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Reciting 'Om Namah Shivaya' while doing Vaishnava aparadha

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JR

Hare Krishna
Lord Shiva on 'SriRanga Mahatmyam' says that it is not enough if a bhagawata all the time recites 'Om Namah Shivaya'. If he were to do Vaishnava Aparadha and speak low of Sri Vishnu, his prayers are never accepted to Sri Shiva!

Ref: Sri Ranga Mahatmyam from Sri Brahmanda Purana (attached), page 9, slokas 34, 35, 36).
 

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Did Vishnu say anything for Shaiva or Smartha Aparadha or speak low of Shiva, and if not, then it is nothing but irrelevant statement.
 
I feel everything holds good both ways.

If one worships one form but derides another..its back to zero cos One is all and All is One.
 
Did Vishnu say anything for Shaiva or Smartha Aparadha or speak low of Shiva, and if not, then it is nothing but irrelevant statement.

Will Vishnu Chitas and Bhakths will agree to this or do they have a different version on Bhadhrinaryan This is from the walls of Sankara Matt in Kalady which I visited 2 days back





0
 
It seems that the Gods like to play nice to each other.

If only their devotees could do so as well ...


Yes you are right...Gods have no problems with each other..hence the following:



shivAya vishnu-rUpAya shiva-rUpAya vishnave;
shivasya hRdayaM vishnur vishnos ta hRdayaM shivaH
yathA shivamayo vishnur evaM vishnumayaH shivaH;
yathAntaraM na pashyAmi tathA me svastir AyuSaH


meaning:

“Vishnu is the form of Shiva and Shiva is the form of Vishnu, Vishnu is
Shiva’s heart and Shiva is Vishnu’s heart. Just as Vishnu is full of Shiva
and Shiva is full of Vishnu, and I can thus see no difference between Them,
let me similarly have a long life."


From Skanda Upanishad
belonging to Krishna Yajurveda
.
 
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Lord Shiva on 'SriRanga Mahatmyam' says that it is not enough if a bhagawata all the time recites 'Om Namah Shivaya'. If he were to do Vaishnava Aparadha and speak low of Sri Vishnu, his prayers are never accepted to Sri Shiva!

Ref: Sri Ranga Mahatmyam from Sri Brahmanda Purana (attached), page 9, slokas 34, 35, 36).

hi

vishnu immmaachhi kopa pada maattarrr,,,lol
 
Pistol walis and shot gun shatrughans are going to have a field day. So far pistol walis are active. The shotgun comes shoots from the hip and scoots.

Vishnu keeps watching everything. When Vishnu watches it goes without saying that Shiva too is watching because Vishnu pervades everything and that includes Shiva.

And a Vishnubhakta just enjoys the fun. LOL.
 
Renukaji,

your post #6:

“Vishnu is the form of Shiva and Shiva is the form of Vishnu, Vishnu is
Shiva’s heart and Shiva is Vishnu’s heart. Just as Vishnu is full of Shiva
and Shiva is full of Vishnu, and I can thus see no difference between Them,
let me similarly have a long life."

"Let me similarly have a long life" hangs in the air without a perceptible connection. Can you please explain? I am poor in understanding such matters.
 
Dear Vaagmi ji,

yes I agree with you it hangs in the English Translation but the site I got it from the translation was done by a very well known person who in an expert in Sanskrit translation..in fact for while he used to be a member here too. My Sanskrit knowledge is nothing compared to his therefore I just pasted what I copied and hesitated to make changes.



But on a personal note I prefer to read the Sanskrit text which I can personally prefer to translate as below:

yathAntaraM na pashyAmi tathA me svastir AyuSaH

As I do not see difference between Them....therefore I am well all my life.
 
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And a Vishnubhakta just enjoys the fun. LOL.

I am poor in understanding such matters.

