• Welcome to Tamil Brahmins forums.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our Free Brahmin Community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Does chanting mantras without knowing the meaning have the full benefit

Does chanting mantras without knowing the meaning have the full benefit? if so, how does it work?

Appreciate insights.

-BrahmanAarvam



Good question.

Hopefully learned members shed some light.

On a personal basis I do not recite mantras without knowing the meaning as I want to know each and every meaning of the word and that takes effort to learn the language of the mantras too.

But then again after learning Vibhakti(grammar) and knowing the meaning of the mantras it didnt have an effect on my bhakti at all...I am very much a technical person..all the Bhava Bhakti is not there in me.

On the other hand I have noted many who do not know the meaning of the mantras but adhere to it with faith..I see that their Bhakti seems solid and genuine.

The mantras all follow chandas and rules of prosody and to a great extent the sound and the intonation is supposed to have an effect much more than they actual meaning..so its more of an sound effect rather than a meaning effect.

Let me give you an example...take binaural beats..we do not need to understand musical notes to experience it effects.

Some binaural beats have a hypnotic effect and also allows the mind to drift and relax.
The knowledge of music of the person hearing it does not make a difference.

Next example is water.

Not everyone knows water is H2O yet we all drink it and derive benefits from it.

So I guess may be the sound effect (Shruti effect) of mantras has an impact though a person might not know the meaning but again its a personal choice cos for me I rather know what I am reciting.
 
Last edited:
Good question.

Hopefully learned members shed some light.

On a personal basis I do not recite mantras without knowing the meaning as I want to know each and every meaning of the word and that takes effort to learn the language of the mantras too.

But then again after learning Vibhakti(grammar) and knowing the meaning of the mantras it didnt have an effect on my bhakti at all...I am very much a technical person..all the Bhava Bhakti is not there in me.

On the other hand I have noted many who do not know the meaning of the mantras but adhere to it with faith..I see that their Bhakti seems solid and genuine.

The mantras all follow chandas and rules of prosody and to a great extent the sound and the intonation is supposed to have an effect much more than they actual meaning..so its more of an sound effect rather than a meaning effect.

Let me give you an example...take binaural beats..we do not need to understand musical notes to experience it effects.

Some binaural beats have a hypnotic effect and also allows the mind to drift and relax.
The knowledge of music of the person hearing it does not make a difference.

Next example is water.

Not everyone knows water is H2O yet we all drink it and derive benefits from it.

So I guess may be the sound effect (Shruti effect) of mantras has an impact though a person might not know the meaning but again its a personal choice cos for me I rather know what I am reciting.

Very good reasonable reply. Don't find any room to differ.
 
Very good reasonable reply. Don't find any room to differ.


Thanks for the comments from your experience.

I have always been thinking of analogous situations and looking for an better understanding

For example, When we do not understand a language but know a few words in the language without knowing the meaning and utter them to a person who understands the language, the receiver does comprehend it and acts based on the meaning of the words uttered. In this situation the end result is for the receiver to respond or react.
The person uttering may or may not have the full benefit depending on the actual words and its end result.

But the important aspect in bhakthi is for the one who is looking to enter into state of bhakthi, I wonder if the full benefit is achieved without knowing the meaning. Following the chanting rules on grammer and emphasis on udhatha and anudhatha creates the necessary positive aural effect through vibrations. Does it have the full effect of creating the emotions that happen when the meaning is known.

-BrahmanAarvam
 
Benefit is received even if you don't know the meanings.

The premise of the mantras are to invoke the divine spirits and seek their blessings. Sanskrit being the the language of the gods is used to convey to them.

hence the person who chants receives the benefit as the mantras invoke the gods to bless us and grant victory in our endeavours !!!
 
Benefit is received even if you don't know the meanings.

The premise of the mantras are to invoke the divine spirits and seek their blessings. Sanskrit being the the language of the gods is used to convey to them.

hence the person who chants receives the benefit as the mantras invoke the gods to bless us and grant victory in our endeavours !!!

Does Sanskrit the only language speak about Gods?

Tamil, the oldest language, has brilliant religious texts on Shiva, Muruga etc.

Is it not a joke that Sanskrit the language of Gods?

You are a Bhakt of different kind.
 
Benefit is received even if you don't know the meanings.

The premise of the mantras are to invoke the divine spirits and seek their blessings. Sanskrit being the the language of the gods is used to convey to them.

hence the person who chants receives the benefit as the mantras invoke the gods to bless us and grant victory in our endeavours !!!

Even though I formally teach Sanskrit now..when my students ask me.." Is Sanskrit the language of the Gods?"

