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    Vegetarianism & Alcoholism

    Every word of this was said by ambedhkar.He says that earlier all Hindus ate beef and meat.Then brahmins turned vegetarians first and stopped eating all meat.They made cow a holy animal and this made non-brahmin hindus to stop eating beef.People who continued to eat beef became chandalas and untouchables because they commited the worst sacrileage in Hinduism,eating beef.

    Ambedhkar classifies hindus as 3 types

    People who eat no meat(Brahmins)
    People who eat meat but not beef (Ksathriyas and vaisyas)
    People who eat beef and meat (chandalas)

    How did this difference in food habits come into existence?
    Why did brahmins stop eating meat and beef?
    Why did they make cow as a holy animal?
    Why did non-brahmins stopped eating beef but not meat?
    Why did untouchables did not stop eating beef?

    Excerpts from the article of ambedhkar

    TO the question whether the Hindus ever ate beef, every Touchable Hindu, whether he is a Brahmin or a non-Brahmin, will say ‘no, never’. In a certain sense, he is right. From times no Hindu has eaten beef. If this is all that the Touchable Hindu wants to convey by his answer there need be no quarrel over it. But when the learned Brahmins argue that the Hindus not only never ate beef but they always held the cow to be sacred and were always opposed to the killing of the cow, it is impossible to accept their view.

    That the Aryans of the Rig Veda did kill cows for purposes of food and ate beef is abundantly clear from the Rig Veda itself. In Rig Veda (X. 86.14) Indra says: “They cook for one 15 plus twenty oxen”. The Rig Veda (X.91.14) says that for Agni were sacrificed horses, bulls, oxen, barren cows and rams. From the Rig Veda (X.72.6) it appears that the cow was killed with a sword or axe.

    Among the Kamyashtis set forth in the Taittiriya Bramhana, not only the sacrifice of oxen and cows are laid down, but we are even told what kind and description of oxen and cows are to be offered to what deities. Thus, a dwarf ox is to be chosen for sacrifice to Vishnu; a drooping horned bull with a blaze on the forehead to Indra as the destroyer of Vritra; a black cow to Pushan; a red cow to Rudra; and so on. The Taittiriya Bramhana notes another sacrifice called Panchasaradiya-seva, the most important element of which was the immolation of seventeen five-year old humpless, dwraf-bulls, and as many dwarf heifers under three year-old.….

    …The killing of cow for the guest had grown to such an extent that the guest came to be called ‘Go-ghna’ which means the killer of the cow. To avoid this slaughter of the cows the Ashvateyana Grahya Sutra (1.24.25) suggests that the cow should be let loose when the guest comes so as to escape the rule of etiquette….

    Coming to Manu there is no doubt that he too did. not prohibit the slaughter of the cow. On the other hand he made the eating of cow's flesh on certain occasions obligatory.

    WHAT MADE THE BRAHMINS BECOME VEGETARIANS?
    THE non-Brahmins have evidently undergone a revolution. From being beef-eaters to have become non-beef-eaters was indeed a revolution. But if the non-Brahmins underwent one revolution, the Brahmins had undergone two. They gave up beef-eating which was one revolution. To have given up meat-eating altogether and become vegetarians was another revolution.


    That this was a revolution is beyond question. For as has been shown in the previous chapters there was a time when the Brahmins were the greatest beef-eaters. Although the non-Brahmins did eat beef they could not have had it every day. The cow was a costly animal and the non-Brahmins could ill afford to slaughter it just for food. He only did it on special occasion when his religious duty or personal interest to propitiate a deity compelled him to do. But the case with the Brahmin was different. He was a priest. In a period overridden by ritualism there was hardly a day on which there was no cow sacrifice to which the Brahmin was not invited by some non-Brahmin. For the Brahmin every day was a beef-steak day. The Brahmins were therefore the greatest beef-eaters. The Yajna of the Brahmins was nothing but the killing of innocent animals carried on in the name of religion with pomp and ceremony with an attempt to enshroud it in mystery with a view to conceal their appetite for beef. Some idea of this mystery pomp and ceremony can be had from the directions contained in the Atreya Brahamana touching the killing of animals in a Yajna.

