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SC rejects Centre's plea, Rafale to be heard on merit

prasad1

Well-known member
The Supreme Court in an unanimous judgment on Wednesday rejected the preliminary objections raised by the central government, as a result the Rafale review petitions will now be heard on merits. The court will look into the documents published.

The apex court dismissed preliminary objections raised by the Centre that documents on which it claimed "privilege" cannot be relied upon to re-examine the verdict in the Rafale fighter jet deal. The Centre had submitted that the privilege documents were procured by petitioners in an illegal way and used to support their review petitions against the December 14, 2018 judgement of the apex court dismissing all pleas challenging procurement of 36 Rafale fighter jets from France.

"We dismiss the preliminary objection raised by Union of India questioning the maintainability of the review petition," a bench comprising Chief Justice Ranjan Gogoi and Justices S K Kaul and K M Joseph said.

The top court said review petitions against its December 14 verdict dismissing all petitions against procurement of Rafale jets will be decided on merits. The apex court said it will fix a date for hearing review petitions.

Petitioner Arun Shourie on the Rafale order said, "We are delighted at unanimous verdict dismissing Centre's argument on admissibility of documents."

Read more at: http://www.sify.com/news/sc-rejects-centres-plea-rafale-to-be-heard-on-merit-news-national-teklxrahidcfb.html


Fortunately In India unlike The USA the Supreme court seems to be independent.
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
Massive blow to this govt from the SC !! Terrific judgement in the face of unprecedented pressure on all the instituitions by this govt.

Hats off to your Sir CJI Gagan Gogoi !!!

My prediction was correct 😀, that CJI has stood his ground against this govt and delivered the second major blow after he brilliantly converted the the first judgement on rafale from "acquittal to conviction" by putting all the contents of CAG report, PAC, etc., in the judgment !!
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
Now to the right wingers - sorry guys, remember my next prediction.

N Ram is never wrong (nope, I do to know him, nor related to him, relax), his analysis is spot on and his comprehensive report indicts this govt on major procedural violation !! His sources, defence ministry documents, his investigative analysis is thorough and have nailed this govt, and their authenticity proved by the AG crying hoarse that these are stolen documents. LOL

Not to forget, Prashant Bhushan and Arun Shourie are veterans who will sew this govt up with their arguments !!

Hence the CJI will most likely order a JPC !. If a JPC is ordered to investigate a sitting PM, he has no choice but to resign !! So this election is not over in May 23, it will continue in the SC !!!

Sorry right wingers, just pointing out some unfavourable news that can come your way !!!
 

mkrishna100

Well-known member
Just before the election, Supreme Court has found a bit of its spine. Modi had done Balakot for Rafale, but just before the Election, Rafale Scam is back Again.
 

zebra16

Well-known member
Now to the right wingers - sorry guys, remember my next prediction.

Hence the CJI will most likely order a JPC !. If a JPC is ordered to investigate a sitting PM, he has no choice but to resign !! So this election is not over in May 23, it will continue in the SC !!!
CJI will order a JPC..?? At least know the procedure for forming a JPC. It sounds like a joke that a JPC will be
formed when Lok Sabha is dissolved that too on the instructions of Chief Justice of India !!!
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
CJI will order a JPC..?? At least know the procedure for forming a JPC. It sounds like a joke that a JPC will be
formed when Lok Sabha is dissolved that too on the instructions of Chief Justice of India !!!
On the contrary, your post is a total joke !! Do you have any common sense? Really ?? So what if the Loksabha is dissolved, a new one will be duly constituted after elections and then the new govt will have to act on any decision from the Supreme Court !!

Petitioners in this case have asked the court to "order an investigation into the rafale deal" based on some documentary evidence of wrong doings.

Court is well within its rights to order a JPC or a court monitored investigation, etc..
 

zebra16

Well-known member
On the contrary, your post is a total joke !! Do you have any common sense? Really ?? So what if the Loksabha is dissolved, a new one will be duly constituted after elections and then the new govt will have to act on any decision from the Supreme Court !!

