• This forum contains old posts that have been closed. New threads and replies may not be made here. Please navigate to the relevant forum to create a new thread or post a reply.
  • Welcome to Tamil Brahmins forums.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our Free Brahmin Community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Foundation for holistic knowledge

Status
Not open for further replies.

sravna

Well-known member
As promised, in this thread , I will be presenting the basis for holistic knowledge of science and spirituality.

Holistic knowledge is something that is acquired when seemingly disparate bodies of knowledge are viewed as a whole. We have physics, chemistry, biology as separate bodies of knowledge which try to explain what happens or what we see in the physical world. Then there is spirituality which tries to help us understand something that is beneath the perception of our senses or physical instruments.

Can Science and Spirituality be linked? I think yes. We can develop a body of knowledge that uses scientific explanations to understand the mechanics of the world and spirituality to explain the objectives behind such mechanics. Such a holistic knowledge should be able to put the various physical phenomenon and the actions and thoughts of people in the perspective of the spiritual knowledge.

There are different levels of existence that an entity can be in. In the most fundamental set of existence, it can be from a quark to an atom and from a chemical element to some mass of solid in the next. The next would be as life and finally as a mental being.

We can say that interaction and bonding among entities at one level of existence give rise to the next higher level. For example, atoms interact and bond to form chemical elements. Chemicals interact and bond and reach a stage where life is formed. This is according to the widespread theory of origin of life. It is the interactions at the biological level between two different organisms where mind did not exist that created a mental being.

There is always a synergy in bonding. Let us say that there are two entities A and B that complement and bond. We can say that A takes from B what it lacks and vice versa. So now both become complete. Thus the energy of A and B as a whole is greater than the sum of the energies when they were separate. This is the synergy or the extra energy derived from bonding.

The better the fit is, the higher is the synergy. When the fit is perfect, the synergy is high enough to take the whole to the next level. I think this is how a jump from one level to the next higher level happens or how the evolution from Physical to chemical to biological to mental happened. The above levels make up the physical world. Then we have the spiritual existence which is a step higher than that of the mental.

We will first see how the various bodies of knowledge of the physical world which deal with these different levels of existence can be linked and how they in turn can be integrated with the spiritual knowledge.
 
Last edited:

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
. For example, atoms interact and bond to form chemical elements. .

Dear Sravna,

Agreed..just like water is formed by combination of 2 atoms of Hydrogen and 1 atom of Oxygen(H2O)

But can H and O quench our thirst if they exists separately?

So likewise the coming together of anything or everything and its separate existence has to be cherished and rejoiced.


That is holistic knowledge in my opinion.
 

sangom

Well-known member
Dear Shri Sravna,

My doubts on some of the points in the OP are given below. Kindly try to clarify.


< Clipped >

Holistic knowledge is something that is acquired when seemingly disparate bodies of knowledge are viewed as a whole. We have physics, chemistry, biology as separate bodies of knowledge which try to explain what happens or what we see in the physical world. Then there is spirituality which tries to help us understand something that is beneath the perception of our senses or physical instruments.

Is spirituality something which tries to help us understand what is beneath the perception of our senses or physical instruments, or, is it the something which will logically explain and convince us why the observed world behaves in a particular way and what causes the scientific laws?

< Clipped >

There are different levels of existence that an entity can be in. In the most fundamental set of existence, it can be from a quark to an atom and from a chemical element to some mass of solid in the next. The next would be as life and finally as a mental being.

Do you mean to say that the same, or the same kind of "entity" is in a quark, atom, chemical element, life, etc. What is the difference between the chemical element state to "some mass of solid" state? Are not these two just a matter of quantity?

< Clipped >

Chemicals interact and bond and reach a stage where life is formed. This is according to the widespread theory of origin of life.
If chemicals were to interact, bond and reach a stage by themselves when life is formed, then should not we find newer and newer life forms coming up continuously, all the time? Why are we not seeing this happen?

It is the interactions at the biological level between two different organisms where mind did not exist that created a mental being.