Yes truly bliss of Ignorance of such matters where you have no clear ideas & answers is sure to be enjoyable to every one! More on Badrinaryna Naranara and Swaminaryana to follow may be more enjoyable!
 
. So far pistol walis are active. .

Well the Pistol Waalis know that Lord Shiva shoots well having turned Lord Vishnu into His arrows and turned the 3 cities to ashes!

So Pistol Waalis know that nothing can be befall them and even Yama can do no harm if they surrender to Lord Shiva.

Rathna sanu sarasanam, rajathadri srunga nikethanam,
Sinchini krutha pannageswarachyuthahana sayakam,
Kshipra dhagdha pura thrayam thri divalayairabhi vanditham,
Chandra shekaramasraye mama kim karishyathi vai yama. 1

I seek refuge in Him, who has the moon,
Who made the mountain of jewels in to his bow,
Who resides on the mountain of silver,
Who made the serpent Vasuki as rope,
Who made Lord Vishnu as arrows,
And quickly destroyed the three cities,
And who is saluted by the three worlds,
And so what can the God of death do to me?


So Vaagmi Ji..care for a game of "encounter" shoot at sight?LOL
 
Well the Pistol Waalis know that Lord Shiva shoots well having turned Lord Vishnu into His arrows and turned the 3 cities to ashes!

According to the story I read, Lord Shiva turned Dasamukha Ganesha into the arrow and shot at the 3 cities of Tripurasura!

So Pistol Waalis know that nothing can be befall them and even Yama can do no harm if they surrender to Lord Shiva.


Ofcourse! But Lord Shiva himself is not going to help the pistol wallis if they are not going to be respectful to Sri Vishnu! Back to square one!

Thodaradipodi Azhwar (DivyaPrabandham)
Thirumail - 2

Pachai mamalai pol meni pavalvai kamala chenkan
Achuta mararere ayar tham kozhute ennum
Echsuvai thavir yan poi indiralogam alum
Achsuvai perinum vendean arangama nagarulanea

The Lord with body like a Green, Emerald mountain
Mouth like Pearls and Lotus-like Eyes!!
As the one who has the taste for your beauty,
Even if given the role as Lord Indra
I would not have the taste for that life
O Lord Aranga living in SriRangam!!

 
Saiva temples depict pictures of Vishnu prostrating to Shiva... and Vaishnavas have scores of "interpretations" puranic/other examples to highlight the supremacy of Vishnu. Every branch in hinduism have their own story... and so there is no neutral comparison. Of course, everyone can claim that only their explanation and backup data are authentic.
 
Vishnu keeps watching everything. When Vishnu watches it goes without saying that Shiva too is watching because Vishnu pervades everything and that includes Shiva.

When Vishnu pervades Shiva or the other way round there is an union Shiva and Vishu and the result of this union is Dharmasastha parented by both - which is not acceptable to the learned and knowledgable vaishnava. For sure both are fertile and the union you accept but the result of union your not comfortable with! <snip> It is all accepted by every devotee of these Gods who may be infertile - pray to them for a child which they are supposed to answer readly !<snip>

edit: snipped out a few lines that can hurt the sentiments of other members. - Praveen
 
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According to the story I read, Lord Shiva turned Dasamukha Ganesha into the arrow and shot at the 3 cities of Tripurasura!



Ofcourse! But Lord Shiva himself is not going to help the pistol wallis if they are not going to be respectful to Sri Vishnu! Back to square one!

Thodaradipodi Azhwar (DivyaPrabandham)
Thirumail - 2

Pachai mamalai pol meni pavalvai kamala chenkan
Achuta mararere ayar tham kozhute ennum
Echsuvai thavir yan poi indiralogam alum
Achsuvai perinum vendean arangama nagarulanea

The Lord with body like a Green, Emerald mountain
Mouth like Pearls and Lotus-like Eyes!!
As the one who has the taste for your beauty,
Even if given the role as Lord Indra
I would not have the taste for that life
O Lord Aranga living in SriRangam!!



dear JR,

Great to know there are 2 opinions on what Shiva used as an arrow becos Chandrasekhara asthakam differs and says Lord Shiva used Lord Vishnu as His arrow.


