Rama - Positive and Negative

[happyhindu]

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But I am more interested to know (from some real researcher/s) what was the motive and the exigency for promoting Rama as divinity when the scribes had probably made Parasurama one already.

Dear Shri Sangom,

Have been reading about Parashurama (as mentioned in various accounts) on google books, but those are also more like speculation with no real research. So apart from offering POVs and insights, i suppose nothing else can be done in such cases.

Speculation from my part goes like this:

Am not sure Parashurama was really considered divine. Or perhaps he did not get popular as a divinity amongst the masses....

i mean why wud a son (parashurama) behead his own mother (renuka) just because his father (jamadagni) suspected her fidelity....if you were to remove the divinity part, i too wud consider such a man a crass cold blooded killer to be hanged until death...in such case, i think jamadagni wud require psychiatric intervention for suspecting his wife for flimsy reasons and for abetment of crime (was this jamadagni really a "sage"?)

As such, Parashurama's character comes across as the kind that can actually kill rather easily..

In the Mahabharat Parashurama supposedly wiped out kshatriyas 21 times: The Mahabharata, Book 1: Adi Parva: Adivansavatarana Parva: Section LXIV -- this sounds like a typical tribal war where the men were killed off and the women were taken as war booties to procreate -- like in a rakshasa vivaha. Am told the word rakshasa actually means a protector (from the word "raksha") and was therefore generally applied to all warriors (is that true?).

But if Parashurama had wiped the earth clean of all kshatriyas, how come so many of them had assembled at Sita's Swayamvaram? And only Rama is said to have placated Parashurama soon after the bow-breaking in Ramayan...But Ramayan is said to have taken place before the Mahabharat (am confused).

I find Parashurama rather controversial actually. Was there more than one Parashurama? Please do post more on Parashurama (is there any variation in the portrayal of his character and exploits in the Puranas, Ramayan and Mahabharat).

Parashurama is credited with giving land to brahmins -- is this true or an interpolation ? And / or is it indicative of tribal fights between naga tribes and brahmins?...or does it mean brahmins created such a story to promote themselves as the new owners of land...

You had mentioned previously that parashurama wiped off the kshatriyas in brahmanical imagination (meaning, were they just writing such stories as imaginary literature and were not true incidents?)...so perhaps their efforts to promote Parashurama as a divinity was unsuccessful...

Looking forward to your posts..

Regards.

 

[sangom]

Dear Shri Sangom,

Thankyou very much for these informative posts. Looking forward to more.

Some say the Ikshvakus were sugarcane farmers. Please also post your views on it. Wud the Ikshvakus be just tribal farmers doing their farming on small (or restricted) areas along the Sarayu ???...

Regards.

HH,

The word "Ikshvaaku" has, as far as I know, no connection with 'ikshu' meaning sugarcane, since the suffix "aaku" does not seem to be convincingly explainable. Still, in many websites (including wikipedia) the word has been shown as meaning sugarcane and further there is another hypothesis of the word having its origin in the southeast Asian myth which holds that man originated from sugarcane. I think this is
rather farfetched. If the southeast Asian myth had been the source of this word, it would more naturally have been the original word or its slightly altered form which would have been used , not the sanskrit word "ikshu".

There is another, and to me, more convincing, theory which postulates that the king list of the Aryans has some characteristics common with the Sumerian king lists. Ikshvaaku, as per this hypothesis, is a modified form of king Ukusi of the first Kish dynasty. I do not know if this has found wide acceptance yet, but I feel this is a fair possibility. We may also note that there was a king by name "Tushratta" in the Mitanni kingdom whose date is approximately 14 th. century B.C. The Mitannis were Aryans. Hence it is quite possible that these past histories of Aryans might have been made use of in writing the king lists and the character of Rama inserted as son of Dasaratha. It may even be that the Mitanni Aryans had links to Kosala and named their kingdom as Ikshvaaku. (In the Mitanni kingdom Tushratta was murdered by his son who could not come to power, however, since Tushratta's brother and his son gained the throne, probably after killing Tushratta's son.) Of course we don't know if the Mitannis were Indo-Aryans gone westward or vice-versa.

