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  1. #1
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    Jambhudwipa in Tamil Literature and Kalidas



    Hindus are unique in preserving their historical and geographical knowledge they have acquired several thousand years ago. During all religious rituals or worship they do announce their intention for the worship in which they say where it is done and when it is done. It is called SANKALPAM in Sanskrit. It is amazing to know their geographical knowledge. They say about their locations. It goes like this: I who live in Jambudwipe….. Bharata Varshe……. Bharat Kande etc. They always say on the banks of which holy river, which holy city, which holy forest area they do it. But Hindus lost much of this wonderful knowledge in the last 3000 years and so they lost the track. Even when they moved to different parts of the earth they were using the same Sankalpa. When you do a thing without proper knowledge and that too in a language (Sanskrit) you don’t know fully, it simply loses its relevance.


    Their historical knowledge is also amazing. They say in which Manvatare, in which Sahapte/ year, season, month, Thithi (day) etc in the Sankalpa during every puja/worship. Sankalpa is the intention or purpose or vow one makes before starting a puja/ worship. The Manvantara period takes you back to the remotest time in the earth’s history.


    Jambudwipa means the land of Jhambu trees. Tamils also followed the same method and named their land divisions after plants such as Kurinji, Mullai, Neithal, Marutham etc. This shows that Hindus from Kashmir to Kanyakumari thought alike. Please read my earlier post FLOWERS IN TAMIL CULTURE.



    No other religious worship is done like Hindu worship. No one bothers about when it is done or where it is done. Another interesting point is the botanical and ethnic knowledge Hindus have. They named all the areas after an abundant plant or the ethnic people in the area. Jambu, Salmali and such plant names are given to the geographical areas. But Jambudwipa is synonymous with India that is Bharat.. The word Jambu means a tree known by its botanical name Syzigium cumini (Family Myrtaceae). This tree is found all over India. Tamils also translated the word Jambudwipa as Naavalanthivu and used it in their ancient literature. Naaval Pazam means Jambu fruits. Following references are found in the Sangam Tamil Literature:


    Purananauru is an anthology of 400 Tamil verses. This forms the oldest part of Tamil Sangam literature. It has got some important references to the tree. One of the references in verse 397 refers to the special type of gold called Jambunadham. Kalidas refers to this Jhambunadam in Ragu Vamsam 18—44. The same is repeated in Sangam Tamil verses (Puram 397 and Thirumurugatru Padai –Line 18).


    Since Kalidas’s hundreds of similes were used by 2000 year old Sangam Tamil poets, I have placed Kalidas before the Sangam period. I have written about it in my previous posts comparing Tamil poets and Kalidas.

    Following references are found in Tamil about the tree and the Land of Jhambu tress (Jambudwipa): Paripatal 5-8,9 ,Puram 397, 177-11 ,Perum 465 ,Malai 135, Akam 380, Narr 35-2, Thiru 18, Post Sangam Literature: Mani 25—2—12/16, Silambu 17-15

    KALIDAS: Megha 19 talks about the Jambu forests. Ragu 18—44 refers to Jhambu land.
    Later Tamil poets such as Appar (in marmaatrah thiruth thandakam) use this more times in their poems.

    (This article is posted also in Tamil); pictures are taken from other sites.

  2. #2
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    If it is in a book call it anything bible, koran, gita, or anything else, does it have to be factual?
    You present articles from these mythical books with reverence as if they are scientific revelations? Why?
    You could be presenting something from Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, or Harry Potter. What is the difference?
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    Quote Originally Posted by prasad1 View Post
    If it is in a book call it anything bible, koran, gita, or anything else, does it have to be factual?
    A probability sure exists, is it not? If we were to go by the logic in your query, can I then ask - if something exists in a book, call it anything, does it have to be fiction (or non-factual)?



    You could be presenting something from Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, or Harry Potter. What is the difference?
    Copyright... perhaps?

    Lighter stuff apart - the religious books are written (and propagated) with a conviction that the events actually transpired. Books like Harry Potter are written (and marketed) with the knowledge that they are fantasy/fiction.

    A sea of difference, imo.
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    Quote Originally Posted by auh View Post
    A probability sure exists, is it not? If we were to go by the logic in your query, can I then ask - if something exists in a book, call it anything, does it have to be fiction (or non-factual)?



    Copyright... perhaps?

    Lighter stuff apart - the religious books are written (and propagated) with a conviction that the events actually transpired. Books like Harry Potter are written (and marketed) with the knowledge that they are fantasy/fiction.

    A sea of difference, imo.
    Yes one is honest the other dreaming or hallucinating.

    Are you saying the religious writer do not an agenda?
    .
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    Indians were not ahistorical

    Some excerpts from the review of book "Geography, People and Geodynamics of India in Puranas and Epics", Author : KS Valdiya, may be of interest. Full review at Indians were not ahistorical

    Noted geologist KS Valdiya investigates the geological history of the Indian subcontinent as mentioned in the epics and Puranas, hitherto a largely neglected field, writes Rohit Srivastava

    n the 20th century, Indian scholarship unfortunately internalised his (Macaulay) views and rejected the merit of our ancient literature in totality, as part of a shameful attempt to gain acceptance — jobs, scholarships, seminar invitations — from Western academia, without ever trying to seriously evaluate the corpus and its relevance in our contemporary lives.

