• This forum contains old posts that have been closed. New threads and replies may not be made here. Please navigate to the relevant forum to create a new thread or post a reply.
  • Welcome to Tamil Brahmins forums.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our Free Brahmin Community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

criteria to buy and sell shares...

Status
Not open for further replies.
criteria to buy ...

Dear Mr.Sriniranga,
Please do not get into this. This is nothing but pure gambling, only fit for
rich people who have surplus money to play with.
 
Sir ,

It is not gambling but a part of business.You can make money if U invst regularly & systematically instead of transacting only during boom time.To start with you ca go for IPOs.
Good luck.
 
criteria to buy and sell shares

Mr. Lotus,

Sorry sir, I do not agree with you. Can you enlighten me the on the
growth in the fundamentals that pushed the sensex from 15 K to 20 K
within a short period of one month ?

Assume the face value of a share as Rs.10. It is now being quoted or
traded at Rs.800. Even if you get 100 % dividend, the amount is Rs.10,
a return of 1.25% on your investment. You buy it with the gambling instinct
that the market price will go up.

There are times when the prices have crashed and many investors have lost
everything.

The Finance Minister weeps if the sensex falls , but he is not worried when
it is artificially boosted. When the foreign investors withdraw their
investment, what would happen to sensex ?. The rupee also will fall
with all its attendant consequences.
 
Dear Sri N.R. Ranganathan Ji,

Shares are only one avenue of investment. Obviously, there are other much less risky investment instruments, such as Treasury notes (in U.S.), Bonds (which have senior status to stocks in terms of devolution) and of course the insured bank savings. All the instruments are valid and carry different risks.

The value of the stock nowadays anywhere in the world represents the Global economic growth. This is why stocks in China and and in India in particular are seeing a lot of 'foreign' money going after them. The problem in investing in stocks in India is higher than if one would invest in the U.S., for example. It is because of the rules and regulations that govern the listing and transparency in NYSE or Nasdaq, are much stricter than the ones for listing in BSE or NSE. But, still in my opinion, it is not equal to gambling, where the success rate is much less than even.

One should recognize this, and should only invest the money one is willing to lose (understanding the risks), and not get greedy. A person who is young and has sufficient 'safe' funds and have liquidity otherwise to invest, should ofcourse look in to how to invest in a stock market (even in India), but with full understanding of the associated risks.

More the risk, better the return. Or the corollary, more the risk, more opportunities to lose the investment!

Stock market is a great tool of capitalism, where the market determines which human business enterprise deserves investment, while making the investor a part owner of that enterprise. It is a glorious system.

But then, if you do not want to lose your money, park in an insured Bank account and better still, below your pillow!

Pranams,
KRS
 
In my poorvashrama I have spent a couple of decades working as an Investment banker. That included actively dealing in shares.

Normally we do not advise anyone who is new to share trading to enter a bull market.
 
criteria to buy and sell shares

Dear sri KRSji,

Sir, you are saying almost what I have said, but clothed in different
language.

We have in India too fixed-interest bearing securities like fixed deposits
with the banks, limited companies and others carrying a fixed rate of
interest based on RBI's guidelines in that regard. Income on these is
fixed and known in advance. Whilst investment in banks and government
securities are safe, the safety of deposits with the limited companies is
linked to its profitability, financial worth and industry. Infra-structure,
IT, pharma and banking industries are good.

I know the nuances of the stock market in India and how people play
with it. If you are in it and know it well and if you are a full-timer, you
can make money by trading in shares. But, if anyone wants to invest his
savings to earn something for augmenting his income, I would not
recommend it.
 
Mr. Lotus,

Sorry sir, I do not agree with you. Can you enlighten me the on the
growth in the fundamentals that pushed the sensex from 15 K to 20 K
within a short period of one month ?

Assume the face value of a share as Rs.10. It is now being quoted or
traded at Rs.800. Even if you get 100 % dividend, the amount is Rs.10,
a return of 1.25% on your investment. You buy it with the gambling instinct
that the market price will go up.

There are times when the prices have crashed and many investors have lost
everything.

The Finance Minister weeps if the sensex falls , but he is not worried when
it is artificially boosted. When the foreign investors withdraw their
investment, what would happen to sensex ?. The rupee also will fall
with all its attendant consequences.

Sri Ranganathan,

I agree with your observations about the current bull run.

However having called the indulgence in trading as gambling, you shouldnt be worried about fundamentals, isnt it ? :)

That was said in a lighter vein, i am not alluding to anything else.

Theoretically, the way stock market behaves is 'supposed' to be a reflection of the mood of the economy or better still a confirmation of the fundamentals. The stock price which is a multiple of the EPS is forward-looking isnt it ?

I neednt tell you that when we invest in a stock it is not only about the dividend income but we also look for capital appreciation else the model wouldnt justify the investment.

There is lot of unscruplousness and unholy collusion but i still would stick my neck out and say that our market is still one of the better managed among the lot.

My general suggestion to anyone wanting to throw his hat in the ring is this :

a. The best advice on investment you will ever get is from the mirror, i.e yourselves.

b. Each person knows his/her investment and risk appetite.

c. Each person should set the disciplines that they like to follow

If the game is played strictly in accordance to the rules that we set for ourselves, we can still walkout with head held high. If you want to indulge in trading, dont befriend Greed.

Now coming to your part about PC being weeping whenever Sensex falls, it is because, normally the index trips on his sound byte or his policy note. Whether fairly or otherwise, the performance of the FM is linked to the bourse. Till the market delinks itself from the signals of the ministry and focusses, as you rightly said, on the fundamentals, FM will always be wary of the index.

About the FIIs pulling out, it is possible but not probable given the fact that the we are one of the markets generating the highest returns.
 
criteria to buy and sell shares

Dear Mr. Hariharan,

Thanks for your message. Perhaps things appear to be different to me
since I am not a votary of monetary economics.

My reply is to Mr.Sriniranga, who appears to be a simple man. I do not
want him to get tricked into this game, of which I have fair knowledge.

It definitely is not an instrument of savings considering the way in which
a few people control the movements of share prices, although I do know
that savings must be channelised to promote production and increase
GDP. But, as you say, if people have surplus funds and know the market-
trend well, they can do so. No bar.
 
Sir ,

Mr. Lotus,

Sorry sir, I do not agree with you. Can you enlighten me the on the
growth in the fundamentals that pushed the sensex from 15 K to 20 K
within a short period of one month ?

Assume the face value of a share as Rs.10. It is now being quoted or
traded at Rs.800. Even if you get 100 % dividend, the amount is Rs.10,
a return of 1.25% on your investment. You buy it with the gambling instinct
that the market price will go up.

There are times when the prices have crashed and many investors have lost
everything.

The Finance Minister weeps if the sensex falls , but he is not worried when
it is artificially boosted. When the foreign investors withdraw their
investment, what would happen to sensex ?. The rupee also will fall
with all its attendant consequences.


Sir ,

Can you enlighten me the on the
growth in the fundamentals that pushed the sensex from 15 K to 20 K
within a short period of one month .

Agreed !! Today it is not going as per the fundamentals but now it is a global push & happening all around us. It is also a cycle ,boom & bust cycles which we have to watch carefully.No body will advice to invest hard earned retirement benefits in stock market .But our youngsters should venture into this growing field & take a calculated risk ,better not to enter with greed & for short term benefits but plan long term & see the sensex reach 50000 !!!in a decade or so.
NO RISK NO REWARD.
Though am not a financial expert or adviser I feel anybody can start with bonus money or a month salary & then do regularly & once the money is big enough you ca convert into real estate.
As for the dividend part ,majority of the people (in India)dont invest in stocks for dividend .Also real estate is not giving any great dividend(rent )at the present market cost unless it was purchased a few years back.

As many accept bank deposits are the safest but youngsters must be more aggressive & dont hesitate to take risks & challenges.

Thank you.
 
Financial study - the need of the hour

Hi,
In this topic I feel it is necessary for everyone to start learning about the stock market , real estate etc. I have heard 'intelligent investor' is a good book. I have read the book 'Rich dad,poor dad' which argues for the necessity of risky investments. We have to learn the market , watch channels like NDTV profit,CNBC18 daily.

I think , if we have surplus money and we invest in only savings we may probably end in leading a life with lower facilities esp in growing market like this. So we have to learn the market first for a period , may be 6 months or 1 year and a percentage of surplus money can go into the market. I think a guy , who saves 5K a month can invest 500 Rs in a SIP which has a good track record.