    The actual killing of the animal is preceded by certain initiatory Rites accompanied by incantations too long and too many to be detailed here. It is enough to give an idea of the main features of the Sacrifice. The sacrifice commences with the erection of the Sacrificial post called the Yupa to which the animal is tied before it is slaughtered. After setting out why the Yupa is necessary the Atreya Brahamana proceeds to state what it stands for. It says:
    “This Yupa is a weapon. Its point must have eight edges. For a weapon (or iron club) has eight edges. Whenever he strikes with it an enemy or adversary, he kills him. (This weapon serves) to put down him (every one) who is to be put down by him (the sacrificer). The Yupa is a weapon which stands erected (being ready) to slay an enemy. Thence an enemy (of the sacrificer) who might be present (at the sacrifice) comes of all ill after having seen the Yupa of such or such one.”
    The selection of the wood to be used for the Yupa is made to vary with the purposes which the sacrificer wishes to achieve by the sacrifice. The Atreya Brahamana says :
    “He who desires heaven, ought to make his Yupa of Khadira wood. For the gods conquered the celestial world by means of a Yupa, made of Khadira wood. In the same way the sacrificer conquers the celestial world by means of a Yupa, made of Khadira wood.
    “He who desires food and wishes to grow fat ought to make his Yupa of Bilva wood. For the Bilva tree bears fruits every year; it is the symbol of fertility; for it increases (every year) in size from the roots up to the branches, therefore it is a symbol of fatness. He who having such a knowledge makes his Yupa of Bilva wood, makes fat his children and cattle.
    “As regards the Yupa made of Bilva wood (it is further to be remarked), that they call light Bilva. He who has such a knowledge becomes a light' among his own people, the most distinguished among his own people.
    “He who desires beauty and sacred knowledge ought to make his Yupa of Palasa wood. For the Palasa is among the trees of beauty and sacred knowledge. He who having such a knowledge makes his Yupa of Palasa wood, becomes beautiful and acquires sacred knowledge.
    “As regards the Yupa made of Palasa wood (there is further to be remarked), that the Palasa is the womb of all trees. Thence they speak on account of the palasam (foliage) of this or that tree (i.e. they call the foliage of every tree palasam). He who has such a knowledge obtains (the gratification of) any desire, he might have regarding all trees (i.e., he obtains from all trees any thing he might wish for).”
    ….
    Given these facts, no further evidence seems to be necessary to support the statement that the Brahmins were not merely beef-eaters but they were also butchers.
    Why then did the Brahmins change front? Let us deal with their change of front in two stages. First, why did they give up beef-eating?

    -------

    For answers to all the above said questions read the full article by ambedhkar
    Many are stubborn in pursuit of the path they have chosen, few in pursuit of the goal.
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    sir - pls. also read the following -

    'He who augments his own flesh by eating the flesh of other creatures live in misery in whatever species he may take his birth' MAHABHARATA 115.47

    'Those high souled persons who desire beauty, faultlessness of limbs, long life, understanding, mental & physical strength & memory should abstain from acts of injury' MAHABHARATA 18.115.8

    'The very name of cow is 'aghnya' (not to be killed) indicating that they should never be slaughtered. who then could slay them ? surely one who kills a cow or bull commits a serious crime' MAHABHARAT SHANTHIPARV 262.47


    'HIM I CALL A BRAHMANA WHO LAYS ASIDE THE ROD, WHO NEITHER KILLS NOR CAUSES THE DEATH OF CREATURES. MOVING OR NON MOVING (ANIMALS OR PLANTS) - BUDDHA IN DHAMMAPADA, 26.409

    'no buddhist country in the world is predominantly vegetarian. tibetian and japanese monks eat meat, even red meat (including dalai lama). SOMA plant is a juice - eminent american DR. DAVID FRAWLEY