So I guess there is always more than one interpretation...thanks for the new info.I wonder if there are any other versions?

BTW the pistol Waali does not recite Om Namah Shivaya or Om Namo Bhagavathe Vasudevaya. Why divide and rule?

Pistol waali is very Skanda Upanishadic...that is she sees no reason to wonder who is greater and sees Vishnu in Shiva and Shiva in Vishnu and loves Them both for both are her life and breath and one and the same.

Both are her eyes and she does not choose the right eye over the left eye or vice versa.


Pistol Waali does not exists separate from God...there are no borders anymore.

Pistol Waali hears in the Sound of Silence where God sings lovingly to His Bhakta...Only when we surrender we can hear this Song of God...Where He sings Main Yahaan Hoon Yahaan...




Bhakta, dekh lo, mit gayi dooriyaan
Devotee.. look around; the distance between us is dispelled.

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan..
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here!


Bhakta, dekh lo, mit gayi dooriyaan
Devotee.. look around; the distance between us is dispelled.

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan..
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here!

Kaisi, sarhadein, kaisi majbooriyaan
What borders are there now? What obstacles?

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here.

Tum chhupa na sakogi main woh raaz hoon
I'm the secret that you can't hide;

Tum bhoola na sakogi woh andaaz hoon
I'm the impulse that you can't forget.

Goonjta hoon jo dil mein toh hairaan ho kyun
When I echo in your heart, why are you surprised?

Main tumhaare hi dil ki toh awaaz hoon
I'm your heart's very voice.

Sun sako, toh suno, dhadkanon ki zabaan
If you can hear it, then listen to the language of your heartbeat.

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here.

Kaisi, sarhadein, kaisi majbooriyaan
What borders are there now? What obstacles?

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here.


Main hi main ab tumhaare khayaalon mein hoon
Now I and only I occupy your thoughts;

Main jawaabon mein hoon, main sawaalon mein hoon
I'm in the answers you receive and the questions you ask.

Main tumhaare har ek khwaab mein hoon basa
I'm at the center of every one of your dreams;

Main tumhaari nazar ke ujaalon mein hoon
I'm the light that shines from your eyes.

Dekhti, ho mujhe, dekhti ho jahaan
Wherever you look, you see me;

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here.


Bhakta, dekh lo, mit gayi dooriyaan
Devotee.. look around; the distance between us is dispelled.

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here!

Kaisi sarhadein, kaisi majbooriyaan
What borders are there now? What obstacles?

Main yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan hoon, yahaan
I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, here.
 
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Does Vishnu do his job?

He has been searching the feet of Lord Shiva and His mission is not completed yet or is he sleeping in the middle of search. At least for this, let us all, irrespective of differences, join together to wake him and make him work.
 
Renukaji

Your yahan hoon post brought to my memory an old post. Do you remember the whoa? and deep meaning it had? LOL.
 
Renukaji

Your yahan hoon post brought to my memory an old post. Do you remember the whoa? and deep meaning it had? LOL.

Dear Vaagmi ji,

I have used the Yahaan Hoon Yahaan line so many times in forum..God knows what I wrote..you need to refresh my memory!
 
Dictionary meaning of 'cunning' as 'achieving one's ends by deceit or evasion'.
Is that the way Sri Krishna Acted in Mahabarata?

Sri Krishna is LEELA MANUSHA MANGALA MURTHI.


Swamy Sri Vedanta Desikacharya (1269 – 1370) in his work Saranagati Deepika, Verse 17, explained the avatara rahasya of Sriman Narayana.



Bhagavan has taken different incarnations out of His sheer Mercy in order to be accessible to us in many ways.