I tell them.."In the Sound of Silence is the voice of God".

Btw Jaykayji...You are implying Devas do not know other languages?
Dont make up stories.
 
Last edited:
Does Sanskrit the only language speak about Gods?

Tamil, the oldest language, has brilliant religious texts on Shiva, Muruga etc.

Is it not a joke that Sanskrit the language of Gods?

You are a Bhakt of different kind.

Sanskrit is a sister language to Tamil. So both are from the same root. Hence no contradictions here. That's why Sanskrit has historically been written only in Tamil Grantham script - all historians agree. Only from 19th century it was agreed to be written in Hindi.

Having said that, our traditions say that Sanskrit is the language of the gods and that's why it is inscribed on all our temples !!!

i am only stating what our traditions and ancient scriptures say.
 
Even though I formally teach Sanskrit now..when my students ask me.." Is Sanskrit the language of the Gods?"

I tell them.."In the Sound of Silence is the voice of God".

Btw Jaykayji...You are implying Devas do not know other languages?
Dont make up stories.

Hi Renukaji,

i am am huge stickler to traditions and culture. I am only stating what our scriptures say,

no I don't make up stories !!!

jk
 
Hstorically there has been no conflict between Sanskrit and Tamil.

infact it is the Tamil kings who were the "only patronages" of Sanskrit, they wrote on all our temples and all south East Asian temples from Bali to Angkor to ayuttya.
 
Thanks for the comments from your experience.



But the important aspect in bhakthi is for the one who is looking to enter into state of bhakthi, I wonder if the full benefit is achieved without knowing the meaning. Following the chanting rules on grammer and emphasis on udhatha and anudhatha creates the necessary positive aural effect through vibrations. Does it have the full effect of creating the emotions that happen when the meaning is known.

-BrahmanAarvam

When you involve Bhakti everything else takes back seat. In uttara BhAgA of ViSnu sahasranAmam it is said:

Sree rAma rAma rAmEti, ramE rAmE manOrame;
sahasra nAma tattulyam, rAma nAma varAnanE

meaning mere chanting of Rama's name thrice is equivalent to full recitation of viSnu sahasranAmam. So the ned of mantrAs is secondary.

Likewise is also the episode of vAlmiki reported that he could not pronounce rAmA properly and used to chant marA marA etc. and there is also the story of kaNNappa nAyanAr.

Having said the above, I remember to have read in some shAstrA that,

(i) the phalam of mantra recitation will be uttamam if the mantrA is chanted in swaram (including uddata, anuddata and swarita) as given and also knowing the meaning;

(ii) the phalam would be madhyamam if meaning is not known or understood but the mantrAs are recited in appropriated swaram; and

(iii) the phalam would be adhamam if neither the meaning nor the swaram is known.
 
Last edited:
Adi Sankaracharya in Shiva mAnasa pUja (stanza 4 line 3) mentions स्तोत्राणि
सर्वागिरो meaning whatever I say is your stotras and your praises.
 
When you involve Bhakti everything else takes back seat. In uttara BhAgA of ViSnu sahasranAmam it is said:

Sree rAma rAma rAmEti, ramE rAmE manOrame;
sahasra nAma tattulyam, rAma nAma varAnanE

meaning mere chanting of Rama's name thrice is equivalent to full recitation of viSnu sahasranAmam. So the ned of mantrAs is secondary.

Likewise is also the episode of vAlmiki reported that he could not pronounce rAmA properly and used to chant marA marA etc. and there is also the story of kaNNappa nAyanAr.

Having said the above, I remember to have read in some shAstrA that,

(i) the phalam of mantra recitation will be uttamam if the mantrA is chanted in swaram (including uddata, anuddata and swarita) as given and also knowing the meaning;

(ii) the phalam would be madhyamam if meaning is not known or understood but the mantrAs are recited in appropriated swaram; and

(iii) the phalam would be adhamam if neither the meaning nor the swaram is known.
Zebraji,
You talk for both sides, so you will not be wrong.
Is that the message?

How can you justify that stance?
In a binary world, it is On Or Off it is never in between or both.


If you believe in rituals it does not matter what you say, as long as your Bhakti is towards that God.
If you expect results for your Bhakti - then you are on your own.


When you do not get your desired results you can blame it on the pronunciation, or on the God.
 
Last edited:
There are three major categories - uttamam madhyamam and adhamam....

be it mantrās, dance, classical music or dappānkooththu!

In people, we get good examples of these three types....

be it a politician, teacher, student, in-law or spouse!! :D
 
http://creative.sulekha.com/bhakthi-vs-vibhakthi-ii_258634_blog
Found something related to this topic!!