    'The rig veda & sama veda call cow 'aghnya' & 'aditi' i.e. not to be murdered. (Rig 1-64-27, 5-83-8, 7-68-9, 1-164-40, 8-69-2, 9-1-9, 9-93-3, 10-6-11, 10-87-16) They extol the cow as unkillable, unmrderable, whose milk purifies the mind & keep it free from sin. Verse 10-87-16 prescribes severe punishment for a person who kills a cow. The Atharvana veda recommends beheading for such a crime (8-3-16). Rig veda advocates expulsion from the kingdom (8-101-15)

    'the original vedic system is quite different from contempoary hinduism. both the old and the new, however, converge harmoniously in regard to vegeteranism. long before st.francis was declared patron saint of animals, the sages of ancient india had already recognised spirituality in all living species. vedic texts even describe incarnation of god in animal forms. vedas even acknowledge ability of ordinary animals to achieve exalted states of spirituality. here then, is a religious tradition that emphasis not only vegeteranism, but also the spiritual equality of all living beings' BY PAUL TURNER, GLOBAL DIRECTOR OF FOOD FOR LIFE, AND MEMBER OF INTERNATIONAL VEGETARIAN UNION COUNCIL.
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    sir- by oversight, i wrongly updated an earlier posting incomplete. pls. consider the following -
    'one who partakes of human flesh, the flesh of horse, or of another animal and deprives others of milk by slaughtering cows, O King! if such a fiend does not desist by other means, then you should not hesitate to cut off his head'
    RIG VEDA SAMHITA 10.87.16

    PROTECT BOTH OUR SPECIES, TWO LEGGED & FOUR LEGGED. BOTH FOOD & WATER FOR THEIR NEEDS SUPPLY . MAY THEY WITH US INCREASE N STATURE AND STRENGTH. SAVE US FROM HURT ALL OUR DAYS. O POWERS!

    RIG VEDA SAMHITA 10.37.11

    O VEGETABLE, BE SUCCULENT, WHOLESOME, STRENGTHENING AND THUS BODY BE FULLY GROWN (RIG VEDA)

    'The purchaser of flesh commits himsa (violence) by his wealth. he who eats flesh does so by enjoying its taste. the killer does himsa by actually tying & killing the animal. thus there are three forms of killing: he who brings flesh or sends for it, he who cuts off the limbs of an animal, and he who purchases , sells or cooks flesh & eats it .- all of these are to be considered meat eaters '
    (MAHABHARATHA ANU.115.40)

    'MY OPINION IS WELL KNOWN. i do not regard flesh food as necessary for us at any stage and under any clime in which it is possible for human beings ordinarily to live. i hold flesh food to be unsuited to our species.' MAHATMA GANDHI.

    'When a man realizes that meat is the butchered flesh of another creature, he must abstain from eating it ' THIRUKKURAL VERSE 257

    'the burning of clarified butter & odoriferous & nutritious substances in the fire in order to purify the are is called ASHWAMEDHA (SHANTHAPATHA BRAHMANA 13:1, 6;3, ) (anyone who sacrifices his wealth & pride for others, it is known as ashwamedha. ashwa i.e. horse represents royalty, luxury, majesty, splendour etc.,)

    'aahavaniiye maamsapratishedha (katyayana sutra)' meaning 'THAT WHICH IS TO BE USED IN A YAGNA (AAHAVANIIYA) MUST BE VEGETARIAN.

    'Maa himsyaat sarvabhuutani' (rig veda) NO CREATURE OR ANIMAL SHOULD BE KILLED.

    'Yah paurusheyena kravishaa samankte yo ashvyena pashunaa yaatudhaanah,
    Yo aghyaayaa bharati kshiiramagne teshaam shirshaani harasaapi vrshcha
    RIG VEDA 10.87.16 - THE EVIL PERSON WHO KILLS OR EATS THE MEAT OF HORSE OR COW SHOULD BE TERMINATED.

    'MAAMSAPAAKAPRATISHEDHASHCHA TADVAT'; (Miimaamsa sutra 10.3.65)
    KILLING & MEAT EATING IS TOTALLY PROHIBITED.