It is better, for the sake of clarity, to explain what characteristics define 'mind' and at what level of evolution mind came in; whether at the multi-celled organisms, insects, reptiles, birds, animals or whatever.

Thus the energy of A and B as a whole is greater than the sum of the energies when they were separate. This is the synergy or the extra energy derived from bonding.

The better the fit is, the higher is the synergy. When the fit is perfect, the synergy is high enough to take the whole to the next level.

Both the above are suppositions; are there scientific evidence to support these?

< Clipped >

The above levels make up the physical world. Then we have the spiritual existence which is a step higher than that of the mental.
< Clipped >

It will be very helpful if "spiritual existence" is defined or explained.
 
OP
OP
sravna

sravna

Well-known member
Dear Shri Sravna,

My doubts on some of the points in the OP are given below. Kindly try to clarify.

Dear Shri Sangom,

Sure, I will try to clarify
Is spirituality something which tries to help us understand what is beneath the perception of our senses or physical instruments, or, is it the something which will logically explain and convince us why the observed world behaves in a particular way and what causes the scientific laws?
Yes, ideally spirituality should logically explain why the observed world behaves in a particular way and what causes the scientific laws but it does not. Traditionally it has been concerned with what is timeless and so talks about something which is beyond the grasp of our senses. The idea behind my effort is to do the former.

Do you mean to say that the same, or the same kind of "entity" is in a quark, atom, chemical element, life, etc. What is the difference between the chemical element state to "some mass of solid" state? Are not these two just a matter of quantity?

The demarcation is along the lines of what goes into different fields of study . For example physics deals with quarks, atoms etc. Chemistry deals with chemical elements, molecules and all matter that is dealt with in chemistry. The difference is just a matter of quantity.
If chemicals were to interact, bond and reach a stage by themselves when life is formed, then should not we find newer and newer life forms coming up continuously, all the time? Why are we not seeing this happen?

Humans evolved from a lower organism and in my view that organism can evolve to only humans. Similarly life forms at each level are limited by the above restriction.
It is better, for the sake of clarity, to explain what characteristics define 'mind' and at what level of evolution mind came in; whether at the multi-celled organisms, insects, reptiles, birds, animals or whatever.

I define mind as something that helps one to see through time. Most of the early life forms respond to external stimuli due to the sensory perception. The stimuli are not processed at a higher level. The higher processing system is the mind and it may be present in rudimentary form in some of the more advanced organisms such as the insects, reptiles etc. I will address this question in more detail later.
Both the above are suppositions; are there scientific evidence to support these?

The creation of synergy is my hypothesis and I will try to support that hypothesis.
It will be very helpful if "spiritual existence" is defined or explained.

It is the ultimate level of existence as defined in the scriptures. Loosely I would call it as being God.
 
OP
OP
sravna

sravna

Well-known member
Dear Folks,

Here's a clarification on the different levels of existence I talked about in the introduction.

Different levels of existence are characterized by how much they span space and time.

The first level is pure energy. Unlike matter this energy does not span in space. My definition of matter is something that spans at least two adjacent points in space. This type of energy radiates in all directions in space.

The next level of existence is matter, something that spans space.

The third level is life, something that transcends space or spans all of space.

The next level is the mind that not only spans all of space but spans time also though in different people to different extent.

The final level is the spiritual one, which spans all of space and time . In other words it transcends space and time.

I will elaborate on each in the subsequent posts.
 
Last edited:

renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
Dear Sravna,

I remember reading somewhere that there are 7 levels of existence.

If I can find out where I read it I will share it with you.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top
Thank you for visiting TamilBrahmins.com

You seem to have an Ad Blocker on.

We depend on advertising to keep our content free for you. Please consider whitelisting us in your ad blocker so that we can continue to provide the content you have come here to enjoy.

Alternatively, consider upgrading your account to enjoy an ad-free experience along with numerous other benefits. To upgrade your account, please visit the account upgrades page

You can also donate financially if you can. Please Click Here on how you can do that.

I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks