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God does exist

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Sastri

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As far as I know in the Geeta Lord Krishna never said "Among the Varnas..I am a Brahmana"

Check out the list below:

0. I am the Self, O Gudakesha, seated in the hearts of all beings! I am the beginning, the middle and also the end of all beings.


21. Among the (twelve) Adityas, I am Vishnu; among the luminaries, the radiant sun; I am Marichi among the (seven or forty-nine) Maruts; among stars the moon am I.


22. Among the Vedas I am the Sama Veda; I am Vasava among the gods; among the senses I am the mind; and I am intelligence among living beings.
23. And, among the Rudras I am Shankara; among the Yakshas and Rakshasas, the Lord of wealth (Kubera); among the Vasus I am Pavaka (fire); and among the (seven) mountains I am the Meru.


24. And, among the household priests (of kings), O Arjuna, know Me to be the chief, Brihaspati; among the army generals I am Skanda; among lakes I am the ocean!


25. Among the great sages I am Bhrigu; among words I am the monosyllable Om; among sacrifices I am the sacrifice of silent repetition; among immovable things the Himalayas I am.




26. Among the trees (I am) the peepul; among the divine sages I am Narada; among Gandharvas I am Chitraratha; among the perfected the sage Kapila.


27. Know Me as Ucchaisravas, born of nectar among horses; among lordly elephants (I am) the Airavata; and among men, the king.


28. Among weapons I am the thunderbolt; among cows I am the wish-fulfilling cow called Surabhi; I am the progenitor, the god of love; among serpents I am Vasuki.


29. I am Ananta among the Nagas; I am Varuna among water-Deities; Aryaman among the manes I am; I am Yama among the governors.


30. And, I am Prahlad among the demons; among the reckoners I am time; among beasts I am their king, the lion; and Garuda among birds.


31. Among the purifiers (or the speeders) I am the wind; Rama among the warriors am I; among the fishes I am the shark; among the streams I am the Ganga.


32. Among creations I am the beginning, the middle and also the end, O Arjuna! Among the sciences I am the science of the Self; and I am logic among controversialists.


33. Among the letters of the alphabet, the letter “A” I am, and the dual among the compounds. I am verily the inexhaustible or everlasting time; I am the dispenser (of the fruits of actions), having faces in all directions.


34. And I am all-devouring death, and prosperity of those who are to be prosperous; among feminine qualities (I am) fame, prosperity, speech, memory, intelligence, firmness and forgiveness.


35. Among the hymns also I am the Brihatsaman; among metres Gayatri am I; among the months I am Margasirsa; among seasons (I am) the flowery season.


36. I am the gambling of the fraudulent; I am the splendour of the splendid; I am victory; I am determination (of those who are determined); I am the goodness of the good.


37. Among Vrishnis I am Vasudeva; among the Pandavas I am Arjuna; among sages I am Vyasa; among poets I am Usana, the poet.


38. Among the punishers I am the sceptre; among those who seek victory I am statesmanship; and also among secrets I am silence; knowledge among knowers I am.


39. And whatever is the seed of all beings, that also am I, O Arjuna! There is no being, whether moving or unmoving, that can exist without Me.



Bhavad-Gita

These are words of Veda Vyasa!!
 
V

V.Balasubramani

Guest
Sir, Read somewhere: "God must be experienced. God cannot be explained"OM SHANTHI, SHANTHI, SHANTHI.
 
S

SANDHYAV

Guest
quoted from internet:

Throughout history, auditory hallucinations have been construed as evidence of communication with divine powers, although contemporary medical models often view them as undesirable and a sign of mental illness. In psychiatry, auditory hallucinations carry considerable weight in the diagnostic process, so there is a clear need for clinicians to have a greater understanding of the multiple facets of this phenomenon.
Auditory hallucinations are false perceptions of sound. They have been described as the experience of internal words or noises that have no real origin in the outside world and are perceived to be separate from the person’s mental processes.[SUP]1 [/SUP]Auditory hallucinations have veridical perceptual qualities in the sense that individuals are often convinced of the objective reality of the experience. In most cases, auditory hallucinations are unintentional, intrusive, and unwanted. Affected individuals may or may not have insight into the hallucinations. A person with insight will acknowledge that the experience is abnormal and will report less interference with daily activities than a person with no insight.
 

mskmoorthy

Well-known member
I found this article by a Harvard Divinity School graduate interesting/

My Faith: What people talk about before they die

My Faith: What people talk about before they die ? CNN Belief Blog - CNN.com Blogs

especially the last paragraph.

We don’t have to use words of theology to talk about God; people who are close to death almost never do. We should learn from those who are dying that the best way to teach our children about God is by loving each other wholly and forgiving each other fully - just as each of us longs to be loved and forgiven by our mothers and fathers, sons and daughters.
 

Govinda

New member
Post # 84


If one goes by strictly advaitic premises, the parabrahman just is; since it is completely nirguna it is axiomatic that that parabrahman is incapable of anything including creation. Yet, most people who expound on advaita have compromised themselves and taking Sankara as having accepted the concept of Iswara, etc., they follow dwaitham in their daily lives.

Hence, it will be difficult to agree to the creator-god concept from a purely and strictly advaitic pov.

Sangom Ji,

Sorry for the delayed reply.

You made a first assumption that 'nirguna' is devoid of anything, then made 'ParaBrahman is nirguna' an another assumption. When ParaBrahman(PB) is the Only one that Exists (Even in advaita terms), you made Him incapable of anything incl. creation. How can anything derived neither from evidence nor from logic, be axiomatic??


If it is difficult to accept any creator god, where did this Universe and Jivas come from?? If you say so, where did the Universe and Jivas (you, me, we all posters fighting here and the internet/silicon chip), come from?? Don't say, we are unreal, we are posting in this site with IDs ;) We are real, and if you say PB is incapable of creation, then Who enveloped me (gave me body) to create a form?? As per SankhyAs, matter evolved into forms/bodies for the Jivas, then shouldn't we worship only that Primal Matter(Pradhana)? But matter is non-being and is incapable, without an instrument! If Jivas had power to create ourselves various forms, then you may see Yogis doing that trick and there would be no hold on KARMA, and Legal systems! So, when Jivas can't do that, unintelligent matter can't create on its own! So, PB must have been the only Cause of creation.

Again, going back to the Potter analogy, if the matter and Jivas existed outside PB, then PB needed that Matter(Clay) to create forms on Jivas to make-up Species/Cosmos(Pots). In this case, Matter(Clay) become powerful material cause. Then, PB still is inefficient in needing outsourced material [the drawback of Dwaita]. If PB is beyond time, space and matter, PB should host Matter and Jivas in Himself, and He caused the creation, with the evolution of matter, according to the karma of the Jivas. Jivas, as already seen, has only finite intelligence, has to be ruled and dictated by the PB in everything nd anything , thus PB pervades in all, thus PB is beyond space and time too!

So, "Your Advaita" contradicts logic and Strutis' axioms!!
 
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Govinda

New member
Sangom ji,

Contd..
When I gave the references to pot-potter and egg-chicken examples, I was only trying to say that in the former it is easy to see a "creator" and the "created", whereas, in the latter case it will be difficult to say which was created first, by the so-called creator-god.
Kindly tell me why none of us remembers our past births (at least the immediate past birth)?
This was already explained. Now, Scientists have found that Chickens produce a specific protein OV-17 to harden the egg ingredients with a thick egg-shell to assist in laying the egg. They assume, they have solved the dilemma saying 'Chicken Came First'. Atheists getting defeated, now comes with the idea of proto-egg for the chicken. As the egg-ingredients are unintelligent matter, the Big Chicken (PB), the SAT (capable of creation of gigantic scale), Jnana (Most-intelligent), singlehandedly made the envelope for the ingredients to evolve into cosmos/jivas. Which Came First - The Chicken or the Egg? - YouTube

PB is also completely blissful (Anandam), hence the sole purpose of creation must be for the jivas' emancipation. He simply enveloped our intellect with some jata-vAyu, to forget our past-births. For example, Just imagine you were a snake, and someone threw you into a thorny bush like Bhisma did. If you are able to remember, you would want to beat up every single guy with vengeance. As, the main purpose is for us to elevate in qualities and wisdom, we are purposely made to forget our past lives, the moment when we are born (shastras say we remember our past lives in the womb). So, our Jnana is a cumulative of all past experiences, and we start from there, so our current svabhava (nature) is at the current level of our Jnana.

(hirayagarbha garbhastham hemabījam vibhāvaso |
anantapuya phaladam ata śāntim prayaccha me ||) ?
Situated in the interior of the golden womb, is the golden seed (AntaryAmi), that is the cause of all creation,
Who is grantor of all punyas/boons, worship Him for Peace!!

I am unable to accept a creator god who will create humans just so that they will go on paying to that creator for his mercy. What sort of a god is that when even ordinary human beings no longer expect such scrounging from their children?
It is solely for our experience, all the sun, moon, the fertile soil, the ocean and the rain, the family and friends, the vedas, the acharyas (Excl. fake gurus) were created before us and PB is still merciful and gracious to maintain irrespective of our conviction. It is our shortsightedness(bad karma/avidya) to remain blind to any of these generous designs.
 
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Raghy

Well-known member
A part of apeom, or few lines that can be used as a reference to instantiate a point or message is o.k.

Whether read or not , posting wall of poems on Vishnu or Siva's glory will not be beneficial, is my point!

Sri. Govinda, greetings.

I beg to differ, please. It is beneficial. I requested for the whole poem and Sri. MSK Moorthy responded by posting the whole poem. Sri. Moorthy had not offended anyone. It is indeed a very nice poem. I do not see the reason to complain.

Cheers!
 