    'Suraam matsyaan madhu maamsamaasavam krsaraudanam ,
    Dhuurttaih pravartitam hyetannaitad vedeshu kalpitam (MAHABHARATA SHANTHIPARVAN 265.9) meaning IT IS ONLY THE EVIL MINDED HYPOCRITES WHO STARTED TELLING THAT VEDIC YAGNAS INVOLVE INTOXICANTS & MEAT EATING. IT IS NOT IN THE VEDAS.

    'Akhaadannanumodamshcha bhaavadoshena maanavah ,
    Yo'numodati hanyantam so'pi doshena lipyate. (MB, AnushaasanaParvan 115.39) meaning THE ONE WHO HIMSELF DOES NOT EAT MEAT BUT EVEN IF HE GIVES CONSENT TO EAT MEAT OR TO KILL AN ANIMAL, HE BECOMES EQUALLY SINFUL AS THEM.

    'THE MEAT EATER WHO KILLS AN ANIMAL INTHE NAME OF VEDIC YAGNA OR
    TELLS THAT IT IS A REQUIREMENT OF YAGNA IS A SINNER AND HE WILL BE A PERSON WHO WILL DWELL IN HELL' (MAHABHARATHAM, AP 115.43)

    'IT IS DHARMA THAT IN THE SHRAADHHA FEAST, HE SHOULD NEVER OFFER MEAT OR SHOULD EAT MEAT. ONLY VEGETARIAN FOOD SHOULD BE OFFERED A MEAT IS OBTAINED BY KILLING' (BHAAGAVATHAM 7.15.7)

    IN MANUSMRITHI,MANU ASSERTS THAT ONE SHOULD NEVER DRINK & SHOULD NEVER SMELL ANY INTOXICANT LIKE WINE (MS 11.146-149). MANU ALSO SAYS SELLING, BUYING, COOKING & EATING MEAT IS AS SINFUL AS KILLING THE ANIMAL ITSELF (MS 5.15)

    'BRAHMINS, KSHATRIYAS & VAISHYAS SHOULD NEVER DRINK WINE, LIQUOR OR INTOXICANTS OF ANY KIND, BECAUSE THESE ARE ALL FOODS OF DEMONS. SO THEY SHOULD NOT BE CONSUMED' (manu smrithi 11.94 &11.95)

    in 5.48 & 5.51, manu says those who kill, eat meat never attain celestial abode. in 5.13 manu explicity forbids meat from a slaughterhouse. in 5.38 he says 'as many hairs as the slain beast has, so often indeed will he who killed it without a lawful reason suffer a violent death in future births' .

    Bhaagavatha purana, 11th skandha , 5th adhyaaya, 14th sloka says 'those who are ignorant of real dharma kill animals will be punished by these very animals in their next birth' (11.5.14)

    in 5.33 manu also says meat eaters will be eaten after their death by animals. in bhagavatha puranam, sage naradha says 'those who sacrificed animals in rituals will be punished by those very animals in next birth' (4.25.7 &4.25.8)

    so, animal sacrifice did take place. but bramins did not take part in it in any way at all. moreover, it is because of wrong inference, interpretation & interpolation that it is being said that bramins are meat eaters & that bramins indulged in animal sacrifice. for bramins vegeteranism is a compulsory trait. for other varnas, it is voluntary.
    in the theravad buddhist, text, it has been said that BUDDHA CONSUMED MEAT!!!
    soma is a plant juice which has medicinal value. it is not an alcoholic drink.

    Hinduism is only religion which believes in rebirth. so it is believed each and every hindu will be born in n each & every varna in each & every birth. so the relatively superior status bramins enjoyed is only for a limited period, during which they were bramins. in any case, no country in the world follows varnasharama now. this practice originated when bramins were in a majority in some places. it is now part of history.
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    sir= pls. consider the following. i had missed by oversight to update these detail :

    1. thosewho harm animals (paashun druhyanthi) are impious (asantah) and will be slain in their next lives by the very animals which they killed (pretya khaadanti te cha taan). (BHAAGAVATHA PURANA 11.5.14)
    this is also mentioned in Manu dharma shastra 5.33

    2. MANU SMIRITHI 5.38 SAYS 'as many hairs as the slain beast has , so often indeed will he who killed it without a lawful reason suffer a violent death in future births'

    3. MANU SMRITHI 5.51 : 'he who permits the slaughter of an animal, he who cuts it up, he who kills it, he who buys or sells it, he who cooks it, he who serves it up, and he who eats it, all must be considered slayers of the animal'

    4. manu smrithi 5.13 explicitly forbids meat from a slaughter house.