Shall write about Parasurama later since it will require much time.

 

[nachi naga]

Two purposes of Seetha's fire ordeal

When Seetha was about ten yards away, Raama, who is butter when He melts and steel when He hardens, said, "Stop, I can accept you only after you pass through Fire." Lakshmana swooned at this thunderbolt; the monkeys who had to bring the fuel for the Fire bent under the weight of even twigs. The Fire Ordeal served two purposes- to scorch the slanderous tongues, which haunt the tracks of Avathaars (Divine Incarnations) at an times; and, to retrieve from the Fire the real Seetha who had entered into it, prior to abduction by Raavana.

http://www.sssbpt.info/ssspeaks/volume03/sss03-03.pdf

 

[samarapungavan]

Dear Shri Nachi Naga Ji,

Excellent! The link is wonderful. Thanks.

The article seems to imply that it was "maaya seetha" who was abducted, which is found in some versions of the Ramayana, but Valmiki Ramayana clearly says that Ravana lifted her by clasping seetha physically.In any case it doesn't take away an iota of seetha's "paathi vrathyam" as quoted by you.



Thanks once again.

Regards,

 

[happyhindu]

Many takes, many views, many people in the mind, some delusional, some escapist, many real, many surreal, many unreal, all vaporous maya, when will maya go, who knows only time...YouTube - Enya- Only time (with lyrics)

Dear Shri Nachi Naga Ji,

Excellent! The link is wonderful. Thanks.

The article seems to imply that it was "maaya seetha" who was abducted, which is found in some versions of the Ramayana, but Valmiki Ramayana clearly says that Ravana lifted her by clasping seetha physically.In any case it doesn't take away an iota of seetha's "paathi vrathyam" as quoted by you.



Thanks once again.

Regards,

 

[nachi naga]

Dear Shri Nachi Naga Ji,

Excellent! The link is wonderful. Thanks.

The article seems to imply that it was "maaya seetha" who was abducted, which is found in some versions of the Ramayana, but Valmiki Ramayana clearly says that Ravana lifted her by clasping seetha physically.In any case it doesn't take away an iota of seetha's "paathi vrathyam" as quoted by you.



Thanks once again.

Regards,

s,

thnx.for me swami is best story teller.have seen some of the artifacts swami has shown from ramayana era,simply mind boggling.such exquisite artistic work,cannot find todayeven in prestigious musuem.recently my cousin visited me at my house and showed me the emerald ring embedded in gold that swami materialised for him the second time,as the first time it was way too tight,and by a mere blow of air thru his mouth-swami made the ring bigger and fit exactly in my brothers finger.such phenomenal miracle is carried on as part of the lore as sai mahima in our family circles.prahbhu lives amongst us,blessed are those who know our seetha-rama in parthi ,jai sai ram - om sai ram.

 

[rcscwc]

From my childhood I was told stories of Rama as one who was truthful/honest who obeyed his parents. He was single wifed and gem of a character. He was ready to sacrifice anything for the welfare of the country and countrymen. He was a person to keep up his words etc etc.
Recently one of my Hindu friend ( as we had a discussion of Nalambalam visit -ie visiting temples of Rama Bharatha Lakshmana and Satrugna on the same day during this month was treated to be auscipious)He was of the opinion that
Rama was a indecisive person.
He was always carried away by the words of others.
For example - He was called by Guru to kill asuras and went with him. Later when Guru instructed he broke the Bow and married Sita.
He without expressing his opinion obeyed his father and went to Forest without thinking what will be the future of the country.
Your opinion ????
Eventhough he was knowing he asked Sita to go through fire just after war to confirm her purity.
ON the words of Hanuman he killed Bali
On the words of a washerman he discarded his wife and let her alone in a forest.

Like this he quoted many examples from Ramayana and wanted to establish his point.

First off he did not break the bow. He attempted to string it, but broke when he bent it.


These are not examples of being indecisive, but consulting type. But after consultations and counsels he took a decision and executed it.