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Thread: Think or sink!

  1. #21
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    Maa Visalakshi,

    Bhakthi is not exclusive only to Vaishnavism, however loudly they may claim. The Nayanmars started the Bhakthi movement and were some of the greatest Bhakthas. The Saktha Bhakthi movement of Bengal is well known. Ram Prasad Sen was a great Kali Bhaktha.

    I am sorry. I thought I should bring this to your attention.
    யான் பெற்ற இன்பம் பெறுக இவ்வையகம் . Sorry. No one should have similar experience here.
    ...

  2. #22
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    Bhakti is more closely related to faith in God than knowledge of scriptures or atma gnaanam.

    The pegans have more bhakti than the pundits since they can see God in trees, plants, rivers, land, animals and almost everything.
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  4. #23
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    What was the Atma gnanam in Bhata Kannappa naayanar?
    His intense love for God was his bhakti and
    not his superior knowledge about anything.
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  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by sankara_sharmah View Post
    Bakthi is Bakthi . I do not think GOD differentiates between these purely academic classifications. Kannappa Nayanar and Purandara Dasa were both Bakthas. GOD was pleased with both of them. That is what we believe in.

    Thamasic, Rajasaic, Sattvic. These are mere Academic categorizations. There is not much difference between the Academics of today and the academics who wrote our scriptures.

    An example of this is the classification of Puranas.

    Vishnu, Narada, Padma, Garuda, Varaha and Bhagavata are
    Satvika Puranas. Brahma, Brahmavaivartha, Brahmaanda, Markandeya, Bhavishya and Vaamana are Rajasika Puranas and Siva, Linga, Skanda, Agni, Matsya and Kurma are Tamasika Puranas.



    I need not say which sect did this classification or why?

    The same about classification of Gods/Goddesses.

    I have not only thought about it, but done a lot of reading and written about it.

    Human beings have these three temperaments namely Rajasic, Tamasic and Satvic.

    In fact my guru used to say that these three moods prevail in the same person during different times of the day.

    So the same qualities are projected on everything man wants to describe or explain.

    Brahma became Rajasic, Siva Taamasi and Vishnu Satvic.
    Saraswathi became Rajasic, Durga Tamasic and Lakshmi Satvic.
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  8. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sankara_sharmah View Post
    Maa Visalakshi,

    Bhakthi is not exclusive only to Vaishnavism, however loudly they may claim. The Nayanmars started the Bhakthi movement and were some of the greatest Bhakthas. The Saktha Bhakthi movement of Bengal is well known. Ram Prasad Sen was a great Kali Bhaktha.

    I am sorry. I thought I should bring this to your attention.

    Did I give any hint anywhere that bhakti is propagated ONLY by the Vaishnavites?

    Not to my knowledge!

    Dravida region is the birth place of bhakthi movement and it includes the six religions...the worship of Siva, Vishnu, Shakti, Ganesh, Skandan and Sun God.

    It is a group of the six schools of Indian religions called Sauram (Sun worship), Ganapatyam (Ganapathy worship), Kaumaram (Murugan worship), Vaishnavam (Vishnu worship), Saktham (Sakthy worship) and Saivam (Siva worship).


    By the way there was one other person who used to call me Maa!

    He had a very powerful avatar too. I made fun of one of his posts and he vanished into thin air.

    To this day I am repenting for having played tomfoolery with a serious and sensitive person like him and the light hearted jokers alike!
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  10. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visalakshi Ramani View Post

    Human beings have these three temperaments namely Rajasic, Tamasic and Satvic.

    In fact my guru used to say that these three moods prevail in the same person during different times of the day.

    So the same qualities are projected on everything man wants to describe or explain.

    Brahma became Rajasic, Siva Taamasi and Vishnu Satvic.
    Saraswathi became Rajasic, Durga Tamasic and Lakshmi Satvic.
    When we worship GOD are we bothered about these purely academic classification? NO. Today being a Monday. I saw a long line of young girls at the Shiva temple doing abhishekam, bilva archanai and some of them even hugging the Siva Linga. They are all praying for a good husband. Do they know or even if they know bother about the classifications by book writers of Siva as thamasic? NO.