Raghy

Well-known member
Post #87 Sri Raghyji posted "If possible, kindly post the full song, please." (you can see that post link here http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/general-discussions/11589-god-does-exist-9.html#post183550 )

In Post #88 I posted the whole song as per request - I have given the URL - But to ease the reader of one more click I posted the song in full.
( Ref: the link http://www.tamilbrahmins.com/general-discussions/11589-god-does-exist-9.html#post183571 )

I apologize if I have violated some (neti)etiquette and sorry for the diversion.

Sri. MSK Moorthy, Greetings.

Thank you for posting the whole poem. I loved it.

You have not violated any etiquette in my opinion. It is not a diversion either. Still within the topic.

Cheers!
 

Raji Ram

Gold Member
Gold Member
........ Then the new Geeta will state:

Among the body parts..my head is Brahmana
My arms are Kshatriya.
My thighs are Vaishya
My feet are Sudra.

O' Arjuna..when I carry all of you in My Supreme Self why this Kola Veri of caste?
Dear Renu,
Only the brahmins will be happy if he says so and others will start :fencing:.

P.S: Somehow I missed this post earlier!!
 
S

Sastri

Guest
Which he downloaded from Lord Krishna's website!

Veda Vyasa authored Mahabharatha including Badwad Gita - Established Fact

The Character Krishna in Mahabharatha is ultimate source of Badwad Gita - Fiction!!!
 

Govinda

New member
Veda Vyasa authored Mahabharatha including Badwad Gita - Established Fact

The Character Krishna in Mahabharatha is ultimate source of Badwad Gita - Fiction!!!

Sastri,

Then what is the source of Bhagavad gita?
 
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renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member
Dear Renu,
Only the brahmins will be happy if he says so and others will start :fencing:.

P.S: Somehow I missed this post earlier!!

Dear RR ji,

Why should there be any fight?

Every limb of God is verily God only.

Would we think that the head of God is superior to the feet of God?? No isn't it?


We humans no matter what our caste is..when we talk about God we keep describing His Padapankajam(Lotus Feet) more than anything else.

Even Bharatha worshipped the Paduka of Lord Rama and did not worship His head.

So even if God would appear in front of anyone the first thing any believer would do is to fall on the feet of God.

The feet is the Sudra "portion" of God and that is the only portion we humans are entitled to touch.


So there should be no reason for fight cos no one touches the head,shoulders or thighs of even a Swamiji.

Everyone touches the feet only.
 
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Raji Ram

Gold Member
Gold Member

Dear Renu,

You know that fight mongers find some reason or the other to fight!

Now people compared to other portions of God's body will anyway fight! :D
 

Govinda

New member
eda Vyasa authored Mahabharatha including Badwad Gita - Established Fact

The Character Krishna in Mahabharatha is ultimate source of Badwad Gita - Fiction!!!

Sastri Sir,

Very learned indeed.

BG starts with the Sanjaya's description of the War's proceedings. He narrates the discussion between Arjuna and Krishna. First Chapter has 46 verses, incl of the Arjuna's lamentation. From 11th verse of 2nd chapter, Krishna educates on the philosophy behind creation and reality.

There are 700 verses in BG, 700-46-10 =644 verses are mostly BhagavAn Uvacha or Krishna UVacha [leave some 10 verses for Arjuna's questions/doubts].

Why did Vyasa had to include Bhagavan or Krishna UVaca, if He authored them or Krishna is a Fictional character? Plus, If we remove those Bhagavan/Krishna UVaca verse, only 70 verses will remain without any intellectual content.

And, BG is one of PrasthAna Traya (3 authroitative texts), Sanakra et al philosophers have written commentaries and used BG as an asrayam /supportive text for their philosophical axioms/sutras.

What did you understnd by the author or source of any information? The original speaker/thinker or the narrator or the illustrator or the scriber?

Actually, it is said GanapATis scribed the Mahabharata for Vyasa, are those ganapATis the authors?
 
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renuka

Gold Member
Gold Member

Dear Renu,

You know that fight mongers find some reason or the other to fight!

Now people compared to other portions of God's body will anyway fight! :D


Dear RR ji,



I was thinking that if a person feels that head of the Supreme Person (a.k.a God) is superior and feet is inferior that means that person is Humanzing and Judging God into High and Low when God is supposed to be beyond the pairs of opposites.


Going by that each part of God is verily the same..The One which is verily One.


Ekam Eva Advaitam Brahman or which ever form of God that appeals to us.



So there is no part higher or lower and each part is verily the limb of the Supreme Person.

A doll made of sugar tastes sweet..no matter which part we take a bite.


God is complete and whole as in Om Purnam Adah Purnam Idam.


I was just thinking that if a person feels bad that he emerged from the feet of God or if a person feels superior that he emerged from the head of of God that means both the of them are not yet ready for the truth cos both have committed the mistake of dividing God into superior and inferior body parts.


If only people can realize their mistake of judging God...there will be no one feeling superior or no one feeling inferior.
 
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