Petitioners in this case have asked the court to "order an investigation into the rafale deal" based on some documentary evidence of wrong doings.

Court is well within its rights to order a JPC or a court monitored investigation, etc..
Moron,

In India the powers of Legislature and Judiciary are separated. JPC is in the domain of Legislature.
Stop your abadha panchangam
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
So what if court cannot order a JPC, they can order a court monitored investigation ??

Focus on issues,instead of name calling. Oh, only those who have no intelligent counter to offer, get into name calling !!
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
Bottom line is - If the court orders an "investigation or passes adverse remarks or says there is prima facie evidence in the rafale deal", then the PM has to resign, as he along with the PMO led the negotiations in this case !!

Again repeat, keep repeating, it does not matter if it is a JPC or court monitored proble !!! It doesn't matter if court cannot order JPC due to separation of powers !!

LOL
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
My advise to right wingers -

1. Focus on key issues and counter. For eg, in my post, the "key point" is that this govt can fall even if they come back to power after the elections, if the SC verdict goes against them !! Given that stalwarts like N Ram, Prashant Bhushan and Arun Shourie are fighting this case, it is more than likely, the govt will lose this case.

2. Now don't nitpick by saying court cannot order JPC. And even if you nitpick on such irrelevant issues, have the common sense to not indulge in name calling.

3. Ideal counter - analyse all the documents, reports and come up with a cogent argument that this case will most likely fail in the court. Great if you can do this, then we can engage in a real debate.

4. Let's keep the debate to high standards instead of name calling and nitpicking.
 

KRN

Active member
The SC ruling will have far reaching implications. In a sense it was to have been expected, in the light of recent precedent. The Government has done its duty of protecting the OSA. Until now the Govt's stand has been that

1) the documents being considered are stolen, not legitimately procured
2) As presented before Court, they are selective, incomplete, and present a biased picture of the matter
3) The Official secrets act prevents important defence related documents from being shared in public

Now, the questions are - in the light of the SC ruling, would the Govt submit before the court, the rest of the privileged documents that would presumably reveal the "full picture" of the negotiations? What would be the implications to national security then? And has the Govt ordered an investigation into how timportant security related documents were admittedly stolen by intrepid journalists? And could the SC ruling be considered as a clean chit to the said journalists, and an encouragement to future investigative journalism? Is it time to set some limits on the right to information, in the interests of national security?
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
The SC ruling will have far reaching implications. In a sense it was to have been expected, in the light of recent precedent. The Government has done its duty of protecting the OSA. Until now the Govt's stand has been that

1) the documents being considered are stolen, not legitimately procured
2) As presented before Court, they are selective, incomplete, and present a biased picture of the matter
3) The Official secrets act prevents important defence related documents from being shared in public

Now, the questions are - in the light of the SC ruling, would the Govt submit before the court, the rest of the privileged documents that would presumably reveal the "full picture" of the negotiations? What would be the implications to national security then? And has the Govt ordered an investigation into how timportant security related documents were admittedly stolen by intrepid journalists? And could the SC ruling be considered as a clean chit to the said journalists, and an encouragement to future investigative journalism? Is it time to set some limits on the right to information, in the interests of national security?
Good points !

My view -

1. May Not be required. Given the current set of documents in the public domain, it is clear, the PMO violated the defence procedures. So, additional defence documents may not be required to prove the case.

2. So only thing is to ensure the documents are authentic. By the AG arguing that these are stolen and later photo copied, he has more or less proven the authenticity. This is what Arun Shourie reepeatedly mentioned, because he knows this is a slam dunk case for him now !!

3. No impact to national security. CJI quotes the pentagon papers case, if the documents are in national interest, then journalists can put it in public domain.

4. Yes, clean chit to N Ram and the journalists.
 

KRN

Active member
I think we will have to see whether the Govt, as a party to the case, will choose the option of submitting additional documents that will throw further clarity on the issue. Now the Govt is no more bound by privilege.