    5. Bhaagavatha purana 4.25.7-8 'sage narada says to king praachiinabarhi that the large no. of animals the king had sacrificed were preparing to seek vengenance on him in his next life. '

    6. 'in this age of kali, 5 acts are forbidden -'the offering of a horse insacrifice, a cow in sacrifice, acceptance of order of sanyasa, offering of oblations of flesh to forefathers, and a man's begetting children in his brother's wife '
    BRAHMA VAIVARTHA PURAANA KRISHNA JANMA KHANDA 185.180)

    7. 'him i call a brahmana who lays aside the rod , who neither kills nor causes the death of creatures (moving or non moving- animals or plants)' BUDDHA IN DHARMAPADA 26.409

    8. the rig veda and sama veda call cow 'aghnya' & 'adithi' .e. not to be killed murdered. (Rig 1-64-27, 5-83-8, 7-68-9, 1-164-40, 8-69-2, 9-1-9, 9-93-3, 10-6-11, 10-87-16). they extol the cow as unkillable, unmurderable whose milk purifies the mind & keeps it free from sin. verse 10-87-16 prescribes severe punishment for the person who kills a cow. the atharva veda recommends beheading (8-3-16) for such a crime. the rig veda advocates expulsion from the kingdom (8-101-15).

    9. 'you should not eat any mammal that has umblical cord , as BRAHMA came out of umblical region of vishnu / mahalakshmi . VISHNU PURANAM.

    10. 'One who partakes of human flesh, the flesh of a horse, or of another animal, and deprives others of milk by slaughtering cows, o king, if such a fiend does not desist by other means, then you should not hesitate to cut off his head ' RIG VEDA SAMHITA 10.87.16

    11. Protect both our species, 2 legged & 4 legged. both food and water for their needs supply. may they with us increase in stature and strength - RIG VEDA SAMHITA 10.37.11

    12. those noble souls who practice meditation and other yogic ways, who are careful about all beings, who protect all animals, are the ones who are serious about spiritual practices ATHERVA VEDA SAMHITHA 19.48.5

    13. he who desires to augment his own flesh by eating the flesh of other creatures lives in misery in whatever species he may take his birth MAHABHARATHA ANU.115.47

    14. AHIMSA IS NOT CAUSING ANY PAIN TO ANY LIVING BEING AT ANY TIME THROUGH THE ACTION'S OF ONE'S MIND, SPEECH & BODY.

    15. the foods that can be offered to god are without meat, egg, fish, intoxicants, excitants, alcohol etc., BHAGAVAD GITA.

    16. slaying of cow is an offence , the punishment of which is losing one's whole wealth MANU SMRITHI CH.11, VERSES 116 & 117

    17. THAT WHICH MUST BE USED IN A YAGNA MUST BE VEGETARIAN - KATYAYANA SUTRA

    18. No creature / animal should be killed = RIG VEDA. b. KILLING & EATING MEAT IS TOTALLY PROHIBITED - MIIMAAMSA SUTRA.

    19. it is only the evil minded hypoctires who started telling that vedic yagnas involve intoxicants &meat eating. it is not in vedas. MAHABHARATHA, SHANTHI PARVAN 265.9 &
    (b) THE ONE WHO GIVES CONSENT FOR KILLING ANIMALS, BECOMES EQUALLY SINFUL, EVEN IF HE DOES NOT EAT THE MEAT. (MAHABHARATHA ANUSHAASAPARVAN115.39) & (c) the person who kills an animal in a yagna or tells that an animal should be killed in a yagna will dwell in hell MAHABHARATHA ANUSHAASAPARVAN 115.43)

    20.BHAGAVATHAM 7.15.7 'IN SHRAADHA FEAST ONLY VEGETARIAN FOOD SHOULD BE USED'

    21. MANU SMRITHI 11.146-149 'ONE SHOULD NEVER DRINK & SHOULD NEVER SMELL ANY INTOXICANT LIKE WINE' & 'SELLING, BUYING, COOKING MEAT IS AS SINFUL AS SLAYING THE ANIMAL' (MS 5.15)

    22. MANUSMRITI 11.94 11.95'Brahmins, kshatriyas & vaishyas must never consume meat,intoxicants or liquor, because these are all meant for demons only'

    23. MANUSMIRITHI 5.48 & 5.51 'KILLER OF ANIMALS NEVER ENTER CELESTIAL ABODE. ALL THOSE INVOLVED IN KILLING ANIMALS IN ANYWAY ARE SINFUL'

    24. you are saying not to quote about other religions. but you are yourselves repeatedly mentioning about jainism & buddhism!
    Last edited by NARAS; 12-03-2007 at 08:13 PM.
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    SIR - Mr.SILVER FOX ALIAS RANGANATHA! KRS IS bashing brahmnism which i am not. it is his posts which should be banned, not mine. what i entered are not my views but proofs and evidences from scriptures which nail the lies of your 'scholarly' members that bramins ate meat. pls. ask your 'scholarly' members to read 'THE WORLD OF FATWAS' By Dr. arun shourie , in which quotations from quran which say prophet mohammed mentioning that 'women are commodities for men to enjoy' are published. WILL YOUR 'SCHOLARLY' MEMBERS HAVE THE COURAGE TO WRITE ABOUT QURAN OR BIBLE?

    the vedas have been there for centures in this country, even before they were written as texts. nobody knows when vedas originated. they are that old.

    if bramins are meat eaters, then how did untouchability originate? even mahatma gandhi , more educated than your 'scholarly' members has said that bramins were always pure vegetarians, and it was because of this that they considered non bramins who consume meat as untouchable. (EDHU HINDU DHARMAM BY MAHATMA GANDHI).

    even buddhists do not follow buddhism, whereas your 'scholarly' members are 'discovering' that brahminism was inspired by buddhism! all religions which originated in india -brahmnism, non brahminism, buddhism, sikhism & jainism - all are vegetarian religions. the only difference is that whereas brahminism is a pure vegetarian religion, other indian religions allow eating meat of animals which die a natural death.

    let me say one thing- the present day bramins may be drunkards, meat eaters, smokers and everything. but bramin forefathers & ancestors were pure vegetarians, who will not touch even onions & garlic. to brand such holy & noble persons as meat eaters only shows the lowly levels to which this forum has descended. persons like me ,naturally have no place in this thread. the sooner this thread is closed, the better for all, otherwise it will lead to lot of bitterness & heartburn amongst many bramins for whom vegetarinism is not just a choice, but a religion by itself.
    Last edited by NARAS; 16-03-2007 at 06:32 AM.
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    SIR- The problem with me is that apart from vegeteranism, i am a total zero in almost all other areas. that is why i am posting about vegeteranism only. it is quite possible Mr. KRS may be a 'scholar' in many other areas. but my contention is that the views of Mr. KRS in this thread are not 'scholarly' enough. for e.g. imagine a judge awarding a punishment of 3 months imprisonment to a person for committing a crime. if someone were to say 'the judge has sanctioned crime. he has said that you can commit a crime provided you are in jail for 3 months!' will it be a correct inference? my understanding of orthodox hindu scriptures is that they discourage meat eating in all possible ways since centuries. it is because of wrong interpretation that some persons think vedic religion sanctions meat eating & animal sacrifice.

    ASHWAMEDHA YAGNA: It is said in those days the horse was an important weapon for the kings because there cannot be any warfare without horses. so no king would be willing to sacrifice horse. each and every year a yagna called ashwamedha yagna would be conducted in honour of horses. after these horses die a natural death, the meat would be extracted and distributed to all non bramins.thus vedic religion did not advocate slaughter of living animals.

    FAILURE OF BUDDHA: IMHO, the main reason & probably the only reason buddhism failed in india, was perhaps because the policies advocated by buddha were something which the buddha himself had not followed for many years in his life (vegeteranism, celibacy etc.,), whereas most of hindu sages & seers over the years like adhi sankarar, paramacharya etc., right from the time they appeared in their mother's womb till their last breath totally followed the policies which they themselves had advocated (again e.g. vegeteranism, celibacy etc.,) so the bramin sages & seers could command lot of credibility which the buddha could not. thus, buddhism looked very ordinary when compared to brahminism because of this reason.

    Jainism failed in india because it advocated total public nudity & total vegeteranism which was totally impracticable. particularly total nudism was impossible even for males!

    there is even a school of thought, though not widely famous, that buddha and mahaveera were descendants of bramins, who converted to kashatriyas. there is another view point, that persons who converted to braminism from other varnas were the ones who later became buddhists, after they were expelled from brahminism for indulging in meat eating & animal sacrifice.



    asking a bramin not to speak about vegeteranism, is asking an ENT Doctor not to speak about ear, nose & throat!
    Last edited by NARAS; 15-03-2007 at 08:05 PM.
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    Dear KRS:
    As usual, Mr. NARAS is dragging us all into unnecessary arguments. Please ignore and continue to enlighten us with the rest of the discourses on our Vedas. It seems you are being sidetracked by his antics in that you have to keep on explaining yourself. Enough is enough! Let us move on!


    Quotes from NARAS<<<Sir - You may certainly be a scholar in many other matters, but in this thread IMHO, atleast so far your scholarly genius has not come out, though the adminstrator of this forum has already proclaimed you as a scholar, ironically for showing bramins in extremely poor light!
    by your logic, even drinking, smoking, gambling, horse racing,betting, womanising can be justified.>>>>>
    SILVER FOX
    "செந்தமிழ் நாடெனும் போதினிலே -இன்பத் தேன்வந்து பாயுது காதினிலே"
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    Vegetarianism and Alcoholism

    As vegetarianism and alcoholism seem to be popular topics with some of our members all posts on these topics unrelated to the core topic of any thread shall find a place here.

    Hope you continue to enjoy your debates/discussions.
    Last edited by Chintana; 19-03-2007 at 11:24 AM.
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    -edited by author-
    Many are stubborn in pursuit of the path they have chosen, few in pursuit of the goal.
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    Dear Sri Chintana Ji,

    My thoughts on this:

    1. This diet is being recognized as the healthiest of all diets nowadays (Vegan or not) provided the Protein requirements are met by combining a grain with a lentil.

    2. This diet is supposed to increase one's 'Sattvic' qualities which are conducive for one to pursue a path of 'Jnana Yoga', in Hinduism.

    3. However, this diet has also increased the 'Diabeteic' conditions of folks in India. This has happened because of the way rice is now polished off at the mills, making it almost behave as sugar in one's body.

    4. This diet is not by itself anything 'pure' or 'superior' in terms of a society, because this diet, in post Vedic periods were definitely not recommended for Kshatrias, in Hinduism.

    5. This diet definitely impedes one's performance in the fields of athletics and other physical sports.

    6. Man is designed to be Omnivorous and so, this was not the 'natural' diet in the history of the humans.

    7. Men, who are born in the regions of the world where just being Vegetarian is impossible (Cold regions, such as Lapland, etc.), have no options to adopt to this diet.

    8. Being a 'Vegetarian' in the post Vedic culture is a necessary condition to being called a 'Brahmin'. But it is not a sufficient condition. Being born to a 'Brahmin' father is not either. We are discussing this in our thread "Who are we?", elsewhere in this Forum.

    9. Ahimsa is integral to our religion and it has developed over centuries. But in essence all food we eat are thought of as the 'sacrificial offerings' to the Devas. ALL OUR ACTIONS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE SCARIFICES.

    Alcoholism to me, as it pertains to our scriptures and as it is practiced by our society is bad. In the wine producing regions of the world, wine is considred as a part of diet and is not abused. I guess that is the difference. In countries where an alcoholic drink is not considered as a part of the diet, it is always abused. England and India are prime examples.

    Pranams,
    KRS
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