Krishna’s obsession throughout the entire Mahabharata was to establish a society where Dharma was the guiding principle. This is a society where there is protection and happiness for all, and where people live in a balanced, spiritually orientated way, with respect for other people, creatures and all of nature.

Krishna’s guidance to the Pandavas reflects a universal and valid approach to certain predicaments that will always face mankind. His efforts to help the Pandavas should be understood in the sole context of the establishment of a righteous society in the face of tyranny.
 

Recollect the episode of Dronas Death What you call this advise of Krishna ! Yudh Dharma in Dharma yudh?

This is the take home message

This form of trickery some believe to be adharmic, and even though Krishna devised this scheme, it is believed to be wrong.It is said that the chariot of Yudhisthra , which always stood one feet above ground due to his honesty, came down to the ground level, since, with this act, Yudhisthra become like other mortals.

Now read the full story

In the war, Yudhisthira was targeted by Drona to get captured. For this plan to be successful, Duryodhana invited King Bhagadatta, who was a son of the asura Narakasur, in order to fight against the Pandavas.


Bhagadatta was the King of Prajokiyatsa (in present-day Assam or Burma). As Krishna had killed his father Narakasur, Bhagadatta agreed to join the Kauravas opposing Krishna. But in spite of Bhagadatta's support, Drona failed to capture Yudhistra alive. The Kuru commander and preceptor did, however, kill hundreds and thousands of Pandava warriors, thus advancing Duryodhana's cause.
On the 15th day of the Mahabharata war, Drona got instigated by King Dhritarastra's remarks of being a traitor. He used the Brahmadanda against the Pandavas. Brahmadanda was a spiritual divine weapon that contained the powers of seven greatest sages of Hinduism (Saptarshis). But Drona did not impart this knowledge either to Arjuna or to Ashwathamma. Thus, he proved to be unconquerable on the 15th day of war.
Observing this, Krishna devised a plan to bring down the invincible Drona. Krishna knew that it was not possible to defeat Drona when he had bow and arrow in his hands. Krishna also knew that Drona loved his son Ashwathama very dearly. So, Krishna suggested to Yudistra and other Pandava brothers that, if he were convinced that his son was killed on the battlefield, then Drona would get dejected to such an extent that he would lay down all his arms on the ground and it would be easier to kill him.
In order to find a way out, Krishna suggested Bhima to kill an elephant by name Ashwathama and claim to Drona that he has killed Drona's son Ashwathama. Following this plan, Bhima located and killed an elephant named Ashwathama, i.e. the same name as Drona's son. He then loudly proclaimed that he had slain Ashwathama, so as to make Drona think that his son was dead.
Drona however, did not believe Bhima's words and approached Yudhisthira. Drona knew of Yudhisthira's firm adherence to Dharma and that he would never ever utter a lie. When Drona approached Yudhisthira and questions him as to whether his son was truly slain in the battle by Bhima, Yudhisthira responded with the cryptic Sanskrit phrase "Ashwathama hathaha iti, narova kunjarova" meaning 'Ashwathama is dead. But, I am not certain whether it was a human or an elephant').
Krishna also knew that it was not possible for Yudhisthira to lie outright. On his instructions, the other warriors blew trumpets and conches, raising a tumultuous noise in such a way that Drona only heard that "Ashwathama is dead", but could not hear the latter part of Yudhishthira's reply.
Drona knew that if Ashwattamma was dead, then his soul must have gone to heaven. So, out of grief, and believing his son to be dead, Drona descended from his chariot, laid down his arms and sat in meditation. Closing his eyes, his soul went to Heaven in search of Ashwathamma's soul.
In the meantime, Drupada's son Dhristadyumna took this opportunity and beheaded the unarmed Drona who was not aware of the whole proceedings on Earth. This was considered an act of cowardice on Dhristadyumna's part.
Drona's soul, which went to Heaven could not find Ashwathama's soul there and so returned to Earth in order to find the truth about Ashwathama's death. But it could not get back into its body as Drona's head was separated from his body.
In this way, Drona was killed in the Mahabharata War. His death greatly aggrieved and enraged Arjuna, who had immense affection towards his teacher, and had hoped to capture him alive rather than killing him.
After Drona's death, Aswatthama, believed it to be his duty to seek revenge. Given that Drona was not killed in a justifiable way, Aswatthama believed his attack to justifiable. His father, Drona, was an invincible warrior as long as he wielded his weapons, and the Pandava army, as well as Krishna, knew this. Drona was the leader of the Kuru army at the time and seemed to be unstoppable. Krishna devised a plan to trick the Kauravas, in specific Drona, into believing that his son, Aswattahma, had died. Bhima had previously killed an elephant whose name ironically was Aswattahma, and Krishna was inspired by the idea of proclaiming that they had killed Aswattahma, not specifying that it was the elephant, not Drona's son. Yudhisthra said, " Aswatthama is slain, in an undertone 'the elephant The plan went through as planned and Drona then dropped his weapons and in the midst of this trickery was beheaded by Drishtayumna. This form of trickery some believe to be adharmic, and even though Krishna devised this scheme, it is believed to be wrong.It is said that the chariot of Yudhisthra , which always stood one feet above ground due to his honesty, came down to the ground level, since, with this act, Yudhisthra become like other mortals.
 