    As a result of this intellectual abdication, modern Indians are totally disconnected from the intellectual currents of their native tradition over the past 3,000 years and cannot put context to its historical books and epics. In sharp contrast, historians in the West have made strenuous efforts to revisit Greek and Roman mythology with the help of archeology, geology and other branches of science.

    According to the Puranas, the earth comprises of seven mega-islands or continents, each one bigger than the other, and all surrounded by oceans of salt water. The mega-islands are Jambudweep, Plaksh, Shalmal, Kush, Kraunch, Shak and Pushkar (Shiva Purana, Pancham Umasanhita, Kurma Purana).

    The book scrutinises the Puranas for the geographical history of the subcontinent. The physiology of the country has changed since the time these books were written. The Puranas are part of Itihas (history) of ancient India. But Valdiya proves, with his expertise in geology, that these books also have recorded the changes in the geography of the land at the time the stories were being written.

    The author has extensively researched Sanskrit texts, and every sentence is supported by appropriate shlokaswith translations for the benefit of the general reader. Valdiya has taken care to be precise and to keep sceptics quiet with the liberal use of verses from ancient texts, rather than using generalised translations to support his conclusions.


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    Quote Originally Posted by prasad1 View Post
    Yes one is honest the other dreaming or hallucinating.
    .
    How can you be so sure?
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    We have a strong puranic-itihasic tradition transmitted by oral and practising continum. It is vital that we keep them as standard or reference and evaluate new findings without throwing away old knowledge. The new knowledge keeps changing, often is biased, inconclusive, derived from inadequate and dubitable evidence. Only hindu civilization has survived and is active because of its inherent strength and resilience. Every community of Bharatavarsha has preserved a segment of sanatana dharma in more than one way - knowledge, anushtanam, wealth, religion, worship and many more. We will be doing a great service to our dharma, ancestors, culture and spirituality if we preserve, practice and pass on whatever we can, in whatever measure we are capable of.
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    This is kind of off topic, but I think it fits in here very well considering the general thrust of the posts the OP makes.

    My nephew has a prosthesis in his leg as a result of cancer treatment. The family imported a special instrument to make adjustment to the prosthesis. When the part arrived in Chennai the customs clerk classified it as medical equipment which meant my brother-in-law had to pay huge customs duty. It should have been classified as medical instrument for which the customs duty is minimal. His wife was furious, all this is because of the reservation system, these unqualified NBs get to these positions and they can't tell the difference between medical equipment and instrument. My brother-in-law had to meekly correct her -- actually, the customs clerk was a brahmin.
    கல்வியறிவும், சுயமரியாதை எண்ணமும், பகுத்தறிவுத் தன்மையுமே தாழ்ந்து கிடக்கும் மக்களை உயர்த்தும் .....
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    Normally the manufacturer classifies the item as per international coding system; goods are not classified by indian customs. When the classification is absent or patently erroneous, it is left to the customs officer to interpret and assign a code. Duty rates for different classifications are decided by the government and published in big volumes. Sometimes the catalogue is also misleading; if it uses hype description classification is left to anybody's guess.

    All government servants (income tax, customs etc.) are duty bound to maximise revenue for the government.

    A cute way to introduce anti brahmin sentiment, nicely clothed in an emotion packed, heart rending story.

    I am not sure what is the intent - wife's prejudice against reservation and NBs or a brahmin sticking to his stand and not willing to help a fellow brahmin.

    Was the equipment cleared through the customs; that is more relevant.
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  18. #10
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    Dear all

    If we dont have historical sense why do we repeat it (Sankalpa) at every Puja?
    If we dont have geographical knowledge why do we repeat such things?

    Middle East, Far East, Near East== What are all these?
    It is not Middle East except to anyone who wrote this!!
    It is not Far East to any any one except who wrote this!!

    (When I was Senior Sub Editor of Madurai Dinamani, my editor AN Sivaraman banned us from using such expressions. He made us to write which area , or which country)

    But the English made us believe this is far, this is middle, this is near and we use it till this day.

    So we, Hindus, divided the world according to the knowledge we had at that time.
    Still Jambhu fruits are available in plenty in India.

    At least we must give the credit of dividing the world on its botanical or zoological things or the ethnic group to Indians.


    The English wrote that Indians, lacked historical knowledge and sense and the first History book was Rajatharangini. It is not correct. Even 300 years before this, Karu Nanthadakkan's seventh century Parthivapuram plates give the Kaliyuga in days-- a six or seven digit number.

    Even before that we have Gupta inscriptions with such dating.

    The English approach was partial. If Greeks mention anything, if Babylonians mention anything, give them the credit, but for Indians turn a blind eye or put it in the negative way- this was their approach.
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