    There are more Amman temples in Tamil Nadu than any other temple. Mostly Kali, Mariamman, Renuka and other goddesses. Devotees go there because they believe that these Goddesses protect them. Protect them from evil. Not many temples for Lakshmi. Why? People need protection more than wealth. Do these devotees bother about the classification? NO.

    BTW these classifications are basically Sankya Philosphy. Bhagavad Gita which is basically a Sankhya text emphasizes thus.

    The classification of God/goddesses suffer one major handicap. Tamas is also a Guna or Quality that is much needed to counter Evil, Tamas cannot be counteracted by tamas. How does Durga becomes Tamasic when all her stories are about her overcoming the Asuras?

    These classifications are highly subjective and arbitrary.

    I had posted the example of the classification of Puranas in my earlier post to show how these writers played sectarian politics with these classifications.
    Last edited by sankara_sharmah; 24-12-2012 at 04:44 PM.
    யான் பெற்ற இன்பம் பெறுக இவ்வையகம் . Sorry. No one should have similar experience here.
    ...

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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by sankara_sharmah;170242
    [B
    Bhakthas are fanatics. Bhakthi does lead to fanaticism.[/B] I can understand why some member defends the God whom he worships. Though he may quote books, the basic feeling is Bhakthi.

    Fanatic devotion is Bhakthi.


    Fanatic devotion to anything is Fanaticism.
    Unfortunately Bhakthi is understood this way because of overall lack of knowledge that pervades due to all that one hears from the so called Bhakthas
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  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by sankara_sharmah View Post
    Bhakthi comes from the heart. It is a feeling, an emotion. It does not come by reading text books or by performing any ritual.

    .

    .



    But then I was shocked when I heard a respected scholar say that You have to reach the stage of Atma Chaitanyam through Jnana yoga before becoming a Bhaktha.

    .
    .

    The respected scholar may be somewhat right though if he knew what he was teaching it would not be as transcribed above. There is no time order here -There is a unification of knowledge giving rise to Bhakthi and vice versa.

    If anyone is preaching that one has to 'become something' it is a hint to stay away since that is not a sign of scholarship.
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  16. #29
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    I remember the discussion I had in a religious forum about Bhakthi a couple of years back. I said that all the people coming to temples are Bhakthas. The counter argument was that "only people who seek spiritual salvation can be termed Bhakthas. Those who seek material benefits can not be termed as Bhakthas." There were more than 100 posts with most people quoting religious texts to buttress their arguments.

    Though I continued posting in that forum, that was the last I posted about Bhakthi. That forum is defunct now.

    I do not think you need any qualifications to be considered a Bhaktha. Only devotion is sufficient.

    The purpose of Devotion is not a consideration.

    This is proved by the stories of Bhakthas. Many of the Bakthas started out seeking material benefits and ended up by gaining in spirituality. The Bhakthas who could not progress spiritually were left behind.

    The Bhakthas who seek materiel benefits are on the right path. But they have the wrong goals/destination. They may realize their mistake and reach the right goal/destination.

    Sometime back I had written an article about Tantra and Bhakthi. How a Tantrik is basically a Bhakta even while following Tantric rituals. That may not be of interest to members of this forum where there are almost no Tantriks.

    The traditional/ritualistic Hinduism had no other option but to include Bhakthi, because of the popularity of the Bhakthi movement. It was a question of their survival.

    But still the contempt for Bhakthi does continue. They would like to view all Bhakthas as illiterate people. Bhakthi is not the current fashion. It is not modern.

    Puja and japa are considered old fashioned. Meditation is the in thing. Vedanta is in.

    My Guru warned me repeatedly about this. He said "An ounce of practice is better than a tonne of theory."

    I have chosen this path after seeking for about 20 years and trying out other paths.
    யான் பெற்ற இன்பம் பெறுக இவ்வையகம் . Sorry. No one should have similar experience here.
    ...

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  18. #30
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    ref # 26.

    I have been under the impression that asuras are Rajasic in temperament since they are always active and busy seeking unlimited power and pleasure.

    If I am correct in saying this, can it mean that Durga can be Tamasic and still conquer the Rajasic asuras?
  19. All views expressed by the Members and Moderators here are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the TamilBrahmins.com Website.
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