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And a Vishnubhakta just enjoys the fun. LOL.

I am poor in understanding such matters.

Yes truly bliss of Ignorance of such matters where you have no clear ideas & answers is sure to be enjoyable to every one! More on Badrinaryna Naranara and Swaminaryana to follow may be more enjoyable!


No more enjoyment possible People are uncomfortable and pressing report Buttons! Back to1977 !!
 
Justification for killing Drona,karna

Justification for killing Drona,karna- because they joined with evil forces

The Kuru-war, supposed to be a ‘Dharma-Yuddha,’ gradually degenerated into one with ‘Victory-at-any-cost’ becoming the chief protagonist, and ‘Dharma’ the main victim! The rules of 'fair' warfare framed at the beginning of the war, were thrown to the winds as the war rolled on through its bloodiest phases. Abhimanyu was killed by seven maharatha’s in of one of the most cowardly acts! It is said the four pillars of the Kaurava side - Bhisma, Drona, Karna and Duryodhana were also killed unethically.

Traditionally accepted facts, nay ‘interpretation of text’ hazes our judgement so much that we seldom feel the urge to take a firsthand plunge into the ‘text’ itself to see what is the ‘fact in the text’ if not the ‘fact of history’! However, a close reading of the ‘text’ relating to the death of Bhisma, Drona, Karna and Duryodhana reveals different shades of the accepted myths! –

After Bhisma’s death, Drona became the supreme general of the Kaurava army.
When he was exterminating the warriors, (Section CXCII of Drona Parva) ‘the Rishis Viswamitra, and Jamadagni, and Bharadwaja, and Gautama, and Vasishtha, and Kasyapa, and Atri, and the Srikatas, the Prisnis, Garga, the Valkhilyas, the Marichis, the descendants of Bhrigu and Angiras, and diverse other sages of subtle forms’ met him.

This meeting could not have taken place in the battlefield! The delegation of the Rishis must have come during a recess of war! They rebuked him on four counts:

1) He was fighting unrighteous.
2) It did not befit him to perpetrate such exceedingly cruel deeds.
3) A ‘film of error’ shrouded him and he should adhere now to the eternal path.
4) He burnt men that were unacquainted with weapons with superior Brahma weapon.


Following this severe admonition, Drona became exceedingly cheerless in battle. –
He had lost the support of the Rishis!