This story happened in 1586 AD. The venue was GuruvayoorTemple. It was enacted two of the greatest poets of the yore; Poonthanam and Melpathur. The former wrote Jnanappana (Song of Wisdom) in simple Malayalam. Jnanappana is also called as the Gita of Malayalees. Narayana Bhattathirippad was the author of the Sanskrit work, Narayaneeyam in the form of a poetical hymn, consisting of 1034 slokas. It, in fact is a summarized version of Bhagavata Purana of 14000 slokas.

The following is the extract taken from the Guruvayoor Devaswom official site ( http://www.guruvayurdevaswom.org/lpoonthanam.shtml ) that presents this story beautifully. It goes like this:


“Though Poonthanam and Melpathur were great devotees of Lord Guruvayurappan, Poonthanam, a great poet, who wrote his verses in the vernacular, was famous for his bhakthi where as Melpathur, an erudite scholar and great poet in Sanskrit was known for his vibhakthi.

.
The Lord was partial towards Poonthanam than Melpathur. Melpathur used to laugh at Poonthanam's Sanskrit reading and recitation. One day Poonthanam was wrongly reciting "Padmanabho Maraprabhu", which means Lord of trees in Malayalam. Melpathur openly laughed at Poonthanam and corrected saying, Padmanabha is not Maraprabhu (Lord of trees) but Amaraprabhu (which means Lord of immortals in Sanskrit). Immediately, there was an asareeri (celestial voice) from the inner shrine, "I am also Maraprabhu" (Lord of trees).

Now there is a statue of "Maraprabhu" in the Sreevalsam Guest house compound fully made of clay. This is the biggest idol made of clay in Asia.”


There is another version to the above.
“The Jnanapana (means the song of wisdom) written in simple Malayalam is Poonthanam 's greatest work. Melpathur was the most knowledgeable and learned man of that time. Poonthanam showed the draft of his Jnanapana to Melpathur. Malayalam was not accepted in the learned circle those days and Melpathur had contempt for Malayalam, which was not considered equal to Sanskrit. He refused to see Poonthanam's work and told him blatantly to learn Sanskrit and then start writing. This act of Melpathur hurt Poonthanam. Melpathur was composing Narayaneeyam in those days and when he came next day to offer d andasaka of ten slokas (ten stanzas) before the Lord, he could not utter a single word. A small boy in his teens, never seen before presented himself and pointed out mistakes after mistakes in the slokas composed by Melpathur. After ten mistakes in ten slokas Melpathur realised the divinity of the boy. He felt at the feet of the boy but the boy disappeared and there was an asareeri (celestial voice) saying, "Poonthanam's Bhakthi (devotion) is more pleasing to me than Melpathur's Vibhakthi (learning or knowledge in Sanskrit grammar)". Melpathur realised his mistake and asked Poonthanam to pardon him and amended his arrogance by reading the works of Poonthanam”.
 
Does chanting mantras without knowing the meaning have the full benefit? if so, how does it work?

Appreciate insights.

-BrahmanAarvam


If we know the meaning of mantras, we can enjoy the mantras also. But it does not mean that only knowing the meaning would give full benefit.
In Ramayana itself we can have example.Sage Valmiki intially was a hunter and without knowing meaning , he uttered 'mara', 'mara'. So there lies answer for your question.
 
Some good insights shared that the mantras also invokes the divine with their blessings.
The uttamam, madhyamam, adhamam phala prapthi also help explain correlating to the effort put in.

I have always wondered, how does the energy circle back. There should be a way for the positivity to reach through the involvement of the self chanting the mantras.

Can anyone point me to write ups/content on the science aspect of chanting mantras?

-BrahmanAarvam
 
Sanskrit is a sister language to Tamil. So both are from the same root. Hence no contradictions here. That's why Sanskrit has historically been written only in Tamil Grantham script - all historians agree. Only from 19th century it was agreed to be written in Hindi.

Having said that, our traditions say that Sanskrit is the language of the gods and that's why it is inscribed on all our temples !!!

i am only stating what our traditions and ancient scriptures say.

Let us not bring relationship between languages.

It isn’t clear whether Sanskrit really originated in India or migrated from Egypt or Persia.

Sanskrit doesn’t have any similarity with Tamil. We, the Brahmins, try to knit in order to revive Sanskrit. The approach may not yield any result.

Like Urdu, unfortunately, Sanskrit, of late, has caste tag.
 
My suggestion: Learn to chant while knowing the meaning. Otherwise dont chant at all. If you do chant, you will never know the benefits if any. You can claim anything you want and even give explanations like vibrations etc.