I have not been following this matter from the beginning. Has the Govt ordered any investigation into this serious matter of important official documents getting stolen?

As far as the clean chit is concerned, if I understand it correctly, the SC Judgment states that such documents could be shared in public but does not legitimize illegal means of procuring them. For example, if they are got through RTI act, that's a legitimate way, but any other illegal means adopted is liable to punishment under the law of the land. In case of an investigation, I think the Hindu is duty bound to reveal its sources.
 

KRN

Active member
Good points !

My view -

1. May Not be required.

2. So only thing is to ensure the documents are authentic. By the AG arguing that these are stolen and later photo copied, he has more or less proven the authenticity. This is what Arun Shourie reepeatedly mentioned, because he knows this is a slam dunk case for him now !!
If the Govt had the intention of protecting anyone, what it woul have done is to outrightly deny he authenticity of the documents, and place the onus of proving their authenticity squarely on the petitioners head. That is what any lawyer worth his salt will do. By no means is it an easy task to prove that photocopies of documents ostensibly gained through illegal means, pertain to genuine stuff. On the other hand, the very fact that the Govt chose to argue on procedural grounds that, in the light of precedent, have limited chance of succeeding in court, shows that the Govt should be given the benefit of doubt until full light is thrown on the matter. We want the truth to come out, that's all.

3. No impact to national security. CJI quotes the pentagon papers case, if the documents are in national interest, then journalists can put it in public domain.

4. Yes, clean chit to N Ram and the journalists.
 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
I think we will have to see whether the Govt, as a party to the case, will choose the option of submitting additional documents that will throw further clarity on the issue. Now the Govt is no more bound by privilege.

I have not been following this matter from the beginning. Has the Govt ordered any investigation into this serious matter of important official documents getting stolen?

As far as the clean chit is concerned, if I understand it correctly, the SC Judgment states that such documents could be shared in public but does not legitimize illegal means of procuring them. For example, if they are got through RTI act, that's a legitimate way, but any other illegal means adopted is liable to punishment under the law of the land. In case of an investigation, I think the Hindu is duty bound to reveal its sources.
Why should they be liable for punishment ?? Pl note, under whistle blower act, those who obtain evidences to expose illegal or unlawful activities are protected.

Let's a company is engaged in unlawful activities, and the employees steal the evidence and give it to police or court, then would you prosecute the employees?
 

zebra16

Well-known member
Zebra, I have reported your abusive post to moderator !! First off, it is you who started this, when you interjected and mocked my post as joke, etc..

In a public forum, you cannot mock someone's post and expect them not to react.

Anyways, I am not going to respond to any of your comment related to my posts going forward.
You deserved the response because you asked if I had common sense when you were questioned the
competence of Chief Justice of India to order Joint Parliamentary Committee.

You should be careful with your words and not start paper wars.

It matters to me the least whether you respond to my posts or not. I only post messages to point out to the members (who read my posts) the factual position and not the fancy position you try to depict.

If you abuse me, you will get back the abuse and playing victim later on will not help.
 

mkrishna100

Well-known member
Chowkidar allowed Ambani to cream off 30KCr from Rafale contract, removed Anti corruption clauses, Bank guarantees etc, increased price, allowed 'theft' of Rafale documents which it hid from SC, but fiercely guards those docs to prevent SC from examining them. Rebuffed by Court - Advocate Prashanth Bhushan

 

Jaykay767

Well-known member
Chowkidar allowed Ambani to cream off 30KCr from Rafale contract, removed Anti corruption clauses, Bank guarantees etc, increased price, allowed 'theft' of Rafale documents which it hid from SC, but fiercely guards those docs to prevent SC from examining them. Rebuffed by Court - Advocate Prashanth Bhushan

Spot on. And this is why the SC has to order an investigation into the rafale deal, as the Hindu report conclusively proves this case subject to authenticity of the documents.

Hence this govt will fall even if they come to power post the elections !!
 

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