Krishna, feeling Drona would annihilate their army, advised Yudhishthira -‘falsehood is better than truth.’ -

Bhima slew a mighty elephant named Aswatthaman, belonging to Indravarman, the chief of the Malavas,

And so when Dronacharya asks Yudhisthir whether his son really died, the elder Pandava replied “अश्वत्थामा हतः इति, नरोवा कुंजरोवा…” which meant Ashwattama is dead but whether he is a human or an elephant, I am not sure.




Yudhishthira's car that had stayed at a ‘height of four fingers' breadth from the surface of the earth’ touched the earth! ‘Hearing those words from Yudhishthira, Drona could not fight as before.' Nevertheless, he was still fighting. It was now Bhima’s turn to chastise Drona

Bhima, holding the car of Drona, called his Guru ‘wretched amongst Brahmanas’, and exterminator of the Kshatriya order. In a rare inspiration of eloquent rhetorical flow, Bhima called him self-centric and avaricious. Bhima, in fact, gave a forceful voice to the opinion of the Kshatriyas and Rishis about Drona. -

Besides, in the din and bustle of a terrible war, Yudhishthira’s dramatic overtone and undertone is as absurd as his car suddenly becoming some sort of an aeroplane. The entire description is rhetorical! What the poet wants to drive home is that, a war’s greatest toll is Truth!

Even a person like Yudhishthira is bound to yield to the real-politick of war! Moreover, Yudhishthira and Bhima’s lies had hardly any effect on Drona! He continued to fight. He did not lay aside weapons; those were exhausted! -



True, Drona and Bhishma were great men. They were not evil men. They did not do anything immoral for their own gain. But they had joined the forces of the unjust Duryodhana.

Similarly,
Kama was also a good man. He had respect for Dharma and for Krishna. While Karna was pulling out one of the wheels of his chariot that had struck in the mud, Krishna asked Arjuna to shoot and kill Karna. Karna cried out to Arjuna, "Fight justly." Arjuna then began to doubt if Krishna's advice was just. Krishna said, "Who is to distinguish between Dharma justice) and Adharma (injustice) ? Not those who have themselves been unjust, not those who have been against the just. Only those who are themselves just and live for the sake of justice can do So it is right to kill your enemies in this war. Those who are against Dharma and their followers should be wiped out by using all possible means. This is Dharma' so said Krishna. Accordingly Karna was killed.

Krishna's activities are neither fair nor unfair, but simply transcendental and completely spiritual.




One who understands this mystery also becomes spiritual and transcendental.

janma karma ca me divyam
evam yo vetti tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti so 'rjuna


TRANSLATION
One who knows the transcendental nature of My appearance and activities does not, upon leaving the body, take his birth again in this material world, but attains My eternal abode, O Arjuna.


PURPORT

The Lord's descent from His transcendental abode is already explained in the 6th verse. One who can understand the truth of the appearance of the Personality of Godhead is already liberated from material bondage, and therefore he returns to the kingdom of God immediately after quitting this present material body. Such liberation of the living entity from material bondage is not at all easy. The impersonalists and the yogis attain liberation only after much trouble and many, many births. Even then, the liberation they achieve -- merging into the impersonal brahmajyoti of the Lord -- is only partial, and there is the risk of returning to this material world. But the devotee, simply by understanding the transcendental nature of the body and activities of the Lord, attains the abode of the Lord after ending this body and does not run the risk of returning to this material world. In the Brahma-samhita (5.33) it is stated that the Lord has many, many forms and incarnations: advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam. Although there are many transcendental forms of the Lord, they are still one and the same Supreme Personality of Godhead. One has to understand this fact with conviction, although it is incomprehensible to mundane scholars and empiric philosophers. As stated in the Vedas (Purusa-bodhini Upanisad):


http://www.freeindia.org/biographies/gods/krishna/page12.htm
Mahabharata: The Myth of the Death of Bhisma, Drona, Karna, Duryodhana by Indrajit Bandyopadhyay

Bhagavad-gita As It Is Chapter 4 Verse 9
 
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