regional Parties, and Coalition Govt is the way of life, as it is in Israel or UK. Chaos will be norm not an exception in any Coalition Govt, I suppose.

Most Indians GIVE and/or TAKE bribes in their daily life, as I said before. How could you stop this with any Legislation, unless there is a Cultural Change or Moral Persuasion?

I don't like the Hindutva Communal Politics of BJP at all, hence I just can't support what they stand for in India where the Constitution is Secular.

In this current Lokpal issue, they have never played as a responsible National Party to work towards a well thought out properly compromised good Lokpal Bill... they never brought up this Federal Structure issue in the Standing Committee or even in the Lower House.

How in the world can you bring up 187 Amendments on a Bill already passed in the Lower House?

Unless, you want to disrupt the entire proceedings and allow the time to elapse at midnight. That's what they did.

How come you don't see what mischief the BJP played as the Opposition Party!!???

Forget about other smaller players in the Midnight Massacre like the TMC, who voted for the Bill in the Lower House after an element of CHOICE was introduced on the "Federal Structure" as an Amendment.

As long as the Choice is there, where is the problem for the States, where nearly 20 million employees work (who are the major source of Govt corruption in the country)?

I don't support DMK or AIADMK on the matters of corruption.

But I support A. Raja and Kani on the issue of incarceration in Tihar and the denial of Bail by the CBI and the OP Saini branch of the Supreme Court.

Because Bail and NOT Jail for an "accused" defendant is the Law and the Constitution, if you care for it...and such basic RIGHTS are violated by the Apex Court.

Shame on them.

Please read this on the current Lokpal Bill:

The Hindu : News / National : BJP did not want a strong Lokpal Bill: Chidambaram


Cheers.

:)
 
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Jaykay767

Well-known member
Please lets not compare our junk parliament with the usa. What is happening in usa is a ideological fight between the democrats & republicans - 2012 will resolve the issue for them !!

What is happening here is - criminals, rascals, thugs, fools, idiots & morons have come to power. Becos our nehru thug cut down all the princely kingdoms / powerful zamindars & became a king himself. Rahul is the prince now, he can only become a prince if the rest of the political class is junk.,

nehru won, india lost !!.
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
Hi Raman:


But I support A. Raja and Kani on the issue of incarceration in Tihar and the denial of Bail by the CBI and the OP Saini branch of the Supreme Court.

Because Bail and NOT Jail for an "accused" defendant is the Law and the Constitution, if you care for it...and such basic RIGHTS are violated by the Apex Court.

Shame on them.


:)

Absolutely agree. read my post under general discussion - "Anti corruption campaign is anti south dravidians" !!
 

kunjuppu

Well-known member
here is an excerpt from toi swaminomics

i apologize for so much copied verbiage, but i think, it effectively presents two enemies of anti corruption initiative - the indian politician, and anna hazare himself. good read. hope you like it too.

The danger in this blame game is that politicians will create enough confusion in the public mind to delay action indefinitely , allowing a gradual return to corruption-as-usual . This happened in the celebrated Bofors case of the 1980s.

Public anger against corruption was sky-high when the Rajiv Gandhi government was accused of taking kickbacks after giving an arms contract to the Swedish company Bofors. This public anger translated into a humiliating election loss for Rajiv in 1989. Voters confidently expected that many top Congress functionaries would be nailed for their misdeeds.

Alas, the VP Singh government that followed was soon totally engrossed in agitations over caste-based reservations and the Babri Masjid. Investigations into Bofors were neglected or diluted. The Congress party returned to power in 1991 and, naturally , stalled investigations. Then came the United Front government in 1996-98 , followed by six years of BJP rule, and still nothing happened. Bofors turned out to be just a game played by politicians to come to power, not to crush corruption.

............l. The plain fact is that politicians across all parties hate the idea of an effective Lokpal that can send them to jail for their sins, which is why they have sabotaged nine earlier attempts to enact Lokpal legislation. This time Hazare’s agitation has forced the political class, kicking and screaming, to finally enact something.

What that something will be remains to be seen. The scope for sabotage on one ground or another remains huge. Some parties could scotch Parliamentary approval by insisting on draconian powers for the Lokpal. Others can sabotage it by aiming for a toothless Lokpal. Still others can sabotage it in the holy name of federalism, which they say will be hit by central legislation that provides for Lokayuktas in the states. Every argument is phrased in passionate appeals to morality, yet the combined effect — wittingly or not — could well be to scotch any effective anti-corruption authority.

Hazare failed to draw big crowds in Mumbai to witness his fast, and then gave up the fast after a day, a pathetically un-Gandhian performance. His said he had failed to persuade the government to introduce a strong Lokpal Bill, and so the reason for the fast was over. He castigated the Congress high command, but had nothing to say about other parties that nixed the Constitutional amendment and the Rajya Sabha bill. He walked out of his press conference when pressed on the BJP’s role, leaving the media aghast. He simply said his next act would be to campaign against the corrupt Congress in the coming state elections.

This can only erode his image further. He soared to fame not because of himself but because he represented a Big Idea. He rode the tide of massive pent-up public anger against corruption in all political parties, not the Congress alone. Hazare could harness this anger because he was seen as a Gandhian not affiliated to any party. But by shifting, first in the Hissar by-election and now in the coming state elections, to a firm anti-Congress stance, he is beginning to look like a political player rather than moral referee. In UP, campaigning against Congress will, by implication, mean campaigning for the highly corrupt government of Mayawati . What a fall for a Gandhian!

He will not lose all his clout just because of one poor Mumbai rally. He may once again attract large crowds if politicians are seen to be jointly killing the Lokpal Bill. But his moral stature has been diminished. The biggest loser may be the public. With much less to fear from Anna, politicians may conspire to create a toothless Lokpal , or kill the Bill in Parliament altogether. Public anger needs to stay on the boil to prevent the Lokpal from going the Bofors way.


Swaminomics/entry/danger-is-lokpal-may-go-bofors-way
 
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