Consider the fact that 3 years ago , the Bangalore real estate was almost 50% cheaper than what it is now. The feeling at that time was the housing market was overvalued.Now the same feeling remains.But the asset price has not come down.It has grown up.Asset price inflation is very high under this UPA government which struggles to maintain growth and inflation at comfortable levels. So if you had 25lak for 2 BH 3 years back , you have to end up for 1BH now or we have to make other compromises in terms of location etc.

I am not saying we have to pump money in risky investments.But its advisable to learn the market closely, identify good adviser and do financial planning for our life.Because the bank investments can give a surplus money compared to basic goods inflation.But you may never become an asset class .

THe stock value is about showing growth. If your stock shows 30% or 20% growth for say 10 years (or n years) you are done with it. Assume the present price is 100 and the growth rate is 20%

100 Current value
100 * (1.2) at the end of 1st year
100* (1.2)(1.2) at the end of 2 nd year
|
|
100 * (1.2) power 10 at the end of 10 th year.

So theoretically it has to grow by 7 times.Similarly your dividend has to grow by that rate. I was taught like this by a colleague 2 years back like this.May be this is the fundamentals.He pointed out that a similar thing happened with infosys for more than ten years with a rate of 30 to 40 percent every year .May be we had similar stories in good stocks of many sectors.Of course we would have many negative stories also.

So learn,identify the adviser, make a decision.Risk profile, the companies we are investing , the holding power are very important.If you cannot hold for a long time say 3 years it is better to avoid the market.

I get the feeling "only savings" approach may make our life difficult in future and a percentage of risk based investments may be mandatory.

In market for the index rise , from 14K to 20K the reason given was the least expected interest rate cut by the Fed on that time and the depreciation of dollar. FIIs found a situation to earn easy money through stock appreciation as well as from dollar depreciation.

Thanks,
Fire.
 
Criteria to buy and sell shares

A discerning investor might have noticed that during the short period when
the sensex shot up from 15k to 20 k , there were no public issues. In one
week, we received an amount of USD 19,000 cr. All this money has gone to
fund the transfers from one existing shareholder to another, and there is no
inflow to the industry. That is, the sensex movement and the inflow of funds
have nothing to do with the internal finance of the corporate entities. The
companies whose shares are traded have not received any funds to finance
its working, either as working-capital finance or as project finance. This
upward movement might help the company only if it goes for public issue at some
later date in fixing the price band.

Of course, many sectors have reported better results for the first half-year.
But, the upward surge of share prices took place before the results were
published.Also, One has to take into account the appreciation of rupee vis-a-vis
USD, which will have the effect of reduction in income of export-oriented
units and IT sector. Pharma industry is now facing erosion of margin due to
centralized price control and approval of drug formulations. The new drug
authority has asked the trade to return many drugs to the manufacturers,
banned the formulations of some companies, arrrogated to itself the
authority to issue the licences etc to make its presence felt ( remember
the elections are fast approaching and guess what is in store ! ). These
steps would affect the profitability of the industry.

So, if one wants to take risks and invest in stock market, he has to watch
the political situation, progress of industry- overall and sectoral, monetary
and fiscal policies of the governement, international oil prices, exchange
parity and such other things and guess their impact.

Invest small amounts out of your savings judiciously and keep watching !
This advice is only to middle-class people. Rich people can do anything
they want.
 
Last edited:
criteria to buy....

Respected Sri Nacchinarkiniyanji,

In one of your posts above, I see a remark " In my poorvashrama ...... ".
Sir, have you taken sanyas, in which case I can't address you as sir .
I must address you as Respected Swamiji. I shall be grateful if you can
clarify. with pranams,
 
Dear N.R.Ranganathan Ji,

Yes, I have said ALMOST what you have said, with one big difference. It is about the idea of safeguarding the interests of the 'uneducated and the naive'.

Capitalism demands personal accountability and if one is willing to roll the dice out of greed, then ofcourse, that person has made his/her decision as an adult.

If a person puts his/her life savings in an instrument without knowing the risks, who is to be blamed?

But at the same time, I wish I had invested in the likes of IBM, XEROX, KODAK, GOOGLE or INFOSYS, when they were in their infancy.

To argue against investing in the idea of Capitalism, is where we disagree.

Not all investments in the equity markets are as risky as you seem to believe.

Pranams,
KRS



Dear sri KRSji,

Sir, you are saying almost what I have said, but clothed in different
language.

We have in India too fixed-interest bearing securities like fixed deposits
with the banks, limited companies and others carrying a fixed rate of
interest based on RBI's guidelines in that regard. Income on these is
fixed and known in advance. Whilst investment in banks and government
securities are safe, the safety of deposits with the limited companies is
linked to its profitability, financial worth and industry. Infra-structure,
IT, pharma and banking industries are good.

I know the nuances of the stock market in India and how people play
with it. If you are in it and know it well and if you are a full-timer, you
can make money by trading in shares. But, if anyone wants to invest his
savings to earn something for augmenting his income, I would not
recommend it.
 
criteria to buy and sell shares..

Dear sri KRSji,

Sir, if you read all my postings you will observe that I am not against
investing in shares per se. Subscribing to equities in public issue is a
mode of converting savings into investment for productive purposes.
This is one aspect. The second aspect is to get fair returns on your
investment. I am only against trading in shares because of large scale
manipulations of which I have fair knowledge and which aspect I can not
deal with in writing !. I hope you will guess what I mean. Other than
this aspect we see eye to eye.
 
Facing Challenging in this industry

Dear all
I am very happy to gothrough these challenging issues in the stock market... i am learning more in these debate... i would like to know what are the factors we need to consider while investing the stocks... because

1. As ranga sir said political and Abroad investors (like google,microsoft) plays the major role

What are the other things we need to consider ... which brokers and doing things well.. like getting charge less...
what are the brokers are available... one of my friend is doing this and he is having account @ 5paise.com and another one is having icicionesource... which one is the best
 
Dear Sri N.R.Ranganathan Ji,

I understand. If transparency is not there, it carries a huge risk. I know. I had all my 401K in the Enron stock! Thanks for the clarification.

Pranams,
KRS


Dear sri KRSji,

Sir, if you read all my postings you will observe that I am not against
investing in shares per se. Subscribing to equities in public issue is a
mode of converting savings into investment for productive purposes.
This is one aspect. The second aspect is to get fair returns on your
investment. I am only against trading in shares because of large scale
manipulations of which I have fair knowledge and which aspect I can not
deal with in writing !. I hope you will guess what I mean. Other than
this aspect we see eye to eye.
 
Criteria to buy and sell shares

Dear sri Sriniranga,

This perhaps is the first time the sensex has fallen on the day of Muhurat
trading. Over the week, it has fallen by about 900 points and is now below
the psychological figure of 19,000. Small investors might have sold their
holdings to encash their profit, fearing further fall. This week's fall is in
sympathy with the fall in the other global markets. Next week's trend would
give us a better indication of things to come !
 
dear sir,
it is only few shares which are contributing to the climb to the dizzy height!!
this is no time to buy index stocks. the p/e is around 40+?? be on the lookout for small &me stocks and u can make around 5-6 per share in 10-15 days cycle. best bets are low p/e psu stocks. sugar stocks which r likely to get sops before election time. most of them r at low end now.
regards
eswaran
 
Muhurat trading

Dear sri Sriniranga,

This perhaps is the first time the sensex has fallen on the day of Muhurat
trading. Over the week, it has fallen by about 900 points and is now below
the psychological figure of 19,000. Small investors might have sold their
holdings to encash their profit, fearing further fall. This week's fall is in
sympathy with the fall in the other global markets. Next week's trend would
give us a better indication of things to come !

Sir
what is muhurat trading... in the http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/2139121.cms they mentioned as session... inititally i tought this is some trading company selling their stokes in NSE and BSE... pls explain this.
 
dear sir,
for stock traders the year closes with diwali and a new trade starts on the diwali day.the first day trading in a new calendar is called muhurat trade.
it is murder out there today.
buy it stocks they are going looooooowwwwwww and hold for a year atleast.
regards
eswaran
 
Criteria to buy and sell shares..

Dear Srini,

In the North, the new year starts from Diwali; on this day the traders make
token buys. They welcome Goddess of wealth Lakshmi on this day. We are
now in the new year Vikram Samvat 2064. In the olden days, the new year
trading was quite a spectacle. Now-a-days, it has lost its charm with the
advent of electronic media and the the large scale trading by FIIs.

Muhurat trading is restricted to one hour in the evening from 18 hrs to 19hrs.

At 12 noon today the sensex is 18433, a fall of around 500 points compared
to the last trading session. Traders normally buy in the falling market and sell
it when prices rise again. But, how does it behave, one does not know for
sure. So keep watching !!!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest ads

Back
Top