• Welcome to Tamil Brahmins forums.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our Free Brahmin Community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

True greatness is not in claiming one's self-glory...

Status
Not open for further replies.

JR

Hare Krishna
"Vaishnava jana to tene kahiye je...."
(
பண்பால் உயர்ந்தவர்கள் வைஷ்ணவர்கள்!)

ஒருவர் படிப்பால் உயரலாம், பதவியால் உயரலாம், மகிமையால் உயரலாம், ஆயினும் பண்பால் உயர்ந்தவரே உண்மையில் உயர்ந்தவர் ஆவர்!

Our Vaishnava devatas - Sri Vishnu, Sri Rama, Sri Krishna... do not bask ever in self-glory.

The most prominent amsha of a truly evolved soul is to identify and praise the virtues of even an enemy.

Sri Vishnu (and his avataras) prove time and again that they are this worthy, high level devata by their glorification not of themselves, but even an 'anya devata' (deity outside of Vaishnavam) such as Lord Shiva.

Here is an instance of where Sri Vishnu has sung the praise of Lord Shiva, knowledge gleaned through asking a parama-Shaiva (nevertheless a devotee of Sri Ramachandra):

"When Brahma and Vishnu see Shiva’s akshamalika-form, there also a hymn he (Vishnu) sings in praise (via Shiva Purana). Similalry during Lingodbhava incident also there is a hymn (Sri Vishnu sings of Lord Shiva). In Suta Samhita of Skanda Purana there is a hymn completely from a-kara (letter-A) to ksha-kara (letter ksha) detailing Shiva’s akshamala swarupam. In harivamsa also a hymn is there by Krishna to Shiva."

"விஷ்ணுவானவர் தன்னை எட்டி உதைப்பவரைக்கூட சபிப்பதில்லை..."


Balaji of Thirupathi- I : The Rage of Bhrigu



After His eighth incarnation, Krishna, met his end when an arrow pierced his toe, Vishnu returned to His abode in Vaikuntha. The much dreaded Kali yuga, the fourth era of the Time Quadrilateral, had begun on Earth and Brahma, the Creator was lost in worry for the Preserver had left Earth.
Kashyapa Prajapati, the grandson-in-law of Brahma, called for a great conclave of sages and seers. They discussed how best to mitigate the chaos that would inevitably accompany Kali yuga. After intense discussion, the council ofrishis came to the conclusion that they would perform a grand yagna, a sacrifice to appease the gods and seek their benevolence to steer the world clear of crises, and Kashyapa was to preside over the yagna.
Narada, the Wandering Sage, went to convey these tidings to his father, Brahma. When he finished telling Brahma all the details that were agreed upon in the conclave, the Creator mused over the news for a while. Then, He laughed out loud. "My son, this is indeed great news. Unwittingly these sages have paved the way for just the thing I wanted. Bhrigu shall ensure that Vishnu comes back to Earth."
"Bhrigu? I spoke not of him, father. Kashyapa is to preside over the yagna.Old Bhrigu will just be another participant."
"No, I have something else in mind. Listen to me carefully..." and Brahma went on to outline His great plan to Narada. When He finished, Narada was left smiling. "Narayana!", the sage exclaimed in happiness. "The cogs need to be set in motion soon. With your permission, father." And Narada took leave of Brahma and left for Earth again, where therishis were all busy preparing for the yagna.
"May Vishnu's blessings be on you, wise ones", Narada announced his arrival. They paused in their activities and welcomed their colleague. "Pranaam Devarshi!" Salutations, Celestial Sage.
"Fellows, we must cease all else and first decide who to give the ultimate offering of the yagna to. Only once a unanimous vote is reached must we actually proceed", said Narada to them.
"Brahma"
"Nay! Vishnu"
"Most certainly not! It should be Siva, Destroyer of Evil"
The sages all broke out in quarrel. Narada smiled to himself for this is exactly what he had planned. He quickly put on a mask of concern, though, and pacified the quarreling sages.
"My brothers! Argue not among yourselves, for that will do nobody any good. We must ask the wise Bhrigu to decide for us. He is learned and wise. He shall guide us."
The rishis looked at him skeptically. Bhrigu, though undoubtedly wise and knowledgeable, was also brash and irritable. However, on Narada's persuasion, they approached him at his hermitage.
The learned Bhrigu divined their intent but he pretended not to know and asked them what brought them to hisaashrama. He had been feeling hurt on not having been given any prominence in the scheme of the yagna but a whole lot of rishis coming to actively seek his help soothed his hurt and when he heard of their concern of appointing a chief deity for the yagna, he agreed to help them.
"Brothers, worry no more. We shall journey to the abodes of all three- Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesha and judge their worthiness. The third eye in our foot sole shall show us the way."
Bhrigu set about making rather elaborate preparations for his self-assigned journey and, on their completion, left first for Satyaloka, abode of Brahma. When he reached, he did not quite receive the royal welcome he had been expecting. In fact, he did not receive any welcome. Brahma was so engrossed in a discussion of music with His consort Saraswati, that He did not even notice Bhrigu's arrival. Bhrigu immediately forgot the weariness of his journey and in a fit of anger, he shouted at the Creator. "Brahma! Cursed as you are to not be worshiped on your Earth, there is no point in appointing you as the chief deity" and pronouncing his judgement, the sage left. He made his way to Kailasa, the mountain home of the Lord of Destruction, Siva.
When he reached, a couple of Siva's attendants, the ganas, blocked his path and refused him entry.
"Halt, sage. Our Lord has asked us to let no one enter. He is occupied with something and He does not wish to be disturbed."
Disregarding them, Bhrigu pushed aside the ganas and barged in through the gates, to embark upon the winding, mountainous stairway that led to Siva's home. What he saw at the end of his ascent infuriated him further. He found Siva busy in a game of dice with Parvati. Sensing that the sage was about to intrude, Siva looked up from the game and frowned in irritation at Bhrigu. Bhrigu was furious.
"So this is what keeps you occupied, is it?! No god who neglects his devotee to attend to such base urges is worthy of being worshiped. We curse you, Siva, to be worshiped as nothing more than a lingam, a phallus, on Earth. You do not deserve the honor of being the chief deity of our yagna."
He stormed out of Kailasa and headed to the last of his three destinations, expecting to be insulted further. Indeed, when he reached Vaikuntha, Bhrigu found Vishnu lost in deep slumber on His many headed serpent, Shesha, with Lakshmi pressing His feet gently. Seeing this, Bhrigu lost his temper completely and in his anger, he kicked Vishnu on His chest. Laskshmi was appalled at the sage's behavior.
Vishnu immediately woke up and fell at Bhrigu's feet, begging for his apology. "To welcome a guest is the foremost duty of the host. Pardon Me, great sage Bhrigu. Kicking My rock hard chest must have hurt your tender foot. Let Me wash it and massage it for you."
Vishnu's humility and submissiveness took brash Bhrigu completely by surprise. As the Preserver was washing Bhrigu's feet, He cleverly pinched the all-knowing eye on Bhrigu's foot shut, and the sage immediately repented his audacious act of kicking the Presever of the World. He humbly requested Vishnu to accept the sacrificial offering from the yagna. Vishnu agreed, of course.

http://talesfrommythology.blogspot.com/2011/09/balaji-of-thirupathi-i-rage-of-bhrigu.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8nfLWcCH3U​

ஹரியும் சிவனும் ஒண்ணு இதை அறியாதோர் வாயில் மண்ணு !

OM SHANTHI SHANTHI SHANTHI

 
Last edited:
"விஷ்ணுவானவர் தன்னை எட்டி உதைப்பவரைக்கூட சபிப்பதில்லை..."

In reality, is it true? His two popular avatars Rama and Krishna acted exactly against the above.

In the case of Rama, while he accepted Vibheeshana to come to his fold, he fought vigorously against Ravana (though some Historians say differently) and destroyed his Kingdom.

As regards Krishna, he encouraged war against two closely related families, sided with one group and helped to destroy the other group.

If both are truly the avatars of the God mentioned above, they should have counselled and advised properly in the above cases to avoid conflict.

It clearly shows it is only a myth.
 
In the case of Rama, He told Ravana 'Indru poi Nalai Vaa' to give hime time for mending his way.
Ahangaram prevented Ravana and he had to pay for that.

Krishna, went as a envoy and requested 5 villages minimum to be given to the Pandavas,Dhuryodhana out of Ahangara refused and had to pay.

Alwan
 
"விஷ்ணுவானவர் தன்னை எட்டி உதைப்பவரைக்கூட சபிப்பதில்லை..."

In reality, is it true? His two popular avatars Rama and Krishna acted exactly against the above.

In the case of Rama, while he accepted Vibheeshana to come to his fold, he fought vigorously against Ravana (though some Historians say differently) and destroyed his Kingdom.

As regards Krishna, he encouraged war against two closely related families, sided with one group and helped to destroy the other group.

If both are truly the avatars of the God mentioned above, they should have counselled and advised properly in the above cases to avoid conflict.

It clearly shows it is only a myth.

What about Narasimha and Hiranyakasipu? Did not Vishnu simply tear and eat the entrails of Hiranyakasipu just because he (the latter) forbade his people from uttering Vishnu's name; Hiranyakasipu did not do any 'etti uthaikkal'.

Vamana also kicked down Mahabali by his head just because Mahabali just aspired for the next Indra's post and because Vishnu possibly felt MB was not good enough. Vishnu, if he is really the Supreme God could have appointed his favourite man as the next Indra! This shows that Vishnu has no power in Indra's appointment!
 
If both are truly the avatars of the God mentioned above, they should have counselled and advised properly in the above cases to avoid conflict.

Krishna was willing to settle down with just 5 houses for the Pandavas and when Duryodhana refused to part with even an inch of land only the matter became worst and war had to be fought .
 
Dear Jayashree,

Krishna says often that he is the supreme being!

Here is one quote from BG:

Quotation-Bhagavad-Gita-wise-love-devotion-understanding-Meetville-Quotes-110880.jpg


Source: meetville.com/ bhagavad-gita/page2
 
What about Narasimha and Hiranyakasipu? Did not Vishnu simply tear and eat the entrails of Hiranyakasipu just because he (the latter) forbade his people from uttering Vishnu's name; Hiranyakasipu did not do any 'etti uthaikkal'.

Vamana also kicked down Mahabali by his head just because Mahabali just aspired for the next Indra's post and because Vishnu possibly felt MB was not good enough. Vishnu, if he is really the Supreme God could have appointed his favourite man as the next Indra! This shows that Vishnu has no power in Indra's appointment!

Even in the case of 'GAJENDRA MOKSHAM' the logic is not clear.

Crocodile has to live by eating either animals or humans. It attacked the elephant for its meat. I don't know why Vishnu's chakra killed the crocodile and freed the elephant. The God could have freed the elephant without killing the crocodile.

To off-set the above lapse, there may be a story floating around.
 
Even in the case of 'GAJENDRA MOKSHAM' the logic is not clear.

Crocodile has to live by eating either animals or humans. It attacked the elephant for its meat. I don't know why Vishnu's chakra killed the crocodile and freed the elephant. The God could have freed the elephant without killing the crocodile.

To off-set the above lapse, there may be a story floating around.
It is believed that Gajendra's foot was held by the crocodile for over a thousand of years. :ballchain:

So, the crocodile was not willing to eat the elephant and it got the mOksham first ! :)
 
It is believed that Gajendra's foot was held by the crocodile for over a thousand of years. :ballchain:

So, the crocodile was not willing to eat the elephant and it got the mOksham first ! :)

Did the crocodile have any special "varam" (boon) to live for over a thousand years without eating anything? If so, was it given by Vishnu, Mahesha, Brahma, Indra or who?
 
Did the crocodile have any special "varam" (boon) to live for over a thousand years without eating anything? If so, was it given by Vishnu, Mahesha, Brahma, Indra or who?
Dear Narayan Sir,

:sorry: ... I did NOT write that story and so I can't answer this Q! :)
 
What about Narasimha and Hiranyakasipu? Did not Vishnu simply tear and eat the entrails of Hiranyakasipu just because he (the latter) forbade his people from uttering Vishnu's name; Hiranyakasipu did not do any 'etti uthaikkal'.

I'm sure Hiranyakashipu would have lived 'to this day' if he had used the above said weapon (or anything worser) against Sri Vishnu alone! The fact that he harassed and tormented the good of the soil led to his slaying by the Lord.

Vamana also kicked down Mahabali by his head just because Mahabali just aspired for the next Indra's post and because Vishnu possibly felt MB was not good enough. Vishnu, if he is really the Supreme God could have appointed his favourite man as the next Indra! This shows that Vishnu has no power in Indra's appointment!

It rather shows Sri Vishnu's honoring of effort rather than his 'lack of power'.

BTW: It is always a win-win situation with Vishnu!

Where there is goodness: Vishnu blesses and praises (Shiva)
Where there is goodness+arrogance: Vishnu kills but grants with moksha+eternity+sovereignty (Mahabali)
Where there is sheer arrogance: Vishnu kills but still grants mukthi (Sishupala, Hiranyakashipu, et al)

Who else but the blessed Mahabali could stand witness to the Lord's infinite glory in his Trivikramavadhara and also be a cause for the 'formation' of holy Ganga? (It is said when the good Lord took Trivikramavathara, his toe pierced the Satyaloka and Brahmadeva washed it with water from his kamandalu which became the holy Ganga).

Jai Ho Sriman Narayana, the god who grants 'win-win' for all, even for a 'paapi'!
 
From Wikipedia:

But Bali was also considered as arrogant and vainglorious and the godly people did not like him for this. Bali was also considered invincible since he was a great devotee of Vishnu. The gods, upset by the harassment meted out to them by the asuras, and jealous of the popularity of Bali – sometimes glorified as Mahabali ("the great Bali"), approached Vishnu to help them to get rid of Bali.[SUP][9][/SUP][SUP][10]

1. The god's considered Bali to be arrogant and Vain glorious.

2. The asuras did a lot of injustice to the gods and the devas, and Bali was their king.

3. The fact that Bali was popular perhaps shows predominance of asuras who Bali failed to control!

4. So inspite of the fact that Bali was personally good, since he was a ruler and failed to perpetuate goodness in his land, the Lord Sri Vishnu decided he was unworthy of becoming Indra and decided to kill him with all the surplus boons.
[/SUP]
 
Dear Jayashree,

Krishna says often that he is the supreme being!

Here is one quote from BG:

Quotation-Bhagavad-Gita-wise-love-devotion-understanding-Meetville-Quotes-110880.jpg


Source: meetville.com/ bhagavad-gita/page2

Raji Madam,

Have you heard of 'Shiva Gita'? This is what Lord Shiva had to tell Rama when he narrates this Shiva Gita to Rama:

"The five elements, the fourteen worlds, the oceans, the mountains, the demons, andthe sages; those that are seen as unmoving, like trees, and those that move(creatures), the Gandharvas, the Pramathas, the Nagas, all these are My gloriousmanifestations. ||5-6||".

Shiva Gita: The Siva-Gita is a text of Vedantic Saivism that comes to us from the latter portion(uttara kanda) of the Padma Purana. In many ways, it is a text not unlike theBhagavad-Gita, except the focus is fully on Siva. In the Siva-Gita, the teacher isLord Siva and the disciple is Sri Rama, and the narrator is Suta.

http://www.spiritual-minds.com/Gita_files/Siva Gita/SivaGita.pdf
 
From Wikipedia:





4. So inspite of the fact that Bali was personally good, since he was a ruler and failed to perpetuate goodness in his land, the Lord Sri Vishnu decided he was unworthy of becoming Indra and decided to kill him with all the surplus boons.
[/SUP]

This point necessarily cant hold any water because inspite of Lord Vishnu being Trivikrama, at no point of time was there total annihilation of wickedness in Bhu Loka. If Bali failed to perpetuate goodness in his kingdom, Lord Vishnu is equally guilty.
 
This point necessarily cant hold any water because inspite of Lord Vishnu being Trivikrama, at no point of time was there total annihilation of wickedness in Bhu Loka. If Bali failed to perpetuate goodness in his kingdom, Lord Vishnu is equally guilty.

No, Sir. I think it is all about 'proportion'. I trust this incident happened in Satya yuka. So if in Satyayuka, Bali's sovereignty propagated as much wickedness as in Kaliyuga, then this is a cause for concern. Whereas if the proportion of wickedness:goodness was ok ratio in Satyayuga (as with annihilation of Bali), this shows a winning situation for Sri Vishnu.
 
[h=2]True greatness is not in claiming one's self-glory...[/h]
Quotation-Bhagavad-Gita-wise-love-devotion-understanding-Meetville-Quotes-110880.jpg


What rajiji is pointing out is the contradiction.
Krishna seems to be proclaiming his glory in the BG. Of course you can always explain the philosophical meaning and say the obvious is not what is meant here.
 
True greatness is not in claiming one's self-glory...


Quotation-Bhagavad-Gita-wise-love-devotion-understanding-Meetville-Quotes-110880.jpg


What rajiji is pointing out is the contradiction.
Krishna seems to be proclaiming his glory in the BG. Of course you can always explain the philosophical meaning and say the obvious is not what is meant here.

It is said, "One grain of rice is enough to verify the state of the potful".
That the Lord who showed the Universe in his mouth as a child, praised Lord Shiva in a glorious stotra is enough evidence of Sri Krishna's golden and humble heart...

images
 
Dear Jayashree,

From your post about Shiva Gita, I understand that the God who tells "Gita" glorifies Himself!
award_star.png
 
Narayana doesn't punishes anyone when some insult/Hardship happens to him personally as stated in OP.
But He does when some hardship happens to his Devotees.
He even not punishes some one (who hurts) when Sri Mahalakshmi recommends pardon as in the case of Kaakaasuran.
Alwan
 
One will fail to understand our epics, puranas and so called kathas till he studies them in depth or seek explanations from learned. Every story has a past present and future to put it simply. The crocodile had a past and got moksha which it wanted.

Even in the case of 'GAJENDRA MOKSHAM' the logic is not clear.

Crocodile has to live by eating either animals or humans. It attacked the elephant for its meat. I don't know why Vishnu's chakra killed the crocodile and freed the elephant. The God could have freed the elephant without killing the crocodile.

To off-set the above lapse, there may be a story floating around.
 
[h=1][FONT=&quot]The Story of KURMA Avatar in a nut's shell[/FONT][/h]In KURMA Avatar, Lord Vishnu incarnates himself as atortoise. It is an interesting story involving both the gods (devtas) andasuras (demons). In the ongoing saga of battle between the gods and asuras, onone occasion the gods suddenly lost all their strength due to a curse by theshort-tempered sage Durvasa. The sage had once presented a garland of flowersto Indra, king of gods, who carelessly gave it away to his elephant whichtrampled it.The Devtas approached Vishnu for help. Vishnu then asked themto churn the ocean of milk after adding medicines into the ocean. Mount Mandaracould be used as the churning stick he said. He requested them to ask them helpof Asuras in lifting the mountain in exchange for offer of the share of nectarof immortality that would ensue from the churning. Both the devatas and theasuras churned the ocean using the serpent Vasuki as the rope. At the start, playinga Machiavellian trick, Indra, king of the gods asked the asuras for the headend of vasuki. But asuras suspecting foul play, took the head end, only to bedeceived as the poison from Vasuki was slowly weakening them. Poison fmenated was consumed by Lord Siva. But as churning wasproceeding the mountain was sinking and then Lord Vishnu took the form of thetortoise KURMA and kept the mountain afloat. As soon as the bowl of amrita, thenectar of immortality was out, the asuras grabbed it. Then Lord Vishnu took the form of an apsara, abeautiful maiden, and seduced the asuras into letting her distribute the nectarand also to abide by her order of distribution. As soon as the devatas wereserved the maiden disappeared thus totally deceiving the asuras and making themtotally weak.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest ads

Back
Top