If 10 people say it is vibrations, 100 more will take that as a fact.

So dont bother, learn well and then chant or just hear other experts chant.
 
The real reason for chanting Mantras without understanding the meaning is due to lack of interest and laziness in learning that language for which we create so many illogical reasons and continue to do it for generations.
 
One can generalize and ask a question: Unless you know how a particular machine works in depth (even a rudimentary knowledge), do not use that. It is a good thing to know how various things work (including our own bod). As an example, unless one knows in depth (or even partially) how a cell phone functions, you should not use it - this looks impractical. I do not know how many car drivers know about internal combustion engine and laws of thermodynamics (Here is a website https://www.brighthubengineering.co...aw-of-thermodynamics-with-automobile-engines/ that explains it). You use a machine and after a while (after thinking and reading) you get some knowledge of how that machine functions. The same logic applies (IMHO) applies to reciting Mantras.
 
Let us not bring relationship between languages.

It isn’t clear whether Sanskrit really originated in India or migrated from Egypt or Persia.

Sanskrit doesn’t have any similarity with Tamil. We, the Brahmins, try to knit in order to revive Sanskrit. The approach may not yield any result.

Like Urdu, unfortunately, Sanskrit, of late, has caste tag.

My point of saying Sanskrit and Tamil are sister languages ( inference from my analysis) and that Tamil kings ( I am referring to all South Indian kings as Tamil kings) were the "only patronage" of Sanskrit (this is a fact, even Nehru says Sanskrit was found only in south india in his passage to india) is that Sanskrit and Tamil coexisted without any major issue right through history in Tamil Nadu.

the example others quoted - Sanskrit vs Malayalam only proves my point that such a prominent scholar in the ancient past apologised and accepted Malayalam. And this incident was specifically called out highlights the coexistence.

so it is rather unfortunate that Sanskrit is being seen as brahmanical in the post independence era!!

Thats why I said if all tamils study Sanskrit, the caste system will disappear in less than 1 generation !!!
 
On the Sanskrit vs Tamil debate, one of the major points that many linguists say is that Tamil has a lot of Sanskrit words.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dravidian_languages#Dravidian_influence_on_Sanskrit

https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-Tamil-words-present-in-Sanskrit-Hindi

"[FONT=q_serif]Sanskrit has borrowed quite as much from Dravidian as Dravidian has from Sanskrit. But none of the four Dravidian languages I have read has borrowed anything from Sanskrit syntax that I can identify. Much of the syntax of Sanskrit is Dravidian, and it has a large Dravidian vocabulary. Its system of phonetics is profoundly influenced by Dravidian [/FONT]"

How is this possible, as Sanskrit was confined to only a few people and rest of the population had no idea of Sanskrit ?? So how could the Tamils have taken so many words from Sanskrit ??

the only possibility is if Sanskrit itself comes from Tamil. Then it perfectly explains why there are so many common words between the two languages.

And the the above references show that Sanskrit has borrowed the syntax from Tamil !!! Pl note the syntax is a major component of w language,

if if the syntax itself had been borrowed from Tamil, then both are sister languages.

if Sanskritwas Persian or Egyptian or European, it should have borrowed the syntax from them which is not the case as per all major linguists in the world !!!
 
Words in a language can be borrowed. For eg, in today's English, there are a lot of Hindi, Chinese, etc,, words. And you can call it as Hinglish or chinglish, but it is still English in the base.

similalry Sanskrit may have Latin or European or Persian or Urdu words, but the base syntax and pronunciation are Tamil !!!

ps. Major linguists who are Nuetral to this debate are saying that Sanskrit has borrowed the syntax and pronunciation from Tamil.

Kannada and Telugu and Malayalam come from Tamil, but you can see many Words are different today as they evolve over time. Similarly Sanskrit evolved over time in the ancient past.

another thing to note is that Sanskrit scholars travelled wide in the past, you can see Jain and Buddhist scriptures in Sanskrit. Even today Tibet monks chant in Sanskrit and refer to sanskrit texts !!

so it would have been easy for other languages including European to borrow from Sanskrit !!!

Let's take some Sanskrit slokams and see how does it sound !!

shuklam baradaram Vishnum, shashivarnam chaturbhujam,
prasanna Vadanam dyayetu, Sarva vignopa shantaye.

Om yopam pushpam veda, pushpavan prajavAn pashuman bhavatichandrama-va-apam pushpaM,
pushpavan prajavAn pashuman bhavati
ya evam veda, yopamayatanam veda, ayatanam bhavati

now you decide whether this sounds Tamil or French or Persian !!
 

Latest ads

Back
Top